Biden Draws GOP's wrath with pause in bombs shipment to Israel

[MSgt]

Nonsense.

No, fact. Hold my hand [again]:

- Israel rejected America and refused to condemn Russia, despite being asked to. Fact?
- Israel rejected America and refused to re-direct American missiles to Ukraine, despite being asked to. Fact?

- But Ukraine declared almost immediate support for Israel after Hamas attacked because....it cares? Because Israel was there for Ukraine? Just...cuz, right?

More of that one-way relationship that Israel defines as "ally," huh? I guess that makes sense to an Israeli who thinks Israel is an ally to anybody; and that Israel has a right to leech off of American tax-dollars and muscle while demanding ever more sacrifice in treasure and blood without question. What did Netanyahu say? Oh, yes, Israel will go it along if it has to. Well? Go it alone. Let's see how that pans out. Even you said that American support was "not worth nothing compared to not being able to defend yourself at all," which was very telling considering that it is only because of America that you can defend yourself at all. See? Typical self-centered and unappreciative Israeli attitude.

- America: "Israel, need your help with Ukraine."
- Israel: "F*** Ukraine and f*** you. Just give us our allowance and arms."
- Israel after Hamas attacked: "Oh...um...long live Ukraine! Now, give us more money and arms."

Thanks for being such a wonderful "ally."

And your fellow countrymen chanted "from the river to the sea" and "long live October 7", does it make you complicit in support for genocide or does this only work one way?

All Israelis did was take their cues from the IDF, which also attacked aid trucks and killed aid workers, didn't it? It was the Israeli government that set the example and defends it, even as America builds temporary docks for the humanitarian crisis that Israel is celebrating.

And my countrymen aren't on a slaughter campaign, masquerading as "defense," while begging for foreign aid. Until Israel refuses it's $3.3B annual allowance, and gets off of America's Defense tit, Americans get to say any damn thing they want on the matter. And my countrymen are attacked in Jordan and Syria because Israel won't be made to behave. Want real support from the international community and not just the support that comes from America's true allies because they are America's allies? Behave as if you deserve it.

Seriously MSgt your arguments are among the most concentrated form of dumbness one can find around here, and you're very consistent at that.

Oh, let's not hurl confessions because you are frustrated about the reality. I hold your hand and still you plug your ears and squeeze shut your eyes.

 

[Apocalypse]

No, fact.

No, it's nonsense.
You claim Ukraine only supports Israel because the US told them to, and I just find it hysterical, but you don't even try to base your claims on anything other than your own nonsensical opinions as usual.

More of that one-way relationship that Israel defines as "ally," huh? I guess that makes sense to an Israeli who thinks Israel is an ally to anybody; and that Israel has a right to leech off of American tax-dollars and muscle while demanding ever more sacrifice in treasure and blood without question. What did Netanyahu say? Oh, yes, Israel will go it along if it has to. Well? Go it alone. Let's see how that pans out. Even you said that American support was "not worth nothing compared to not being able to defend yourself at all," which was very telling considering that it is only because of America that you can defend yourself at all. See? Typical self-centered and unappreciative Israeli attitude.

Israel existed and survived several wars with larger nations prior to the US support. It will continue to exist and defend itself with or without external help, which is very much appreciated.
You don't represent Americans to me, but even you who are obsessed with opposing the US-Israel alliance can surely understand that a nation will not self-destruct just because you feel like it.

And my countrymen aren't on a slaughter campaign, masquerading as "defense," while begging for foreign aid. Until Israel refuses it's $3.3B annual allowance, and gets off of America's Defense tit, Americans get to say any damn thing they want on the matter. And my countrymen are attacked in Jordan and Syria because Israel won't be made to behave. Want real support from the international community and not just the support that comes from America's true allies because they are America's allies? Behave as if you deserve it.

You don't represent your countrymen, you're some angry individual who blames Israel for everything that happens to you.
I was however pointing out that if you're going to pretend like some several Israeli individuals who protest something represent the entire nation, then you are represented by the vile antisemites who support Hamas in US campuses.

