Again... Why did we invade Iraq?

[kal-el]

Yes, but you also stated a while back that saving the Iraqi people from Saddam's abuses wasn't worthy of our action.

I still don't. Look you brought up Superman, so Supes does not send bombs over populations, torture, abuse, or cause a hell of a lot of non-needed civilian deaths over falsified or hyped-up claims.

 

[MSgt]

I still don't. Look you brought up Superman, so Supes does not send bombs over populations, torture, abuse, or cause a hell of a lot of non-needed civilian deaths over falsified or hyped-up claims.

Yes...but Superman has the ability to get rid of Saddam and his regime without the loss of life. And he would want to help the Iraqis.

That was the point. (What the hell are we talkling about.)

 

[kal-el]

Yes...but Superman has the ability to get rid of Saddam and his regime without the loss of life. And he would want to help the Iraqis.

Yes, he has the ability to do alot. In your examples, there wouldn't be any, well maybe a few, loss of life, so if you are comparing him to us, forget it.

That was the point. (What the hell are we talkling about.)

I have no idea.:2razz:

 

[MSgt]

Yes, he has the ability to do alot. In your examples, there wouldn't be any, well maybe a few, loss of life, so if you are comparing him to us, forget it.




I have no idea.:2razz:

No I'm not comparing. This whole thing started because you remarked on the Jesus avatar as being hypocritical to his post. I mentioned the Superman avatar.


I downloaded all the Season 4 of Smallville. I'm going to try to watch it before Season 5 starts. I'm going to burn them on disks and watch them at work. YOUR TAX DOLLARS AT WORK, BABY!!!!

 

[kal-el]

No I'm not comparing. This whole thing started because you remarked on the Jesus avatar as being hypocritical to his post. I mentioned the Superman avatar.

ohh, I see

I downloaded all the Season 4 of Smallville. I'm going to try to watch it before Season 5 starts. I'm going to burn them on disks and watch them at work. YOUR TAX DOLLARS AT WORK, BABY!!!!

You won't be dissapointed my friend.It's awesome! Like I said, I can't wait till Thursday, when Season 5 starts, the premeire looks spectacular!

 

[MSgt]

ohh, I see



You won't be dissapointed my friend.It's awesome! Like I said, I can't wait till Thursday, when Season 5 starts, the premeire looks spectacular!

I couldn't watch them largely on TV, because of deployments. I never really took an interest in it because I thought it would be boring without his powers. I had a chance to watch the seasons on DVD last year in Iraq, but I didn't do it. I wish I had. I was told by a friend that Season 4 was really good and Season 5 looks like he is going to make the transition.

 

[kal-el]

I couldn't watch them largely on TV, because of deployments. I never really took an interest in it because I thought it would be boring without his powers. I had a chance to watch the seasons on DVD last year in Iraq, but I didn't do it. I wish I had. I was told by a friend that Season 4 was really good and Season 5 looks like he is going to make the transition.

Yea, I only got into it because in 2000,I was on house arrest, so I had nothing better to do, so I watched and got hooked right away. Ever since, I never missed an episode, and I have all the seasons on DVD. Yea, I think he will make the transition to Superman, but I hope Smallville dosen't end. If it does, they should continue and make a "metropolis."

 

[MSgt]

Yea, I only got into it because in 2000,I was on house arrest, so I had nothing better to do, so I watched and got hooked right away. Ever since, I never missed an episode, and I have all the seasons on DVD. Yea, I think he will make the transition to Superman, but I hope Smallville dosen't end. If it does, they should continue and make a "metropolis."

That would be interesting.

I'm outy. Some of us have to waste time at work tomorrow.

 

[icantoofly]

Here's some more about a few relatively harmless thugs.:2razz:

A booklet by the Pakistani jihadist group Lashkar-e-Taiba (Army of the Pure), believed to be linked to the recent London bombings, declares
the U.S., Israel and India as existential enemies of Islam and lists eight reasons for global jihad. These include the restoration of Islamic sovereignty to all lands where Muslims were once ascendant, including Spain, "Bulgaria, Hungary, Cyprus, Sicily, Ethiopia, Russian Turkistan and Chinese Turkistan. . . Even parts of France reaching 90 kilometers outside Paris." Blaming the U.S. for the delusions of these admittedly small groups confers a degree of legitimacy on Islamist extremists and undermines moderate Muslim struggling for the soul of their faith.

