‘I literally lost organs:’ Why detransitioned teens regret changing genders

[CLAX1911]

It's not anyone's duty to protect people from the consequences of their own dumb choices. In fact, I would say we have a responsibility to ensure that people do face the consequences of their actions.

So being transgender is a dumb choice. This goes against thee it's not a choice thing and I believe some transgender people will take issue with that.

A consequences of this very unethical practice is somebody's life is destroyed.

You should err on the side of not destroying human bodies.

 

[Lisa]

So being transgender is a dumb choice. This goes against thee it's not a choice thing and I believe some transgender people will take issue with that.

A consequences of this very unethical practice is somebody's life is destroyed.

You should err on the side of not destroying human bodies.

For the vast majority of people their transition and surgery improved their life to a great extent, so not doing it would destroy their life. The system is not perfect, just like the rest of the medical field. Trans patients are informed of the risks all of the way though the process and can opt-out or stop any time that they want to.

Nobody chooses to be trans, just as you didn't choose to be gay.

 

[CLAX1911]

Okay yes they are. Do a little more digging than just accepting what you were told to believe.

It's a virtue signal. I ran into this when I came out a lot of people treated me different like that I needed to be treated as a kid gloss but I have one friend that still make gay jokes, that was the friend that was the most approving you didn't have to change who he was and I didn't expect him to I expected him to treat me and just like he always had.

Virtue signal attacks that because they want to show how woke/sophisticated/enlightened they are. And that's why you have white knights they trying to get approval.

 

[CLAX1911]

For the vast majority of people their transition and surgery improved their life to a great extent, so not doing it would destroy their life.

right so there's a certain amount of people in the population that really do suffer with gender dysphoria and whatever they need to feel content with their lives should be available.

Up until very recently this has been a very miniscule part of the population. Women started seeing it explode when it became trendy who started seeing transgender regret. Tried to transition and changed his mind.

So with transgenderism becoming incredibly trendy chances of this regret is going to go up in the destroyed lives because of it is going to go up I get caring about transgender people and that's important.

But not at the expensive people who are not transgender.

The system is not perfect, just like the rest of the medical field.

yeah but I think it was better when people really had to work hard to show that they were actually transgender.

But it seems like because we're talking hundreds and thousands of dollars probably a billion dollar industry the caring for people no longer matters.

We should make sure people need a treatment before we give it to them.

Trans patients are informed of the risks all of the way though the process and can opt-out or stop any time that they want to.

that's not what people who have been through transitions say.

I'll listen to them because they know better than you.

Again I dated a guy that had stopped the transition.

Nobody chooses to be trans, just as you didn't choose to be gay.

I understand your virtue signal it just doesn't seem enlightened to me it seems like a chant you are programs to repeat.

Tulsa you're a bit of a hypocrite in this regard because over the time I've known you, you thought it was your duty to keep reminding me that I was gay and repeatedly tell me that I'm supposedly gay as if I forgot. I say homophobic thing to do so your virtue signal is a lie.

 

[Mina]

‘I literally lost organs:’ Why detransitioned teens regret changing genders

A look at the alarming rise of teens who are changing genders and then “detransitioning” back.

nypost.com

THIS, please @Lisa and a few others PRO-Transitioning kids, read this. This is the thing I and others fear. This tells you what we are worried about. Even if you disagree, read the words of these kids.

Does anyone have any data on what percentage of people who transition later regret it?

 

[CLAX1911]

Does anyone have any data on what percentage of people who transition later regret it?

40% suicide rate.

Also depending on what study you look at 75 to 80% of people grow out of this you're making sure that that's zero to intervene with butchery. But as long as the medical practitioners can let there be accessed yes and suffering of no concern.

 

[Renae]

Does anyone have any data on what percentage of people who transition later regret it?

It's picking up steam in terms of how many, go read the reddit r/transregret for some real world understanding and examples.

 

[CLAX1911]

It's picking up steam in terms of how many, go read the reddit r/transregret for some real world understanding and examples.

It's not just picking up steam it's a full blown fad. I would think that would be far more insulting to trans person went through the therapy and went through the channels and did the personal growth that took to become transitioned and happy with themselves.

