18- to 20-year-olds can’t be barred from buying handguns, judge rules

[iguanaman]

Protection doesn't always involve shooting someone. I daresay most gun owners hope it doesn't come to that.

You "left out" something that would make your statement completely different from what you actually said.

Protection always involves the ability to shoot someone if a gun is involved right? I also think most people know what guns are for too. Even the ones that treat them like toys.

 

[RF667799]

Protection always involves the ability to shoot someone if a gun is involved right? I also think most people know what guns are for too. Even the ones that treat them like toys.

So what? It doesn't always involve shooting someone.

You're trying to deflect from your original claim though.

 

[iguanaman]

So what? It doesn't always involve shooting someone.

You're trying to deflect from your original claim though.

You really are arguing that people do not know that guns can be used to kill people?

 

[RF667799]

You really are arguing that people do not know that guns can be used to kill people?

Not at all, and nothing I said should lead you to think that is what I'm arguing.

I was actually done once I showed your original claim was false. Your continued attempt to deflect from it is just icing on the cake.

 

[jaeger19]

Most states have special programs intended to encourage new hunters.

My own state allows new hunters to participate their first year without taking the normally required hunter safety course. There are also special hunts and areas limited to youthful hunters.

Yes. I took advantage of the " mentored hunter " program in two states when my boys were young ( 9 yo)
It was a great way to get them a taste of hunting before they went to hunters education so that when they went to hunters education it had more situational meaning for them.
I have used tge program to become a mentor to several kids...and that has made some of them get interested in hunting when they might not have before.

 

[jaeger19]

So you think less people taking up hunting every year for decades indicate what then? That it is not dying?

Exactly. It's indicative of an aging population that is aging out of hunting.

 

[Nickyjo]

Conflating possession of a car with use of public highways is a common move when attempting to weasel out of the "Let's do it like cars!" argument.

A car can be bought without a license. Without training. Sorry you don't like those facts, and no longer like your own argument.

So buy your guns, but don’t use them without a license.

 

[RF667799]

So buy your guns, but don’t use them without a license.

I use them on private property.

 

[Nickyjo]

I use them on private property.

Fine, do so, much as you can drive a car without a license on private property.

 

[RF667799]

Fine, do so, much as you can drive a car without a license on private property.

The entire point.

You do know that private property includes most gun ranges and many or most hunting opportunities, right?

 

[Lursa]

So no background checks for purchase, in fact no prohibition for felons, abusers, etc. No licensing for use on private property. No registration for use on private property. "Red flag" laws are out. Possession and use on private property is virtually unhindered.

For use on the public commons, a license would be required but a 16 year old could obtain that license. Liability insurance protecting oneself against accidents would be required. Unjustified use of a gun to shoot other people, vandalize, etc. would be prohibited.

It certainly takes several incidents harming others in most cases before a license privilege is removed. Including for drunk drivers.

 

[RF667799]

It certainly takes several incidents harming others in most cases before a license privilege is removed. Including for drunk drivers.

And even then, the car isn't generally removed. It sits there in the driveway until the guy gets drunk enough to get brave enough to drive it without a license.

 

[iguanaman]

Exactly. It's indicative of an aging population that is aging out of hunting.

And the young are not becoming hunters as much as they used to.

 

[Ahlevah]

OK which countries with similar average incomes are they leaving out? Here is the full OECD list.

Um, maybe you’re not aware of this, but the country at the top of the list? It has one gun store.

 

[iguanaman]

Um, maybe you’re not aware of this, but the country at the top of the list? It has one gun store.

Uh maybe you are not aware of the fact that Mexico gets most of it's guns from the US. We are one huge gun store for them.

 

[RF667799]

Uh maybe you are not aware of the fact that Mexico gets most of it's guns from the US. We are one huge gun store for them.

Really? You wouldn't try to support that by referencing the guns traced by the ATF, would you?

 

[ttwtt78640]

Allen, Texas is an affluent exurb. Uvalde, Texas is rural.

Neither mass of those mass shootings involved use of a handgun and only one involved a young adult shooter.

 

[Bok Tuklo]

Neither mass of those mass shootings involved use of a handgun and only one involved a young adult shooter.

I was addressing the contention that gun violence is an urban problem in the United States. It isn’t. Not even primarily.

 

[iguanaman]

Really? You wouldn't try to support that by referencing the guns traced by the ATF, would you?

​

American gunmakers have so much blood and death on their hands it is a wonder they don't spontaneously burst into flames.

Guns Recovered by Mexico’s Military Come Mostly From U.S. Makers​

In the wake of a judge's decision to throw out the Mexican government's lawsuit against the gun industry, data shows American companies produce the weapons driving cartel violence.

https://www.thetrace.org/2022/10/how-many-american-guns-mexican-cartels/

 

[RF667799]

​

American gunmakers have so much blood and death on their hands it is a wonder they don't spontaneously burst into flames.

Guns Recovered by Mexico’s Military Come Mostly From U.S. Makers​

In the wake of a judge's decision to throw out the Mexican government's lawsuit against the gun industry, data shows American companies produce the weapons driving cartel violence.

https://www.thetrace.org/2022/10/how-many-american-guns-mexican-cartels/

Do you think they would submit an old Eastern Bloc gun to the ATF for tracing?

As to American guns...why so many Colts? I wonder who supplies the Mexican government with firearms?

 

[ttwtt78640]

I was addressing the contention that gun violence is an urban problem in the United States. It isn’t. Not even primarily.

That ignores reality. Crime (armed or not) requires a criminal and a victim. Since more people (both perps and potential victims) live in more densely populated (urban and their nearby suburbs) areas that’s where crime is concentrated.

 

[Bok Tuklo]

That ignores reality. Crime (armed or not) requires a criminal and a victim. Since more people (both perps and potential victims) live in more densely populated (urban and their nearby suburbs) areas that’s where crime is concentrated.

No. That’s where people are concentrated. Your argument is tautological. Crime still occurs where fewer people live. More often than not at a higher rate.

 

[jaeger19]

And the young are not becoming hunters as much as they used to.

Hmmm.
"The number of youth hunters between 6 and 17 has grown by a whopping 60% from 2007 to 2017. At the same time, the growth in hunting participation in the general population has stayed relatively level.".

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[ttwtt78640]

No. That’s where people are concentrated. Your argument is tautological. Crime still occurs where fewer people live. More often than not at a higher rate.

That’s simply not so generally, at least in Texas. Obviously there are some exceptions. For example, I live in Hays County, TX (ranked 101st) while immediately to the north is Travis County, TX (containing Austin ranked 11th).

Texas Counties: Crime Rate in 2020

Texas counties listed in order of the overall crime rate in 2020.

www.texascounties.net

 

[Ahlevah]

Uh maybe you are not aware of the fact that Mexico gets most of it's guns from the US. We are one huge gun store for them.

What’s “most”? Can you give me a percentage and a source? And are you saying that the cartels and criminals are actually smuggling guns, too? They didn’t turn in their guns like the law told them to