Writing a book

[joko104]

Nice try... but no. :rofl

I have no idea what that message means.

 

[joko104]

ive tried before but i have never gotten very far. your wife must be seriously good to write books that fast.

Conversational writing is little different from talking to a person other than you generally use complete sentences when writing. If you can tell your story, you can write it. She blocked out the topics she wanted to go into and then went back and filled it in, adding other subjects as they come to mind and moving sections about to give it a logical order. Basically to say your point, explain why and what it means, give examples, and then conclude with the point you want to make. To keep it simple, the chapters tend to be short.

 

[joko104]

She's done with the writing. 140ish pages (will be exact after final clean up of spacing and formatting. But then it's only 9x7 in 12 pt type with generous white space. On regular paper and regular type it would be closer to around 60 pages. She had her old notes, records and materials to work with.

Some the white space is for visual relief and convenient stopping points. The huge task of doing an index remains plus then converting it to files the printer can use. Our oldest daughter (adult) is proof reading. The book in some regards a collaboration between them, as at points it goes into very in depth microbiology and biochemistry - my daughter's field. Some people won't read nor can grasp anything unless short, summary and simplistic. Others cannot respect a topic unless they believe they are one of the few people who can understand the words.

I understand the concept behind the book. Read it at your own personal level. It can be read at a very simple "do this, don't do that, and here's why in simple terms" that a marginally literate person can fully understand. For those who want some explanation and rationale, that also is present. A person can read it at the level that works for the person. If you want to be lectured and need chatter, it's there. If you are a licensed doctor, PhD chemist, or biomedical researcher? There are chapters for you too.

In terms of quality, it blows away the book it is rivaling and competing against, which just is 120 pages of raging against the government, AMA and drug companies as murderous criminals (as if that is relevant to anything), while promising the cure to every disease and illness if a person uses massive quantities of what the book promotes. My wife's book doesn't do so.

For it's specific topic area, she gets right to it without much repetition. First, very simply. Then at a more complete level. Then at a wordy level for people who want chatter. And finally off the chart in technical language and explanation. Then it just goes off into other topics generally about health, diet and so forth.

Anyway, the book is done. It has a great looking cover. But for some technical conversion issues of the cover and back - plus the very time consuming making an index - and cleaning up some formatting and spacing - just time consuming details, so it won't go to the printers until Monday night via emailing the files for a Tuesday printing. They'll ship the books on 2-3 days shipping on Thursday. So Monday, a week from tomorrow she'll have them. 9000 will ship out the next day.

 

[NoC_T]

Writing pwns. I've yet to take the plunge.

All luck to your good lady, Joko. May it take the bestseller lists by storm.

 

[joko104]

Writing pwns. I've yet to take the plunge.

All luck to your good lady, Joko. May it take the bestseller lists by storm.

Thanks.

I can't imagine my writing a book and don't have the skills nor inclination to try. I have been working on a website for about a year all on my own building it from scratch without any templates using Microsoft Expression - old software. My wife intensely was into website building for her business when she had it, and it seems she's headed back that way, though also could reload her old commercial sites anytime, plus left all her info sites up. She would built complex websites with many internal pages, lots of formatting plus shopping carts at 1 or 2 a day with many sub-pages. After 10 months I almost have 1.

 

[NoC_T]

Thanks.

I can't imagine my writing a book and don't have the skills nor inclination to try. I have been working on a website for about a year all on my own building it from scratch without any templates using Microsoft Expression - old software. My wife intensely was into website building for her business when she had it, and it seems she's headed back that way, though also could reload her old commercial sites anytime, plus left all her info sites up. She would built complex websites with many internal pages, lots of formatting plus shopping carts at 1 or 2 a day with many sub-pages. After 10 months I almost have 1.

That's way the hell beyond me, dude. I can turn on the PC and shut it down. :lol: Website construction, eh? A woman of many talents. That's cool.