Tim Wilcox
International Investigators, Inc.
3216 N. Pennsylvania Street
Indianapolis, Indiana USA
(317)925-1496
(317)926-1177 FAX
(317)418-3875 CELL
www.internationalinvestigators.com

This from a usually reliable source:

LEADERSHIP: Al Qaeda's Plan for World Conquest

September 1, 2005: Al Qaeda has a plan, and it's been published in a
book (Al-Zarqawi: al Qaeda's Second Generation) by Jordanian journalist,
Fouad Hussein. Several al Qaeda leaders were interviewed for the book,
including al Qaeda's man in Iraq, Abu Musab al-Zarqawi. The book is
only available in Arabic, but it does lay out a very straightforward
strategy for world conquest. Actually, it sounds a lot like what the nazis
and communists had in mind last century. The only difference is that,
while the nazis killed you for who you were, and the communists killed
you for what you believed, al Qaeda kills you for religious differences.
No matter which zealot gets you, you're still dead.

According to Fouad Hussein, al Qaeda has a seven phase plan for world
conquest. It goes like this.

Phase 1, the "wakeup call." Spectacular terrorist attacks on the West
(like September 11, 2001) get the infidels (non-Moslems) to make war on
Islamic nations. This arouses Moslems, and causes them to flock to al
Qaedas banner. This phase is considered complete.

Phase 2, the "eye opening." This is the phase we are in, where al Qaeda
does battle with the infidels, and shows over a billion Moslems how
it's done. This phase is supposed to be completed by next year.

Phase 3, "the rising." Millions of aroused (in a terrorist sense)
Moslems go to war against Islam's enemies for the rest of the decade.
Especially heavy attacks are made against Israel. It is believed that
major
damage in Israel will force the world to acknowledge al Qaeda as a major
power, and negotiate with it.

Phase 4, "the downfall." By 2013, al Qaeda will control the Persian
Gulf, and all its oil, as well as most of the Middle East. This will
enable al Qaeda to cripple the American economy, and American military
power.

Phase 5, "the Caliphate." By 2016, the Caliphate (one government for
all Moslem nations) will be established. At this point, nearly all
Western cultural influences will be eliminated from Islamic nations. The
Caliphate will organize a mighty army for the next phase.

Phase 6, "world conquest." By 2022, the rest of the world will be
conquered by the righteous and unstoppable armies of Islam. This is the
phase that Osama bin Laden has been talking about for years.

Phase 7, "final victory." All the world's inhabitants will be forced to
either convert to Islam, or submit (as second class citizens) to
Islamic rule. This will be completed by 2025 or thereabouts.

Nothing really new in all this. Al Qaeda has been talking openly about
this (the global Islamic state) for years. These Islamic terrorists are
true believers. God is on their side, and they believe all obstacles
will be swept aside by the power of the Lord. Will al Qaeda's plan work?
Ask the nazis and communists.

 

[MSgt]

Here's some more about a few relatively harmless thugs.:2razz:

The American military has been screaming this for almost twenty years. Islam is determined to be at war with us. People still refuse to believe the threat. They believe that they are just misunderstood and we should apologize for our wrong doing instead of fighting them. People also refuse to believe that this is very much a regional Islamic issue and that their civilization is failing because of their hijacked religion and that it is not simply the easily explained away "rogues" of Islam.

And people are worried about an American New World Order? Ignorant politically correct fools. At this point the only thing that the appeasing western world has going for them is the fact that despite their absence, America is already in the fight and that Muslims can't even live peacably with themselves without slaughtering each other, much less unifying.

The liberal left's answer to this?......"If America would leave them alone everything would be OK. The never ending feuds between Shi'ites and Sunni won't disrupt our oil flow." Fools.

Good post.

 

[cnredd]

The American military has been screaming this for almost twenty years. People still refuse to believe the threat. They believe that they are just misunderstood and we should apologize for our wrong doing instead of fighting them. People also refuse to believe that this is very much a regional Islamic issue and that their civilization is failing because of their hijacked religion.

And people are worried about an American New World Order? Ignorant politically correct fools. At this point the only thing that the appeasing western world has going for them is the fact that despite their absence, America is already in the fight and that Muslims can't even live peacably with themselves without slaughtering each other, much less unifying.

Good post.

Agreed...icantoofly's research is very good....

This one thing that people around the world can't get through their head is that if America doesn't intervene, ALL of the Western civilized nations go down...

If GWB made a national statement on foreign policy saying that "all ties with Germany have been severed...If Islamic Fundamentalists were to attack there, we will not "meddle" in their affairs", I'm guessing the attacks would start within a month...

