Yesterday, in the middle of summer, greenland gained a record-smashing 4 gigatons of snow and ice (1 Viewer)

[Aberro]

Yesterday, in the middle of Summer, Greenland Gained a Record-Smashing 4 Gigatons of Snow and Ice - Electroverse

(These astonishing gains add to those witnessed over the past few years.

The tide has turned in Greenland.

And that trend of GROWTH has ACCELERATED in 2020, this is BIG news.

This is how GLACIERS build.

This is also how ICE AGES begin.

The COLD TIMES are returning, the lower-latitudes are refreezing, in line with historically low solar activity, cloud-nucleating Cosmic Rays, and a meridional jet stream flow. Even NASA agrees, in part at least, with their forecast for this upcoming solar cycle (25) seeing it as the weakest of the past 200 years, with the agency correlating previous solar shutdowns to prolonged periods of global cooling here.)

Stock up on firewood, going to be a cold decade.

 

[Drawdown]

Snow falls. Snow snicks. Snow melts. Rinse and repeat.

Greenland only matters when it supports AGW. When it contradicts it, Greenland is just weather.

 

[longview]

Yesterday, in the middle of Summer, Greenland Gained a Record-Smashing 4 Gigatons of Snow and Ice - Electroverse

(These astonishing gains add to those witnessed over the past few years.

The tide has turned in Greenland.

And that trend of GROWTH has ACCELERATED in 2020, this is BIG news.

This is how GLACIERS build.

This is also how ICE AGES begin.

The COLD TIMES are returning, the lower-latitudes are refreezing, in line with historically low solar activity, cloud-nucleating Cosmic Rays, and a meridional jet stream flow. Even NASA agrees, in part at least, with their forecast for this upcoming solar cycle (25) seeing it as the weakest of the past 200 years, with the agency correlating previous solar shutdowns to prolonged periods of global cooling here.)

Stock up on firewood, going to be a cold decade.

I hope we are not returning to an ice age! The only benefit I can see is to finally silence the warming alarmist.
Anyone can see that warming has physical limits, and within those limits warmer is better for Humans.

 

[Aberro]

I hope we are not returning to an ice age! The only benefit I can see is to finally silence the warming alarmist.
Anyone can see that warming has physical limits, and within those limits warmer is better for Humans.

Yep, ever try to grow a garden in the winter?

Does not work.

Learn to like cabbage and collards, cold weather greens.

 

[Visbek]

Holy Cherry-Picking, Batman!!!

From the source your whacko friends are "citing:"

Ongoing heat wave and blocking over large parts of Europe go along with unseasonally snowy weather in eastern Greenland. An increase in surface mass balance of 4 gigatons is extreme for the season; however, the total ablation is still somewhat larger than the average 1981-2010.
https://twitter.com/PolarPortal/status/1293047207583678464

("Ablation" means "loss," by the way.)

Your "Electro" buddies literally have to cherry-pick a TWEET to make their claims.


But as long as you see Polar Portal as a valid source, the following is from their 2019 season report:
- 2019 had a high degree of melting. Between 1981 and 2010, the surface mass balance (not total mass, just surface) gained 368 gigatons; in 2019, it only gained 168gt.

- There was anomalously high melting and runoff at various points around the coast of Greenland

- Between 1981 and 2010, an average of 449gt of ice calved off of Greenland. In the 2019 season, that was 497gt.

- The ice sheet's albedo is dropping. That means it is absorbing more sunlight, which leads to more melting.

- Sea ice extent is at the lowest level in 40 years
http://polarportal.dk/fileadmin/user_upload/polarportal-saesonrapport-2019-EN.pdf


And of course, global temperatures haven't cooled, despite the deniers proclaiming year after year after year that "it's cooling now!!!"



Spare us all the bad-faith denialism, kthx.

 

[Jack Hays]

New Northern North Altantic Study Finds The Coldest Period With The Most Sea Ice Of The Last ~85 Years…Is Today

By Kenneth Richard on 24. August 2020

Now a new study (Weckstrom et al., 2020) not only documents the cooling in the subpolar North Atlantic has been ongoing for 80 years, but the sub-Arctic sea ice in this region has been steadily increasing in extent since about 1940 too.
The sea ice reconstruction was derived from an ecological study of 3 warmth-demanding “sea-ice species” abundant only in regions with a narrow temperature threshold.

