Which gun control measure would you prefer?

[Glitch]

Gun registration isn't un-Constitutional. Many urban cities require gun registration. Problem is, it hasn't reduced crime one bit. It becomes a formality and many people simply ignore the requirement. Criminals ignore it altogether. BTW; every time you buy a gun through the Instant Check you have registered that gun.

You are seriously mistaken. Any form of registration, permit, license, or any limitation or restriction placed on ownership or possession of a firearm is very much a violation of the Second Amendment.

The only reason cities and and some States (and it is always the ones under leftist control) have such unconstitutional laws is because they have had 221 years when the Second Amendment did not apply them. Since the Second Amendment only applied to the federal government, States and cities could violate the Second Amendment at will, and regularly did exactly that.

However, that was all changed by the McDonald decision in 2010. State and local governments are now required to abide by the restrictions imposed by the Second Amendment. Which makes any city ordinance or State law that infringes upon the individual right to keep and bear arms unconstitutional, including registration.

 

[CLAX1911]

It says that they have universal healthcare.

I know it's because they abandoned socialized medicine because it was failing and created what they call super hospitals and what we call hospitals.

 

[jaeger19]

I know it's because they abandoned socialized medicine because it was failing and created what they call super hospitals and what we call hospitals.

You have no idea what you are talking about. Please don;t inject your conspiracy theories/paranoia into an intellectual discussion

 

[Rich2018]

I read the title and in fact the entire article..which is why I question the title's veracity. Because the information in the article did not support the titles assertion.
Just facts and science.

Really, so the title was:

A Powerful Database Helps Solve Gun Crimes

So where is your disconnect ?

 

[RF667799]

Really, so the title was:

A Powerful Database Helps Solve Gun Crimes

So where is your disconnect ?

No need to read the article itself, eh? I doubt you did. That's why your own references so often fail to support your arguments, and in fact sometimes contradict them.

 

[jaeger19]

Really, so the title was:

A Powerful Database Helps Solve Gun Crimes

So where is your disconnect ?

The article didn't provide any information that supported that title. It had no information on convictions due to the "powerful database".

 

[CLAX1911]

You have no idea what you are talking about. Please don;t inject your conspiracy theories/paranoia into an intellectual discussion

Der dee dum dum. I don't know what you're talking about.

Don't blame me for your incompetence.

 

[jaeger19]

Der dee dum dum. I don't know what you're talking about.

Don't blame me for your incompetence.

Yep.. I understand you don;t understand what I am saying.
Which is why I didn;t try to explain why you are so wrong. I just asked you to stop.
Have a nice day.

 

[CLAX1911]

Yep.. I understand you don;t understand what I am saying.
Which is why I didn;t try to explain why you are so wrong. I just asked you to stop.
Have a nice day.

When did you ask me to stop. You just told me you were incompetent.

 

[Rich2018]

The article didn't provide any information that supported that title. It had no information on convictions due to the "powerful database".

Yes it did.

You're just in denial.

 

[jaeger19]

Yes it did.

You're just in denial.

Great... then how about you show me in the article where it showed the conviction rate from using the data base.
I will wait with baited breath.

 

[Rich2018]

Great... then how about you show me in the article where it showed the conviction rate from using the data base.
I will wait with baited breath.

A Powerful Database Helps Solve Gun Crimes. Only Two States Require Police to Use It.

Four years ago, before collecting bullet casings became a widely hailed tool for solving gun crimes, New Jersey state legislators did something radical: They passed a law requiring police to submit guns and casings to a national ballistics database called NIBIN. Detractors said it would never...

www.thetrace.org

I suggest you actually read it this time.
As a test, who is Ali Muhammad Brown ?

 

[jaeger19]

A Powerful Database Helps Solve Gun Crimes. Only Two States Require Police to Use It.

Four years ago, before collecting bullet casings became a widely hailed tool for solving gun crimes, New Jersey state legislators did something radical: They passed a law requiring police to submit guns and casings to a national ballistics database called NIBIN. Detractors said it would never...

www.thetrace.org

Al

I suggest you actually read it this time.
As a test, who is Ali Muhammad Brown ?

I did.
Ali Muhammad Brown is one fellow that they used the database on. BUT.. there is no evidence that his conviction would was DUE to the database.
In fact.. its questionable because all they knew from the database was that it matched a shooting in Seattle two weeks later.
Well.. that means that the database didn;t give them a NAME.. it didn;t identify the shooter. Other evidence is what must have led to knowing the shooter was Brown. NOT the database.

The article you presented did not in any way show the conviction rate due to using the database.
So.. again.. please present that information.