And the rest of Europe would still appease...and, of course, blame America...

 

[MSgt]

Fine, we have to go after Islamic terrorism. WHY IRAQ? This is an issue that's being completely ignored! Iraq wasn't a threat, it was a crappy country formed out of European stupidity that was hanging on by a thread, and thus invading them was the STUPIDEST THING WE COULD'VE DONE!!! Go after the Saudis, or the Jordanians, why the hell did we attack Iraq?
We attacked Iraq because Bush lied to us. Don't give me the crap about the CIA giving him faulty intelligence, because we all know exactly how much Bush actually cares about intelligence (thus why he ignored the intelligence about 9/11 beforehand), and also HE'S THE PRESIDENT!!! Why do we hold him to the same standard as us? He's supposed to be better than us, and know what he's frickin doing! If he mistook the intelligence, that's an even bigger problem because instead of being an evil genius, it's a confirmation of the fact that he is 100% incapable of ruling this nation, cause we stand stand for screw ups like this!!!

Dude, get it through your head. This is a Middle Eastern problem and Iraq is only one country. You should be asking why we aren't doing it everywhere else also.

 

[jallman]

Dude, get it through your head. This is a Middle Eastern problem and Iraq is only one country. You should be asking why we aren't doing it everywhere else also.

I agree, this is only the first step in what should be an all out cleansing process. The problem is...can we afford it when you look at the cost of this step alone?

 

[MSgt]

I agree, this is only the first step in what should be an all out cleansing process. The problem is...can we afford it when you look at the cost of this step alone?

Nope. Nor can we do it alone. Imagine where we would be in Iraq if Europe got off it's ass and helped.

 

[jallman]

Nope. Nor can we do it alone. Imagine where we would be in Iraq if Europe got off it's ass and helped.

They arent going to though...why should they involve themselves when bulldog america is going to do it for them? And why would they involve themselves in cleaning up their own self serving messes? Prime example...France...need I say more?

 

[icantoofly]

Fine, we have to go after Islamic terrorism. WHY IRAQ? This is an issue that's being completely ignored! Iraq wasn't a threat, it was a crappy country formed out of European stupidity that was hanging on by a thread, and thus invading them was the STUPIDEST THING WE COULD'VE DONE!!! Go after the Saudis, or the Jordanians, why the hell did we attack Iraq?
We attacked Iraq because Bush lied to us. Don't give me the crap about the CIA giving him faulty intelligence, because we all know exactly how much Bush actually cares about intelligence (thus why he ignored the intelligence about 9/11 beforehand), and also HE'S THE PRESIDENT!!! Why do we hold him to the same standard as us? He's supposed to be better than us, and know what he's frickin doing! If he mistook the intelligence, that's an even bigger problem because instead of being an evil genius, it's a confirmation of the fact that he is 100% incapable of ruling this nation, cause we stand stand for screw ups like this!!!

:roll:

I think it time for another reality check?

The Iraq Liberation Act
October 31, 1998
STATEMENT BY THE PRESIDENT
THE WHITE HOUSE
Office of the Press Secretary
For Immediate Release
October 31, 1998
STATEMENT BY THE PRESIDENT
Today I am signing into law H.R. 4655, the "Iraq Liberation Act of 1998." This Act makes clear that it is the sense of the Congress that the United States should support those elements of the Iraqi opposition that advocate a very different future for Iraq than the bitter reality of internal repression and external aggression that the current regime in Baghdad now offers.

Let me be clear on what the U.S. objectives are: The United States wants Iraq to rejoin the family of nations as a freedom-loving and law-abiding member. This is in our interest and that of our allies within the region.

The United States favors an Iraq that offers its people freedom at home. I categorically reject arguments that this is unattainable due to Iraq's history or its ethnic or sectarian make-up. Iraqis deserve and desire freedom like everyone else. The United States looks forward to a democratically supported regime that would permit us to enter into a dialogue leading to the reintegration of Iraq into normal international life.

My Administration has pursued, and will continue to pursue, these objectives through active application of all relevant United Nations Security Council resolutions. The evidence is overwhelming that such changes will not happen under the current Iraq leadership.

In the meantime, while the United States continues to look to the Security Council's efforts to keep the current regime's behavior in check, we look forward to new leadership in Iraq that has the support of the Iraqi people. The United States is providing support to opposition groups from all sectors of the Iraqi community that could lead to a popularly supported government.