Oh, let's not hurl confessions because you are frustrated about the reality. I hold your hand and still you plug your ears and squeeze shut your eyes.

I'm just noting how much ignorance and petty hatred are making the basis for your views here. If anyone needed that confirmation that is.

 

[MSgt]

No, it's nonsense.
You claim Ukraine only supports Israel because the US told them to,

Why else would it? What's in it for Ukraine, especially with Israel's support for Russia and that Israel would not do a thing to try to help Ukraine with America-supplied missiles? C'mon...figure it out. You can do it. Or are you suggesting that Ukraine simply has more integrity and honor than Israel that it would support an "ally" where Israel would not?

No, Ukraine joined with the West in its support for Israel for local geopolitical and military reasons. And who leads the West? You really have no idea how things work in the world, do you?

and I just find it hysterical

Nah, you find it embarrassing; and this why you avoid certain realities and cling to the Israeli propaganda that America owes you something.

I'm just noting how much ignorance and petty hatred are making the basis for your views here. If anyone needed that confirmation that is.

Hardly ignorance. I know more about your country's history and policies than you do. Want some book titles? Let's start with The Birth of the Palestinian Problem by Israeli Benny Morris and hit Against Our Better Judgement: The Hidden History of How the U.S. Was Used to Create Israel by British Alison Weir next. I can hold your hand through the Cold War and on through to the Post-9/11 era too if you want. We'll even dive all into what little exists in the public domain in the Israeli government archives, because the Israeli government makes a great effort of destroying evidence and paper trails into its conduct to achieve its less-than-publicized agenda for "Palestine."

Hatred? Why not? I have been very clear that I am neither Israeli nor Palestinian. I'm supposed to care? I went from being a blind Israel supporter before 9/11 to growing more and more disillusioned after 9/11 as I learned more and more about this one-way, senseless relationship. Does America owe Israel anything? Did it ever? Nope. It is absolutely Israel that owes everything to America, but Israel still consistently betrays.

I only want America to be left out of your crap. That too much for Israel? But this won't happen. The Israel Lobby will continue to drown America in pro-Israel propaganda, pushing American politicians to keep treating Israel as if it has a star on the American Flag when it comes to budget time. And as Israel throws itself a parade for "winning," shrugging off all consequence again, America will spend ever more treasure dealing with the humanitarian crisis, the regional political fallout that makes it harder for the U.S. to secure Israel, and getting attacked by terrorists for the effort.

 

[MSgt]

......and hit Against Our Better Judgement: The Hidden History of How the U.S. Was Used to Create Israel by British Alison Weir next.

Correction, wrong Alison Weir. American.

 

[Geoist]

Anti-Zionism and Antisemitism

High schools and colleges across the country have seen concerning increases in anti-Zionist activity in recent years. This resource delves into the nuances and complexities surrounding anti-Zionism, and why these activities may be antisemitic.

www.ajc.org

To claim anti-zionism is antisemitic is like saying being anti-caliphate is Islamophobic.

 

[Apocalypse]

To claim anti-zionism is antisemitic is like saying being anti-caliphate is Islamophobic.

Zionism is not a belief in some religious state or any specific policy by that state for that point. It is a belief that Jews should have the right to self-determination that all people do, and nowadays it's just a belief that Israel should continue to exist.
Anti-Zionism is pretty much antisemitic as it singles out the Jewish state for destruction and doesn't promote the destruction of say the Netherlands or Saudi Arabia or Japan or whatever.
It's obviously directed at the Jewish people.
You simply use the Iranian version of the term where Zionism is some dark and evil ideology. It's not, it's really basically just supporting something everyone should support - the continued existence of an existing country.

 

[Apocalypse]

Why else would it?

Relying on what makes sense to you and what doesn't isn't an actual argument.
You know this place has 'debate' in its name right?
You seem to just be willing to push your ridiculous opinions without ever having to base them on anything real.

No, Ukraine joined with the West in its support for Israel for local geopolitical and military reasons. And who leads the West? You really have no idea how things work in the world, do you?