 

[joko104]

The final "word" count total is in for the book. 34,583. 2 days/nights. Now that's burning up a keyboard!

Our daughter, who has always been an avid reader and is highly technically skilled in the written English language plus experienced in technical and scientific writing, did the proof reading and editing - mostly fixing minor typos carefully going sentence by sentence. Grammar errors, technical writing skills errors and typos indicate recklessness and lack professionalism. She said the writing style is in "an excellent voice for the average person" and was dazzled that she should click this off in 2 days. She has very fast body movement, is a fast thinker, and generally gets right to whatever she determines to do. Puttering and procastination are not in her DNA.

 

[Cephus]

The final "word" count total is in for the book. 34,583. 2 days/nights. Now that's burning up a keyboard!

Sorry, 34k words is not a book, it's a pamphlet. That barely clocks in at 135 pages. I write more than 100,000k words per month and the things I've written come in between 125k-150k, or between 450-600 pages. My blog output is more than 35k words per month (actually, 4 posts usually total close to 50k every single month).

 

[joko104]

Its a paperback. 100 pages plus index, forewords, bibliography, table of contents etc is the standard length for books in the general topic area. If they get much longer (ie thicker) people won't buy them. Too much to read. More is not better fro certain categories of books.

In the general field, anything from 100 pages up is a "book." If it is folded over and stapled as binding and more than about 30 pages, its a "booklet." If there is no binding, its a "pamphlet." That is ordinary terminology.

Do people read your blog? Is it a money maker? What is the general topic area?

 

[joko104]

Technical issues on conversion to PDF, adding 2 additional chapters, proofreading it 2 more times, plus sending it off via email for reading by a few of her past retail customers in the topic area delayed the book going to the printer until yesterday. The feedback on the book is extremely positive, has lead to more pre-sales including an order for 10,000, and is a result of the chapters she added.

My wife has always had a very unusual view of herself, reality and life - ever since she could first speak. While she does not going into anything about herself, she gives a fashion of an introduction to the most simple of one aspect of it, which she calls "organic metaphysics." It is a very unusual view of higher forms of organic life. I won't bother to try to explain it.

That actually is not the book's topic, but more is just chattering in the book that is only loosely analogously attached. It is that topic that the retailers of health produces so highly praised. The 10,000 book order is due to one of the largest retailers - like many - being ticked off at the price increase of the other book, which is inferior by comparison anyway.

The book is at the printers, with a second 10,000 book order already made. The book isn't even printed yet and her profit is just over $60K. Not a bad start.

 

[vasuderatorrent]

We used to call this the "vanity press." My only concern with self-publishing is the lack of an editor. As well you know, everybody needs a "fresh eye."

I agree but a somewhat educated spouse, friend or bored acquaintance can provide this service. I have heard it's well worth the investment of a professional editor. You can hire the services of professional editor for about $0.021 per word unless it is less than 10,000 words it might end up costing more per word. If you are just writing to fulfill a life dream it might be sufficient to find a patient friend to read over your manuscript. Writing is rarely profitable. Make sure you keep that in mind when approaching companies associated with the self-publishing industry.

Self publishing can be done through (*a certain company) at no cost whatsoever. You only cost occurs if you decide to order a copy of the book. Another tip that I heard was that it was better to buy your own ISBN for $129. This way if someone comes accross your book and wants to buy the rights they will contact you. Otherwise, they will contact the publisher on file. If that self publishing service is enormous like (*a certain company), you will never hear anything about the solicitation. Does that make sense?

There are two optional costs that are kinda worth it if you are more serious about your writing. The first is the services of a professional editor which may cost around $300 The second is to buy your own ISBN which cost $129. Your other costs should be close to $0.00. You can obtain the ISBN for free too if you are just getting your feet or writing for pleasure. You can become self-published for $0.00 and yes that's the total cost.

*I didn't want to get in trouble for advertising.

 

[vasuderatorrent]

Have any of you written a book?