On October 21, 1998, I signed into law the Omnibus Consolidated and Emergency Supplemental Appropriations Act, 1999, which made $8 million available for assistance to the Iraqi democratic opposition. This assistance is intended to help the democratic opposition unify, work together more effectively, and articulate the aspirations of the Iraqi people for a pluralistic, participa--tory political system that will include all of Iraq's diverse ethnic and religious groups. As required by the Emergency Supplemental Appropriations Act for FY 1998 (Public Law 105-174), the Department of State submitted a report to the Congress on plans to establish a program to support the democratic opposition. My Administration, as required by that statute, has also begun to implement a program to compile information regarding allegations of genocide, crimes against humanity, and war crimes by Iraq's current leaders as a step towards bringing to justice those directly responsible for such acts.

The Iraq Liberation Act of 1998 provides additional, discretionary authorities under which my Administration can act to further the objectives I outlined above. There are, of course, other important elements of U.S. policy. These include the maintenance of U.N. Security Council support efforts to eliminate Iraq's weapons and missile programs and economic sanctions that continue to deny the regime the means to reconstitute those threats to international peace and security. United States support for the Iraqi opposition will be carried out consistent with those policy objectives as well. Similarly, U.S. support must be attuned to what the opposition can effectively make use of as it develops over time. With those observations, I sign H.R. 4655 into law.
WILLIAM J. CLINTON
THE WHITE HOUSE,
October 31, 1998.
www.library.cornell.edu/colldev/mideast/libera.htm

The Clinton administration was facing the possibility of major combat operations against Iraq. Since 1996, the UN inspections regime had been increasingly obstructed by Saddam Hussein. The United States was threatening to attack unless unfettered inspections could resume. The Clinton administration eventually launched a large-scale set of air strikes against Iraq. Operation Desert Fox, in December 1998. These military commitments became the context in which the Clinton administration had to consider opening another front of military engagement against a new terrorist threat based in Afghanistan.

I previously posted:

PRIOR TO OUR INVASION OF IRAQ

Pakistan:
1. government's average daily mass murder rate of its civilians was low.
2. government agreed to USA request to remove al Qaeda from its midst.
3. no active al Qaeda training camps in its midst at time of Iraq invasion.

Saudi Arabia:
1. government's average daily mass murder rate of its civilians was low.
2. government agreed to USA request to remove al Qaeda from its midst.
3. no active al Qaeda training camps in its midst at time of Iraq invasion.

Iran:
1. government's average daily mass murder rate of its civilians was low.
2. government agreed to USA request to remove al Qaeda from its midst.
3. no active al Qaeda training camps in its midst at time of Iraq invasion.

Syria:
1. government's average daily mass murder rate of its civilians was low.
2. government agreed to USA request to remove al Qaeda from its midst.
3. no active al Qaeda training camps in its midst at time of Iraq invasion.

Afghanistan:
1. government's average daily mass murder rate of its civilians was not low.
2. government ignored USA request to remove al Qaeda from its midst.
3. active al Qaeda training camps in its midst at time of its invasion.

Iraq:
1. government's average daily mass murder rate of its civilians was high.
2. government ignored USA request to remove al Qaeda from its midst.
3. active al Qaeda training camps in its midst at time of Iraq invasion.

Because at the time of USA invasion of Afghanistan, Iraq did not yet have active al Qaeda training camps in its midst, Afghanistan was first choice for invasion, and Iraq was second choice. But at the time of USA invasion of Iraq, Iraq did have active al Qaeda training camps in its midst. Iraq had thereby graduated to first choice among the remaining candidates for invasion.

USA currently lacks sufficient military resources to invade those countries that have failed to keep their agreement with USA to remove al Qaeda from their midsts.

I previously posted:

FACTS

The Islamic Movement in Kurdistan is an Iraqi political party.
Some more radical members joined the al-Queda aligned Ansar al-Islam.
These two sentences were excerpted from: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_Movement_in_Kurdistan

Ansar al-Islam is an Islamist group, promoting a radical interpretation of Islam and holy war.
At the beginning of the 2003 invasion of Iraq it controlled about a dozen villages and a range of peaks in northern Iraq on the Iranian border.
It was formed in December 2001 as a merger of Jund al-Islam (Soldiers of Islam), led by Abu Abdallah al-Shafi'i, and a splinter group from the Islamic Movement in Kurdistan led by Mullah Krekar.
These three sentences were excerpted from: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ansar_al-Islam

I previously posted:

FACTS

05/19/1996: Bin Laden leaves Sudan and returns to Afghanistan.