Ukraine understands who its enemies are and understands that they're the same enemies of Israel and the entire Western world.
You really struggle with that do you.

Hardly ignorance. I know more about your country's history and policies than you do.

Now this is why I try to avoid drinking coffee while reading your comments.

Want some book titles? Let's start with The Birth of the Palestinian Problem by Israeli Benny Morris

Yeah I know all about your books reading and how it bred your ignorance, you only talk about it in every other post.
I wish I could convey how much I find your belief that you are knowledgeable on the subject because you read some history revisionists' nonsense to be hilarious.

Not surprising to learn that the source of your miseducation lies with Benny Morris' nonsense as so many others who push the same false narratives as you do.

Here, read this:

Benny Morris's Reign of Error, Revisited: The Post-Zionist Critique

The collapse and dispersion of Palestine's Arab society during the 1948 war is one of the most charged issues in the politics and historiography of the Arab-Israeli conflict. Initially, Palestinians blamed the Arab world for having promised military

www.meforum.org

Hatred? Why not? I have been very clear that I am neither Israeli nor Palestinian. I'm supposed to care? I went from being a blind Israel supporter before 9/11 to growing more and more disillusioned after 9/11 as I learned more and more about this one-way, senseless relationship. Does America owe Israel anything? Did it ever? Nope. It is absolutely Israel that owes everything to America, but Israel still consistently betrays.

You mean you went through an indoctrination and a radicalization process that filled your mind and heart with lies regarding the only democratic nation in the Middle East. I know, you're hardly the first one I encounter.

I only want America to be left out of your crap. That too much for Israel? But this won't happen. The Israel Lobby will continue to drown America in pro-Israel propaganda, pushing American politicians to keep treating Israel as if it has a star on the American Flag when it comes to budget time. And as Israel throws itself a parade for "winning," shrugging off all consequence again, America will spend ever more treasure dealing with the humanitarian crisis, the regional political fallout that makes it harder for the U.S. to secure Israel, and getting attacked by terrorists for the effort.

Take it with your local representative then.

 

[Geoist]

Zionism is not a belief in some religious state or any specific policy by that state for that point. It is a belief that Jews should have the right to self-determination that all people do, and nowadays it's just a belief that Israel should continue to exist.

Zionism is a nationalist movement and always been a nationalist movement. To claim it's not a belief in an ethno-state is gaslighting.

Anti-Zionism is pretty much antisemitic as it singles out the Jewish state for destruction and doesn't promote the destruction of say the Netherlands or Saudi Arabia or Japan or whatever.

More gaslighting.

First off, I'm ideologically anti-state. So I don't just want the longterm end of the nation-state of Israel but all nation-states. Not happening in our lifetimes but I believe nation-states, just like monarchies and empires, will one day become an archaic institution.

But even if one believed in nation-states, they can reject the concept of an ethno-state like Israel and not be antisemitic just as they can reject a caliphate and not be islamaphobic.

It's obviously directed at the Jewish people.

And being anti-caliphate is obviously directed at Muslims, right?

Are you Islamophobic or are you pro-caliphate, Apocalypse?

BTW, many Jews are anti-zionist.

You simply use the Iranian version of the term where Zionism is some dark and evil ideology.

No, it's literally about ethno-nationalism. I reject the idea of ethno-nationalism.

It's not, it's really basically just supporting something everyone should support - the continued existence of an existing country.

More gaslighting. This is like saying opposing apartheid is advocating for the destruction of South Africa.

 

[Apocalypse]

Zionism is a nationalist movement and always been a nationalist movement. To claim it's not a belief in an ethno-state is gaslighting.

It was a nationalist movement to establish the state of Israel, which isn't an ethno-state since Jews are an ethnoreligious people and since it is democratic with equal rights to everyone.

Getting angry because people are pointing out facts to you does not make it gaslighting.

First off, I'm ideologically anti-state.

You can be ideologically anti-raccoon for all I care.