[h=6]Image Source: Weckstrom et al., 2020[/h]

 

[istodolez]

New Northern North Altantic Study Finds The Coldest Period With The Most Sea Ice Of The Last ~85 Years…Is Today
]

Interesting. When I looked at one of the maps that highlights cooling in the North Atlantic it kinda looked like it might be related to Greenland Ice Sheet Melting leading to a weakening of the AMOC.

This actually fits a known effect in the North Atlantic of a cold "blob"...or a "warming hole" per the common parlance.

'The North Atlantic warming hole is associated with a decline of the AMOC. The AMOC fingerprint resembles Atlantic multidecadal variability (AMV), but details of the pattern change when the AMOC decline increases, underscoring the nonlinearity in the response."
Is a Decline of AMOC Causing the Warming Hole above the North Atlantic in Observed and Modeled Warming Patterns? | Journal of Climate | American Meteorological Society

Wow...it's almost like this SCIENCE THING WORKS!

Guess we have even more evidence that the AGW hypothesis is real and having the expected impact!

Science is so cool when you understand it.

 

[Jack Hays]

Interesting. When I looked at one of the maps that highlights cooling in the North Atlantic it kinda looked like it might be related to Greenland Ice Sheet Melting leading to a weakening of the AMOC.

This actually fits a known effect in the North Atlantic of a cold "blob"...or a "warming hole" per the common parlance.

'The North Atlantic warming hole is associated with a decline of the AMOC. The AMOC fingerprint resembles Atlantic multidecadal variability (AMV), but details of the pattern change when the AMOC decline increases, underscoring the nonlinearity in the response."
Is a Decline of AMOC Causing the Warming Hole above the North Atlantic in Observed and Modeled Warming Patterns? | Journal of Climate | American Meteorological Society

Wow...it's almost like this SCIENCE THING WORKS!

Guess we have even more evidence that the AGW hypothesis is real and having the expected impact!

Science is so cool when you understand it.

Newer science.

[h=2]Multiple Recent Papers Dispel Gulf Stream Collapse, Alarming The Climate Alarmism Industry[/h]By P Gosselin on 10. June 2019
No Reason For Panic: The Oscillating Gulf Stream By Die kalte Sonne (German text translated/edited by P Gosselin) Image: NASA JPL (public domain) The Gulf Stream provides heating for Western Europe. Some climate activists paint horror scenarios on the wall that the Gulf Stream is slowing down or even stopping due to climate change – […]

 

[lwf]

Is Greenland gaining or losing ice?

 

[Lord of Planar]

Yesterday, in the middle of Summer, Greenland Gained a Record-Smashing 4 Gigatons of Snow and Ice - Electroverse

(These astonishing gains add to those witnessed over the past few years.

The tide has turned in Greenland.

And that trend of GROWTH has ACCELERATED in 2020, this is BIG news.

This is how GLACIERS build.

This is also how ICE AGES begin.

The COLD TIMES are returning, the lower-latitudes are refreezing, in line with historically low solar activity, cloud-nucleating Cosmic Rays, and a meridional jet stream flow. Even NASA agrees, in part at least, with their forecast for this upcoming solar cycle (25) seeing it as the weakest of the past 200 years, with the agency correlating previous solar shutdowns to prolonged periods of global cooling here.)

Stock up on firewood, going to be a cold decade.

Thursday's CME (coronal mass ejection) even probably contributed as well.

 

[Lord of Planar]

Snow falls. Snow snicks. Snow melts. Rinse and repeat.

Greenland only matters when it supports AGW. When it contradicts it, Greenland is just weather.

Also, like any moving mass system, it has a natural resonance.

 

[Lord of Planar]

I hope we are not returning to an ice age! The only benefit I can see is to finally silence the warming alarmist.
Anyone can see that warming has physical limits, and within those limits warmer is better for Humans.

