Biden is talking about this guy...

[trouble13]

And that represents a huge sore point for the MAGA cult. They chanted "Lock Her Up!" Trump led them on. He pretended he was going to deliver on that promise, and then nothing. The fact that they have not held Trump accountable for his failure on this is very strong evidence that MAGA is a cult. A cult is typified by a great devotion to a person. Why doesn't the MAGA cult hold Trump responsible for letting Hillary go? He had 4 years to deliver. What a let-down. And they just look the other way as if he can do no wrong.

Just as they look the other way as they vote alongside deplorable people who hate our own government. We have to support our government. If it has issues, and all governments do, it is up to us to correct those. Anti-government is anti-America and anti-Constitution. We don't want to split up America in a civil war. That will never end well. We have to address our issues together. We are stronger together. We have to rediscover our respect for our fellow Americans.

We need to forget about the art of the deal and learn the art of compromise, and the art of true patriotism, including the art of respect for fellow Americans.

Ok let's talk about the art of a comprise...

What in your view would be a fair compromise?

 

[Integrityrespec]

Domestic terrorism is the number one terror threat to the United States. The January 6th Capitol Attack was planned. Those violent people were encouraged by the MAGA cult voting with them. Denial of this is as dangerous as voting with deplorables and condoning government hatred.

We don't fix government issues by hating government. We do it the old fashioned way by working together and supporting American unity and our common interests. Such as preserving this great nation. Patriots never give up on America. We stand with our fellow Americans.

Please stop exaggerating Jan 6. The democrats want us to believe that a few hundred poorly organized and practically unarmed protestors turned rioters were actually capable or nearly successful in overthrowing our government. If that was true it was certainly poorly handled. An attempted overthrow in which the people in charge failed to adequately provide protection to the capital and those inside. A failure to provide additional LEO's and/or National Guardsmen. A failure to provide the Capital Police with all the equipment necessary to repel such an attempt. This is particularly troubling when we have seen the JAN 6 committee tell us they had information in advance of the potential for this event to possibly take place.
The resulting JAN 6 committee found itself without sufficient evidence and resorted to editing event video. Showing only what they cherry picked to support their accusations and not allowing an opposing defense nor allowing video of for instance, Trump saying "go patriotically and peacefully to the Capital to protest". Never did he say attack anyone or anything. That was not presented to the American people and that is manipulating the narrative.

 

[Peacenik]

Ok let's talk about the art of a comprise...

What in your view would be a fair compromise?

Something that works for the good of America. Something creative that effectively addresses an issue. Sometimes it can include elements that satisfy opposing concerns without going all for one side or the other. Other times it can be a matter of trading: "OK, we'll agree to this if you will agree to that."

The art of compromise is the art of diplomacy. Agree to talk in good faith. While conducting talks, listen. Brainstorm ideas to work out an agreement. Be willing to entertain creative ideas.

 

[Razoo]

Can I be a traditional Republican that still supports Trump?

Why would you do that? TRump is not a republican. Neither is Newt. Neither is Koch. Voter Suppression is NOT republican........it is fascist violent military style control.

What exactly is a traditional republican from your perspective?

Voter Suppression Anti American Fake Republican Groups Are Declaring Hundreds of Thousands Of Voters Ineligible To Vote While the So Called Republican Party Does Nothing About It! ==== this is not republican.

 

[Queen Margo]

Why would you do that? TRump is not a republican. Neither is Newt. Neither is Koch. Voter Suppression is NOT republican........it is fascist violent military style control.

What exactly is a traditional republican from your perspective?

Voter Suppression Anti American Fake Republican Groups Are Declaring Hundreds of Thousands Of Voters Ineligible To Vote While the So Called Republican Party Does Nothing About It! ==== this is not republican.

OK- I give, jut call me an Independent FOR Trump. There are a lot of independents on here that are anti- Trump.

