Bernie sanders wants to tax stock trades to pay for free college

[TheDemSocialist]

anyone that wants a higher education can get one

there are loans, grants, scholarships

you can go part time, and work part time

you can go to community college for two years, and then switch over

you can join the military, and they will pay for the majority of the cost

there are literally hundreds of ways to get it done.....if the person is motivated enough

but just like not everyone can go to Stanford, not everyone can go to a four year university from go

i didnt....i got my education while active duty....took me longer, and cost me much less

when there is a will, there is always a way

Yes its all that easy :roll: Wanna go to school but dont have the money to pay for it? Go get a job, and go get loans off the wazoo! Dont mind being in debt for a good portion of your life!

 

[faithful_servant]

It's nice to have somebody fighting for education.

Bernie Sanders Wants to Tax Stock Trades to Pay for Free College - Bloomberg Politics

Bernie Sanders wants to take from the rich in order to make public college tuition-free for everyone else. On Tuesday, Sanders will hold a press conference in the nation's capital at which he will introduce a plan to use a so-called Robin Hood tax on stock transactions to fund tuition at four-year public colleges and universities. Sanders' bill sets a 50-cent tax on every "$100 of stock trades on stock sales, and lesser amounts on transactions involving bonds, derivatives, and other financial instruments," the group Robin Hood Tax on Wall Street said Monday in a press release. "The Robin Hood tax would also slow the growth of automated high frequency trading, which makes the stock market more dangerous," the press release stated. "A small tax would make risky HFT unprofitable, and help reduce the excess speculation on commodities like food and gas that drives up prices, which will protect the economy from computer-generated collapses and market manipulation."

Sanders, who is the only candidate so far to mount a formal challenge to Democrat Hillary Clinton, argues that making college tuition-free will help America compete in the global marketplace. "We live in a highly competitive global economy and, if our economy is to be strong, we need the best-educated work force in the world," the Vermont senator said in a press release on Sunday. "That will not happen if, every year, hundreds of thousands of bright young people cannot afford to go to college, and if millions more leave school deeply in debt."

In other words "Eat the rich!!"

 

[OrphanSlug]

This thread sure took a turn...

When it comes to college costs the elephant in the room is that consistently over the past 10-20 years college costs have gone up 3 to 4 times faster than the CPI and PCE, and over the same period has gone up faster than medical costs.

No matter how you look at the data behind the costs we end up with the realization that the higher we see government presence in education the higher the costs. So when someone says "free college" all we are talking about is shifting cost burden to the tax payer (even more than it already is) and adding government regulations and controls. There is no way that we can have free college and it be free of the expected associated government bureaucracy that comes with.

Our main issue is all the mechanisms for grants, loans and scholarships represent an aggregate shift in the economics of supply and demand for higher education, which then in turn impacts the economics of supply of higher educated workers to the demand for them with good paying jobs. Worse than even that, I cannot find much in published empirical data to tell us the results of that government grant spending in terms of graduation rates in 4 years, 5 years, or 6 years. We do not have empirical results on critical application of the degree obtained.

But as an economics based proposal, you take away some of the reason for colleges to consistently inflate their prices well above any reasonable metric of inflation calculation over the same period of time. Lowering college revenues via taking away so many avenues for them to extract wealth from the tax payer will force colleges to take steps to economize their business model and apply a little market economics to what they can charge. In other words, colleges would have to compete on their exclusive earning potential per degree merit, and not bank on government dollars that is not subject to those same economic forces. All the usual impacts would then apply: reduce the administrative bloat on college budgets, force professors to teach more in practical impact and job function, cut the college business model of raising capital by appealing to government to hand out more grants, and overall force the model of higher education off government constructs.

Therefor, the very last thing we need is "free college." The idea would incentive colleges to continue to inflate college costs in total absence of the market earning potential behind the various degrees, and keep the business model in reliance on that revenue stream. We cannot discard that government bureaucracy, standardization efforts, and regulation attempts will end up as anti-innovative, anti-practical education, and come with huge conflicts of interests. Assuming college ever becomes a subsidized public good, it comes with all the usual problems of being under the government umbrella of controls. Usually in total absence of economic reality.

 

[faithful_servant]

Without having read any of the responses, my guess is that the #1 argument in favor of this will be "Why do conservatives hate education and don't want to support it?"

