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Stand Your Ground, and Castle Doctrine laws appear to work pretty well.
Name one gun law that has ever stopped a crime involving a gun from being committed. Name one offense that a gun law could prevent. Any offense you want to consider and any gun law you want to make. Let's hear 'em.
I agree but those are statutes. I'm referring to laws that are meant to criminalize something. You can't be convicted of a crime for running away instead of standing your ground. Know what I mean?Stand Your Ground, and Castle Doctrine laws appear to work pretty well.
I agree but those are statutes. I'm referring to laws that are meant to criminalize something. You can't be convicted of a crime for running away instead of standing your ground. Know what I mean?
regulating use is OK with me as long as its sensible
for example-shooting pigeons on Times Square with a 12 bore should be banned
target shooting with a 50 BMG in a suburban environment-banned as well
I agree. And that's the point I have been trying to make.
What folks that don't know anything about guns think when someone states "gun laws don't work" is that means that there should be NO regulation.
And quite frankly, that hurts us in the gun debate
Its unfortunate thought that some of this board don't seem to get that. That's why we responsible gun owners constantly have to educate and
for example-shooting pigeons on Times Square with a 12 bore should be banned
I disagree with this. Once a week for three hours there should be a free for all on those flying rats. Just clear out the area of humans first.
so what
a proper reading of Heller and Miller would find that real assault rifles are the single most 2A protected arms
There were lots of murders with pistols before Chicago banned them
even more afterwards
machine gun murders before the 1934 NFA basically went from being ones that had been legally bought to ones that were not
That is what I thought. That is not proof of a reduction in crime. That is a reduction of a type of weapon used in crime. It did not affect crime at all. Just look at the massive bombings and shootings we still have?
Keep trying.
Actually no.. machine gun murders before NFA went from being more common to being virtually non existent.
Just the facts. .
Actually its both.. And the "massive bombings and shootings" we now have are really not like what was going on in the 1920s and 1930's. Only we now freak out because its on a 24 hour news cycle.. and interrupts Snooki. It was a much more dangerous time then. In fact statistically, crime is much lower now.
Just pesky facts .
I disagree with this. Once a week for three hours there should be a free for all on those flying rats. Just clear out the area of humans first.
You keep coming back with this "Don't let a 6 year old buy a gun" tripe. No, 6 year old's can't by guns. They can't buy cars, cigarettes, alcohol or F'n airplanes either. A lot manufacturers are required to notify the public of recalls; Cars, Child car seats, drug companies, aircraft, boats, etc.
Yep.. you are absolutely right... and so saying that gun laws don't work or aren't necessary is just plain wrong.. and paints us in a bad light.
Please stop. True Patriots don't care if there are people that perceive that we are "making it easy for the anti gun crowd". The anti gun crowd sure as heck doesn't care what we think and every little inch you give them the more miles they try to take. I don't appease when it comes to my rights. I don't give inches, I take miles.[/
Please.. You are an anti gunners wet dream. The fact is that gun owners in this country are a minority.. not a majority. and if we do not recognize that fact that public relations plays a role in maintaining our freedoms.. then we are just plain stupid. There is a vast amount of folks in this country that know nothing about guns.. they are not for them or against them per se. but they do listen to both sides of the issue. Now.. if they are listening to gun owners preach how they are "REAL PATRIOTS" and how no gun laws work, and how no regulation of guns should ever be allowed....
And they compare to an Anti gunner saying there needs to be "reasonable gun control"... we look like the extremists.
You can say how that doesn't matter all you want.. but it does.. and quite frankly, I get tired have having to give thousands of dollars to lobby for my freedoms because some ideologues don't want to listen to reason and rather howl at the moon how they are real patriots.
It isn't appeasement.. its smart. Turtledude said it:turtledude said:regulating use is OK with me as long as its sensible
That's our message and then we get people to listen why particular laws.. such as background checks, etc are NOT SENSIBLE... cause THATS an easy sell. For example... the Sandy Hook Shooter shot his mother and stole her weapons... so Obama wants background checks? How would that work.
Reasonable people who don't know about guns.. do respond to that. Not to the no regulation, True PATRIOT crap you espouse.
