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A Question for the Skeptics...

Overitall said:
If you were writing about the history of your people you might be justified. However, knowing that your captors weren't keen on recording history that reflects them negatively or in defeat it's very likely Americans would try to suppress that history. Even today you have groups of people trying to wipe out history that doesn't make us look good.

If you had bothered to read through the article you might have found that historical aspect presented as to why you don't see a record of Hebrew's enslavement in Egyptian history.
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You think the only archaeological evidence that would support Hebrew slaves in Egypt or the Exodus are Egyptian writings?
 
Questerr said:
You think the only archaeological evidence that would support Hebrew slaves in Egypt or the Exodus are Egyptian writings?
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Not at all. However, I doubt the exodus of slaves out of Egypt would merit much historical attention by Egyptian or other historians and yet there is some written evidence that Hebrews were slaves in Egypt that left as a group. You might just be hung up with numbers.

www.haaretz.com

Were Hebrews ever slaves in ancient Egypt? Yes

Ancient Egypt Had Intimate Relations With Canaan, and Most of the Semitic Peoples Migrating There Would Have Been Canaanite. But Not All.
www.haaretz.com www.haaretz.com
The absence of evidence of a sojourn in the wilderness proves nothing. A Semitic group in flight wouldn't have left direct evidence: They would not have built cities, built monuments or done anything but leave footprints in the desert sand.
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Also, the Egyptians were not above altering historical records when the truth proved to be embarrassing or went against their political interests. It was not the praxis of the pharaohs to advertise their failures on temple walls for all to see. When Thutmose III came to power, he tried to obliterate the memory of his predecessor, Hatshepsut. Her inscriptions were erased, her obelisks surrounded by a wall, and her monuments were forgotten. Her name does not appear in later annals.
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History does depend on who's writing it. The Hebrews weren't a very popular group of people in antiquity. Anything recorded by them would be considered unreliable. Somewhat like the way you dismissed my earlier source.
 
Overitall said:
Not at all. However, I doubt the exodus of slaves out of Egypt would merit much historical attention by Egyptian or other historians and yet there is some written evidence that Hebrews were slaves in Egypt that left as a group. You might just be hung up with numbers.

www.haaretz.com

Were Hebrews ever slaves in ancient Egypt? Yes

Ancient Egypt Had Intimate Relations With Canaan, and Most of the Semitic Peoples Migrating There Would Have Been Canaanite. But Not All.
www.haaretz.com www.haaretz.com


History does depend on who's writing it. The Hebrews weren't a very popular group of people in antiquity. Anything recorded by them would be considered unreliable. Somewhat like the way you dismissed my earlier source.
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Millions of people wandering around a desert for decades would leave evidence. The Bedouins leave lots of archaeological evidence throughout their entire history.
 
Questerr said:
Millions of people wandering around a desert for decades would leave evidence. The Bedouins leave lots of archaeological evidence throughout their entire history.
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Like I said - you're hung up on numbers. And your response indicates to me that I'm wasting my time citing sources for my position. You didn't read it.
 
Elora said:
Yeah, suicide kinda defeats the purpose of spreading your message...😊
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Sure didn't attract any new followers to that other cult. That's why I asked whatever happened to the cult. :)
 
Elora said:
Jesus’ disciples went from being fearful of death, to being willing to die for their belief that Jesus rose from the dead...if Jesus didn’t rise...what do you think changed their mind?
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Words.

That's all it took to convince you.
 
Overitall said:
Like I said - you're hung up on numbers. And your response indicates to me that I'm wasting my time citing sources for my position. You didn't read it.
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The numbers are the core of the claim. The Bible claims THE ENTIRE HEBREW TRIBE OF MILLIONS OF PEOPLE wandered through the Sinai for decades. That would leave tons of evidence if it happened.
 
Questerr said:
The numbers are the core of the claim. The Bible claims THE ENTIRE HEBREW TRIBE OF MILLIONS OF PEOPLE wandered through the Sinai for decades. That would leave tons of evidence if it happened.
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That's one interpretation. I presented you with another.
 
Questerr said:
The Bible isn’t using coded language. It makes its claim pretty clear.
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Yea, but the Bible doesn't have its origin in the English language.
 
Overitall said:
Yea, but the Bible doesn't have its origin in the English language.
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That doesn’t matter. The claim made by the Bible is that the entire Hebrew tribe, made up of hundreds of thousands to millions of people, wandered through the Sinai for decades.

That would leave evidence behind. The Bedouins have left evidence in the same areas for thousands of years and they have far smaller numbers.
 
Questerr said:
That doesn’t matter.
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It surely does. The way a word is translated into another language makes all the difference between truth and error.
Questerr said:
The claim made by the Bible is that the entire Hebrew tribe, made up of hundreds of thousands to millions of people, wandered through the Sinai for decades.

That would leave evidence behind. The Bedouins have left evidence in the same areas for thousands of years and they have far smaller numbers.
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Do you know what the Arabic word for Bedouin means? The Hebrews were not Bedouins.
 
Overitall said:
It surely does. The way a word is translated into another language makes all the difference between truth and error.

Do you know what the Arabic word for Bedouin means? The Hebrews were not Bedouins.
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I know the Hebrews weren’t Bedouins. I brought the Bedouins up because they have moved through the Sinai for thousands of years in far smaller numbers than the Hebrew Exodus and we have tons of archaeological evidence of their migrations.

There’s a reason why I’m saying “hundreds of thousands to millions”. Because the Hebrew words used to refer to the size of the group moving through the Sinai after the Exodus don’t have exact meanings. But this was no tiny group of people.
 
Questerr said:
I know the Hebrews weren’t Bedouins. I brought the Bedouins up because they have moved through the Sinai for thousands of years in far smaller numbers than the Hebrew Exodus and we have tons of archaeological evidence of their migrations.

There’s a reason why I’m saying “hundreds of thousands to millions”. Because the Hebrew words used to refer to the size of the group moving through the Sinai after the Exodus don’t have exact meanings.
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Then why do you think the translators chose to translate the word in the way they did? Sounds more impressive to claim millions were involved in the Exodus than just thousands, doesn't it? The numbers don't matter, it's the deliverance of God's chosen people that does.
Questerr said:
But this was no tiny group of people.
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KevinKohler said:
Words.

Like the words Joseph believed when Mary needed to escape being stoned to death for infedelity.
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Only a fool would not believe the words of an angel...
 
Elora said:
Jesus’ disciples went from being fearful of death, to being willing to die for their belief that Jesus rose from the dead...if Jesus didn’t rise...what do you think changed their mind?
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It would seem a question worthy of consideration, but it is not.
Have not followers of unspeakable evil also been delighted to sacrifice their lives for a cause?
You either have faith in the message or you don't. No need for silly games.
 
Elora said:
Only a fool would not believe the words of an angel...
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Ever play telephone?

Only a fool would believe his wife got pregnant via immaculate conception while he was away on a business trip.

Seriously. Ask yourself, why aren't unfaithful women the world over making that claim?

Because people aren't that stupid anymore.
 
HK.227 said:
It would seem a question worthy of consideration, but it is not.
Have not followers of unspeakable evil also been delighted to sacrifice their lives for a cause?
You either have faith in the message or you don't. No need for silly games.
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I've thought about what changed the all-too-human Peter and the other disciples from being cowardly to becoming fearless in the face of death. Something happened to transform them. It's not a game to wonder, particularly if you're a non-theist, what that something was.
 
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