AP-NORC poll: Americans are split on Trump's impeachment

[GummyVitamins]

AP-NORC poll: Americans are split on Trump's impeachment

WASHINGTON (AP) — A majority of Americans say former President Donald Trump bears at least some blame for the Capitol insurrection, and about half say the Senate should vote to convict him at the end of his impeachment trial.

apnews.com

Fewer Americans, 47%, believe the Senate should vote to convict Trump after his impeachment trial, which begins next week. Another 40% say he should not be convicted, and 12% aren’t sure. Trump last month became the first president in the nation’s history to be impeached twice by the House, but it appears unlikely Democrats will have enough votes to convict him in the upper chamber.

Looks like it will be another failed impeachment attempt. Less than half (40%) of Americans believe Trump should be convicted of his 2021 impeachment with 12% being unsure. Unless a large number of Senators vote against their constituents it's not likely to pass considering the 2/3rds requirement to convict. The Senate Dems have a chance to make their case and sway public opinion, but it will be interesting to see where opinions move once Trump has the ability to publicly defend himself. For better or worse, the social media bans have limited his access to defend himself from these accusations.

 

[MamboDervish]

Looks like it will be another failed impeachment attempt. Less than half (40%) of Americans believe Trump should be convicted of his 2021 impeachment with 12% being unsure. Unless a large number of Senators vote against their constituents it's not likely to pass considering the 2/3rds requirement to convict. The Senate Dems have a chance to make their case and sway public opinion, but it will be interesting to see where opinions move once Trump has the ability to publicly defend himself. For better or worse, the social media bans have limited his access to defend himself from these accusations.

Americans are split on everything. As recently as 2017, 55% of them believe in angels.

 

[Taylor]

We already know he won't be convicted. Democrats want their dog and pony show nonetheless.

 

[joko104]

Anything to divert from what Beijing Biden is doing.

 

[Callen]

We already know he won't be convicted. Democrats want their dog and pony show nonetheless.

I think most would say that aquittal is a foregone conclusion but having Republican Senators of the record for their votes come 2022 is going to be incredibly important. If McConnell signals he is going to vote to convict, and I think there is a 50/50 chance he will, then there is an outside chance they get to 17.......but it's a long shot. None the less, what Trump did will be burned into the psyche of a majority of Americans and it will help marginalize the Trump faction even more.

 

[MamboDervish]

We already know he won't be convicted. Democrats want their dog and pony show nonetheless.

No. Democrats want the Republicans to go on record making excuses for Trump, justifying his sedition, kissing the asses of the Party crazies, overlooking his crimes, and ignoring his obvious psycho-pathologies. ON RECORD !! That's what Democrats want, and that's exactly what Republicans are going to give them.

The Dems get to publicly cite chapter and verse on Trump's treasonous actions, for the historical record - and the Republicans get to paint bullseyes on their own asses by publicly proclaiming their unwavering support of it.

That's not a dog and pony show - that's put up, or shut up!

 

[GummyVitamins]

I think most would say that aquittal is a foregone conclusion but having Republican Senators of the record for their votes come 2022 is going to be incredibly important.

I think you're looking at this wrong. The popular vote is to not convict Trump. That means there are Biden/Democrat voters who disagree with this. Democrats would be putting themselves on a ledge for voting against the will of their constituents and it will be used against them in 2022. A lot of swing voters want bipartisanship, this isn't it. Republican voters would hold their senators accountable if they vote to convict, not acquit.

 

[mrjurrs]

AP-NORC poll: Americans are split on Trump's impeachment

WASHINGTON (AP) — A majority of Americans say former President Donald Trump bears at least some blame for the Capitol insurrection, and about half say the Senate should vote to convict him at the end of his impeachment trial.

apnews.com

Looks like it will be another failed impeachment attempt. Less than half (40%) of Americans believe Trump should be convicted of his 2021 impeachment with 12% being unsure. Unless a large number of Senators vote against their constituents it's not likely to pass considering the 2/3rds requirement to convict. The Senate Dems have a chance to make their case and sway public opinion, but it will be interesting to see where opinions move once Trump has the ability to publicly defend himself. For better or worse, the social media bans have limited his access to defend himself from these accusations.