 

[faithful_servant]

I would be alright if, on the state level, college/university was made free for those who excelled academically (3.5 GPA or higher). I would not support "free" tertiary education for those who slacked-off in secondary school. I'm also not a fan of taxpayer money going towards some students' art history degree or any degree with an incredibly low ROI.

Look at where the NEED is in education and provide help towards getting those degrees. Make it a partial subsidy and partial loan (re-paid 10 years after graduation with no interest accrued until then and only inflation rate interest charged after that). Make colleges show the need for the tuition they charge so that they aren't simply over-charging to pay for bloated salaries, over built campuses and programs which don't support the scholastic efforts of the school.

 

[TheDemSocialist]

I guess you are conceding I was right

Well whats going to happen? You made a statement that 1.)more people getting a higher education is bad, then 2.)somehow funding this with a 50 cent tax on $100 worth of stock is going to cause some sort of economic disaster. So care to explain more or just make broad accusations and statements and not back them up?

pay for stuff you want and stop demanding others fund your desires.

Oh TD. I know you love oligarchy and all. I know you are for any policy that economically benefits the elite, while being against any policy that economically benefits the middle and working class especially when it costs some sort of tax $$$ from the elite.

 

[Helix]

There's nothing you can say. You haven't proven or even provide good evidence that education leads to a decrease in dependence on public assistance.

sure i did. your refusal to acknowledge it is not a refutation of the data that i posted, nor is your utterly ridiculous analogy.

 

[ludin]

i'm willing to pay more in taxes if that's what it takes to remove the idiotic paywall. we can also seriously curb our role as pro bono global police force. send those kids to college instead.

i sent you the link to pay more taxes now you can go do it.
other people are not you and you don't get to try and steal other peoples money.

 

[ludin]

Well what are you saying when you say, " you can send your own money to the treasury. I think the department of education has their own as well... better yet you guys can all donate to a scholarship fund with your own money."?

put your money where your mouth is. if you want to pay more money to the federal government then you can do so of your own free will.
you don't get to steal other peoples money.

which is all that sanders is asking.

peoples 401ks retirements and other items would take huge hits under his plan.
but hey it is a feel good argument with no logic or reason behind it.

more promise of free stuff with someone else paying it that is the liberal mantra. don't pay for anything or work to pay for anything someone else will pay it.

now I am giving you and all your liberal friends the chance to do just that. only instead of demanding other people do it. you can do it yourself.

 

[Helix]

i sent you the link to pay more taxes now you can go do it.
other people are not you and you don't get to try and steal other peoples money.

then be satisfied having your money "stolen" to pay the entitlements, i guess. you're going to pay in either way. just makes more sense to me to educate the kids so that not as many of them end up collecting public assistance.

 

[ludin]

Yes its all that easy :roll: Wanna go to school but dont have the money to pay for it? Go get a job, and go get loans off the wazoo! Dont mind being in debt for a good portion of your life!

Yea I know working for something isn't something liberals understand. everything is supposed to be handed to them on a silver platter.
I was working full time got married had a kid and was going to school full time on the weekend.

got my 2nd degree in 3 years time.

I had to take out loans and other money in order to do it.
I got a good job out of college

and the only debt I have left is student loans and my home mortgage, but it was well worth it.
if you get a degree in a viable field you can be those loans off in little time. if you consolidate the loans then you can actually pay them off faster with a good job and a good degree.


it's a little thing called work.

 

[KLATTU]

Free college for everybody. What a great idea. Everybody betters themselves and makes more money, thus paying more taxes. Who could object?

 

[haymarket]

It's nice to have somebody fighting for education.

Bernie Sanders Wants to Tax Stock Trades to Pay for Free College - Bloomberg Politics

Bernie Sanders wants to take from the rich in order to make public college tuition-free for everyone else. On Tuesday, Sanders will hold a press conference in the nation's capital at which he will introduce a plan to use a so-called Robin Hood tax on stock transactions to fund tuition at four-year public colleges and universities. Sanders' bill sets a 50-cent tax on every "$100 of stock trades on stock sales, and lesser amounts on transactions involving bonds, derivatives, and other financial instruments," the group Robin Hood Tax on Wall Street said Monday in a press release. "The Robin Hood tax would also slow the growth of automated high frequency trading, which makes the stock market more dangerous," the press release stated. "A small tax would make risky HFT unprofitable, and help reduce the excess speculation on commodities like food and gas that drives up prices, which will protect the economy from computer-generated collapses and market manipulation."

