Would you support her having an abortion now?

[brianpatrick]

That would make sense if the head of MAGA wasnt leading in every poll

Polls are designed and administered to make elections appear closer than they actually are. It’s good for the “news-business.” It’s also good to keep voter participation high. Come on Fletch, you’re a partisan but not an idiot. Now not only are democrats rooting out MAGA but so are regular republicans.

 

[Fletch]

Wanting to abort a dead fetus makes one a "bigot"?

Anti-choicers say the darndest things.

So you acknowledge that a fetus is alive. Thats a good first step for you. The abortion debate is about when rights are bestowed upon this new human life. Some say birth, others say sooner. That makes this a complicated moral, legal and scientific issue that most libs cannot engage in,

 

[noonereal]

Yes, we are all aware of that. You admonished me about one of my posts (not even a poll) without "crib notes" as well. Get over it. If you won't take the time to view the video, then just leave the thread and respond to something else.

May i ask, why don't you take the time to post in a manner that communicates as one should on a message board?

 

[Grand Mal]

The state has a role because we are talking about human life here. I get that as a Canadian you dont understand this, but then maybe you shouldnt comment in areas you know nothing about.

Funny how every time the rightist I'm engaging with feels backed into a corner my nationality comes up.
We have a lower abortion rate in Canada than you have in America with all your cluster**** of abortion laws. Your laws are just useless bullshit and everyone knows it except rightists who think the government needs to be involved in all parts of a citizen's life.
Who don't you trust anyway? Women or doctors? Who do you think needs your supervision, who do you think you need to take decisions away from?

 

[ksu_aviator]

Wanting to abort a dead fetus makes one a "bigot"?

Anti-choicers say the darndest things.

Where in the hell did you get that?

 

[Risky Thicket]

As long as you judge people by skin color, sex and age, you are being a bigot. I would suggest you look past identity politics to achieve a more enlightened view.

That old dog won't hunt.

I'm an old white guy criticizing an old white guy system that discriminates against the majority of the people in the United States. That systems does not view women, people of color, people who have varied sexual orientations, people who are immigrants, people who are disabled, people who are not Christian and generally anyone who is not like themselves.

You don't know jack about me. I will tell you that I am an old white guy, Southern born and Southern bred. I am a disabled vet. I have been disabled since Vietnam (the significance is I've been disabled for a long time). My wife is white. Three of my children are women, 2 are white and one is Vietnamese. My grandchildren include white daughters and bi-racial daughters. I'm not going to list personal involvement at local, state and national levels where I have advocated for the equality and inclusion of all of the above.

I walk the talk. You get the picture - or you don't because (mixing metaphors) I have apparently gored your ox. It's made you uncomfortable. Get used to it.

 

[Risky Thicket]

The state has a role because we are talking about human life here. I get that as a Canadian you dont understand this, but then maybe you shouldnt comment in areas you know nothing about.

WRONG! Get your shit together or move on.

We are talking about a woman being forced by the state to carry around a dead fetus.

 

[Gordy327]

So you acknowledge that a fetus is alive. Thats a good first step for you. The abortion debate is about when rights are bestowed upon this new human life. Some say birth, others say sooner. That makes this a complicated moral, legal and scientific issue that most libs cannot engage in,

Birth is the legal point. Morality and science is irrelevant to that.

 

[Phys251]

Where in the hell did you get that?

Just quoting what you said.

Don't be a bigot. It's not a good look.

 

[ksu_aviator]

That old dog won't hunt.

I'm an old white guy criticizing an old white guy system that discriminates against the majority of the people in the United States. That systems does not view women, people of color, people who have varied sexual orientations, people who are immigrants, people who are disabled, people who are not Christian and generally anyone who is not like themselves.

You don't know jack about me. I will tell you that I am an old white guy, Southern born and Southern bred. I am a disabled vet. I have been disabled since Vietnam (the significance is I've been disabled for a long time). My wife is white. Three of my children are women, 2 are white and one is Vietnamese. My grandchildren include white daughters and bi-racial daughters. I'm not going to list personal involvement at local, state and national levels where I have advocated for the equality and inclusion of all of the above.

I walk the talk. You get the picture - or you don't because (mixing metaphors) I have apparently gored your ox. It's made you uncomfortable. Get used to it.

You do realize how you are proving my point, don't you? Every person you identified in your rant you classified by some superficial characteristic. Then you used those characteristics to excuse your characteristics (old, white, male).

What you didn't say is that you don't judge people by those characteristics. Far from it. You made a lot of assumptions and you treated skin color and sex like they affect opinion. In total, you proved me correct.

 

[Gordy327]

Would you support her having an abortion now?​

I would support her and anyone having an abortion anytime they want for any reason they want, no questions asked.

 

[ksu_aviator]

Just quoting what you said.

Don't quote it if you don't understand it.