So I don't just want the longterm end of the nation-state of Israel but all nation-states. Not happening in our lifetimes but I believe nation-states, just like monarchies and empires, will one day become an archaic institution.

But even if one believed in nation-states, they can reject the concept of an ethno-state like Israel and not be antisemitic just as they can reject a caliphate and not be islamaphobic.

Promoting the destruction of Israel (anti-Zionism) and not of any other country is clearly antisemitic.
Being anti-Zionist does not make you anti-ethno-state (that Israel isn't), it makes you against Israel's existence as the nation-state of the Jewish people.
There are many nation-states in the world. The UK, Japan, Spain, Belgium, etc. Do you support the destruction of all of those?
The fact that you would define yourself as an anti-Zionist and not say anti-nation-state means you have it only for one type of people.

And being anti-caliphate is obviously directed at Muslims, right?

Are you Islamophobic or are you pro-caliphate, Apocalypse?

You mean supporting a religious theocracy for Islam that will be built on certain religious laws, right?
So - that's not what Zionism is for Jews. You are using some perverted Iranian definition of the term Zionism and that's your problem here.
You were literally pointed to the definition of the term and what it means to Jews and others who define themselves as Zionists (such as Biden) and why anti-Zionism is treated as antisemitism rightfully (such as by Macron president of France, among many other leaders of the West)

BTW, many Jews are anti-zionist.

"Many".
People of any group can be anything, I don't find it meaningful.

More gaslighting. This is like saying opposing apartheid is advocating for the destruction of South Africa.

Apartheid was a system of racial segregation among citizens of S.Afirca. It wasn't the belief that S.Africa should just exist.

 

[MSgt]

Ukraine understands who its enemies are and understands that they're the same enemies of Israel and the entire Western world.

Ha! Let's see:

Arguing that Ukraine supports Israel because it "understands that their enemies are Israel's enemies" say's a lot about what Israel truly is that it turned its back on Ukraine, doesn't it? I mean, did Israel not understand this? Or did Israel just follow it's historical path of betraying others at the drop of a dime because it is selfish and self-centered? Funny that you wish to abandon all sense of how true allies in the West work with each other, so that you can argue that Israel has no integrity and no honor. Blind partisanship, lies, and false narratives are how the naïve trip all over themselves. Be honest and this wouldn't happen.

Not surprising to learn that the source of your miseducation lies with Benny Morris' nonsense as so many others who push the same false narratives as you do.

Morris used primary documentation straight out of Israel's archives. He was immediately met with criticism by the Israeli government because he refused to sing the false narrative that the Israeli government had pushed. The criticism centered on how Morris wasn't fair in regards to Arabs rejecting Israel's creation, despite the book not even being about that. It is about the activity that took place during the 1948 war, as recorded by Israelis and captured in the archives.

You cling to whatever helps you discredit truth. You do it even today. Israelis attack a humanitarian truck again and you pretend that they weren't following the government sanctioned example of prior activity. Or how the only reason we know that the IDF killed Israeli hostages was because they were Israeli hostages. Otherwise, like throughout the campaign, that would have been just another unheard of case of Palestinian civilians being targeted.

And...why are their settlers in the first place? I'm sure you've been given a false narrative to legitimize that activity too. Lies and a lack of education is your thing, not mine.

You mean you went through an indoctrination and a radicalization process that filled your mind and heart with lies regarding the only democratic nation in the Middle East. I know, you're hardly the first one I encounter.

I woke up and recognized Israel for what it is. The sad thing is that all I had to do was start observing the reality after 9/11.

Time to stop the propaganda. Democratic elections have been held throughout the region. Even Iran's government is a mix between Islamic theocracy and democracy. And wasn't Hamas elected? Besides that reality, after an entire Cold War of America wrecking democracies, propping up and supporting dictators, it is amazing that you still fall for this "democracy" nonsense. Israel's democracy has never mattered to anything. It was a tactic used to explain away blind support and American tax-dollars. In the meantime, American economic and material aid flows to even Saudi Arabia, doesn't it? I guess this must mean that the House of Saud is a democracy, huh?

