Why

[Rev.]

If the church helps people some much then why did it not step in and say something about slavery? Why did the CONDONE slavery? Are Africans not equals in the eyes of God? Why did the church burn alleged witches and heretics at the stake? I guess that's something Jesus condones, although we all know he doesn't. All in all, your church isn't all that innocent, my friend.

I am happy to respond to this, but who are you addressing and about what? Quoting would be helpful here.

 

[eja2721]

That was kind of addressed to anybody. I dont mind you respond. Please do, I would like to hear your reply.

By the way, I like that whole "motherhood" thing at the bottom.

 

[Rev.]

If the church helps people some much then why did it not step in and say something about slavery? Why did the CONDONE slavery?

The Bible never comes right out and says "slavery is wrong." In fact, there are laws regarding the owning of slaves, how long they may be owned, how to treat them etc. When Onesimus ran away from his owner, Paul spoke to him about how he should behave toward his owner as a slave and sent him back. To the Corinthians, Paul said "consider what you were when you were saved...and stay there." If you were married, don't get divorced. If you were a slave, don't escape to freedom. There is more to this issue of slavery than "is it right for one human being to own another"

The idea that "slavery is wrong" is a modern western liberal idea. Slavery still exists in the east and underground in South America. What is the proper Christian response to slavery? As Christians, we believe that all people, men and women, slave and free, Jew and Gentile, are equal under God in regards to salvation All have equal opportunity to be saved without consideration of social standing. But the Bible doesn't seem to judge social structures...it seems to accept them. Therefore, I think the church's proper response is that all people deserve to hear the message of the gospel. And their first priority should be preaching the gospel to everyone regardless of social standing. Jesus said, "The poor will always be among you." And I think he meant that we should not be distracted by social ills but PREACH THE GOSPEL. If everyone lived the gospel the way they should...social ills would take care of themselves.

Are Africans not equals in the eyes of God?

The roots of the idea that Africans are inferior is in Genesis. After the flood, one of Noah's sons discovered Noah drunk in his tent. He tattled to his brothers. As a result, he and his descendants "the Cushites" were cursed. Kush is in Africa below Egypt. And there you get the idea that it is okay to own Africans because they were cursed. Are Africans inferior? No.

Why did the church burn alleged witches and heretics at the stake?

The Bible very soundly condemns witchcraft. Anyone who was a heretic was a "son of the devil" which amounts to witchcraft.

I guess that's something Jesus condones, although we all know he doesn't.

Well Jesus certainly doesn't condone witchcraft and heresy. How should the church handle it?

All in all, your church isn't all that innocent, my friend.

No, the church isn't perfect. I have never heard a Christian say it is. But I sense some...anger? in your statement here. I wonder what is behind it?

 

[eja2721]

Where the anger is coming from is that the bible tells u not to escape ur slavery. what the f*** is that? u condone slavery or something? u make me sick! did jesus have slaves? no! see, now i'm starting to see that it is not the church to blame for this crap, it's the followers that twist the mean of Christianty. did the Bible say to burn heretics at the cross? i dont think so, or at least i hope not. but its followers took it that way. im done with debating. im not gonna debate with a racist, white supremist who justifies his ancestors crimes.

 

[sebastiansdreams]

Where the anger is coming from is that the bible tells u not to escape ur slavery. what the f*** is that? u condone slavery or something? u make me sick! did jesus have slaves? no! see, now i'm starting to see that it is not the church to blame for this crap, it's the followers that twist the mean of Christianty. did the Bible say to burn heretics at the cross? i dont think so, or at least i hope not. but its followers took it that way. im done with debating. im not gonna debate with a racist, white supremist who justifies his ancestors crimes.

So then you are suggesting that the church be a political tool that fights for what God says in issues of social structure? Because it seems to me far more important that the church work towards the freedom of the soul before they attempt to cure the injustices within a political or social arena. It seems as though you are blaming renegade Christians for slavery? But are you unaware that slavery existed long before Christianity? Also, that it is not a system belonging to Christianity, but to multiple cultures with multiple beliefs?
As far as burning heretics, it does, in the OT, tell us that the punishment of witchraft is death. So, to a degree, yes, the Bible does say that. Although, with the New Covanent, we are told that judgement will be dispensed by God in the end. My question to you would be why would you stop debating with a white supremisist, assuming Rev was one? Don't you think that they are the minds that need convincing the most? Or do you just always throw in the towel to a debate when you find that a person believes in something that you do not? He is not attempting to "justify" slavery. He is simply attempting to explain to you that it is not the place of Christians to change social issues, but rather issues of the heart, and through that social ills (such as slavery) will themselves fall apart (as they did in America).

 

[apathetic fools]

Religion is about control. It is rules and regulations, do's and don't. Jesus Christ was executed by the religious people of his time. Not the "Jews", but the religious rulers of his time :smash: . Christ had hard words about religion. He called them child of the devil in his own terms. Christ and true rebirth of the spirit do not condemn, judge, and control. People kill and murder out of fear, fear of opposing a shakey foundation."WITHOUT LIBERTY, TRUTH IS A MYTH"

 

[Rev.]

So then you are suggesting that the church be a political tool that fights for what God says in issues of social structure? Because it seems to me far more important that the church work towards the freedom of the soul before they attempt to cure the injustices within a political or social arena. It seems as though you are blaming renegade Christians for slavery? But are you unaware that slavery existed long before Christianity? Also, that it is not a system belonging to Christianity, but to multiple cultures with multiple beliefs?
As far as burning heretics, it does, in the OT, tell us that the punishment of witchraft is death. So, to a degree, yes, the Bible does say that. Although, with the New Covanent, we are told that judgement will be dispensed by God in the end. My question to you would be why would you stop debating with a white supremisist, assuming Rev was one? Don't you think that they are the minds that need convincing the most? Or do you just always throw in the towel to a debate when you find that a person believes in something that you do not? He is not attempting to "justify" slavery. He is simply attempting to explain to you that it is not the place of Christians to change social issues, but rather issues of the heart, and through that social ills (such as slavery) will themselves fall apart (as they did in America).

:bravo:

Well said!

 

[eja2721]

Good arguement, sabastiansdreams. You know what guys, I really suck at debating so I'm just going to look at everybody else debate THEN give my opinion.

 

[sebastiansdreams]

Good arguement, sabastiansdreams. You know what guys, I really suck at debating so I'm just going to look at everybody else debate THEN give my opinion.

Your opinion and debate are always welcome

 

[eja2721]

Thank you, sebastiandreams. I really like this site. You guys are so polite.