Actually its both.. And the "massive bombings and shootings" we now have are really not like what was going on in the 1920s and 1930's. Only we now freak out because its on a 24 hour news cycle.. and interrupts Snooki. It was a much more dangerous time then. In fact statistically, crime is much lower now.
Just pesky facts .
No. The law you quoted had no effect on crime whatsoever. There is no correlation between gun laws and the reduction in crime we have experienced, none.
The only thing "pesky" about your facts is well... That you have none.
I guess you can continue to say it as much as you want.. but it simply isn't true.
I showed you easy evidence of the crimes that were committed during the era before 1934 and after that their has been much less of that type of crime.
now.. that doesn't generalize that "all gun laws" work or that gun laws =less crime as a general rule (hardly).. but it does point out that certain regulations.. like the 1934 law did have an effect on the types of crime.
Can't get around it.. be mad all you want.. but its simply a fact.
Simply pointing out to you that if you ever get in a debate over this in a room full of people that are not already on your side.. you are going to lose. Blanket statements like you are making are often a debaters dream.
I guess you can continue to say it as much as you want.. but it simply isn't true.
I showed you easy evidence of the crimes that were committed during the era before 1934 and after that their has been much less of that type of crime.
now.. that doesn't generalize that "all gun laws" work or that gun laws =less crime as a general rule (hardly).. but it does point out that certain regulations.. like the 1934 law did have an effect on the types of crime.
Can't get around it.. be mad all you want.. but its simply a fact.
Simply pointing out to you that if you ever get in a debate over this in a room full of people that are not already on your side.. you are going to lose. Blanket statements like you are making are often a debaters dream.
Yep.. you are absolutely right... and so saying that gun laws don't work or aren't necessary is just plain wrong.. and paints us in a bad light.
Please.. You are an anti gunners wet dream. The fact is that gun owners in this country are a minority.. not a majority. and if we do not recognize that fact that public relations plays a role in maintaining our freedoms.. then we are just plain stupid. There is a vast amount of folks in this country that know nothing about guns.. they are not for them or against them per se. but they do listen to both sides of the issue. Now.. if they are listening to gun owners preach how they are "REAL PATRIOTS" and how no gun laws work, and how no regulation of guns should ever be allowed....
And they compare to an Anti gunner saying there needs to be "reasonable gun control"... we look like the extremists.
You can say how that doesn't matter all you want.. but it does.. and quite frankly, I get tired have having to give thousands of dollars to lobby for my freedoms because some ideologues don't want to listen to reason and rather howl at the moon how they are real patriots.
It isn't appeasement.. its smart. Turtledude said it:
That's our message and then we get people to listen why particular laws.. such as background checks, etc are NOT SENSIBLE... cause THATS an easy sell. For example... the Sandy Hook Shooter shot his mother and stole her weapons... so Obama wants background checks? How would that work.
Reasonable people who don't know about guns.. do respond to that. Not to the no regulation, True PATRIOT crap you espouse.
I don't care what you think or rather or not anti-gunners like me or dream of me or whatever the f***. Your arguing a point in your own little room standing by yourself and basically saying a lot of pro gunners are morons that think kids should be able to buy guns. It's like saying that 6 year old's not being able to buy cars prevents auto accidents. NO S**T!!!! It's ridiculous to use the "Kids getting guns" in this thread because it's obvious (Well, maybe not to you) that I was referring to criminal laws and banning laws. You are insulting forum members stating that we are too moronic to realize a 6 year old shouldn't be able to buy a gun. I think you just started that inane line of dialog to troll/bait. You start acting like you are so enlightened and post crap that assumes we are all Neanderthal, low I.Q. idiots and I'm calling you out. I will state this another way because maybe your intelligence level is just way to elevated to understand my last reply; The anti-gun/anti-freedom socialists do not give two s**ts if we agree that 6 year old's shouldn't have guns. We can state that 24/7/365 and it wouldn't go 1 inch with them, they will still want bans, prove your not a criminal checks and all the other crap that they keep trying to implement. They don't care about recalls because they don't want us to have guns that we will need to get a notification about in the first place. They don't care about extra time for use of firearm laws because THEY WANT ALL GUNS BANNED!!!!!