 

[Rich2018]

Ali Muhammad Brown is one fellow that they used the database on. BUT.. there is no evidence that his conviction would was DUE to the database.

Exactly, no evidence at all
But there ***IS*** evidence that his conviction ***WAS*** due to the gun database

If you're aware of evidence that he would have been convicted anyway, please post it

In fact.. its questionable because all they knew from the database was that it matched a shooting in Seattle two weeks later.
Well.. that means that the database didn;t give them a NAME.. it didn;t identify the shooter. Other evidence is what must have led to knowing the shooter was Brown. NOT the database.

How do you know
How do you think law enforcement got his name ?

The article you presented did not in any way show the conviction rate due to using the database.
So.. again.. please present that information.

"...after that (Ali Muhammad Brown's conviction), gun evidence started yielding clues regularly. Eighteen months into the new mandate, the New Jersey State Police had increased ballistic leads by 78 percent..."

78% increase in clues, and you're going to pretend they were ALL superfluous in solving crimes ?
Do be stupid.


Microstamping and ballistics identification can reduce gun violence by improving the solve rate of gun-related crimes.
"...it’s no coincidence that in a city like Chicago, where the homicide solve rate is as low as 21%, gun violence rates are astronomical. By way of comparison, the Murder Accountability Project estimates that the national homicide clearance rate in 2015 was 61.5%.3 In many cities like Chicago, there is much room for improvement. Ballistic imaging and microstamping technologies have the potential to reduce gun violence by improving the solve rate of gun-related crimes.
...both ballistic identification and microstamping systems help law enforcement officials investigate gun crimes because they can accurately identify the gun from which a cartridge case was fired.5By linking the cartridge cases recovered at crime scenes to the gun that fired them, ballistic identification and microstamping technologies make it easier to solve gun crimes..."

Microstamping & Ballistics

Universal background checks save lives from gun violence.

giffords.org

 

[RF667799]

Exactly, no evidence at all
But there ***IS*** evidence that his conviction ***WAS*** due to the gun database

If you're aware of evidence that he would have been convicted anyway, please post it



How do you know
How do you think law enforcement got his name ?




"...after that (Ali Muhammad Brown's conviction), gun evidence started yielding clues regularly. Eighteen months into the new mandate, the New Jersey State Police had increased ballistic leads by 78 percent..."

78% increase in clues, and you're going to pretend they were ALL superfluous in solving crimes ?
Do be stupid.


Microstamping and ballistics identification can reduce gun violence by improving the solve rate of gun-related crimes.
"...it’s no coincidence that in a city like Chicago, where the homicide solve rate is as low as 21%, gun violence rates are astronomical. By way of comparison, the Murder Accountability Project estimates that the national homicide clearance rate in 2015 was 61.5%.3 In many cities like Chicago, there is much room for improvement. Ballistic imaging and microstamping technologies have the potential to reduce gun violence by improving the solve rate of gun-related crimes.
...both ballistic identification and microstamping systems help law enforcement officials investigate gun crimes because they can accurately identify the gun from which a cartridge case was fired.5By linking the cartridge cases recovered at crime scenes to the gun that fired them, ballistic identification and microstamping technologies make it easier to solve gun crimes..."

Microstamping & Ballistics

Universal background checks save lives from gun violence.

giffords.org

The "ballistic leads" point was already addressed. You're just repeating it as if it wasn't.

 

[Rich2018]

...any form of registration, permit, license, or any limitation or restriction placed on ownership or possession of a firearm is very much a violation of the Second Amendment.

No it's not. It's not at all

 

[jaeger19]

Exactly, no evidence at all
But there ***IS*** evidence that his conviction ***WAS*** due to the gun database

If you're aware of evidence that he would have been convicted anyway, please post it



How do you know
How do you think law enforcement got his name ?




"...after that (Ali Muhammad Brown's conviction), gun evidence started yielding clues regularly. Eighteen months into the new mandate, the New Jersey State Police had increased ballistic leads by 78 percent..."

78% increase in clues, and you're going to pretend they were ALL superfluous in solving crimes ?
Do be stupid.


Microstamping and ballistics identification can reduce gun violence by improving the solve rate of gun-related crimes.
"...it’s no coincidence that in a city like Chicago, where the homicide solve rate is as low as 21%, gun violence rates are astronomical. By way of comparison, the Murder Accountability Project estimates that the national homicide clearance rate in 2015 was 61.5%.3 In many cities like Chicago, there is much room for improvement. Ballistic imaging and microstamping technologies have the potential to reduce gun violence by improving the solve rate of gun-related crimes.
...both ballistic identification and microstamping systems help law enforcement officials investigate gun crimes because they can accurately identify the gun from which a cartridge case was fired.5By linking the cartridge cases recovered at crime scenes to the gun that fired them, ballistic identification and microstamping technologies make it easier to solve gun crimes..."