 

[dseag2]

May i ask, why don't you take the time to post in a manner that communicates as one should on a message board?

Yes, you may ask. Is a response like "I hate when people don't provide a link to the thread", in your opinion, a better way to communicate on a message board than simply ignoring the post or providing an opinion based on what you've seen?

Waiting to hear your sage advice. Is this post acceptable according to your standards?

 

[noonereal]

Yes, you may ask. Is a response like "I hate when people don't provide a link to the thread", in your opinion, a better way to communicate on a message board than simply ignoring the post or providing an opinion based on what you've seen?

Waiting to hear your sage advice. Is this post acceptable according to your standards?

Discuss things yourself. Offer citation to support your position if you care to.

 

[Fletch]

Funny how every time the rightist I'm engaging with feels backed into a corner my nationality comes up.
We have a lower abortion rate in Canada than you have in America with all your cluster**** of abortion laws. Your laws are just useless bullshit and everyone knows it except rightists who think the government needs to be involved in all parts of a citizen's life.
Who don't you trust anyway? Women or doctors? Who do you think needs your supervision, who do you think you need to take decisions away from?

Lol like you backed me into some corner. You Canadians are a riot. Again, we have things called rights that you Canadians know nothing about. We form government to secure those rights. The issue with abortion involves a conflict between those rights. The question is when do the rights of the child begin? You believe they begin at birth, others believe they begin prior to that. We are going to resolve that conflict in the US by leaving it up to the people of each state to decide. That, to me, seems appropriate. But of course, the intolerant, arrogant, anti-science, my-way-or-the-highway left shuts off any debate with its typical mindless and lazy smears of anyone who disagrees.

 

[Fletch]

Birth is the legal point. Morality and science is irrelevant to that.

Morality and science are only irrelevant to the left. The law once said that slavery was A-okay. And I have no doubt that there were plenty of people like you back then who declared that morality and science were irrelevant to the justness of slavery.

 

[Ginger Ale]

Don't quote it if you don't understand it.

Reverse discrimination, and or racism is a myth because it attempts to completely ignore the power or privilege dynamic between the individuals or groups involved. It's become a common and ugly tactic of the right.

Say what you "really" mean. Say it like Trump does, when he accuses blacks of white racism. Be clear, so we don't misunderstand you and that Trump mimicry.


Why on earth would the women of this country deserve their healthcare to be legally laid out by MEN, whom aren't doctors? How on earth does that make sense? Do you think MEN are better at deciding what kind of healthcare women are allowed in this country? Do you think whites understand how these laws disproportionately affect minority women? Why on earth would anyone, anyone, want their healthcare decided by people who aren't doctors, and who aren't even their gender or race?

 

[Grand Mal]

Lol like you backed me into some corner. You Canadians are a riot. Again, we have things called rights that you Canadians know nothing about. We form government to secure those rights. The issue with abortion involves a conflict between those rights. The question is when do the rights of the child begin? You believe they begin at birth, others believe they begin prior to that. We are going to resolve that conflict in the US by leaving it up to the people of each state to decide. That, to me, seems appropriate. But of course, the intolerant, arrogant, anti-science, my-way-or-the-highway left shuts off any debate with its typical mindless and lazy smears of anyone who disagrees.

You have rights? As in you have the right to impose your personal beliefs on someone else's rights.
It's simple. Mind your own damned business. Don't expect the government to force others to conform to your weird conception of society.
**** sakes. Why is this so hard for you to understand? Everyone has a different opinion so let everyone make their own decision. The bloody right just loooves a big, strong Daddy state, the bigger and stronger the better. A Daddy state well equipped with laws and regulations.
None of your business when a woman you don't know has an abortion. None of your business either if some stranger across town bumps a couple lines of coke but that's a different Daddy state topic.

 

[Fletch]

You have rights? As in you have the right to impose your personal beliefs on someone else's rights.
It's simple. Mind your own damned business. Don't expect the government to force others to conform to your weird conception of society.
**** sakes. Why is this so hard for you to understand? Everyone has a different opinion so let everyone make their own decision. The bloody right just loooves a big, strong Daddy state, the bigger and stronger the better. A Daddy state well equipped with laws and regulations.
None of your business when a woman you don't know has an abortion. None of your business either if some stranger across town bumps a couple lines of coke but that's a different Daddy state topic.

Again, you dont get it, The issue is rights and when they begin, not the nonsense excuses you post. We know when life begins--at conception. Since that is a scientific fact that you libs refuse to accept, people with clear minds have to continue on without you. If you could actually move beyond your leftist bromides for a moment, tell me when your life began. Were you dropped off by a stork or did your life begin before that? Life is a process that begins at conception, and the early stages of development take place in the mothers womb. People who oppose abortion believe that it ends a human life. And they are right about that. And they believe it is the role of the state to protect human life which is why they oppose abortion. This is not an embrace of the 'daddy state' which is a moronic accusation, but an acceptance of the state filling its legal and moral role.

