Where do you stand?[W:452]

[Crimefree]

Re: Where do you stand?

The court can be changed, restacked, or dissolved.

Somebody does not know who holds the power and is the final say on political and legal matters. That must be lovely for government to have subjects and not citizens.

 

[Crimefree]

Re: Where do you stand?

What good are gun laws in cities when some Jim Bob or Bubba in a city with tight gun laws can travel to another town or state and buy a gun?

Why did you stop there as if it were the fault of places where a gun can be "legally" purchased? Could they not just steal one from the nearest cop, house, police station, military or "import" or make one or buy from the local "gun merchant". I mean the realisation that criminals have endless options of acquisition comes with thought and recognition criminal are not bound by some idiotic law.

 

[Crimefree]

Re: Where do you stand?

So you aren't man enough to back up your accusations. Hardly a surprise.

A good example of anal retentive.

I repeat read it slowly. I recognised a serious inability to comprehend, so much so I decided to do it one step at a time so you could grasp the content of what was previously presented to you since you had failed abysmally to comprehend

What are you babbling about? Get a grip.

I can do it in steps for you so you can understand.

1) Who do you wish to disarm?

You most certainly have expressed on many many pages the desire to disarm certain people. I am now asking who do you wish to disarm? List them please, all of them.

Is that a question you do not understand and why is it not understood?

 

[Crimefree]

Re: Where do you stand?

Get gun control laws like Europe and Australia. There has to be some reason why their gun violence is less than ours.

There is but it is not guns

 

[MisterLogical]

Re: Where do you stand?

I do not believe guns are safe for everyone to have
I do believe there is rare occasions where someone might need one to defend their home
I do not believe banning guns is a good solution to stop stuff like school shootings since its not addressing the 100 of other issues going on with that problem

 

[Crimefree]

Re: Where do you stand?

You don't necessarily need to be able to buy a gun in order to defend yourself. For example, a child may be trained to find use their parents gun in the case of a home invasion. In that case, the parent is the responsible party.

Children are the parents responsibility QED

Others with guns doesn't really make me afraid. People have lots of guns all around me, i'm not afraid. That's different than wanting a little caution exercised in the sale of firearms.

You are trying to split hairs to avoid what you know to be true.

Even if you could argue to me that UBC had zero impact, i would still think it's a good law. What we have is already pretty close to UBC, and the extent to which a loophole is exploited should not be used to leave a loophole wide open.

1) yes. I think it's safe to say that guns influence gun-related crimes.

You mean in the same way vehicles influence vehicle related crime and deaths? You have to have one to play? That was gun control's intention by conning people into discussing "gun crimes". Nice move from gun control don't you think?

2) yes. In other words, to correct the current law that is negligent in its duty.

WTF???? I cannot believe you wrote this. Laws have no duty......

I would say that a projectile bullet lodging into someone's skull constitutes physical influence.

You lost me in the mind movie you have running. I have no idea how this constitutes physical influence of guns causing crime. Maybe you had better explain how the bullet moved in the first place. Move = physical. What made it move from where it was to a skull? Why did it move? Keep going until you get to the gun. Then explain what the gun did.

I think it's safe to say that humans, in moments of desperation, will use whatever's in arms reach.

A light doth shine yonder.

If that person is mentally unstable, and can buy a number of guns, i think such a situation is a potentially preventable tragedy.

Opps sorry a mirage or illusion false alarm. Sit down where you are and count the number of ways you could murder somebody or commit suicide. Now compare that to your light that shone above ( yes read it again ) and tell me how you can equate these two sentences in your head and not see the utter rubbish one is

Now, if i can show that just one, single life is saved through ever so slightly stricter gun control (simply universal enforcement of current laws), i hope that you would consider it. I do not mean to steamroll you through policy, but i think that wider gun law discussions often fall apart because the topic is so polarizing that parties neglect to listen to one another.

Now if I can show just one life taken because of gun control what then? I think that is perfectly fair based on your expectation of others. You first. I have 262 million so be warned it had better be good.

 

[Crimefree]

Re: Where do you stand?

I do not believe guns are safe for everyone to have

Guns are perfectly safe. It's been tested many times and not once have guns proven to be unsafe.