There's the kicker. With extra CO2, the H2O levels in the atmosphere have to drop substantially more to trigger an ice age. In my opinion, another benefit of CO2, as we are due to start an ice age, if we haven't already passed that point.

 

[istodolez]

I hope we are not returning to an ice age!

The only thing standing between you and another ice age is human activities leading to warming. We SHOULD be heading into another ice (for quite a long time now), but we aren't.

Anyone can see that warming has physical limits, and within those limits warmer is better for Humans.

Is that why there are so many people living in Death Valley?

 

[longview]

The only thing standing between you and another ice age is human activities leading to warming. We SHOULD be heading into another ice (for quite a long time now), but we aren't.



Is that why there are so many people living in Death Valley?

Do you really think the predicted warming would make the planet like death Valley?
Hyperbole aside, consider the expected warming and the average temperatures in Death Valley.
Total observed warming is likely to be less than 2C, and of that only about .6 C would be the maximum temperatures,
and this assumes we will actually double the CO2 level, which itself is somewhat unlikely.
A quick check of Death Valley and Dallas, Texas, shows the average August Maximums are about 3C apart.

 

[istodolez]

Do you really think the predicted warming would make the planet like death Valley?

No, but by the same token simply saying "warming is good for humans" is equally facile and silly.

The fact of the matter is we are talking about global climate which is pretty widely distributed in terms of temperature. It's the change that makes a difference. Society can EASILY collapse in various areas if their agricultural infrastructure collapses.

And if we spend all our time playing "debate" the reality of AGW rather than DEALING WITH IT we'll quickly figure out that this can happen very fast.

Economic collapse is the name of the game. You don't have to turn the world into Death Valley...you just need to f*** with the agriculture of much of the developed West to see sufficient disaster. Oh and the impoverished 3rd world is a goner then anyway! Economically, agriculturally, etc.

 

[longview]

No, but by the same token simply saying "warming is good for humans" is equally facile and silly.

The fact of the matter is we are talking about global climate which is pretty widely distributed in terms of temperature. It's the change that makes a difference. Society can EASILY collapse in various areas if their agricultural infrastructure collapses.

And if we spend all our time playing "debate" the reality of AGW rather than DEALING WITH IT we'll quickly figure out that this can happen very fast.

Economic collapse is the name of the game. You don't have to turn the world into Death Valley...you just need to f*** with the agriculture of much of the developed West to see sufficient disaster. Oh and the impoverished 3rd world is a goner then anyway! Economically, agriculturally, etc.

It is no different that simply saying "warming is bad for Humans!"
the difference is that History supports my argument, the warmer periods, have been when civilization made great advances,
the colder periods, when civilization drew back.
We have already seen more than half of the expected warming from the first doubling of CO2, yet agriculture is doing better than it ever has.
We do have a very real energy and fresh water problem, but both can be addressed.

 

[istodolez]

It is no different that simply saying "warming is bad for Humans!"

Actually the phrase you're looking for is: "wholesale shake-up of the only global climate ensemble humanity has been in since settling into civilizations is extremely risky for humans".

It's the same as if I were to hope my home catches fire. Maybe it'd be a great experience! I might get a better house of the deal (some folks I knew in SoCal who lost homes to some of the wildfires had owned long enough that they were able to massively improve their home after losing EVERYTHING to the fires. I don't think they were "happier" but it was a better home.)

The whole point is that you simply don't know. But you can be guaranteed there WILL BE THRASH. And those of us here in the US for example will probably end up with things being much, much worse. Our agricultural infrastructure is currently focused on an area that is water-poor and lives and dies by annual snowpack in the Sierras. If you want to pay most of your paycheck feeding your family DEFINITELY root for warmer temps and decreased snowfall in the Sierras. (As but one example).

the difference is that History supports my argument, the warmer periods, have been when civilization made great advances,

Your argument relies on a serious oversimplification. And it doesn't take into account the fact that CHANGE doesn't always yield good experiences for the societies of the time. History supports MY argument. You need only travel to the Yucatan and see what happens when multidecadal droughts dramatically changed the environment and destroyed some of the most advanced civilizations in Meso America.

