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Who's going first?

Who's going first?

  • The Pope

    Votes: 9 100.0%
  • Prince Rainier of Monaco

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    9

Urethra Franklin

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Who's going to leave us first, the pope or Prince Rainier of Monaco?
Will they actually be missed by anybody?
Poor Prince Rainier was at least fairly harmless, even if he served no actual purpose. The pope has done and said some evil things, and caused much misery in the world. One hopes for a more enlightened successor, but it's unlikely. And I think he's going first.
 

Naughty Nurse

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I hope the Pope goes soon. I for one won't miss the mysogynistic, homophobic, AIDS-promoting old fool!
 

Hoot

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I voted for the Pope.

From what I've heard on the news today, he's not doing too well, in fact, he's already been given 'last rites.' Last rites do not mean death is imminent, but is merely a form of blessing for the infirm...but still?

I am not Catholic, but I do know Popes are usually chosen from among the Cardinals...usually a vote by secret ballot.

I suppose it takes years before becoming a Cardinal, but wouldn't it be refreshing to have a Pope who was around 35-45 years of age?

How about a young Pope this time...someone who's a bit more progressive, and dare I say it? Liberal?
 

Urethra Franklin

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Pacridge said:
A poll on who's going to die first? Think I'll pass on this one.
Oh don't be so puritanical pac. I've got bets placed everywhere.
 

Fried Rice

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Pope is gone soon. Maybe then his church will open the window and see it is actually 21st century not 1st
 

Arch Enemy

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I vote for the Pope...

At least he isn't AS bad as Popes of the past, I doubt there will ever be a "good" Pope...
 

Fried Rice

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Dear Urethra - maybe you can have new poll - how bad will next pope be ? Even who is the next one ?

Why not all christians get to vote ?
 

Pacridge

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Fried Rice said:
Pope is gone soon. Maybe then his church will open the window and see it is actually 21st century not 1st
Not likely. As this Pope installed almost every one of the 117 Cardinals who will vote on who will be his successor. There’s even talk of the Church taking a turn to become even more conservative when the next Pope is chosen.
 

Pacridge

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Urethra Franklin said:
Oh don't be so puritanical pac. I've got bets placed everywhere.
Yes, I should perhaps come down from my perch on this book from time to time. Just voting on some one's death seems a bit odd to me.
 

Naughty Nurse

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Looks like Urethra's gonna cash in.

And the world is free of another bigot.
 

ShamMol

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The pope just died...may he rest in peace.
 

Squawker

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Naughty Nurse said:
Looks like Urethra's gonna cash in.

And the world is free of another bigot.
Sounds like you are the bigot, and the one full of hate. Are you so self centered that you can't even respect the Pope? I feel sorry for you. The world is in mourning for a great spiritual leader and great man.
 

Arch Enemy

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I agree,

You don't even have to like the Pope the respect all the things he's done. He has toppled the remaining Soviet Union remains (in Poland), he's traveled to various different places trying to better the ties between Catholics, Orthodox, Muslims. He was the target of an assassination by Mehmet Ali who was later given life in prison, two years later two days after Christmas John Paul II visited Mehmet and spoke to him as a brother; Honestly how many of you would talk like a brother to someone who wanted to kill you?
 

ShamMol

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Arch Enemy said:
I agree,

You don't even have to like the Pope the respect all the things he's done. He has toppled the remaining Soviet Union remains (in Poland), he's traveled to various different places trying to better the ties between Catholics, Orthodox, Muslims. He was the target of an assassination by Mehmet Ali who was later given life in prison, two years later two days after Christmas John Paul II visited Mehmet and spoke to him as a brother; Honestly how many of you would talk like a brother to someone who wanted to kill you?
I am agnostic and I have tremendous respect for the man. The common decency that he showed everyone, the help he tried to give to his own country, the love that he exhibited....don't know if the next pope will be able to top the love for all that John Paul II showed.

what worries me about his death is not that a great man died, but what will happen to the church and its 1 billion followers. personally, i believe that what will likely happen is that a extremely conservative italian pope will be elected and reverse many of the more liberal rulings that JPII passed. i hope it doesn't happen and that the church might even continue a minor trend towards liberalness in the world, but I am currently doubting it. the first test that will enable the world to see what the new pope does on africa.
 

Naughty Nurse

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Squawker said:
Sounds like you are the bigot, and the one full of hate. Are you so self centered that you can't even respect the Pope? I feel sorry for you. The world is in mourning for a great spiritual leader and great man.
Tell that to the millions of people who are dying for lack of a condom!
 

ShamMol

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Naughty Nurse said:
Tell that to the millions of people who are dying for lack of a condom!
You can't blame the actions of the world leaders on the pope. His personal opinion and that of the church is clear, but that doesn't prevent the world leaders from funding condoms does it? Just because one man opposed the use of condoms does not mean that other people can't fund it.
 

Naughty Nurse

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ShamMol said:
You can't blame the actions of the world leaders on the pope. His personal opinion and that of the church is clear, but that doesn't prevent the world leaders from funding condoms does it? Just because one man opposed the use of condoms does not mean that other people can't fund it.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/aids/story/0,7369,1059068,00.html

http://www.catch.com/comments/21971_0_1_0_C/

http://www.catholicsforchoice.org/new/inthenews/120103Scotsman.htm

Need I say more?
 

