Why Can't Prisoners Vote?

[calamity]

Since I'm not a fascist, my first point of order isn't to remove the right to vote from everybody who isn't like me. In a democracy, people who are not like you can vote. In a non-stable democracy, the right to vote is removed from as many groups as possible that are not like you. This gets to the heart of why Republicans have given up on democracy -- they no longer want to share power with people who are not like themselves.

Bingo

 

[calamity]

Felons can't vote because it's an insanely-easy group to disenfranchise.

Especially since, as the stats I posted earlier suggest, a large number of those felons are black.

 

[MaryP]

As noted below, this did not pass, but one has to ask. Why?



Ok, Fred broke a law and now sits in jail. So what? He should still be allowed to vote, IMO. Why do we accept disenfranchising those who are incarcerated?

BTW, we actually double down on this injustice by transporting the prisoner, often a person of color, out of his neighborhood to be counted in the census where he is incarcerated, giving predominantly white areas of the country higher representation than they justly deserve.

If you count them, you should let them vote.

Prisoners have always been allowed to vote in Maine. At the prison I worked at, not many took advantage of it, but they have the chance.

 

[MaryP]

I suspect more nefarious motives are involved than simply "punishment."

From Wiki:
Many states adopted felon voting bans in the 1860s and 1870s, at the same time that voting rights for Black citizens were being considered and contested. Scholars have linked the origins and intents of many state felon voting bans to racial discrimination.[6][7][8] In some states, legislators have been accused of specifically tailoring felon voting bans to purposely and disproportionately target African Americans, for example, by targeting minor crimes more common among these citizens while allowing felons who committed more serious crimes (such as murder) to vote.[9][10]

Felony disenfranchisement in the United States - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

 

[Risky Thicket]

Heh...from the article above

Why am I not surprised to see that?

A disproportionate number of incarcerated people are black.

 

[calamity]

A disproportionate number of incarcerated people are black.

...and disenfranchised as a result.

 

[NatMorton]

Since I'm not a fascist, my first point of order isn't to remove the right to vote from everybody who isn't like me. In a democracy, people who are not like you can vote. In a non-stable democracy, the right to vote is removed from as many groups as possible that are not like you. This gets to the heart of why Republicans have given up on democracy -- they no longer want to share power with people who are not like themselves.

Don’t sell yourself short.

 

[Cardinal]

Don’t sell yourself short.

I guess in lieu of a clever response, you thought that would do. But you know I’m right.

 

[Ren]

As noted below, this did not pass, but one has to ask. Why?



Ok, Fred broke a law and now sits in jail. So what? He should still be allowed to vote, IMO. Why do we accept disenfranchising those who are incarcerated?

BTW, we actually double down on this injustice by transporting the prisoner, often a person of color, out of his neighborhood to be counted in the census where he is incarcerated, giving predominantly white areas of the country higher representation than they justly deserve.

If you count them, you should let them vote.

Disagree. If you break the law you lose many of your freedoms including the right to vote. I love that rule.

Besides, most convicted felons would probably vote democrat so I can see why you would want them to vote.

 

[Cardinal]

Disagree. If you break the law you lose many of your freedoms including the right to vote. I love that rule.

Besides, most convicted felons would probably vote democrat so I can see why you would want them to vote.

Your second paragraph reveals the intellectual dishonesty of your first paragraph.

 

[Hamish Howl]

Why?

This is the usual hair shirt punishment freak ideology. You can never actually pay your debt to society. There's no way back in.

 

[Ren]

Your second paragraph reveals the intellectual dishonesty of your first paragraph.

Your paragraph proves that you have no idea what you're talking about.

Did your mom just introduce you to Wikipedia?

 

[Cardinal]

This is the usual hair shirt punishment freak ideology. You can never actually pay your debt to society. There's no way back in.

We’re no further from the Serengeti than we were 100,000 years ago, but the toys are definitely cooler.

 

[Wayne Jr]

As noted below, this did not pass, but one has to ask. Why?

It follows that only the people willing to follow the rules should have a say in what those rules are.

 

[Cardinal]

Your paragraph proves that you have no idea what you're talking about.

Did your mom just introduce you to Wikipedia?

I‘ll type a little slower for you so you get it: your first paragraph was your pretext, and your second was your true motive.

 

[Patriotic Voter]

I've always thought that once one was finished with all punishment, that the full of their rights should be recognized again. But this is for people currently incarcerated? I mean, we disenfranchise them a hell of a lot more than just by infringing on their right to vote.

The word disenfranchise only means a person has no right to vote, so no, they are not disenfranchised in any other way.

During the Democratic primary/caucus season, I read about the positions each candidate had on letting felons vote. Bernie Sanders was the only one who supports the right to vote in jail. Others want criminals to get their voting rights back after they are released. In Florida, the issue has been considered but not appeared on the ballot. My state district representative's campaign ran an anti-challenger commercial about "cookoo ideas" that suggested the Democrat supports voting in jail.

If you don't deserve to live, you don't deserve to vote, so death row inmates should remain disenfranchised. But I am totally against the death penalty, so if I had my way all prisoners except murderers could get ballots.

 

[Ren]

I‘ll type a little slower for you so you get it: your first paragraph was your pretext, and your second was your true motive.

Wrong on both counts.

My first paragraph is true and my second paragraph was based on reasonable supposition as well as a zinger at her race hustling.

How's Wikipedia treating you? You know, the so-called dictionary that any ol' democrat can edit.

 

[Cardinal]

Wrong on both counts.

My first paragraph is true and my second paragraph was based on reasonable supposition as well as a zinger at her race hustling.

Then you're simply unable to distinguish your rationalizations from yourself.

And trust me, I didn't spot that because I'm a mind reader or Hannibal Lecter. Anybody who can read can see what I saw in your post. It was like watching a person running toward you with an axe while several bloodied bodies lay behind him and concluding, "Hey, I think this guy might be an axe murderer."

 

[Risky Thicket]

...and disenfranchised as a result.

And that has been and continues to be the plan.

 

[Ren]

Then you're simply unable to distinguish your rationalizations from yourself.

And trust me, I didn't spot that because I'm a mind reader or Hannibal Lecter. Anybody who can read can see what I saw in your post. It was like watching a person running toward you with an axe while several bloodied bodies lay behind him and concluding, "Hey, I think this guy might be an axe murderer."

Uh-uh. What we're seeing here is as a fellow leftist pouncing to the aid of another.

You're not very good at it, mind you, but you do get an "A" for effort.

 

[Yakshi]

Interesting thread. My first reaction is that I can't think of a single good reason why prisoners can't vote, but I am all ears. I haven't given the topic much thought.

 

[Cardinal]

Uh-uh. What we're seeing here is as a fellow leftist pouncing to the aid of another.

You're not very good at it, mind you, but you do get an "A" for effort.

Now you're spouting tribalist bibble babble, which once again points to the very obvious fact that voter disenfranchisement is about refusing to share power with people who are not like you, and not about any larger principle.

 

[Cardinal]

Interesting thread. My first reaction is that I can't think of a single good reason why prisoners can't vote, but I am all ears. I haven't given the topic much thought.

If they can't vote, then that's a larger share of voting power for you.

 

[Yakshi]

If they can't vote, then that's a larger share of voting power for you.

And that's troublesome to me.

 

[Ren]

Now you're spouting tribalist bibble babble, which once again points to the very obvious fact that voter disenfranchisement is about refusing to share power with people who are not like you, and not about any larger principle.

Sorry, pal. You hated what I wrote because it's true.

People like you come storming at me all the time.

It's quite simple, really: I reveal the truth and you get up in arms.