And all these white feminist types claiming to be transgender but non-binary which doesn't mean anything to fulfill a fad.

It's like the people that pretend they have autism or tourette syndrome that's more insulting to someone that has that then someone who calls them names.

And it's because it turns a legitimate thing into a joke.

 

[Mina]

40% suicide rate.

Is there data on the suicide rate of those who want transition but are denied it? How does it compare?

Also depending on what study you look at 75 to 80% of people grow out of this you're making sure that that's zero to intervene with butchery. But as long as the medical practitioners can let there be accessed yes and suffering of no concern.

What I'd be interested in is what percentage grow out of it AFTER they've been wanting transition for long enough to actually have gone through with surgical changes. It's one thing to say 80% grow out of it, if you mean 80% of people who briefly flirt with the idea of being the other gender eventually decide otherwise. But how about those who, as in this story, had spent three full years in the same mindset? Do we have data on how likely it is, at that stage, for a person to change his or her mind?

 

[Mina]

It's picking up steam in terms of how many, go read the reddit r/transregret for some real world understanding and examples.

There's no knowing how many cases on reddit are genuine, rather than anti-trans activists trying to create cautionary tales to support their political objectives. I'm looking less for Internet anecdotes and more for peer reviewed studies.

 

[CLAX1911]

Is there data on the suicide rate of those who want transition but are denied it? How does it compare?

Maybe you should look.

What I'd be interested in is what percentage grow out of it AFTER they've been wanting transition for long enough to actually have gone through with surgical changes.

I agree there needs to be more research before we surgically cripple people.

It's one thing to say 80% grow out of it, if you mean 80% of people who briefly flirt with the idea of being the other gender eventually decide otherwise. But how about those who, as in this story, had spent three full years in the same mindset? Do we have data on how likely it is, at that stage, for a person to change his or her mind?

Well in the future we might get the chance to have that data and the people that provided it will be suffering.

 

[CLAX1911]

There's no knowing how many cases on reddit are genuine, rather than anti-trans activists trying to create cautionary tales to support their political objectives. I'm looking less for Internet anecdotes and more for peer reviewed studies.

So there has to be immense amounts of unethical behavior before you believe it's unethical?

Because you think there's people who transitioned for politics.

How's the weather on Mars

 

[Mina]

Maybe you should look.

I tried, but wasn't able to find anything.

I agree there needs to be more research before we surgically cripple people.

I'm not clear on how much research there's been. That's something I'm trying to locate.

Well in the future we might get the chance to have that data and the people that provided it will be suffering.

Well, in the future, we might have data and suffering in either direction (e.g., there might be some large avoidable body count from extra suicides by people who wanted to transition but were denied or excessively delayed). The stakes are pretty high either way.

 

[Mina]

So there has to be immense amounts of unethical behavior before you believe it's unethical?

What makes you think it's unethical?

Because you think there's people who transitioned for politics.

No. I'm saying I think there are people on Reddit who aren't who they say they are. Anyone who has argued online for long has encountered those accounts that are conveniently whatever identity is needed to personally aver whatever is at stake. I had fun once going back through another forum's archives for a particular poster and pulling posts where the person claimed to be a Vietnam Vet at one point, but also to have been a kid in the 80's. Basically, his identity shifted depending on whether he needed to claim first-hand authority to establish a point about Vietnam, or one about the wonders of childhood in the Reagan years. I can certainly see an anonymous anti-trans person posing as a de-trans account online in order to serve up "first hand" horror stories about trans people regretting their decisions.

 

[buck]

What does "90% success rate" mean? You have some kind of evidence that 90% of transgenders who get the drugs, hormones and surgeries are proven to be better off than if they did get them? You found good scientific evidence for that? One small biased short term study? Multiple large long term quality studies? How come you don't support your statements with links?

If you look at what she provided, you will find she has some big time reading comprehension issues. What she quoted does not say what she claims it says" "93% success rate" vs "93% of the studies we analyzed". There are additional problems with her cite, but whatever.