5 years, 3 months, 23 days later
09/11/2001: Osama’s al Qaeda perpetrates terrorist attack on USA.

The night of 9/11, the President broadcast to the nation that we will not distinguish between terrorists and those who harbor them.

1 month, 9 days later.
10/20/2001: USA invades Afghanistan.

Did the USA wait to long?

2 months later.
12/20/2001: Osama’s al Qaeda establishes training base in Iraq.

1 year, 3 months later.
03/20/2003: USA invades Iraq including al Qaeda’s expanded training bases in northern Iraq.

Should the USA have waited longer?

 

[BJHOUGH]

:roll: :doh :2razz: IF WE DID NOT GO TO IRAQ,THEY WOULD OF BEEN HERE-----THEY GOT AWAY WITH THE FIRST TIME THEY HIT THE TOWERS---THEY GOT AWAY WITH BOMBING THE SHIP [ALL ON CLINTON WATCH] THAK GOD WE HAVE A REAL MAN IN THE WHITE HOUSE THAT IS NOT SCARED OF THE BUNCH OF RAG HEADS!!!!!!!

 

[MSgt]

They arent going to though...why should they involve themselves when bulldog america is going to do it for them? And why would they involve themselves in cleaning up their own self serving messes? Prime example...France...need I say more?

Nope. "France" about say's it.

 

[MSgt]

:roll:

I think it time for another reality check?





I previously posted:


I previously posted:


I previously posted:

DAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[kal-el]

:roll: :doh :2razz: IF WE DID NOT GO TO IRAQ,THEY WOULD OF BEEN HERE-----THEY GOT AWAY WITH THE FIRST TIME THEY HIT THE TOWERS---THEY GOT AWAY

Dude, Iraq didn't get away with anything. I think you mean al-Qeada.

 

[MSgt]

:roll: :doh :2razz: IF WE DID NOT GO TO IRAQ,THEY WOULD OF BEEN HERE-----THEY GOT AWAY WITH THE FIRST TIME THEY HIT THE TOWERS---THEY GOT AWAY WITH BOMBING THE SHIP [ALL ON CLINTON WATCH] THAK GOD WE HAVE A REAL MAN IN THE WHITE HOUSE THAT IS NOT SCARED OF THE BUNCH OF RAG HEADS!!!!!!!

As soon as people realize that 9/11 and every terrorist attack in the last thirty years has been a regional thing and not the act of "rogues", the sooner we can get a steady course of action. But I suspect people will continue to be blind and we will suffer some more 9/11's eventually before this happens.

Taking the drugs dealer (Bin Laden, Zarqawi, Kadafi, etc) off of the streets will not stop the drug flow (the Middle East).

 

[Trajan Octavian Titus]

Why did we invade Iraq?

To kill terrorists in the war on terror which wether you agree or disagree with going to Iraq in the first place you have to concede that we are infact killing terrorists. You don't want to fight them here and honestly we had no other legal pretext to invade any other country in the mid-east and I don't think you give the Bush administration enough credit do you not think the DOD and the former Secretary of State Collin Powell didn't know that Al-Qaeda would declare a Jihad to try and fight us? I even knew that they would, that's what they do, that's what they've done for 1,000's of years, how else would we draw out an army with no nation? It's all going according to plan you people just can't see the big picture.

 

[scottyz]

Why did we invade Iraq?

To kill terrorists in the war on terror which wether you agree or disagree with going to Iraq in the first place you have to concede that we are infact killing terrorists.

Allawi had stated that only 30% of the insurgents are foreigners. The other 70% is made up of Iraqis.

 

[MSgt]

Why did we invade Iraq?

To kill terrorists in the war on terror which wether you agree or disagree with going to Iraq in the first place you have to concede that we are infact killing terrorists. You don't want to fight them here and honestly we had no other legal pretext to invade any other country in the mid-east and I don't think you give the Bush administration enough credit do you not think the DOD and the former Secretary of State Collin Powell didn't know that Al-Qaeda would declare a Jihad to try and fight us? I even knew that they would, that's what they do, that's what they've done for 1,000's of years, how else would we draw out an army with no nation? It's all going according to plan you people just can't see the big picture.

Very insightful.

 

[Trajan Octavian Titus]

Allawi had stated that only 30% of the insurgents are foreigners. The other 70% is made up of Iraqis.

Former Baathists? Kill them too, and I've heard this percentage used before and have still not understood how one would be able to poll such a question but hay believe anything you want.