Once again, the impeachment didn't fail. 45 is impeached.

 

[Callen]

Republican voters would hold their senators accountable if they vote to convict, not acquit.

Perhaps, but I think it is important to take into consideration the numbers of Republicans leaving the GOP over Trump's actions. They are now Independents and Independents and Democrats outnumber Republicans by a substantial margin. We will see how it all shakes down but I think the radical arm of the GOP is driving moderates away in significant numbers. These people are conservatives, that aren't going to go to the Dems BUT they will, I think, choose more moderate Republicans in primaries and elections.

 

[Taylor]

I think most would say that aquittal is a foregone conclusion but having Republican Senators of the record for their votes come 2022 is going to be incredibly important. If McConnell signals he is going to vote to convict, and I think there is a 50/50 chance he will, then there is an outside chance they get to 17.......but it's a long shot. None the less, what Trump did will be burned into the psyche of a majority of Americans and it will help marginalize the Trump faction even more.

Their votes are simply going to say that this an extraconstitutional exercise in partisan grandstanding.

The party that at best ignored months of rioting and at worst spurred it on whilst calling their Republican counterparts "enemies of the state" can pretend all they want that they hold some moral high ground, but the truth says otherwise.

 

[ALiberalModerate]

We already know he won't be convicted. Democrats want their dog and pony show nonetheless.

Trump could rape a 14 year old and 60% of the Republican House and Senate members would respond with:

"Yeah, well, what was she wearing?"

30% of the Republican House and Senate members would respond with:

"We really have a problem with parents in this country for young women to find themselves in such a situation. (and then blame some kind of culture war bullshit)"

Another 5% would respond with:

"This is very troubling, but we should wait and let the American people decide."

And the remaining 5% would call for his impeachment.

 

[GummyVitamins]

Perhaps, but I think it is important to take into consideration the numbers of Republicans leaving the GOP over Trump's actions. They are now Independents and Independents and Democrats outnumber Republicans by a substantial margin.

Trump, in all likelihood, won't be on the ballot again. People will evaluate the available candidates in a bubble each election. People who voted Republican up until 2020 aren't going to suddenly support the identity politics of the left. That's still a hard hurdle to jump over. I don't think they're truly long term independents. It would be like if the Democrats nominated AOC and the moderate ones decided they didn't want to vote for a far left loony bin Democrat. If the options change the following year to a more reasonable candidate it's not like they'd continue voting for a Republican.

We will see how it all shakes down but I think the radical arm of the GOP is driving moderates away in significant numbers. These people are conservatives, that aren't going to go to the Dems BUT they will, I think, choose more moderate Republicans in primaries and elections.

I think Biden's agenda is far more radical than the moderates who voted for him expected. He's going to have to answer for it in 2024. But, he'll probably be dead, mentally deficient or too old to run again anyway. There's a short attention span in politics and if Biden takes the foot off the gas it can help whoever runs in 2024. The other risk would be Harris takes over and decides to start getting some policy feathers in her cap. Depending on how radical or close to the election they are it could hurt her as well.

 

[upsideguy]

AP-NORC poll: Americans are split on Trump's impeachment

WASHINGTON (AP) — A majority of Americans say former President Donald Trump bears at least some blame for the Capitol insurrection, and about half say the Senate should vote to convict him at the end of his impeachment trial.

apnews.com

Looks like it will be another failed impeachment attempt. Less than half (40%) of Americans believe Trump should be convicted of his 2021 impeachment with 12% being unsure. Unless a large number of Senators vote against their constituents it's not likely to pass considering the 2/3rds requirement to convict. The Senate Dems have a chance to make their case and sway public opinion, but it will be interesting to see where opinions move once Trump has the ability to publicly defend himself. For better or worse, the social media bans have limited his access to defend himself from these accusations.