We have already seen more than half of the expected warming from the first doubling of CO2, yet agriculture is doing better than it ever has.

Again, an oversimplification. Ag is doing better in no small means because of HUMAN INGENUITY and, dare I say, rather profligate overextension. Returning to the Central Valley as a great example: the only reason the Central Valley is our primary producer of the table vegetables we ALL eat here in the US is the "extended growing season". But there's not enough water. Surface water has been so dammed and monkeyed with that there's little spare capacity. So when the multi-year droughts were hitting a couple years ago they started OVERPUMPING THE AQUIFERS. They have collapsed some of the aquifers so badly there's MASSIVE subsidence. And these aquifers have a recharge time on the order of THOUSANDS of years, meaning once gone, pretty much permanently gone in terms of human societies.

Agriculture is one of those incredible success stories for humanity but it isn't always a one-way road to ever-increasing greatness. We are just as likely overextend because of our short-term views.

We do have a very real energy and fresh water problem, but both can be addressed.

Can be addressed, but aren't. And there's one major political party in the US that seems dedicated to fighting against dealing with these very real problems seriously.

 

[Lord of Planar]

The only thing standing between you and another ice age is human activities leading to warming. We SHOULD be heading into another ice (for quite a long time now), but we aren't.

Wow.

That has to be the most idiotic, arrogant statement I have seen yet from you.

How can you claim we should have already been heading for another ice age when we have had so little time to make changes, and after the earth naturally warmed coming out of the Maunder Minima?

This is laughable.

Do you remember me pointing out the sun increases in luminosity over time? It's possible that ice ages wouldn't happen again, even wiithout oiur help.

I find it harder and harder to believe you are a scientist, as you sure don't maintain a skeptical mind dictated by science. You are more activist than scientist.

 

[Lord of Planar]

LOL...

The Arctic Report card lets a persons confirmation bias tell them what to think. Even their video quantifies nothing.



"This will inevitability contribute to widespread coastal flooding..."

LOL... What is the quantification of "contribute?"

The report card isn't very useful either.

 

[Surface Detail]

Yesterday, in the middle of Summer, Greenland Gained a Record-Smashing 4 Gigatons of Snow and Ice - Electroverse

(These astonishing gains add to those witnessed over the past few years.

The tide has turned in Greenland.

And that trend of GROWTH has ACCELERATED in 2020, this is BIG news.

This is how GLACIERS build.

This is also how ICE AGES begin.

The COLD TIMES are returning, the lower-latitudes are refreezing, in line with historically low solar activity, cloud-nucleating Cosmic Rays, and a meridional jet stream flow. Even NASA agrees, in part at least, with their forecast for this upcoming solar cycle (25) seeing it as the weakest of the past 200 years, with the agency correlating previous solar shutdowns to prolonged periods of global cooling here.)

Stock up on firewood, going to be a cold decade.

SMB =/= total ice mass! When are people going to learn this!

Greenland did not gain 4GT of snow and ice in one day. While 4GT of snow and ice may accumulated on the surface of the ice, large amounts were also lost in glacial flow to the sea. Overall, Greenland is losing far more ice through glacier flow than it is gaining in snowfall, which is why its icecap is gradually shrinking, not growing.

 

[longview]

Actually the phrase you're looking for is: "wholesale shake-up of the only global climate ensemble humanity has been in since settling into civilizations is extremely risky for humans".

It's the same as if I were to hope my home catches fire. Maybe it'd be a great experience! I might get a better house of the deal (some folks I knew in SoCal who lost homes to some of the wildfires had owned long enough that they were able to massively improve their home after losing EVERYTHING to the fires. I don't think they were "happier" but it was a better home.)

The whole point is that you simply don't know. But you can be guaranteed there WILL BE THRASH. And those of us here in the US for example will probably end up with things being much, much worse. Our agricultural infrastructure is currently focused on an area that is water-poor and lives and dies by annual snowpack in the Sierras. If you want to pay most of your paycheck feeding your family DEFINITELY root for warmer temps and decreased snowfall in the Sierras. (As but one example).