 

[Geoist]

It was a nationalist movement to establish the state of Israel, which isn't an ethno-state since Jews are an ethnoreligious people and since it is democratic with equal rights to everyone.

It is an ethnostate no matter how much you try to deny it.

An ethnostate can be democratic, at least to an extent. The problem with ethnostates is they inherently seek dominance of the favored ethnic groups over other minorities within the state.

Promoting the destruction of Israel (anti-Zionism) and not of any other country is clearly antisemitic.

I promote the end of a system that favors one group/class/ethnicity over another. You claiming I want the destruction of Israel would be like George Wallace crying that I want the destruction of America because I want the end of segregation.

Being anti-Zionist does not make you anti-ethno-state (that Israel isn't), it makes you against Israel's existence as the nation-state of the Jewish people.

It's amazing how you can write that out and not expect readers to laugh.

There are many nation-states in the world. The UK, Japan, Spain, Belgium, etc. Do you support the destruction of all of those?

I support ending all unjust discriminatory policies enacted by any nation-state.

The fact that you would define yourself as an anti-Zionist and not say anti-nation-state

Except I did and you responded, "You can be anti-raccoon for all I care." Lol.

You mean supporting a religious theocracy for Islam that will be built on certain religious laws, right?
So - that's not what Zionism is for Jews.

I'm sure zionism has a very different meaning to the migrant moving into a new settlement than it does to the Palestinian kicked off the land to make room for the migrant.

"Many".
People of any group can be anything, I don't find it meaningful.

Why do you think there are anti-zionist Jews?

Apartheid was a system of racial segregation among citizens of S.Afirca. It wasn't the belief that S.Africa should just exist.

Israel can exist, it just has to exist without the oppression of minorities.

 

[MSgt]

Why do you think there are anti-zionist Jews?

According to blind Israeli supporters, this is because those Jews are anti-Semitic and hate Jews.

Seventy-six years later, Israel would not have to face so much international scorn had it learned to behave decades ago. They even bite the hand that feeds them. A history of either attacking Americans or creating scenarios where Americans are targeted. A history of betraying American-sponsored truces and peace accords, then playing the victim card. A history of increasing pressure and oppression upon a people who's only means to fight back is extremism and terrorism (only to get their butts whupped for not just taking it.) And Israel consistently takes advantage of the fight at hand by taking more, which is in keeping with the agenda of eradicating the territory of its original inhabitants.

 

[Apocalypse]

Arguing that Ukraine supports Israel because it "understands that their enemies are Israel's enemies" say's a lot about what Israel truly is that it turned its back on Ukraine, doesn't it?

That's the truth, Ukraine sees Iranian drones attacking it and understands who its enemies are.
Israel knows that Russia isn't a friendly nation too, they work closely with Iran and Syria and others.
The part you intentionally mistake is Israel has delicate security interests and needs to work a diplomatic solution with Russia regarding Syrian airspace, which has allowed it to bomb Hezbollah and Iranian targets there.

Morris used primary documentation straight out of Israel's archives.

He's a history revisionist and I referred you to an article that elaborates on his errors.

I woke up and recognized Israel for what it is.

Most people who go extreme and radical refer to their moment of radicalization as "waking up".

Time to stop the propaganda. Democratic elections have been held throughout the region. Even Iran's government is a mix between Islamic theocracy and democracy.
And wasn't Hamas elected?

Democracy isn't just about elections, in some cases even fake elections.
I guess you don't know what democracy is because you didn't read a book about it by some history revisionist.

 

[Apocalypse]

It is an ethnostate no matter how much you try to deny it.

An ethnostate can be democratic, at least to an extent. The problem with ethnostates is they inherently seek dominance of the favored ethnic groups over other minorities within the state.

So much ignorance. The Jewish people are an ethnoreligious group. There are Jews who aren't ethnic Jews.
So the word you're looking for in your false accusations is an ethnoreligious state perhaps.
Not that it's going to cure your mistake, but at least try to stay relevant with your ridiculous accusations.
Rights are equal for everyone in Israel. Arabs are in government, supreme court, parliament, etc.