Not failed at all. The impeachment pretty much neutered Trump for his final week in office. He left quietly.

The record now reflects that he is only POTUS to be impeached twice. History will render the final verdict, but given no other president was ever impeached twice, much less in the same year, the double impeachment will pretty much cement Trump's place in history as America's worst president.

The Senate can do what it wants. If 45 Republican Senators wish to join Trump the history books for thinking Jan 6 was no big deal, let them. Their great children can be embarrassed for them.

 

[MamboDervish]

Their votes are simply going to say that this an extraconstitutional exercise in partisan grandstanding.

The party that at best ignored months of rioting and at worst spurred it on whilst calling their Republican counterparts "enemies of the state" can pretend all they want that they hold some moral high ground, but the truth says otherwise.

Spare us the horseshit.

Fact check: Joe Biden has condemned violent protests in the last three months

Tens of thousands of social media users are posting memes that claim that Democratic presidential nominee, Joe Biden, has been silent for over three months on the issues of rioting and violence and has only just denounced them because of a dip in the polls. This claim is...

www.reuters.com

Fact check: Democrats have condemned violence linked to BLM, anti-fascist protests

A post claims that no Democrats have advocated for an end to violence by BLM and antifa. That is false — Joe Biden, Nancy Pelosi, and others have.

www.usatoday.com

Myron B. Pitts: 8 times Biden, Obama and others condemned Black Lives Matter violence

Some accuse Democrats of condemning the Capitol riots but giving a pass to the violence at some Black Lives Matter protests. The charge is false.

www.fayobserver.com

Democrats quotes twisted to look like they endorsed riots

After pro-Trump rioters stormed the U.S. Capitol on Jan. 6, some have taken to social media to criticize liberals who ha

www.politifact.com

Can Republican voters go a single day without shoveling more false equivalencies on the mountains they're already fabricated?
I wonder.

 

[phoenix2020]

I think Biden's agenda is far more radical than the moderates who voted for him expected. He's going to have to answer for it in 2024. But, he'll probably be dead, mentally deficient or too old to run again anyway. There's a short attention span in politics and if Biden takes the foot off the gas it can help whoever runs in 2024. The other risk would be Harris takes over and decides to start getting some policy feathers in her cap. Depending on how radical or close to the election they are it could hurt her as well.

So far his agenda has proven to be balanced and moderated--anything but radical. Outside of needing to get their numbers straight on vaccination (which IMO has been rocky in the first two weeks and is only now starting to make sense) they're making the right decisions and I think will have the support of the people who voted him into office. Those people wanted all of what he's brought so far--the Executive Orders, the daily press conferences and COVID updates, the legislative bills, the follow-through on Trump and MTG, and so on.

 

[MamboDervish]

I think Biden's agenda is far more radical than the moderates who voted for him expected.

There's no evidence of that.

But, he'll probably be dead, mentally deficient or too old to run again anyway.

And likewise - no evidence of that.

 

[Binary_Digit]

Their votes are simply going to say that this an extraconstitutional exercise in partisan grandstanding.

Do you think the Founders intended that the President can do anything he wants on his way out the door and not face any consequences?

 

[ALiberalModerate]

Do you think the Founders intended that the President can do anything he wants on his way out the door and not face any consequences?

So long as he has an R after his name, yes, that is exactly what the founders intended.

 

[GummyVitamins]

Once again, the impeachment didn't fail. 45 is impeached.

That's a good call-out and a huge oversight on my part. It's a personal pet peeve of mine to see this mistake when written elsewhere. Thanks for holding me accountable.

 

[Chagos]

I think most would say that aquittal is a foregone conclusion but having Republican Senators of the record for their votes come 2022 is going to be incredibly important. If McConnell signals he is going to vote to convict, and I think there is a 50/50 chance he will, then there is an outside chance they get to 17.......but it's a long shot. None the less, what Trump did will be burned into the psyche of a majority of Americans and it will help marginalize the Trump faction even more.