Additionally, you asked aboue detransitioners. What she linked has nothing to do with detransition rates and the studies they analyzed would not have even included detransitioners. Basically, there is a near complete lack of information on detransition rates in the medical and scientific literature. We simply know that there are growing numbers of detransitioners.

 

[Lisa]

It's picking up steam in terms of how many, go read the reddit r/transregret for some real world understanding and examples.

Do you believe absolutly what you read on Reddit? Trolls and transphobes making it up .................., just maybe?

 

[CLAX1911]

What makes you think it's unethical?

because it removes organs and destroys reproductive systems that aren't causing any issues with health it's doing harm when it's unnecessary the basic for ethics is first Do no harm.

How can you think it's the slightest bit ethical to put your people like this when they're 15 years old?

No. I'm saying I think there are people on Reddit who aren't who they say they are.

so you think the only place where you find detrans people is on Reddit I've seen multiple interviews with them and their scars are visible is that all one Reddit and is it all fake as well?

I dated a guy years ago that had started transitioning and then he stopped was that just on Reddit?

Anyone who has argued online for long has encountered those accounts that are conveniently whatever identity is needed to personally aver whatever is at stake.

you would have a point if I haven't actually seen these people in real life are they do exist. And with how we're all going crazy about this trans nonsense there's going to be a lot more of them and it's going to be undeniable I can't believe you need immense amounts of unethical behavior in order to believe that it's unethical.

Is there a world where you think that it's at that go to intentionally cripple somebody you have a clue at ethics are?

These aren't anonymous people on Reddit they have spoken up and they're well known so you don't have a point you might have if it was just on Reddit but it isn't.

 

[CLAX1911]

I tried, but wasn't able to find anything.

so apparently we need to butcher some more people to get you the data you need to be convinced that butchering people is not good.

I'm not clear on how much research there's been. That's something I'm trying to locate.

I'm not sure there needs to be too much research done on it why not let's error on the side of first Do no harm so chemically castrating children and then chopping them up probably shouldn't happen unless we're absolutely certain that it needs to.

This rational reasonable well-guided approach doesn't take any studies all it takes is using your brain for more than just keeping your ears from violently slamming together.

Well, in the future, we might have data and suffering in either direction (e.g., there might be some large avoidable body count from extra suicides by people who wanted to transition but were denied or excessively delayed). The stakes are pretty high either way.

we definitely will have data in the future of how unethical unethical behavior is and maybe then it will convince you we shouldn't be castrating children but I don't know why you need that sort of thing. Sounds like kind of thing Joseph mangala would do.

 

[Lisa]

If you look at what she provided, you will find she has some big time reading comprehension issues. What she quoted does not say what she claims it says" "93% success rate" vs "93% of the studies we analyzed". There are additional problems with her cite, but whatever.

Additionally, you asked about detransitioners. What she linked has nothing to do with detransition rates and the studies they analyzed would not have even included detransitioners. Basically, there is a near complete lack of information on detransition rates in the medical and scientific literature. We simply know that there are growing numbers of detransitioners.

You were saying........

Rule(s): In a systematic literature review of all peer-reviewed articles published in English between 1991 and June 2017 that assess the effect of gender transition on transgender well-being, Cornell University found that “[r]egrets following gender transition are extremely rare and have become even rarer as both surgical techniques and social support have improved. Pooling data from numerous studies demonstrates a regret rate ranging from .3 percent to 3.8 percent. Regrets are most likely to result from a lack of social support after transition or poor surgical outcomes using older techniques.”

What does the scholarly research say about the effect of gender transition on transgender well-being? | What We Know

Overview We conducted a systematic literature review of all peer-reviewed articles published in English between 1991 and June 2017 that assess the effect of gender transition on transgender well-being. We identified 55 studies that consist of primary research on this topic, of which 51 (93%)...

whatweknow.inequality.cornell.edu

Your beloved Swedish study was never about diagnosed transgender teens or people. It was about children and teen who were non-traditional gender conforming which means that gay, bi non binary and trans children/teens were all part of that study. The fact that most of them were not trans is not in any way surprising. This has been pointed out to you multiple times but you ignore it because it doesn't support the conservative propaganda that you have been fed for over a year.

