WHY GOP will do Nothing about Immigration reform

[TheNextEra]

Well, let's a poll that differs?

I don't need to show a poll that differs as the poll you showed didn't show what you claimed. Just because only 5% of the people think immigration is the TOP priority, your claim that the 95% somehow "don't care" is not proven.

The poll shows that 5% of the population think that immigration is the TOP priority. Anything else outside of that fact, you are just assuming and it isn't proven.

 

[Perotista]

I dont think the article got the math right. While Hispanics vote overwhelmingly for democrats, 70% or so, they only make up 10% of voters. Thats about 11 million votes. Meanwhile, whites make up 100 million votes. So Republicans can simply get more white votes to offset hispanics. This is accepting the premise that race somehow determines votes and is unchanging. From what I can tell, theres no reason the color of ones skin would automatically determine ones vote. It merely influences based on culture.

Republicans have bigger problems right now losing conservatives and libertarians.

I think you're wrong about getting more whites. I think you're real close to being topped out of the white vote. Here is some history on how whites voted:

1976 52% republican 48% democratic
1980 56% republican 36% democratic 8% other
1984 66% republican 34% democratic
1988 60% republican 40% democratic
1992 41% republican 39% democratic 21% other
1996 46% republican 44% democratic 9% other
2000 55% republican 42% democratic 3% other
2004 58% republican 41% democratic 1% other
2008 55% republican 43% democratic
2012 60% republican 39% democratic 1% other

I think 60% is just about tops as far as the white vote goes. The lone exception above was Reagan in 1984, his re-election over Mondale which was a huge landslide where Reagan received a total of 59% of the popular vote. The white vote was a plus seven over his percentage he received overall. Romney's white vote was a plus 13 points over what he received overall, McCain's was a plus 9, Bush's was a plus 7 in 2004 and a plus 9 in 2000.

Taking everything into consideration 60% of the white vote seems to be the limit the Republicans can expect, the lone exception of 1984 when Reagan received 66%, he was only 7 points above his total overall and was actually a low as far as plus points go.

 

[Ockham]

Politically, I think the current GOP climate is correctly portrayed. Democrats are the free cheese distributors, or at least seen that way, therefore the political view is poor immigrants would come to the U.S. with a new and improved immigration reform package and stuff the ballot box with more Democrats in office. That is the conventional wisdom. What hispanics in particular have that could be utilized by the GOP is their belief in God. Democrats tend to whip out their religion in tight races to eek out a win, but otherwise they don't wear it on their sleeves. Traditional Catholic families do tend to be a bit more on the conservative side - that could be a point to gain some hispanic votes under the GOP tent but only if the GOP is willing to have a big tent political policy.

However, it's certainly an opportunity for the GOP to let the existing hispanic communities know that they are willing to have a bigger tent and aren't skeerd of an immigration policy change.

 

[WCH]

This from Gallup shows 72% favor a path to citizenship

Immigration Reform 2013: Poll Shows Surprising Consenus - PolicyMic

That has nothing to do with whether it's important to people nor is it really about a path to citizenship. The key is the stipulations.

They've always had a path...it called going back to Mexico or wherever and doing it the legal way.

 

[haymarket]

That has nothing to do with whether it's important to people nor is it really about a path to citizenship. The key is the stipulations.

They've always had a path...it called going back to Mexico or wherever and doing it the legal way.

you and I both know that is NOT what is being discussed as a viable path to citizenship which can be achieved within the expected lifetime of the people involved . To pretend otherwise is intellectually dishonest.

 

[Linc]

Senator Rubio sure found that out with his bi-partisan Dream Act in the Senate.
Once again, Boehner is between a rock and a hard place, with DEMs watching the many wings of the GOP fight it out .

Perhaps the Republicans do look upon a path to citizenship for illegals as suicide. But you need to understand that people can be for immigration reform, a way to make those in this country that are illegals and make them legal without a path to citizenship. The majority of those in favor of immigration reform are also against amnesty or a path to citizenship. They realize something needs to be done with 11-15 million illegals now living in this country, but they also do not want to reward them for breaking our immigration laws.

Being totally against immigration reform or finding a way to make those illegally in country legal is a loser to the Republicans
Being for immigration reform with a path to citizenship for those illegally in this county is a loser to the Democrats

But being for immigration reform, to find a way to make those illegally in this country legal without a path to citizenship would be a winner to either party if they take up that mantra. The American people are not stupid, they know there is not an all or nothing approach to the immigration problem. To them the common sense approach is somewhere in the middle between the two extreme views of the two major parties. It is these all or nothing approaches that has caused the two major parties to lose supporters. Since 2005 the Democratic Party has dropped from 35% of the electorate who identify/associate themselves with that party to 29% today. The Republican Party has dropped from 30% in 2005 down to 24% today. The American electorate is just plain tired of these all or nothing approaches.