Your argument relies on a serious oversimplification. And it doesn't take into account the fact that CHANGE doesn't always yield good experiences for the societies of the time. History supports MY argument. You need only travel to the Yucatan and see what happens when multidecadal droughts dramatically changed the environment and destroyed some of the most advanced civilizations in Meso America.



Again, an oversimplification. Ag is doing better in no small means because of HUMAN INGENUITY and, dare I say, rather profligate overextension. Returning to the Central Valley as a great example: the only reason the Central Valley is our primary producer of the table vegetables we ALL eat here in the US is the "extended growing season". But there's not enough water. Surface water has been so dammed and monkeyed with that there's little spare capacity. So when the multi-year droughts were hitting a couple years ago they started OVERPUMPING THE AQUIFERS. They have collapsed some of the aquifers so badly there's MASSIVE subsidence. And these aquifers have a recharge time on the order of THOUSANDS of years, meaning once gone, pretty much permanently gone in terms of human societies.

Agriculture is one of those incredible success stories for humanity but it isn't always a one-way road to ever-increasing greatness. We are just as likely overextend because of our short-term views.



Can be addressed, but aren't. And there's one major political party in the US that seems dedicated to fighting against dealing with these very real problems seriously.

I had the phrase I wanted!

Also the observed warming, has not been disruptive and agricultural yields are up even in places without irrigation,
Our world is greening, and the mega droughts predicted as a possibility for an average warmer planet,
look invalid, as global precipitation is up since most of the warming began in the late 1980's.
Climate Change Indicators: U.S. and Global Precipitation | Climate Change Indicators in the United States | US EPA

There is no doubt that cultures based on single points of failure, are prone to failure,
and the US has a over reliance on aquifer water in the great plains, that will need to be addressed,
if precipitation does not increase, but it is increasing!

Yes, Energy is our real problem, and with enough energy, we could even solve the fresh water problem.
As I said these are solvable issues, Solar power with real grid scale energy storage, could alone be a game changer.
Storing surplus energy as transport fuel and electrical capacity (with fuel cells and hydrogen storage).
Green Hydrogen - Sunfire
You have to consider that the path of lowering emissions by increasing efficiency and lower lifestyles is a slow and perhaps useless path.
We need to provide the same or higher level of lifestyle without new CO2 emissions, and at a lower cost.

 

[Visbek]

SMB =/= total ice mass! When are people going to learn this!

Deniers aren't interested in actual facts, so I'd guess "never."

They couldn't even read all 278 characters in a single Tweet from their source. Two sentences and all they pluck out is literally half of one of the sentences.

 

[Lord of Planar]

I had the phrase I wanted!

Also the observed warming, has not been disruptive and agricultural yields are up even in places without irrigation,
Our world is greening, and the mega droughts predicted as a possibility for an average warmer planet,
look invalid, as global precipitation is up since most of the warming began in the late 1980's.
Climate Change Indicators: U.S. and Global Precipitation | Climate Change Indicators in the United States | US EPA

There is no doubt that cultures based on single points of failure, are prone to failure,
and the US has a over reliance on aquifer water in the great plains, that will need to be addressed,
if precipitation does not increase, but it is increasing!

Yes, Energy is our real problem, and with enough energy, we could even solve the fresh water problem.
As I said these are solvable issues, Solar power with real grid scale energy storage, could alone be a game changer.
Storing surplus energy as transport fuel and electrical capacity (with fuel cells and hydrogen storage).
Green Hydrogen - Sunfire
You have to consider that the path of lowering emissions by increasing efficiency and lower lifestyles is a slow and perhaps useless path.
We need to provide the same or higher level of lifestyle without new CO2 emissions, and at a lower cost.

These AGW agenda driven indoctrinated tools just don't get it.

Warming has increased usable land.

Warming has increased needed precipitation.

CO2 has increased plant growth.

What I don't get, is that its mostly rich people who own ocean from property, and live in such areas. Why are they crying about the rich only for AGW when they bash the rich for everything else?

Is it because president Obama bought beachfront property?