Yes but it was a once in a lifetime thing. It was just an opportunity to vent my frustrations against a toxic period of time in my life. You can always play around with the margins, the book size, the font size, the spacing and things like that to make your book smaller or bigger.

I have had 4 editions of my book printed. My first edition was 4.25 x 7.00 inches, 81 pages with an 11pt font. The second edition was 5.5 x 8.5 inches, 52 pages and a 9pt font. The third edition was 6 x 9 inches, 34 pages and a 9 pt font.

I just published my last edition and actually had the bravery to publish under my real name. This book is 4 x 6 inches, 196 pages, an 11pt font and really wide margins. I haven't seen the final product of my latest. It just became active on January 7, 2014. Supposedly I will receive 10 copies of my latest edition on Wednesday.

Nothing serious like your wife's work. It's just a little bit of therapy for the closing to a painful era of my life.

 

[vasuderatorrent]

ive tried before but i have never gotten very far. your wife must be seriously good to write books that fast.

My book took a little less than two years. I can give an exact time frame because I'm not exactly sure when I started writing. Two days is very fast.

 

[vasuderatorrent]

I have no idea what that message means.

It means that she isn't going to reveal her identity to you. :roll: If you were Stephenie Meyer, you probably wouldn't want anybody to know either. :slapme: I probably shouldn't have said that much.

 

[vasuderatorrent]

Yes, I've written 32 novels which were not "self-published", but published by a legitimate publisher. I've sold over 6 million copies in more than 2 dozen languages around the world. And each one of them took considerably more than two days to write.

But that was back in the day, before anyone with enough time on their hands could empty their thoughts into their keyboards, upload it to a website, and call it a book. Sorry, whatever your wife is selling, I certainly won't be buying. :shrug:

How did it used to work? I had a book self-published in 2013. I agree with you. It costed nothing and required no approval process of any sort. I can put a string of z's into a book and have it published. What is the appropriate avenue for becoming a reputable author? If you prefer to PM me this information I will understand. It isn't my intention to make a spectacle of this. I am genuinely interested. What is the author's role? What is the publisher's role? What is the literary agent's role? What is the editor's role? Who else is involved in the process that I didn't mention? Sorry for so many questions but I am curious about such things. You seem to be a good resource of this type of information.

 

[DiAnna]

How did it used to work? I had a book self-published in 2013. I agree with you. It costed nothing and required no approval process of any sort. I can put a string of z's into a book and have it published. What is the appropriate avenue for becoming a reputable author? If you prefer to PM me this information I will understand. It isn't my intention to make a spectacle of this. I am genuinely interested. What is the author's role? What is the publisher's role? What is the literary agent's role? What is the editor's role? Who else is involved in the process that I didn't mention? Sorry for so many questions but I am curious about such things. You seem to be a good resource of this type of information.

If you were genuinely interested, you would have PM'd me for the info, as other posters have occasionally done in the past. But I'll indulge your curiosity.

1. "What is the appropriate avenue for becoming a reputable author?" This is the question that leads me to believe that making a spectacle of this is indeed your intention. But I'll bite. One becomes a reputable author by maintaining a high quality of work over a long period of time, work which generates significant sales and profit for publisher and author alike, working professionally with colleagues and editorial staff, by adhering to contract deadlines and performing the job in an honest, reliable manner.

One becomes a disreputable author by plagiarizing the work of others, by including dishonest source materials or using unsourced quotations as her/his own, by behaving in an unprofessional manner with readers, colleagues and editors, by missing routinely missing deadlines, and generally being seen as unreliable, uncooperative, and unpleasant. This kind of author is usually cut loose by the publisher at the contract's end, and since the publishing industry is a tight-knit group, other publishers are unlikely to consider future works.

2. The author's role is to write a publishable manuscript of high quality, provide excellent story-telling, be original, creative, and reliable in meeting contractual deadlines for manuscript submission, editorial reviews, galley approvals, participate in public relations events that will create interest in the book, and behave professionally with colleagues, editors and readers.