Sanders, who is the only candidate so far to mount a formal challenge to Democrat Hillary Clinton, argues that making college tuition-free will help America compete in the global marketplace. "We live in a highly competitive global economy and, if our economy is to be strong, we need the best-educated work force in the world," the Vermont senator said in a press release on Sunday. "That will not happen if, every year, hundreds of thousands of bright young people cannot afford to go to college, and if millions more leave school deeply in debt."

Excellent idea. A transactions tax on stock sales and purchases goes back to the 1930's in modern origin and is long overdue.

 

[TheDemSocialist]

put your money where your mouth is. if you want to pay more money to the federal government then you can do so of your own free will.
you don't get to steal other peoples money.

So voluntary taxes? Which is what I stated....

which is all that sanders is asking.

Nope, no he is not.

peoples 401ks retirements and other items would take huge hits under his plan.
but hey it is a feel good argument with no logic or reason behind it.

Well saying almost all legislation that has introduced a robin hood tax provide protections for the types of tax-free investments such as 401K's. We will have to find out if his legislation offers the same protection when his legislation is officially introduced in about 30 minutes.

more promise of free stuff with someone else paying it that is the liberal mantra. don't pay for anything or work to pay for anything someone else will pay it.

So its just liberals? Just liberals? Really?

now I am giving you and all your liberal friends the chance to do just that. only instead of demanding other people do it. you can do it yourself.

Do liberals not owe $100 worth of stock? Or is the thing you dismissed a strawman, voluntary taxes, not what you are calling for here?

 

[TurtleDude]

Well whats going to happen? You made a statement that 1.)more people getting a higher education is bad, then 2.)somehow funding this with a 50 cent tax on $100 worth of stock is going to cause some sort of economic disaster. So care to explain more or just make broad accusations and statements and not back them up?


Oh TD. I know you love oligarchy and all. I know you are for any policy that economically benefits the elite, while being against any policy that economically benefits the middle and working class especially when it costs some sort of tax $$$ from the elite.

I love freedom. did you ever figure out why the real oligarchs want death taxes, high income taxes and welfare socialism?

 

[tres borrachos]

It's nice to have somebody fighting for education.

Bernie Sanders Wants to Tax Stock Trades to Pay for Free College - Bloomberg Politics

Bernie Sanders wants to take from the rich in order to make public college tuition-free for everyone else. On Tuesday, Sanders will hold a press conference in the nation's capital at which he will introduce a plan to use a so-called Robin Hood tax on stock transactions to fund tuition at four-year public colleges and universities. Sanders' bill sets a 50-cent tax on every "$100 of stock trades on stock sales, and lesser amounts on transactions involving bonds, derivatives, and other financial instruments," the group Robin Hood Tax on Wall Street said Monday in a press release. "The Robin Hood tax would also slow the growth of automated high frequency trading, which makes the stock market more dangerous," the press release stated. "A small tax would make risky HFT unprofitable, and help reduce the excess speculation on commodities like food and gas that drives up prices, which will protect the economy from computer-generated collapses and market manipulation."

Sanders, who is the only candidate so far to mount a formal challenge to Democrat Hillary Clinton, argues that making college tuition-free will help America compete in the global marketplace. "We live in a highly competitive global economy and, if our economy is to be strong, we need the best-educated work force in the world," the Vermont senator said in a press release on Sunday. "That will not happen if, every year, hundreds of thousands of bright young people cannot afford to go to college, and if millions more leave school deeply in debt."

I have stock holdings. And my 401K is full of them. I guess that makes me part of the "rich". Funny, I always thought I was middle class.

What's the point here? Free public college is just another 4 years of high school. How will this make anyone more competitive in the job market if millions of kids each year graduate from pubic school grades 13-16? You think this will be considered on par with an Ivy degree, or even a small private Liberal Arts school degree, or a degree from University of Virginia or Auburn or Cal Poly, and so on?