I promote the end of a system that favors one group/class/ethnicity over another. You claiming I want the destruction of Israel would be like George Wallace crying that I want the destruction of America because I want the end of segregation.

Zionism is not a system that favors one group over another. It's not policy. It's only the belief that Israel should continue to exist.
You keep using definitions that do not fit with the word.
When you promote anti-Zionism you promote the destruction of Israel, since this is what the term means.
But of course you wish to tell people who actually live there what the term they invented means.

I support ending all unjust discriminatory policies enacted by any nation-state.

Yet in Israel's case you attack Zionism which is the support for the nation-state's very existence, not some policy promoted by that nation-state.
You falsely portray it as some government policy so to attack it but you have nothing to base that on evidently and Israelis and Jews who see you doing so can immediately point out that you're speaking nonsense and are adopting the Iranian propaganda.

I'm sure zionism has a very different meaning to the migrant moving into a new settlement than it does to the Palestinian kicked off the land to make room for the migrant.

It has a universal meaning.

Why do you think there are anti-zionist Jews?

Many reasons. Some ultraorthodox believe it's a sin in their faith to establish Israel prior to the Messiah coming, some are far-left nutjobs, etc.
It's not relevant is it? The idea that having some person who is Jewish share your antisemitic views makes it legitimate is itself antisemitic.

Israel can exist, it just has to exist without the oppression of minorities.

And this false accusation has nothing to do with Zionism which is not a policy but the support for Israel existing.

 

[Shelly T]

This place is interesting. I believe Biden should support Israel without question, He shouldn't hold back armaments.

 

[Apocalypse]

This place is interesting. I believe Biden should support Israel without question, He shouldn't hold back armaments.

Welcome to DP, Shelly.

 

[Shelly T]

Welcome to DP, Shelly.

Thank you.

 

[hecatmoggie]

Biden is in quite the bind


fund Israel and piss off pro-Palestinian supporters
do not fund Israel and piss off Jewish people and Israel supporters

he'll lose millions of votes either way

 

[Shelly T]

Biden is in quite the bind


fund Israel and piss off pro-Palestinian supporters
do not fund Israel and piss off Jewish people and Israel supporters

he'll lose millions of votes either way

I think there are more Israel supporters than Palestinians

 

[Geoist]

So much ignorance. The Jewish people are an ethnoreligious group. There are Jews who aren't ethnic Jews.
So the word you're looking for in your false accusations is an ethnoreligious state perhaps.
Not that it's going to cure your mistake, but at least try to stay relevant with your ridiculous accusations.
Rights are equal for everyone in Israel. Arabs are in government, supreme court, parliament, etc.

'Bro, Israel is not an ethnostate, it is an ethnoRELIGIOUS state!'

GTFO with that nonsense.

Zionism is not a system that favors one group over another.

Yes, it is.

It's not policy.

Zionism is central focus of the Israeli government:

Politics in Israel are dominated by Zionist parties. They traditionally fall into three camps, the first two being the largest: Labor Zionism, revisionist Zionism, and religious Zionism. There are also several non-Zionist Orthodox religious parties and non-Zionist secular left-wing groups, as well as non-Zionist and anti-Zionist Israeli Arab parties.

Politics of Israel - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

It's only the belief that Israel should continue to exist.

Jews will continue to migrate to Israel with or without Israeli government zionist policies. They just shouldn't get to kick people off the land to do it.

Yet in Israel's case you attack Zionism which is the support for the nation-state's very existence, not some policy promoted by that nation-state.

You better tell Israel's non-Zionist parties they promote the end of Israel.

There are also several non-Zionist Orthodox religious parties and non-Zionist secular left-wing groups, as well as non-Zionist and anti-Zionist Israeli Arab parties.

Politics of Israel - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

You falsely portray it as some government policy so to attack it but you have nothing to base that on evidently and Israelis and Jews who see you doing so can immediately point out that you're speaking nonsense and are adopting the Iranian propaganda.