 

[trouble13]

Something that works for the good of America. Something creative that effectively addresses an issue. Sometimes it can include elements that satisfy opposing concerns without going all for one side or the other. Other times it can be a matter of trading: "OK, we'll agree to this if you will agree to that."

The art of compromise is the art of diplomacy. Agree to talk in good faith. While conducting talks, listen. Brainstorm ideas to work out an agreement. Be willing to entertain creative ideas.

I wasn't looking for you to give me a definition of the word. I'm looking for an example of how you would split the baby between the left and the right that both sides feel like they walked away with something of equal value to what they gave away.

For instance...
The left wants green energy and the right wants more oil. If congress said for every drill that opens on federal land green energy gets (x) amount of money invested in alternative energy. That would be a compromise both sides can get something they want.

I see very limited opportunities for compromises given the ground each side has staked out for themselves. There are some places we have room for common ground but it's scarce.

 

[Peacenik]

Please stop exaggerating Jan 6. The democrats want us to believe that a few hundred poorly organized and practically unarmed protestors turned rioters were actually capable or nearly successful in overthrowing our government. If that was true it was certainly poorly handled. An attempted overthrow in which the people in charge failed to adequately provide protection to the capital and those inside. A failure to provide additional LEO's and/or National Guardsmen. A failure to provide the Capital Police with all the equipment necessary to repel such an attempt. This is particularly troubling when we have seen the JAN 6 committee tell us they had information in advance of the potential for this event to possibly take place.
The resulting JAN 6 committee found itself without sufficient evidence and resorted to editing event video. Showing only what they cherry picked to support their accusations and not allowing an opposing defense nor allowing video of for instance, Trump saying "go patriotically and peacefully to the Capital to protest". Never did he say attack anyone or anything. That was not presented to the American people and that is manipulating the narrative.

This does not sound like a view resultant from having watched and paid attention to all of the hearings with an open mind.

There is so much video of January 6th it is not possible to present it all. There isn't enough time. Of course the Committee is going to focus on the most egregious examples of violence. There would not be much point in showing people who were simply curious and got swept along with the crowd and behaved respectfully to the Capitol. And speaking of cherry picking, it is biased to only focus on Trump's words to be peaceful. He didn't stress that very much, but he did use the word 'fight' over and over and over again. What was it, something like 20 times? And he totally lied to the crowd by telling them if they didn't fight, that we wouldn't have a country any more. What BS. Talk about scaring gullible minds! That was both alarmist and false. Their fight was for nothing, and guess what, we do still have a country, even if they didn't stop the certification.

Trump also further incited the violence by tweeting that Vice President Pence had 'let them down' by doing his job. That was also false. The Vice President does not have the power to overturn an election. If that were true Al Gore could have taken the presidency away from George W Bush in 2000 by doing exactly what Trump wanted Pence to do. And further, Kamala Harris would be able to decide who wins the 2024 election. Nobody is advocating for that. Trump lied to the crowd and incited them into further violence. And he did nothing to stop it. He could have called the National Guard. Nope! He never picked up the phone. It was Pence who had to do that. Trump simply sat back and watched the riot on TV as our Capitol was desecrated.

The charge of the Select Committee on the Capitol Attack being biased is a non starter for several reasons. Reason 1) Republicans prevented having an independent 911 style commission investigate the January 6th Capitol Attack. Reason 2) The Select Committee is bipartisan.

 

[Peacenik]

I wasn't looking for you to give me a definition of the word. I'm looking for an example of how you would split the baby between the left and the right that both sides feel like they walked away with something of equal value to what they gave away.

For instance...
The left wants green energy and the right wants more oil. If congress said for every drill that opens on federal land green energy gets (x) amount of money invested in alternative energy. That would be a compromise both sides can get something they want.

I see very limited opportunities for compromises given the ground each side has staked out for themselves. There are some places we have room for common ground but it's scarce.

That sounds like a really good suggestion to me.