 

[Linc]

Which President Reagan granted amnesty to the first wave of illegals?
Do you think that may have spurred the 2nd wave?
And did they all arrive during let's blame Obama for that one too?
Mexican-Americans hear the dog whistles loud and clear .

What does it say that immigrants who are here illegally, largely support democrats? To me, it speaks volumes. I'm not sure that's a fact to be proud of.

 

[WCH]

you and I both know that is NOT what is being discussed as a viable path to citizenship which can be achieved within the expected lifetime of the people involved . To pretend otherwise is intellectually dishonest.

Too bad. One of my customers had a friend who was a 94 year old alien who spent the last several years of his life attaining American citizenship. He died a week after finding his American dream.

Ryan has a plan that would give them legal status but, a long road to any sort of citizenship.

Paul Ryan: Under our plan, illegals will have probationary legal status while the border is being secured « Hot Air

 

[Perotista]

Senator Rubio sure found that out with his bi-partisan Dream Act in the Senate.
Once again, Boehner is between a rock and a hard place, with DEMs watching the many wings of the GOP fight it out .

Yeah on Boehner. but I do not think either party realizes that the bulk of Americans want immigration reform, they want a sensible solution where every 20 years or so we do not have to go through this again. Reagan gave amnesty to approximately 3 million illegals and that was suppose to solve the problem for good. It didn't. So we know just amnesty by itself won't work, at least for the future. We also know it is impossible just to round up 10-20 million illegals and ship them back. If we were any other country, perhaps that would be tried. If we had enforced our immigration laws since Reagan and deported each and every illegal as they came here, we wouldn't have the problem we do today either, but we didn't. We seem to, as a country to accept illegal aliens as being here regardless if they came legally or illegally.

This is where I think Gary Johnson's plan comes in. His idea of a red card. Give all illegals 3 years to report and obtain their red card. That gives them legal status in the U.S. Then strict enforcement of all immigration laws to include the deportation of any and all illegals after three years. Now those who have obtained a red card are barred from citizenship unless they leave the U.S. and come back legally. This way we are not rewarding law breakers. Of course their children will automatically be citizens.

But to be successful, strict enforcement of all immigration laws must be done after the three year period. If not we have accomplished nothing other than to kick the can down the road again much like we do with our national debt. I like most Americans, believe citizenship should only be bestowed on those who enter our country legally. So is a red card amnesty? yes in a way as it allows those illegals here already to remain here legally, but it does not give them a path to citizenship. Every legal resident or alien should have that right, those who entered our country legally, went through the background checks, obtained the visas, paid the fees, etc. but not the ones who avoided all of this.

 

[mak2]

If they flat could not work you would not have to round them up, they would go back. This could be accomplished by arresting several company owners that employ illegals. Make sure the do the Perp walk on Fox and CNN and others. Then next week the rest of them would be unemployed and southbound. We know that will never happen, so we will just talk about about immigration and do nothing.

Yeah on Boehner. but I do not think either party realizes that the bulk of Americans want immigration reform, they want a sensible solution where every 20 years or so we do not have to go through this again. Reagan gave amnesty to approximately 3 million illegals and that was suppose to solve the problem for good. It didn't. So we know just amnesty by itself won't work, at least for the future. We also know it is impossible just to round up 10-20 million illegals and ship them back. If we were any other country, perhaps that would be tried. If we had enforced our immigration laws since Reagan and deported each and every illegal as they came here, we wouldn't have the problem we do today either, but we didn't. We seem to, as a country to accept illegal aliens as being here regardless if they came legally or illegally.

This is where I think Gary Johnson's plan comes in. His idea of a red card. Give all illegals 3 years to report and obtain their red card. That gives them legal status in the U.S. Then strict enforcement of all immigration laws to include the deportation of any and all illegals after three years. Now those who have obtained a red card are barred from citizenship unless they leave the U.S. and come back legally. This way we are not rewarding law breakers. Of course their children will automatically be citizens.

But to be successful, strict enforcement of all immigration laws must be done after the three year period. If not we have accomplished nothing other than to kick the can down the road again much like we do with our national debt. I like most Americans, believe citizenship should only be bestowed on those who enter our country legally. So is a red card amnesty? yes in a way as it allows those illegals here already to remain here legally, but it does not give them a path to citizenship. Every legal resident or alien should have that right, those who entered our country legally, went through the background checks, obtained the visas, paid the fees, etc. but not the ones who avoided all of this.

 

[WCH]

I guessing the bulk of people who are unemployed and have been for some time aren't interested in letting loose 11+ million people to accept jobs at a lower wage and probably no benefits. 'Cause that's what going to happen

 

[mak2]

If the illegals go home that opens up millions of jobs and puts upward pressure on wages.