ShamMol

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Naughty Nurse said:
I believe that my point stands. It is one person saying that he thinks they should not be used for moral reasons. He is not out there in the streets ripping condoms from the hands of the masses in Africa is he? I never saw that picture i guess...

Just because opinion is there, doesn't prevent the masses from rebelling against it. I seem to remember that 96% of American Catholics have used contraceptives at one time or another...so it is possible to ignore the teachings.

Catholics for Choice said:
-The majority of Catholics - 72% - believe that one can be a good Catholic without obeying the church hierarchy’s teaching on birth control.
– National Catholic Reporter, 1999

-96% of all Catholic women who have ever had sex have used modern contraceptive methods at some point in their lives.

-75% of Catholic women of childbearing age who are currently sexually active use a contraceptive method forbidden by the church.

-Sexually active Catholic women who attend church once a week or more use contraception at about the same rate as Catholic women who attend church less frequently (monthly) - 73.5% vs. 75%.

http://www.catholicsforchoice.org/lowbandwidth/youthfacts.htm

Just because it is taught, doesn't mean that it will be followed.
 

Naughty Nurse

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The Catholic Church is actively spreading incorrect information to people who do not have the education or the resources to find out the truth for themselves. Therefore I think your point does not stand. We are not talking about Americans who have access to libraries, the internet etc.


What we should be asking is why does the Catholic Church act in this way? What are its motives?
 

ShamMol

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Naughty Nurse said:
The Catholic Church is actively spreading incorrect information to people who do not have the education or the resources to find out the truth for themselves. Therefore I think your point does not stand. We are not talking about Americans who have access to libraries, the internet etc.


What we should be asking is why does the Catholic Church act in this way? What are its motives?
Its motives, which I really don't agree with, are to spread the message of the bible throughout the world. They do this through missionaries, preaching, etc. Their teachings are inspired from the original founder supposedly. This founder preached that all life was sacred and that one cannot destroy life. The church has taken this to mean that abortion, the death penalty, contraceptives, all those good things (sarcasm, I don't necessarily think they are good) are evil because they either take away or prevent life. The teaching of the Catholic Church is that the act of sex should always be open to new life and any hinderance on that is against the Church's teachings.
 

Naughty Nurse

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ShamMol said:
Its motives, which I really don't agree with, are to spread the message of the bible throughout the world. They do this through missionaries, preaching, etc. Their teachings are inspired from the original founder supposedly. This founder preached that all life was sacred and that one cannot destroy life. The church has taken this to mean that abortion, the death penalty, contraceptives, all those good things (sarcasm, I don't necessarily think they are good) are evil because they either take away or prevent life. The teaching of the Catholic Church is that the act of sex should always be open to new life and any hinderance on that is against the Church's teachings.
And the Catholic Church is prepared to tell outright lies about condoms in order to further its agenda.

Great moral leadership :rolleyes:
 

ShamMol

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Naughty Nurse said:
And the Catholic Church is prepared to tell outright lies about condoms in order to further its agenda.

Great moral leadership :rolleyes:
How bout you provide some of those lies. The Catholic Church issues enciclicals to tell how people should, key word, should lead their lives. People don't necessarily follow it and you haven't done anything to rebutt that little fact.

About moral leadership, the Church and other religious institutions have helped to form the basis of our morality over time and they are just continuing on that tradition...of all people...an agnostic is defending the church...
 

Urethra Franklin

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My, this is too confusing; two threads called "who's going first"

Well, I repeat what I just said in the other one:

I agree 100% with Naughty Nurse.
The pope was an evil man heading an evil institiution. He perpetrated the inequality of women, and the hatred of gays, and has done more to spread poverty and HIV throughout the world than many other individuals.

His persistance to carry on to the end despite his obviously failing health was rather too martyr like; he even compared it to the way of the cross. How long before we have another plastic saint just like Mother Theresa?

His death has been turned into another media circus. To mourn somebody you don't actually know, whether it be princess Di, Elvis, the pope or the Queen mother, is really quite an unbvelieveably self indulgent thing to do - and smacks of insincerity.

One hopes for a successor who'll ordain women, accept gay marriage and preach that condoms save lives - but sadly that's unlikely.
 

Naughty Nurse

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Urethra Franklin said:
My, this is too confusing; two threads called "who's going first"

Well, I repeat what I just said in the other one:

I agree 100% with Naughty Nurse.
The pope was an evil man heading an evil institiution. He perpetrated the inequality of women, and the hatred of gays, and has done more to spread poverty and HIV throughout the world than many other individuals.

His persistance to carry on to the end despite his obviously failing health was rather too martyr like; he even compared it to the way of the cross. How long before we have another plastic saint just like Mother Theresa?

His death has been turned into another media circus. To mourn somebody you don't actually know, whether it be princess Di, Elvis, the pope or the Queen mother, is really quite an unbvelieveably self indulgent thing to do - and smacks of insincerity.

One hopes for a successor who'll ordain women, accept gay marriage and preach that condoms save lives - but sadly that's unlikely.
Right on, girlfriend!

And I see the Catholics have conveniently ignored the evidence that the Catholic Church is spreading lies about condoms, thereby contributing to many avoidable deaths.
 
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