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Airport Security - Which one do you prefer?

Airport security


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Sidgaf

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1. USA /TSA Weapons search.
Pat downs / Xrays

2. Israel behavioral profiling
Passengers are asked to report three hours before departure. All El Al terminals around the world are closely monitored for security. There are plain-clothes agents and fully armed police or military personnel who patrol the premises for explosives, suspicious behavior, and other threats. Inside the terminal, passengers and their baggage are checked by a trained team. El Al security procedures require that all passengers be interviewed individually prior to boarding, allowing El Al staff to identify possible security threats. Passengers will be asked questions about where they are coming from, the reason for their trip, their job or occupation, and whether they have packed their bags themselves. The likelihood of potential terrorists remaining calm under such questioning is believed to be low (see microexpression).[38]

At the check-in counter, passengers' passports and tickets are closely examined. A ticket without a sticker from the security checkers will not be accepted. At passport control passengers' names are checked against information from the FBI, Canadian Security Intelligence Service (CSIS), Scotland Yard, Shin Bet, and Interpol databases. Luggage is screened and sometimes hand searched. In addition, bags are put through a decompression chamber simulating pressures during flight that could trigger explosives.[39] El Al is the only airline in the world that passes all luggage through such a chamber.[40] Even at overseas airports, El Al security agents conduct all luggage searches personally, even if they are supervised by government or private security firms.[41]
El Al - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
 

MaggieD

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1. USA /TSA Weapons search.
Pat downs / Xrays

2. Israel behavioral profiling
Passengers are asked to report three hours before departure. All El Al terminals around the world are closely monitored for security. There are plain-clothes agents and fully armed police or military personnel who patrol the premises for explosives, suspicious behavior, and other threats. Inside the terminal, passengers and their baggage are checked by a trained team. El Al security procedures require that all passengers be interviewed individually prior to boarding, allowing El Al staff to identify possible security threats. Passengers will be asked questions about where they are coming from, the reason for their trip, their job or occupation, and whether they have packed their bags themselves. The likelihood of potential terrorists remaining calm under such questioning is believed to be low (see microexpression).[38]

At the check-in counter, passengers' passports and tickets are closely examined. A ticket without a sticker from the security checkers will not be accepted. At passport control passengers' names are checked against information from the FBI, Canadian Security Intelligence Service (CSIS), Scotland Yard, Shin Bet, and Interpol databases. Luggage is screened and sometimes hand searched. In addition, bags are put through a decompression chamber simulating pressures during flight that could trigger explosives.[39] El Al is the only airline in the world that passes all luggage through such a chamber.[40] Even at overseas airports, El Al security agents conduct all luggage searches personally, even if they are supervised by government or private security firms.[41]
El Al - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

We could learn a lot from airport security from El Al.

An ElAl screener will pay close attention to a variety of inputs, some of which are listed below for reference:

* race and nationally
* use of language - local or foreign
* speech patterns
* is the accent true or fake
* tone and voice pitch
* the way and behavioral manners questions are answered
* use of slang – is it up to date, older, foreign; does it fit the age and declared profession
* hair style, scars and tattoos
* clothing, shoes and accessories
* type of luggage, how many pieces – does it fit the pattern
* do the clothes and personal items in the suitcase match the type and clothing the person is wearing
* does the passenger’s profession and the reasons of taking the flight match the other details
* mood and body language
* skin complexion as compared to the other findings
* sweating heavily in the air-conditioned hall
* does information about the destination fit the reasons of taking the flight

Global Politician - TSA and Aviation Security: What is wrong with their concepts and strategy – Part Two

And we'll start right after a U.S. plane is blown up midair.
 

Sadie

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Sidgaf

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Now the question is with airport like The Hartsfield-Jackson Atlanta International Airport
which averages more than 240,000 passengers a day can the Israel model handle that many people a day?

ATL FactSheet
under Other Facts:
 

Kernel Sanders

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It's a nice model, but it wouldn't scale to the size the US would need. It would take an unfeasibly long time to get through security, there would be a lack of qualified screeners, and we would have to increase the security budget to more than twelve times its current level (and that's ignoring the increased inefficiency that would necessarily come with such a huge expansion).

Borovich estimated El Al's security bill at $100 million a year, which amounts to $76.92 per trip by its 1.3 million passengers. Half is paid by the Israeli government.

By contrast, the TSA spent $4.58 billion on aviation security, or just $6.21 per trip by 737 million passengers, in fiscal 2005.

Source - Bloomberg
 

molten_dragon

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Not really sure how to respond to the poll, since I'm not sure what it's asking. Is it asking which is a better system? Or which should the US use? Or what?

I would argue that the Israeli model is probably more effective, but I doubt it would work well for the US's huge overcrowded airports.
 

disneydude

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Neither. Simple weapons screening and further procedures if there is probable cause to justify. Otherwise, as a freedom loving American, don't be touching my junk.
 

Ikari

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I'd say what we had before was good enough. Simple weapons screening, metal detectors, maybe the occasional pat down (but no groping).
 

disneydude

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Why are so many people in support of allowing us to become a police state? Where the government can violate you in these ways?
 

Sidgaf

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Not really sure how to respond to the poll, since I'm not sure what it's asking. Is it asking which is a better system? Or which should the US use? Or what?

I would argue that the Israeli model is probably more effective, but I doubt it would work well for the US's huge overcrowded airports.

Sorry about that I was looking for "Which one do you prefer", and so far the Israeli model is winning
but as you pointed out it will never work with major airports.
I know check in on Monday, fly out on Wednesday.
 