You claim zionism does not drive the policies of Israel, and at the same time you claim Israel would no longer exist without zionism. Do you think through your arguments?

It has a universal meaning.

It was under the banner of zionism that the Palestinian farmer gets kicked off his land for some new migrant.

Many reasons. Some ultraorthodox believe it's a sin in their faith to establish Israel prior to the Messiah coming, some are far-left nutjobs, etc.

So you admit, there are reasons outside of antisemitism to oppose zionism.

It's not relevant is it? The idea that having some person who is Jewish share your antisemitic views makes it legitimate is itself antisemitic.

No. the idea that an entire group's identity is or should be wrapped up in a nationalist movement IS ANTISEMITIC.

 

[Geoist]

This place is interesting. I believe Biden should support Israel without question, He shouldn't hold back armaments.

Without question, eh? We literally put conditions on Ukraine's use of our arms. Doesn't seem to be too much of an ask for Israel to not carpet bomb the Gazans (half of whom are under the age of 18.)

 

[exoplanet]

Congress voted for the bill to send the arms. Biden ridiculed the GOP for not voting on the bill and now he doesn't want to send the aid that the Congress approved. He's an idiot who hasn't the common sense to find his way off the stage and he's trying to tell other countries what they can and can't do to protect themselves now and for the future. Way to go Brandon.

It's funny to me that supporting NATO is somehow a "globalist" thing but sending military aid to Israel is something sacred in Trump world.

 

[Apocalypse]

'Bro, Israel is not an ethnostate, it is an ethnoRELIGIOUS state!'

GTFO with that nonsense.

I didn't say it's an ethnoreligious state, that would be stupid almost like claiming it's an ethnostate.
I pointed out to you that Jews are an ethnoreligious people since your ignorance of what the Jewish people even are is annoying.

Yes, it is.

Point to the definition where it shows it is. At this point you just promote empty lies because you feel like treating your opinion as a fact.

Politics in Israel are dominated by Zionist parties. They traditionally fall into three camps, the first two being the largest: Labor Zionism, revisionist Zionism, and religious Zionism. There are also several non-Zionist Orthodox religious parties and non-Zionist secular left-wing groups, as well as non-Zionist and anti-Zionist Israeli Arab parties.

Politics of Israel - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

You've just proven Zionism itself is not a policy or support for any policy. Saying that a party is Zionist in Israel merely means it supprots Israel's continued existence as the Jewish state that it is.
There is Labor Zionism, Revisionist Zionism, etc. as you pointed, which is the actual policy-supporting ideology unlike just Zionism which is not.

Jews will continue to migrate to Israel with or without Israeli government zionist policies. They just shouldn't get to kick people off the land to do it.

You still abuse the term Zionism.

You better tell Israel's non-Zionist parties they promote the end of Israel.

They indeed do and it's well known in Israel. Some Arab parties for example call for Israel to be abolished as a Jewish state, which is anti-Zionism. It's just that Israel is a democracy so it has room for these kind of parties as well.

You claim zionism does not drive the policies of Israel, and at the same time you claim Israel would no longer exist without zionism. Do you think through your arguments?

Of course I do, don't mistake your lack of ability to comprehend simple text with me not thinking through my arguments.
Zionism is not a policy. It is the belief that Israel as it exists today (a Jewish nation-state) should continue to exist.

It was under the banner of zionism that the Palestinian farmer gets kicked off his land for some new migrant.

Kicked off? They bought lands legally.
Or you mean the war where several nations tried to destroy the one-day old nation and its people and failed to do so, which happened after the Zionist movement achieved its goal.

So you admit, there are reasons outside of antisemitism to oppose zionism.

Anti-Zionism, as president Macron of France and many other world leaders rightfully declared, is antisemitism plain and simple.
You can oppose Israeli policies and not be antisemitic of course, but anti-Zionism opposes the core that is a Jewish nation-state even existing.

No. the idea that an entire group's identity is or should be wrapped up in a nationalist movement IS ANTISEMITIC.