3. The publisher's role is to review and accept manuscripts that fit into the genre of work they publish and is likely to be enjoyed by their readership. They front the money for the project, and take the biggest risk in that not all books will earn out their contract advance... although most certainly do. The publisher also turns the manuscript into a saleable book, hardback or paperback, provides the cover art for the book (usually with the author's approval and input), has the book printed and distributed the hundreds of thousands of bookstores around the country. The publisher is also responsible for having the work translated into various languages, printed and released to various countries around the globe. The publisher is responsible for maintaining a scrupulous account of books distributed, returns, sales, calculating royalties and sending royalty checks either directly to the author or to the author's representative (agent) as specified in the contract.

3. The editor's role is to make sure the story moves well, correct grammatical errors, note when the story bogs down in too much narrative, etc., and work with the author when necessary for rewrites to enhance the work. Also, to make certain the mss does not contain any libel or potential legal complications for the publisher, particularly if real-life names are used in the book.

4. The literary agent's role is to shop the author's work to various publishers, trying to find the proper fit between the manuscript and the genre in which each publisher specializes to maximize the potential sale of the manuscript.

5. Others involved that you didn't mention include printers, artists, warehousing and distribution centers, international liaisons and translators for international reprints, hack-and-slash editors for international reprints that chop a 100,000 word North American First Run book into a 50,000 word novella for the global market, and a host of various and sundry other folks who do what they do so that I can get a whopping $52.00 royalty check from a book I first published six years earlier.

All of this takes place after the author has spent months/years writing, rewriting and rewriting to prepare a professional, saleable manuscript in the first place. Hope that answers your questions.

 

[vasuderatorrent]

Hope that answers your questions.

Thank you so much for the information.

 

[vasuderatorrent]

But that was back in the day, before anyone with enough time on their hands could empty their thoughts into their keyboards, upload it to a website, and call it a book.

The technology that changed the writing business. I heard about this machine before I started writing my book. Otherwise I would have lacked all ambition to start writing.

 

[Dr. Chuckles]

The technology that changed the writing business. I heard about this machine before I started writing my book. Otherwise I would have lacked all ambition to start writing.

solely due to economy of scale, I can't see this as being anything more than an aid to people publishing low volume numbers

 

[vasuderatorrent]

solely due to economy of scale, I can't see this as being anything more than an aid to people publishing low volume numbers

I'm not exactly sure I understand what you are saying. Are you suggesting this technology gives people the incentive to aim low? Instead of writing a good book that requires an investment in printing 10,000 books, instead you can go ahead and write a mediocre book because you know you only have to invest in 10-20 copies of the book.

Perhaps you are saying this allows people to publish books who only have an ambition of selling 20 copies. In the past that was a lot more difficult.

I wish I knew what you were saying. It sounded negative in tone but when I analyzed your comments it didn't seem negative at all. I'm not sure what you meant.

 

[Cephus]

I'm not exactly sure I understand what you are saying. Are you suggesting this technology gives people the incentive to aim low? Instead of writing a good book that requires an investment in printing 10,000 books, instead you can go ahead and write a mediocre book because you know you only have to invest in 10-20 copies of the book.

You can also get people who are writing for a very niche audience, where their entire target may be less than 100 people. Quality of writing has nothing to do with investment, there are some really awful books that get printed in great quantities.

Plus, there are people whose goal is really to see their work in printed form, even if it's just a handful of books. That's what the vanity press publishers cater to.

 

[Dr. Chuckles]

I'm not exactly sure I understand what you are saying. Are you suggesting this technology gives people the incentive to aim low? Instead of writing a good book that requires an investment in printing 10,000 books, instead you can go ahead and write a mediocre book because you know you only have to invest in 10-20 copies of the book.

Perhaps you are saying this allows people to publish books who only have an ambition of selling 20 copies. In the past that was a lot more difficult.