My suggestion would be that both sides agree that we should avoid being judgemental. People have different ideas on things and that needs to be OK. Just because there is disagreement is no reason to think less of the other party. We should agree that we are all Americans and we all want a prosperous nation and that we need to work together to achieve that. We agree that a house divided cannot stand.

Let us agree that we need to try to reduce hatred. That should be agreeable to all.

If we feel a need to criticize something, an action, an idea, that's fine. But criticizing people is a different story. That should be avoided. It's just not helpful to America.

 

[trouble13]

That sounds like a really good suggestion to me.

My suggestion would be that both sides agree that we should avoid being judgemental. People have different ideas on things and that needs to be OK. Just because there is disagreement is no reason to think less of the other party. We should agree that we are all Americans and we all want a prosperous nation and that we need to work together to achieve that. We agree that a house divided cannot stand.

Let us agree that we need to try to reduce hatred. That should be agreeable to all.

If we feel a need to criticize something, an action, an idea, that's fine. But criticizing people is a different story. That should be avoided. It's just not helpful to America.

Sign me up!

 

[D_NATURED]

You do know there are very bad people on both sides. I can be a MAGA Republican and not support Robert Packer.

If you both support Trump, who supports fascism, what's the difference?

 

[Queen Margo]

If you both support Trump, who supports fascism, what's the difference?

Just because you claim "fascism, racism, bigotry, and every other ism" doesn't make it so.

 

[NolanVoyd]

Just because you claim "fascism, racism, bigotry, and every other ism" doesn't make it so.

The facts make it so.

Your denials don't change the facts.

 

[D_NATURED]

Just because you claim "fascism, racism, bigotry, and every other ism" doesn't make it so.

Before you deny fascism, tell me how its definition is misapplied with regard to Trump. Let's check some fascist boxes:

Hypernationalism- Check. Except they justify their anger/violence by saying their (white, cristian) country is being destroyed.

Authoritarianism- Check. This one is beyond obvious. The repubs love prisons more than freedom.

Desire for a dictator- Check. The repubs have often denied that democracy works, claimed that elections are illegitimate, and Trump has said how much easier it would be if he were the king. His president for life position is fascist as ****.

The government represents the monied interests, first and foremost- Check. Citizens United is the transparent normalizing of bribery. It is fascism enshrined by conservatives into the constitution.

Religion and politics with no church/state separation- Check. This is another Inarguable MAGA /fascist idea.

Blaming the communists, minorities, LGBTQ, immigrants, etc. For the country's woes- Check. This too can't be denied.

Please, Queen Margo, tell me what's NOT fascist about Trump and company. He checks every box.

 

[Checkerboard Strangler]

You feel that way because you lack objectivity on the subject.

Objectivity about an insurrection. How about "objectivity" about the
Civil War?

 

[Checkerboard Strangler]

The FBI did not allege any of those things as their predicate for their raid of his home. Stick with the facts.

They didn't need to.

 

[Checkerboard Strangler]

Biden is doing a good job as our leader. It was good that he called out the MAGA cult and the danger it represents to America. Republicans are already divided. There are those conservatives who refuse to compromise their morals, such as Liz Cheney, and there is the MAGA cult. The MAGA cult can be broken down into deplorables and those who purposely look the other way and thus enable the deplorables.

It has gone too far. People need to stop looking the other way, stop condoning the deplorables. We cannot erode faith in our elections. We must have a certain amount of faith in our government. We must have faith in America. It is absurd to demand perfection from government, but we have to have faith in our elections. The 2020 election was the most secure ever. And that moral statement came from a Republican.

Several European nations (and even a couple of Middle Eastern ones) reached the point a few decades ago where they realized that extraordinary evil in the form of an extraordinarily evil dictator necessitated extraordinary actions to stop them. Italy finally reached a breaking point when Mussolini "trumped" the justice system to the point of near collapse. So Italy finally took the extraordinary (yes, I am repeating that word for a reason) step of creating a summary court devoted solely to trying Mussolini for his attacks on the republic.
The people got to Mussolini before the court could carry out their sentence themselves but that does not change the fact that they had convicted and sentenced him and had received support from the Allies for it.
America has very nearly reached this inflection point now.
This is a time for choosing.