Ikari

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Why are so many people in support of allowing us to become a police state? Where the government can violate you in these ways?

Some people would rather be horribly violated than face low probability events.
 

Sidgaf

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I favor a security system that relies on the decision of the Airport/Airline without government backing

You mean like in some cases no security at all.

You do know we are not talking about some cab/bus company where if you don't like one you can always go with the down street.

We are talking about airports that takes sometimes years to plan and build and take up square miles of land.

We are talking about places where flying bombs take off every minute and fly over dense population centers.

and you want to leave security systems to company like SouthWest Air which is nothing more than a flying bus company.
 

Tucker Case

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I'm of the belief that 9/11 could have been very easily prevented had they just not allowed knives on planes. I don't think we need all that much more than not allowing people to get on planes with weapons.
 

Cold Highway

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You do know we are not talking about some cab/bus company where if you don't like one you can always go with the down street.

You can change airports its just more difficult

We are talking about airports that takes sometimes years to plan and build and take up square miles of land.

Irrevelant to what I support

We are talking about places where flying bombs take off every minute and fly over dense population centers.

Just like how cars and other vehicles that can explode drive all over the place?

and you want to leave security systems to company like SouthWest Air which is nothing more than a flying bus company.

Yes, yes I do, if they are put in charge of their own security then they can set their own security polices. Then the market decides on which airports people feel safer on.
 

Kal'Stang

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I favor a security system that relies on the decision of the Airport/Airline without government backing

Not possible. For the simple fact that our Federal Government is responsible for all border crossings not only of national borders but also of state borders. They have had that task since the founding of the US.
 

Korimyr the Rat

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I'm of the belief that 9/11 could have been very easily prevented had they just not allowed knives on planes. I don't think we need all that much more than not allowing people to get on planes with weapons.

The harder it is for people to get weapons into a place, the more power weapons give to people who manage to smuggle them in somehow. Put a couple of armed agents on every flight and the problem disappears entirely.
 

Anthony Miller

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The harder it is for people to get weapons into a place, the more power weapons give to people who manage to smuggle them in somehow. Put a couple of armed agents on every flight and the problem disappears entirely.

Certainly that would work if our economy was in better shape and if the government cared but unfortunately neither of those true. So if you know any ideas on how to get enough money legally to put armed guards on every flight please do share.
 

Kal'Stang

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The harder it is for people to get weapons into a place, the more power weapons give to people who manage to smuggle them in somehow. Put a couple of armed agents on every flight and the problem disappears entirely.

What are a couple of armed agents going to do against 5-10 terrorists? Or even just a couple who find out who the agents will be / look like before they get on the flight? Armed agents are not that useful. What needs to be done instead is to STOP telling people to not do anything when some dirtbag is threatening their lives or the lives of others around them. Seriously that has got to be among the WORST things that "experts" have "trained" people to do. Most civilians have been trained to be cowards imo. Personally if I ran an airport I would hand every adult passenger a gun with one bullet in it at the door of the plane and collect that gun back at the end of the flight. I'd like to see a group of terrorists hijack those planes. ;)
 

marduc

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The harder it is for people to get weapons into a place, the more power weapons give to people who manage to smuggle them in somehow. Put a couple of armed agents on every flight and the problem disappears entirely.

as simplistic and realistic as that answer seems on the surface, that does beg the question of how much that would cost over the long term, and whether or not that cost is prohibitive, there are thousands of domestic flights daily, I cannot see how it would be economically feasible to have an armed person on every flight (yet alone a couple) when there are thousands daily.

The machines suck, but IMO for security they do the job required of them, and that as a whole soceity is too damn uptight if they are put off and offended by some ghostly undefined image of themselves.. even if the image made it off the machine and the public.. so what? nobody will care about your fat ass vague outlined anatomy (which one cannot even tell would belong to you) when super attractive high rez photo options are available for free.

People are too damn uptight and a bunch of damn prudes IMO. My god, someone brushes your testes if you do not go through the screener.. holy molestation, are the same people throwing a fit when a Dr. asks them to turn their head and cough during a physical, or refuse to go get a check up from the gynecologist, or screaming molestation over a pap smear?
 
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Sidgaf

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I favor a security system that relies on the decision of the Airport/Airline without government backing

short and sweet
There are seventeen airports participating in a Screening Partnership Program: San Francisco International Airport, Kansas City International Airport, Greater Rochester International Airport, Sioux Falls Regional Airport, Jackson Hole Airport, Tupelo Regional Airport, Key West International Airport, Charles M. Schultz-Sonoma County Airport, Roswell Industrial Air Center, Havre, Lewistown, Sidney-Richland (SDY), MT, Glasgow, Wolf Point, Glendive, Miles City and E. 34th Street Heliport (6N5), NY.

TSA: Frequently Asked Questions - Program
 

Zyphlin

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Lets see.

A "right" to health care. A seeming "right" to flying.

Can someone please enumerate all these magical created rights we supposedly have that the government is infringing on? Its hard to keep up with them all.
 

Tucker Case

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The harder it is for people to get weapons into a place, the more power weapons give to people who manage to smuggle them in somehow. Put a couple of armed agents on every flight and the problem disappears entirely.

Great point. If costs are an issue, there's always the pilot and co-pilot in a locked cabin. Give them guns and training.
 

Ikari

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I wonder when someone will just end up bombing the TSA line. Then what? Pre-security security screening?
 
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