I wish I knew what you were saying. It sounded negative in tone but when I analyzed your comments it didn't seem negative at all. I'm not sure what you meant.

No, I am saying this invention will hardly impact the printing industry, besides in the area generally populated by vanity press publishers (people publishing low number runs)

 

[joko104]

I'm not exactly sure I understand what you are saying. Are you suggesting this technology gives people the incentive to aim low? Instead of writing a good book that requires an investment in printing 10,000 books, instead you can go ahead and write a mediocre book because you know you only have to invest in 10-20 copies of the book.

Perhaps you are saying this allows people to publish books who only have an ambition of selling 20 copies. In the past that was a lot more difficult.

I wish I knew what you were saying. It sounded negative in tone but when I analyzed your comments it didn't seem negative at all. I'm not sure what you meant.

The quality of books sold is a different question than the quality of the book itself.

Book stores carry only certain types of books and that are of national or worldwide interest, but with very limited selections and even less specific-topic books. I would be surprised if book stores sold 10% of all books sold.

Many books are for very specific or even local topics. For example, someone writing a book on the history of the New York harbor or the Statute of Liberty might sell thousands or even tens of thousands of copies, but would be of little nation or foreign interests. Most technical oriented books will have their specific market that would like not sell 1 copy in a book store, but might sell thousands or tens of thousands of books. The same definitely is how the alternative health products and topics book works.

Does self publishing work? Some natural health topic books sell 100 copies. Others sell thousands, tens of thousands or millions. For example, one book that focused on herbs and natural remedies sold over 5,000,000 copies as example. With a publisher taking most the money that would still have been a profitable book for the author. But as a self-published book for which author sold retail, wholesale and by affiliate sales (giving a commission to anyone who sells it), the author received the majority of the profit - and it was merely a paperback.

He was lucky as his book released at the right time and the massive Internet world of affiliate sales bloggers picked it up. So, in about 2 years, he made about $10,000,000. But the other 1000 people who self published a book on the same topic probably didn't break even unable to sell their first 1,000 copies. Was he a legitimate author? Of course. I don't even know what an illegitimate author would be other than stealing someone else's materials.

And it can be a collective effort commercially. For example, you scribble out a book enough to get the ideal across, but horribly written, and pay someone with high writing skills about $15 per 1000 words to rewrite. From there, another $5 per 1000 words obtains someone to edit it and proof read it more carefully. There are printing companies that will design a cover for it for $100. Yet the book in terms of the ideas and messages of it was by the author.

Simply, it is an extremely diverse market with goals and purposes in almost every direction. Just because a book isn't in a Barnes and Noble doesn't mean it is the best book. It may not even be relevant to Barnes and Noble customers. Nor did all books that came into a Barnes and Noble necessarily go through a publisher. If a book gets hot enough, they will directly buy. Of course, a self-publishing author is also the publisher.

In my opinion, a valid measure of a good book is a book that people buy and don't regret having done so. It is only in the academia arrogance world that books are foremost about writing skills. A good technical manual or history book has more value that a good sci-fi or fiction novel. But the measure of a good book, ultimately, is up to the readers.

 

[joko104]

Some books are so profitable for their prices and captured market. For example, my wife was talking to someone telling about her best friend who annually updates her book for college drama classes as her sole income. My wife said that probably isn't that profitable. The woman replied "she makes over $150,000 per semester" off the book. $300,000 per year. 1 book.

Ever see the prices of college text books?

How many tens of millions do you think O'Reilly is making off his Killing Someone books? Do you really think he labored over the book and did all his own writing and editing? Hell, after the first one I have little doubt someone else did 90% of the writing.

 

[vasuderatorrent]

I don't even know what an illegitimate author would be

Maybe an author whose parents weren't married when the author was born. :shrug:

It is only in the academia arrogance world that books are foremost about writing skills.

or maybe that's it. It's the losing of a turf war that causes frustration. It's human nature.