 

[Peacenik]

Several European nations (and even a couple of Middle Eastern ones) reached the point a few decades ago where they realized that extraordinary evil in the form of an extraordinarily evil dictator necessitated extraordinary actions to stop them. Italy finally reached a breaking point when Mussolini "trumped" the justice system to the point of near collapse. So Italy finally took the extraordinary (yes, I am repeating that word for a reason) step of creating a summary court devoted solely to trying Mussolini for his attacks on the republic.
The people got to Mussolini before the court could carry out their sentence themselves but that does not change the fact that they had convicted and sentenced him and had received support from the Allies for it.
America has very nearly reached this inflection point now.
This is a time for choosing.

What they did to Mussolini was reflective of what Romans did to their emperors.

But in a more recent case, Italians convicted Italian Premier Silvio Berlusconi of tax fraud.

 

[KLATTU]

This has been mentioned before but the rebranding of MAGA in Biden's speech was genius. It's putting all the Trump toadies on the defensive.

Biden and genius in the same sentence . Now that's a laffriot. The WH is on what? day five of walking back /trying to define what a MAGA Republican is. The speech was a shit show. Admit it.

 

[JMB802]

Biden and genius in the same sentence . Now that's a laffriot. The WH is on what? day five of walking back /trying to define what a MAGA Republican is. The speech was a shir show. Admit it.

Tell us you have comprehension issues without telling us you have comprehension issues.

 

[KLATTU]

Tell us you have comprehension issues without telling us you have comprehension issues.

Nope . They can’t explain it . Neither can you

 

[JMB802]

Nope . They can’t explain it . Neither can you

I KNOW I am going to regret this but here goes.

Are you saying that democrats can't explain Biden's speech? I'll need links to back up your assertions, por favor.

 

[D_NATURED]

Biden and genius in the same sentence . Now that's a laffriot. The WH is on what? day five of walking back /trying to define what a MAGA Republican is. The speech was a shit show. Admit it.

American politics is a shit show. The speech was one old man trying to scold us away from the brink. It won't work. The left is too sanctimonious and the right is too apathetic about their leader being a traitor.

 

[NolanVoyd]

American politics is a shit show. The speech was one old man trying to scold us away from the brink. It won't work. The left is too sanctimonious and the right is too apathetic about their leader being a traitor.

What is the proper response to the leader of the Republican party being a traitor and his base being Ok with it?

 

[Fishking]

The speech was clear. Robert Packer is a fascist. He engaged in fascist activity. Robert Packer is a threat to democracy.

If you support Robert Packer, either his activity here on 1/6 or the antisemitism on his shirt, then you too are whom Biden is talking about.

I'm sure there are very good people on both sides. Biden made that clear as well. Robert Packer is a MAGA Republican. Whose side are you on? MAGA Republican or traditional Republican?

There are like an entire 3 Robert Packer types.

 

[jcgriff2]

Nice try.

Let's end with this: When has Trump said, "Black lives matter?" When has Trump condemned white nationalism? Reagan condemned it emphatically. Reagan is "the" modern traditional Republican. How does Trump measure up against that metric?

OH... so BLM and Black Supremacy groups are fine... but God forbid if any other race, including whites, do the same thing?

That is racist as hell.

I suppose you would have supported and donated to the Black Panthers in the 1960s? Ronald Reagan was the governor of California then and did not appreciate it at all when dozens of Black Panthers entered the state capitol armed with long guns and shotguns then entered the chamber where legislators were busy debating.

Ronald Reagan took care of that real quick like.

Reagan never said "black lives matter" but like Trump, Reagan said "All Lives Matter".

Besides, BLM is a terrorist organization whose leadership embezzled at least $90 million so far.