I guessing the bulk of people who are unemployed and have been for some time aren't interested in letting loose 11+ million people to accept jobs at a lower wage and probably no benefits. 'Cause that's what going to happen

 

[Perotista]

If they flat could not work you would not have to round them up, they would go back. This could be accomplished by arresting several company owners that employ illegals. Make sure the do the Perp walk on Fox and CNN and others. Then next week the rest of them would be unemployed and southbound. We know that will never happen, so we will just talk about about immigration and do nothing.

I tend to agree, the fine for hiring an illegal is very small and the employer faces no other repercussions. Make the fine $1,000 per illegal for the first offense, double the fine for the second and double it again for the third and so on.

Yes we talk about it and do nothing. In a way both parties like the status quo and use immigration as a campaign issue to shore up their base. To actually solve the problem would be to eliminate it as an issue that couldn't be used in the next election.

 

[clownboy]

I am sick and tired of hearing that any immigration plan that doesn't include an amnesty is a loser. That's far from the truth. I've heard that tripe over and over again over the last few decades and the people always rebel in such numbers their politcos abandon the amnesty plan. Show us enforcement, a plan that puts enforcement first and let those legitimately standing in line in. The ones who are here illegally now need to go - stop holding up this pipedream of amnesty for them.

 

[Linc]

I am sick and tired of hearing that any immigration plan that doesn't include an amnesty is a loser. That's far from the truth. I've heard that tripe over and over again over the last few decades and the people always rebel in such numbers their politcos abandon the amnesty plan.

Tell me again why Mr. Reagan supported amnesty, opening the floodgates for Illegals 2.0 .

Show us enforcement, a plan that puts enforcement first and let those legitimately standing in line in. The ones who are here illegally now need to go - stop holding up this pipedream of amnesty for them.

The GOP is already saying why have amnesty reform when Mr. Obama won't enforce the law.
What say you ?

 

[Linc]

I tend to agree, the fine for hiring an illegal is very small and the employer faces no other repercussions. Make the fine $1,000 per illegal for the first offense, double the fine for the second and double it again for the third and so on.

As long as I'm a partisan, do you have any numbers on which party has the most employers of Illegals ?

 

[clownboy]

Tell me again why Mr. Reagan supported amnesty, opening the floodgates for Illegals 2.0 .

You picked the wrong conservative to answer that one if you're expecting a stock answer. Reagan was in many ways a fool. He either believed the second enforcement phase would actually happen or he was taking the popularity and now kicking the can down the road.

The GOP is already saying why have amnesty reform when Mr. Obama won't enforce the law.
What say you ?

That's a legitimate question - why make law they know won't be enforced. Just for ****s and giggles?

 

[WCH]

If the illegals go home that opens up millions of jobs and puts upward pressure on wages.

Why would they go home? If legalized, they would likely be showered with all sorts of FedGov freebies.

 

[mak2]

If they could not work, they would go home.

Why would they go home? If legalized, they would likely be showered with all sorts of FedGov freebies.

 

[WCH]

If they could not work, they would go home.

Most of the males, I would imagine, already have jobs but, once they can legally be hired, who do you think employers will want?

 

[Perotista]

As long as I'm a partisan, do you have any numbers on which party has the most employers of Illegals ?

nope, illegal immigration is not in my top ten of issues I pay much attention to.

 

[danarhea]

This pretty much says it all and comes from a hard core conservative/Republican stalwart.

Ann Coulter - January 29, 2014 - GOP CRAFTS PLAN TO WRECK THE COUNTRY, LOSE VOTERS

The Republican Party will do nothing to provide a path to citizenship for the 11 million people under discussion simply for one reason: self preservation - the first order of business for any living organism.

found this as the headline on Drudge Report with Boehner in a Mexican sombrero in front of the House and the headline of Republicans On Suicide Watch. Pretty dramatic and over the top.

Ann Coulter does not represent the Republican party. As for the Republican party, the House is about to pass a version of immigration reform. Looks like a decent compromise measure.

 

[Linc]

But the whole issue will be soon, especially after the GOP can breathe easier when their primaries are over.
Can you imagine what the Founding Fathers would say of their floundering on immigration?
The TEAs v. The RINOs v. The ELITEs v. The Libertarians

nope, illegal immigration is not in my top ten of issues I pay much attention to.

 

[mak2]

Nothing like what I was saying...

Most of the males, I would imagine, already have jobs but, once they can legally be hired, who do you think employers will want?

 

[Perotista]

But the whole issue will be soon, especially after the GOP can breathe easier when their primaries are over.
Can you imagine what the Founding Fathers would say of their floundering on immigration?
The TEAs v. The RINOs v. The ELITEs v. The Libertarians

As far as I know there were no immigration laws back in the late 1700's and hence no immigration laws to be broken.