O.P. "Name one gun law that has ever stopped a crime involving a gun from being committed. Name one offense that a gun law could prevent. Any offense you want to consider and any gun law you want to make. Let's hear 'em."
Notice the phrases "Stopped a crime" and "Offense prevented". Commonsense logic says I meant adult criminal actions. Commonsense logic doesn't assume I'm referring to 6 year old's robbing liquor stores or shooting their baby sister.
Gun owners are not the minority. pro- freedomers may be but not gun owners. you show me some stats showing that gun owners are the minority in this Country. In 2007 there where 94.3 guns per every 100 people in the U.S.A. This is more recent
do you support banning a certain class of gun if that would decrease crime with that gun?
.Manta said:No you have not. You showed that crime involving that type of weapon continued until the end of prohibition. It did not affect crime, only the weapon used. Doh! Had nothing to do with gun laws
I am not mad. As soon as you post a relevant fact that flies in the face of there being no correlation between crime reduction and gun laws, you might have something. The problem is I know you can't.
Not fact.. there are correlations between crime and guns... in fact.. areas with more lax laws are correlated with lower rates of crime. Fact.Fact: No correlation between crime and guns exist. Period.
Fact: The restricting of fully automatic weapons did not affect crime at all, the end of prohibition did.
. Again not true.Fact: You have provided no evidence at all to back up what you said, period
Some more nasty little facts for you...
States’ crime rates show scant linkage to gun laws - States' crime rates show scant linkage to gun laws - Washington Times
Harvard Study: Gun Control Is Counterproductive - Harvard Study: Gun Control Is Counterproductive | The American Civil Rights Union
Gun Control 2013: Guns and Crime is a False Correlation - Gun Control 2013: Guns and Crime is a False Correlation
[/QUOTE]I don't care what you think or rather or not anti-gunners like me or dream of me or whatever the f***. Your arguing a point in your own little room standing by yourself and basically saying a lot of pro gunners are morons that think kids should be able to buy guns. It's like saying that 6 year old's not being able to buy cars prevents auto accidents. NO S**T!!!! It's ridiculous to use the "Kids getting guns" in this thread because it's obvious (Well, maybe not to you) that I was referring to criminal laws and banning laws. You are insulting forum members stating that we are too moronic to realize a 6 year old shouldn't be able to buy a gun. I think you just started that inane line of dialog to troll/bait. You start acting like you are so enlightened and post crap that assumes we are all Neanderthal, low I.Q. idiots and I'm calling you out. I will state this another way because maybe your intelligence level is just way to elevated to understand my last reply; The anti-gun/anti-freedom socialists do not give two s**ts if we agree that 6 year old's shouldn't have guns. We can state that 24/7/365 and it wouldn't go 1 inch with them, they will still want bans, prove your not a criminal checks and all the other crap that they keep trying to implement. They don't care about recalls because they don't want us to have guns that we will need to get a notification about in the first place. They don't care about extra time for use of firearm laws because THEY WANT ALL GUNS BANNED!!!!!
O.P. "Name one gun law that has ever stopped a crime involving a gun from being committed. Name one offense that a gun law could prevent. Any offense you want to consider and any gun law you want to make. Let's hear 'em."
Notice the phrases "Stopped a crime" and "Offense prevented". Commonsense logic says I meant adult criminal actions. Commonsense logic doesn't assume I'm referring to 6 year old's robbing liquor stores or shooting their baby sister.
Gun owners are not the minority. pro- freedomers may be but not gun owners. you show me some stats showing that gun owners are the minority in this Country. In 2007 there where 94.3 guns per every 100 people in the U.S.A. This is more recent
A Gallup poll quoted by the Sourcebook of Criminal Justice Statistics asked U.S. residents the following question:
Do you have a gun in your home?
In 2010, 39% of respondents answered "yes." The figure has been fluctuating between 38% and 42% in polls taken since 2000, and has ranged between 36% and 51% since polling began in 1959.
Read more: Who Owns Guns in America? | Infoplease.com Who Owns Guns in America? | Infoplease.com
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