 

[Ginger Ale]

You have rights? As in you have the right to impose your personal beliefs on someone else's rights.
It's simple. Mind your own damned business. Don't expect the government to force others to conform to your weird conception of society.
**** sakes. Why is this so hard for you to understand? Everyone has a different opinion so let everyone make their own decision. The bloody right just loooves a big, strong Daddy state, the bigger and stronger the better. A Daddy state well equipped with laws and regulations.
None of your business when a woman you don't know has an abortion. None of your business either if some stranger across town bumps a couple lines of coke but that's a different Daddy state topic.

Indeed, it's hard to recognize the right anymore. Weird ass shit.

 

[Gordy327]

Morality and science are only irrelevant to the left.

Sweeping generalization. A clear indication you have no rational or legal argument to make.

The law once said that slavery was A-okay.

That issue has long since been settled.

And I have no doubt that there were plenty of people like you back then who declared that morality and science were irrelevant to the justness of slavery.

See first statement.

Again, we have things called rights that you Canadians know nothing about. We form government to secure those rights.

Now there's an ignorant statement. Are you suggesting Canada does not have rights?

The issue with abortion involves a conflict between those rights.

What rights is abortion in conflict with? Be specific! Abortion restrictions are what is in conflict with rights.

The question is when do the rights of the child begin?

Birth!

You believe they begin at birth, others believe they begin prior to that. We are going to resolve that conflict in the US by leaving it up to the people of each state to decide. That, to me, seems appropriate. But of course, the intolerant, arrogant, anti-science, my-way-or-the-highway left shuts off any debate with its typical mindless and lazy smears of anyone who disagrees.

It's already decided. Both the Constitution and federal government affirm rights at birth as a legal person. No state recognizes rights for the unborn as a person. Of course you cannot offer anything to refute that and have to engage in ad hom attacks, which only shows how weak your position really is and your lack of credibility.

Again, you dont get it, The issue is rights and when they begin, not the nonsense excuses you post.

Already addressed and established. You burying your head in the sand about it doesn't change that fact.

We know when life begins--at conception. Since that is a scientific fact that you libs refuse to accept, people with clear minds have to continue on without you.

So what? What does that have to do with rights?

If you could actually move beyond your leftist bromides for a moment, tell me when your life began. Were you dropped off by a stork or did your life begin before that? Life is a process that begins at conception, and the early stages of development take place in the mothers womb. People who oppose abortion believe that it ends a human life. And they are right about that. And they believe it is the role of the state to protect human life which is why they oppose abortion. This is not an embrace of the 'daddy state' which is a moronic accusation, but an acceptance of the state filling its legal and moral role.

"Life" is a scientific designation and irrelevant to the law. You have yet to make any rational legal argument. All you have is irrelevance and emotion/feelings. Which explains why your argument spectacularly fails and why no one in their right mind takes you seriously.

 

[dockside]

Yeah, well that rings hollow coming from big government leftists who want the government involved in every other aspect of our lives. The debate over when life begins and when ending it ceases to be a choice is a scientific, legal and moral decision that should be decided by the people

I agree. If the people, or just the person, believe abortion is wrong, they should not have one. Easy peasy. See, it's a matter of "belief". I and. million of others don't believe in the Christian God. So, therefore, we should have laws forbidding anyone from believing and acting on such a belief. Wait. You don't think so? Well, you should. After all, it complies with how you think about abortion, even if there are others who believe as you do. IOW, non-provable beliefs should remain just that -beliefs- not laws.

 

[Fletch]

I agree. If the people, or just the person, believe abortion is wrong, they should not have one. Easy peasy. See, it's a matter of "belief". I and. million of others don't believe in the Christian God. So, therefore, we should have laws forbidding anyone from believing and acting on such a belief. Wait. You don't think so? Well, you should. After all, it complies with how you think about abortion, even if there are others who believe as you do. IOW, non-provable beliefs should remain just that -beliefs- not laws.

That life begins at conception is not a belief, its a fact. That abortion ends a human life is not a belief, it is a fact.

 

[dockside]

If a two year old child has cancer, is expected to die in three weeks, and has temper tantrums which cause great psychological stress and grief on the parents is it moral for the parents to shoot and kill the child? My thoughts on this: Once the child actually dies from cancer then it's okay to shoot the child.

I'll guess that the replies to this are that the fetus has no value and that value is arbitrarily obtained upon birth during the biological life cycle.

Not "no value" but less value than the value of the woman whose life and or health and/or physical and mental health may be at risk if she has to continue the pregnancy.

 

[Gordy327]

That life begins at conception is not a belief, its a fact. That abortion ends a human life is not a belief, it is a fact.

Life is irrelevant to abortion laws, it is a fact.