McConnell isn't 50/50 pro or con conviction, he's 50/50 on "how much is my arse going to show, either way?"

 

[JasperL]

Their votes are simply going to say that this an extraconstitutional exercise in partisan grandstanding.

The party that at best ignored months of rioting and at worst spurred it on whilst calling their Republican counterparts "enemies of the state" can pretend all they want that they hold some moral high ground, but the truth says otherwise.

Thank goodness someone did a both sides in this thread to excuse Trump's behavior. Was worried for a minute.

And the partisan grandstanding is simply saying Trump's behavior clearly crossed a red line. That's it. You could argue his actions from the election through Jan 6 were acceptable, but you aren't. Odd!

 

[GummyVitamins]

Do you think the Founders intended that the President can do anything he wants on his way out the door and not face any consequences?

The Founders/constitution states that impeachment was a mechanism by which the government could have an official "removed from office."

You can't exactly remove a private citizen from government office as was the initial intention. I think a better option would be to charge him criminally with the accusations of the impeachment. If Democrats are confident of these charges they should just move forward with it. A large part of the intent behind impeachment was so you could criminally charge a sitting official who would otherwise be unable to be charged within their term.

 

[Atomic Kid]

AP-NORC poll: Americans are split on Trump's impeachment

WASHINGTON (AP) — A majority of Americans say former President Donald Trump bears at least some blame for the Capitol insurrection, and about half say the Senate should vote to convict him at the end of his impeachment trial.

apnews.com

Looks like it will be another failed impeachment attempt. Less than half (40%) of Americans believe Trump should be convicted of his 2021 impeachment with 12% being unsure. Unless a large number of Senators vote against their constituents it's not likely to pass considering the 2/3rds requirement to convict. The Senate Dems have a chance to make their case and sway public opinion, but it will be interesting to see where opinions move once Trump has the ability to publicly defend himself. For better or worse, the social media bans have limited his access to defend himself from these accusations.

The constituency part is a somewhat uneven as Democratic Senators represent over 20 million more Americans than their Republican counterparts do even though their numbers are even. The Trump defense plan appears to be to not have Trump take the stand or even to have written statement read. Sworn testimony would certainly set him up for sworn lies and invoking the fifth would be admitting that his First Amendment speech might expose him criminally. Trump's has been very quiet lately because opening his big mouth is probably what could most endanger his chances of his already apparent acquittal.

 

[iguanaman]

The Founders/constitution states that impeachment was a mechanism by which the government could have an official "removed from office."

You can't exactly remove a private citizen from government office as was the initial intention. I think a better option would be to charge him criminally with the accusations of the impeachment. If Democrats are confident of these charges they should just move forward with it. A large part of the intent behind impeachment was so you could criminally charge a sitting official who would otherwise be unable to be charged within their term.

Maybe you would have a point if Trump allowed himself to be called a "former President" but he does not and insists on the title "the 45th President". So according to him he is still President and still can be removed from office by a conviction by the Senate. BTW Impeachment was seen as the only way to make a President subject to the law and that is still the case.

 

[GummyVitamins]

The constituency part is a somewhat uneven as Democratic Senators represent over 20 million more Americans than their Republican counterparts do even though their numbers are even.

It's still accurate when taking into account the representation in the Senate. The House is where that disparity would have been more closely aligned and they already had their say.

The Trump defense plan appears to be to not have Trump take the stand or even to have written statement read.

This is the pretty status quo legal defense plan and shouldn't matter.

Sworn testimony would certainly set him up for sworn lies and invoking the fifth would be admitting that his First Amendment speech might expose him criminally.

He's not being impeached for lying under oath. Democrats need to convict him on what he has done, not what they hope they can get him to do at some point in the future. They should be confident in their case rather than hoping to find an impeachable act during testimony. You bring me the man and I'll find you the crime is not how our system should function.

Trump's has been very quiet lately because opening his big mouth is probably what could most endanger his chances of his already apparent acquittal.

Not speaking publicly after serious charges have been brought against you is also status quo for a legal defense.