 

[TheDemSocialist]

Yea I know working for something isn't something liberals understand. everything is supposed to be handed to them on a silver platter

Hmmm I see you are sticking with the hack argument. "LIBERALS! LIBERALS BAD! LIBERALS MEAN! LIBERALS LAZY! LIBERALS THIEVES!". What a great, and narrow worldview you keep. A world painted in black and white. Are you able to move beyond the hackish rhetoric or not?

I was working full time got married had a kid and was going to school full time on the weekend.

Well good for you.

got my 2nd degree in 3 years time.

Well good for you.

I had to take out loans and other money in order to do it.
I got a good job out of college

Well good for you.

and the only debt I have left is student loans and my home mortgage, but it was well worth it.

Well good for you.

if you get a degree in a viable field you can be those loans off in little time. if you consolidate the loans then you can actually pay them off faster with a good job and a good degree.

Well that is nice.

it's a little thing called work.

Yup.


Now because you did all this, higher education should not be provided?

 

[tomkat364]

more theft from the left go figure.
typical liberal mantra take what doesn't belong to you and give it to someone else.

you realize the havoc this would wreck on 401k's and other things?
nope but it is a feel good thing full of emotion and little reason.

Why would anyone need to worry about the long-term effects that this grand idea would cause? If people can go to college for free, then they can work at higher paying jobs (that don't exist) for an indefinite time-frame making retirement a moot point (because they can just continue to work at these cushy jobs that the rich people all have due in no part to their personal achievement or responsibility).
Ignore the fact that we have tons of college grads who can't get jobs (according to the media when they want to talk about repaying student loans), flooding a non-existent market with 'qualified' people would have no negative effects on the economy whatsoever. Lol, noob!

 

[TheDemSocialist]

I love freedom.

:lamo

What a great argument: "Do you not love freedom!?"

did you ever figure out why the real oligarchs want death taxes, high income taxes and welfare socialism?

:doh
you still havent explained these two things TD: 1.)more people getting a higher education is bad, then 2.)somehow funding this with a 50 cent tax on $100 worth of stock is going to cause some sort of economic disaster. So care to explain more or just make broad accusations and statements and not back them up?

 

[haymarket]

I love freedom. did you ever figure out why the real oligarchs want death taxes, high income taxes and welfare socialism?

To punish you would seem to be the reason you think they want such things.

 

[ludin]

then be satisfied having your money "stolen" to pay the entitlements, i guess. you're going to pay in either way. just makes more sense to me to educate the kids so that not as many of them end up collecting public assistance.

just because my money is stolen now doesn't mean I have to support future theft.

as I said you and your liberal friend can give all the money you want to. I gave you the link. so put your money where your mouth is.

 

[mike2810]

Who gives a ****?

I don't.

If 'sticking it to the middle class' helps the poor people, I'm down with that.

Funny. :lamo

 

[ludin]

:lamo

What a great argument: "Do you not love freedom!?"


:doh
you still havent explained these two things TD: 1.)more people getting a higher education is bad, then 2.)somehow funding this with a 50 cent tax on $100 worth of stock is going to cause some sort of economic disaster. So care to explain more or just make broad accusations and statements and not back them up?

and the strawmans continue.

 

[ludin]

Why would anyone need to worry about the long-term effects that this grand idea would cause? If people can go to college for free, then they can work at higher paying jobs (that don't exist) for an indefinite time-frame making retirement a moot point (because they can just continue to work at these cushy jobs that the rich people all have due in no part to their personal achievement or responsibility).
Ignore the fact that we have tons of college grads who can't get jobs (according to the media when they want to talk about repaying student loans), flooding a non-existent market with 'qualified' people would have no negative effects on the economy whatsoever. Lol, noob!

having been reading the paper lately I take it. there are plenty of jobs but not enough qualified people.
the issue is that companies want real life experience anymore on top of a college education.

both in general are hard to get at the same time.
I made sure that I actually did real world experience so that I would have more to put on my resume than I waited tables.

 

[ludin]

Hmmm I see you are sticking with the hack argument. "LIBERALS! LIBERALS BAD! LIBERALS MEAN! LIBERALS LAZY! LIBERALS THIEVES!". What a great, and narrow worldview you keep. A world painted in black and white. Are you able to move beyond the hackish rhetoric or not?

are you going to ever move beyond thievery?

Now because you did all this, higher education should not be provided?

I worked and paid for it why can't they? I gave you the link that you can give all the money you want to the federal government
now be the good liberal and practice what you preach.