Many groups are wrapped up in a nationalist movement.
The Dutch, the Japanese, all created their own nations to set their own shared future.
If you promote the destruction of the Jewish state (anti-Zionism) and only the Jewish state, then that's discriminating against Jewish people, and I'm sorry to be the one who's breaking the news to you but that's good old antisemitism.

 

[MSgt]

MSgt said:
"Arguing that Ukraine supports Israel because it "understands that their enemies are Israel's enemies" say's a lot about what Israel truly is that it turned its back on Ukraine, doesn't it?"

That's the truth, Ukraine sees Iranian drones attacking it and understands who its enemies are.
Israel knows that Russia isn't a friendly nation too, they work closely with Iran and Syria and others.
The part you intentionally mistake is Israel has delicate security interests and needs to work a diplomatic solution with Russia regarding Syrian airspace, which has allowed it to bomb Hezbollah and Iranian targets there

So, Ukraine can see, but Israel can't? When it came to Ukraine's need against Russia, Israel turned its back, but Ukraine has a duty to support Israel? Again, we see the stereotypical attitude that always comes out of Israel.

And let's clear up another lie:

- Israel has been in bed with Russia since the early 2000s. Ariel Sharon was quite public about his pro-Russia stance, while Putin feigned a support for democracy and played pro-Israel games to woo Israel away from the West. And Israel bought it. This cozy relationship began well before Trump betrayed the Kurds and handed territorial influence over to Putin, Iran, and Turkey; and well before the Syrian Civil War. Like abandoning the Iran Deal, Israel's "delicate security interests" have become exacerbated because of Israel. In fact, like the West, Russia has sent some 60 tons of tents, medicines, food, and other humanitarian aid to Palestinians. What does this say when even Russia joins with the West to address what Israel's rampage has caused? I'll answer: It say's that Putin is playing up his relationship with Iran and the Islamists, while Israel betrays Western efforts against Russia and Iran, as Israel plays with its "delicate security interests."

He's a history revisionist and I referred you to an article that elaborates on his errors.

Horse shit. It's truth that bucks the Israeli narrative of what happened during that war. And it is important because that same behavior to slaughter and shove out as many Palestinians as possibly, under the "fog of war," is still happening today.

 

[Apocalypse]

MSgt said:
"Arguing that Ukraine supports Israel because it "understands that their enemies are Israel's enemies" say's a lot about what Israel truly is that it turned its back on Ukraine, doesn't it?"

So, Ukraine can see, but Israel can't? When it came to Ukraine's need against Russia, Israel turned its back, but Ukraine has a duty to support Israel? Again, we see the stereotypical attitude that always comes out of Israel.

https://www.reuters.com/world/ukraines-zelenskiy-condemns-terrorist-attack-israel-2023-10-07/

Sure sounds like they only do it because the "US told them to".
What a joke your opinions are.

And let's clear up another lie:

- Israel has been in bed with Russia since the early 2000s.

Another one of your jokes?
Russia has been arming Israel's enemies even back in the 60s and 70s, and sure does it now.

In fact, like the West, Russia has sent some 60 tons of tents, medicines, food, and other humanitarian aid to Palestinians. What does this say when even Russia joins with the West to address what Israel's rampage has caused? I'll answer: It say's that Putin is playing up his relationship with Iran and the Islamists, while Israel betrays Western efforts against Russia and Iran, as Israel plays with its "delicate security interests."

Russia can afford to act in this so-called "relationship" ways Israel cannot.
Each country has its interests. When they mostly align, they decide it's worth having an alliance.
It's really sad that after all the years in the military you need me to explain such things to you.

Horse shit. It's truth that bucks the Israeli narrative of what happened during that war. And it is important because that same behavior to slaughter and shove out as many Palestinians as possibly, under the "fog of war," is still happening today.

Yelling that "the world is flat and I have read it in this book" doesn't make it the "truth".
I'm sorry but the article I referred you to does an intelligent job in dismantling your history revisionism teacher's claims.