 

[Renae]

Do you believe absolutly what you read on Reddit? Trolls and transphobes making it up .................., just maybe?

Lisa, you wont' even bother looking so why should I bother answering? Yes it's all made up, it's a BIG RIGHT WING CONSPERIACY!!! You figured it out...
Holy hells to live with head in sand so deep

We're not against Transfolk getting the care, support and love they need.
We are saying "woah now, kids need to be carefully treated and we're saying there are issues"

You dismiss any concerns out of hand, with nary a care in the world. It's, almost obscene.

 

[Roadvirus]

No it isn't. The children decided that they were transgender. They decided to transition. They could have made a different choice. They could have waited, or stopped, but they didn't. That's on them.

It's also on the doctors who did the irreversible surgeries.

 

[Roadvirus]

I said it once, and i'll say it again: Minors should not be subjected to life-altering, irreversible transgender surgical procedures & not given hormone blockers when their effects on minors are still under scrutiny. It is not transphobic, despite what some say. It is common sense. If they are having "identity issues", then parents should invest in shrinks until their kid is over the age of 18 and is 100% sure he/she wants to cut certain parts off or whatever.

 

[buck]

You were saying........


Regrets are most likely to result from a lack of social support after transition or poor surgical outcomes using older

As you know by now, that is from the usts. To be included in that survey, you had to "currently identify as Transgender". While I suspect you won't be able to figure out the problem with trying to use "currently identify as trans" to determine detransition details... others should have no issue.

Also as you know by now, majorities of detransitioners said their decision to detransition was due to a realization that their dysphoria was due to something else. We discussed this. It was linked to you. You can't remember it.

Your beloved Swedish study was never about diagnosed transgender teens or people. It was about children and teen who were non-traditional gender conforming which means that gay, bi non binary and trans children/teens were all part of that study. The fact that most of them were not trans is not in any way surprising. This has been pointed out to you multiple times but you ignore it because it doesn't support the conservative propaganda that you have been fed for over a year.

1: there are 11 studies reaching the same conclusion. Many have already been discussed here. Some even had the kids saying they wanted to be the opposite sex (we discussed that too, with quotes from the cite.).

2: They did a reanalyis on the study you are discussing and found that of those that met the criteria for dysphoria in the dsm5 over 60% desisted. We've discussed this before. I assume you just can't remember again.

 

[CLAX1911]

Lisa, you wont' even bother looking so why should I bother answering? Yes it's all made up, it's a BIG RIGHT WING CONSPERIACY!!! You figured it out...
Holy hells to live with head in sand so deep

We're not against Transfolk getting the care, support and love they need.
We are saying "woah now, kids need to be carefully treated and we're saying there are issues"

You dismiss any concerns out of hand, with nary a care in the world. It's, almost obscene.

She tried to deny my identity because I didn't agree with her.

Don't be surprised if she says you are supposedly trans. I've been here long enough to have remembered you before you came out. Lisa hasn't and narcissism seems to be a big part of politics these days.

 

[Lisa]

Lisa, you wont' even bother looking so why should I bother answering? Yes it's all made up, it's a BIG RIGHT WING CONSPERIACY!!! You figured it out...
Holy hells to live with head in sand so deep

We're not against Transfolk getting the care, support and love they need.
We are saying "woah now, kids need to be carefully treated and we're saying there are issues"

You dismiss any concerns out of hand, with nary a care in the world. It's, almost obscene.

I'm not pushing anything on anyone. You seem to be convinced that they fact that I am not gatekeeping or denying effective care until the age of 18 that I am being too aggressive, reckless and supposedly part of some nonsense trans agenda that doesn't ever exist. It should be pragamtic diagnosis by an experienced pediatric psychologist or psychiatrist over 5-8 appointments before any hormones or anti-androgens beginning at 12-14 at the very earliest, usually later. I read Reddit on occasion but I don't take anything I read on there as fact until it can be verified by outside sources. The idea of claimed huge numbers of de-trans people, either teens or adults cannot be verified by fact. The number is in the single digits and the system seems to be working because the vast majority of patients who seek trans care have their lives improved.




Do you have any regrets, because your ideas seem to be a mask on the fact that you might have some regrets?