Microstamping & Ballistics

Universal background checks save lives from gun violence.

giffords.org

Yawn. Sorry dude but you have not rebutted a single point I have made except to reiterate the opinion of your article.
Opinions that as I point out are not based on actual conviction rates because of the database.
78% in clues? Great..did these clues lead to conviction..or did these clues lead to red herrings that made the case more difficult.?
The article doesn't say and you don't know either.
That's the facts and science.

 

[TurtleDude]

Yawn. Sorry dude but you have not rebutted a single point I have made except to reiterate the opinion of your article.
Opinions that as I point out are not based on actual conviction rates because of the database.
78% in clues? Great..did these clues lead to conviction..or did these clues lead to red herrings that made the case more difficult.?
The article doesn't say and you don't know either.
That's the facts and science.

Rich wants to ban all guns.

Thus, anything he supports concerning guns, has to be seen as a tool he thinks will help achieve a complete gun ban

all his claims why this or that is needed is a facade

 

[Rich2018]

Yawn. Sorry dude but you have not rebutted a single point I have made except to reiterate the opinion of your article.
Opinions that as I point out are not based on actual conviction rates because of the database.
78% in clues? Great..did these clues lead to conviction..or did these clues lead to red herrings that made the case more difficult.?
The article doesn't say and you don't know either.
That's the facts and science.

Be a flat Earther then...believe what you want, talking to you is like trying to persuade a fundamentalist Christian that the world wasn't created in 6 days, about 6,000 years ago

But the evidence is there if ever you want to connect with reality and acknowledge the mountains of evidence.

 

[Rich2018]

Rich wants to ban all guns.

And again you strangely miss out the EXEMPTIONS
I wonder why you do that ?

Thus, anything he supports concerning guns, has to be seen as a tool he thinks will help achieve a complete gun ban

all his claims why this or that is needed is a facade

The objective is of course a repeal of the 2nd Amendment and a gun ban*

*Subject to exemptions previously discussed, and that TD doesn't want to acknowledge as it undermines his world view.

 

[RF667799]

And again you strangely miss out the EXEMPTIONS
I wonder why you do that ?



The objective is of course a repeal of the 2nd Amendment and a gun ban*

*Subject to exemptions previously discussed, and that TD doesn't want to acknowledge as it undermines his world view.

You've never answered any criticism of your ridiculous plan along with its exemptions.

What about a pro-gun administration that exempts every damn thing?

Since exemptions in your plan are arbitrary and subject to whim by design; how will gun owners comply with a legality that can change on a daily basis?

 

[jaeger19]

Be a flat Earther then...believe what you want, talking to you is like trying to persuade a fundamentalist Christian that the world wasn't created in 6 days, about 6,000 years ago

But the evidence is there if ever you want to connect with reality and acknowledge the mountains of evidence.

Hah.. thats funny. You don't realize that you are the "flat earther" that simply holds into belief out of pure ignorance. I believe in science facts and logic to make my decisions.
You?
Faith and fear.

 

[jaeger19]

I'd say a 78% increased ballistic leads does EXACTLY that.


SEVENTY-EIGHT PER CENT

You just in denial.

Yes 78 % ballistic leads. In your ignorance you don't understand that a lead isn't always good. And a lead isn't a conviction.
I would explain the how and why to you..but frankly you are incapable of understanding.

 

[Rich2018]

Hah.. thats funny. You don't realize that you are the "flat earther" that simply holds into belief out of pure ignorance. I believe in science facts and logic to make my decisions.
You?
Faith and fear.

No, I gave you the evidence - you're the one choosing to ignore it

Yes 78 % ballistic leads. In your ignorance you don't understand that a lead isn't always good. And a lead isn't a conviction.
I would explain the how and why to you..but frankly you are incapable of understanding.

So you're admitting that a lead sometimes ***IS*** good and therefore helps to solve a gun related crime

Thank you for contradicting your own flat-Earth position and supporting my case.

Cheers.

 

[RF667799]

No, I gave you the evidence - you're the one choosing to ignore it



So you're admitting that a lead sometimes ***IS*** good and therefore helps to solve a gun related crime

Thank you for contradicting your own flat-Earth position and supporting my case.

Cheers.

This argument originated with you supporting a statement about registering gun owners. All this about gun data bases is rabbit hole you dug trying to support that.

You aren't even supporting your rabbit hole well. Your implication was that this ballistic data base was a significant crime fighting tool. The only support you have mustered is the title of an article.