If you mean the person holding it say so. That is a generalisation that makes no real contribution. I don't believe everyone should be allowed to drive on our roads is about as helpful. I don't believe everyone should be allowed to own a house, go out on the streets.....

I do believe there is rare occasions where someone might need one to defend their home

I don't know what the number is but when you get through reading this tell me. It is not rare as gun control would have everyone believe.

Armed Resistance to Crime: The Prevalence and Nature of Self-Defense with a Gun

I do not believe banning guns is a good solution to stop stuff like school shootings since its not addressing the 100 of other issues going on with that problem

Banning gun will only stop legitimate sales of guns the same as banning alcohol did or drugs. It seems government and gun control needs reminding of that fact. Note anything lesser that a ban simply follows the same rule it does nothing. There is absolutely no reason why it should not follow the same failure. As noted the problem is not addressed.

What one by study learns is that gun control is one big lie. Nothing gun control claims is true.

 

[Kal'Stang]

Re: Where do you stand?

This poll question addresses what you think the laws and the constitution should say about firearms in your ideal scenario.

The only people that should not be allowed have guns are violent criminals in Prison and those in mental health institutions. If they're not in prison or mental health institutions then obviously the system thinks they're safe enough to be let out. If they end up not being safe enough then the system is to blame since the prison system and mental health institutions are supposed to be exactly for locking up dangerous people.

 

[Crimefree]

Re: Where do you stand?

The only people that should not be allowed have guns are violent criminals in Prison and those in mental health institutions. If they're not in prison or mental health institutions then obviously the system thinks they're safe enough to be let out. If they end up not being safe enough then the system is to blame since the prison system and mental health institutions are supposed to be exactly for locking up dangerous people.

Absolute clear expression of what the founding fathers wrote the 2nd to guarantee. Guns are not the problem and if a solution is needed it involves the individual who cannot live in society without being locked up.

These absolutely unfounded calls for restrictions checks and testing from gun control have absolutely nothing to do with crime control. It's like the indoctrinated idiots who fostered the prohibition of alcohol. Well meaning idiots who could not be bothered to think and simply believe the emotion laden fear mongering of gun control. If just one life can be saved, make it safe for our children, they screech, while uncaring knowing that what is proposed will lead to increased opportunities for nuts and criminals.

If they don't know then I'm telling them now. Society does not need these people pushing backwards into control by the few. One revolution is enough to get rid of them.

 

[MisterLogical]

Re: Where do you stand?

Children are the parents responsibility QED



You are trying to split hairs to avoid what you know to be true.



You mean in the same way vehicles influence vehicle related crime and deaths? You have to have one to play? That was gun control's intention by conning people into discussing "gun crimes". Nice move from gun control don't you think?



WTF???? I cannot believe you wrote this. Laws have no duty......



You lost me in the mind movie you have running. I have no idea how this constitutes physical influence of guns causing crime. Maybe you had better explain how the bullet moved in the first place. Move = physical. What made it move from where it was to a skull? Why did it move? Keep going until you get to the gun. Then explain what the gun did.



A light doth shine yonder.



Opps sorry a mirage or illusion false alarm. Sit down where you are and count the number of ways you could murder somebody or commit suicide. Now compare that to your light that shone above ( yes read it again ) and tell me how you can equate these two sentences in your head and not see the utter rubbish one is



Now if I can show just one life taken because of gun control what then? I think that is perfectly fair based on your expectation of others. You first. I have 262 million so be warned it had better be good.

No, guns are not safe and they are not a toy. You need to figure that out before you touch one. Its a weapon and you can hurt someone if youre are going to be an idiot about it.

 

[AmericanSpartan]

Re: Where do you stand?

No, guns are not safe and they are not a toy. You need to figure that out before you touch one. Its a weapon and you can hurt someone if youre are going to be an idiot about it.

Yes they are safe. It is a tool until it is used to harm innocent people.

 

[NonoBadDog]

Re: Where do you stand?

It's funny, when it's a $2 trillion dollar war where we lose 4,400 American lives, it's good to be proactive. That was a good decision.

I think that they should stop painting wagons red. I mean, it is the same color as blood. I think we should take the color red out of all boxes of crayons. This has about as much to do with the topic as this part of your post.

 

[NonoBadDog]

Re: Where do you stand?

Thanks for letting us know up front you have no interest in any meaningful discussion on the subject. A real time saver that.

:funny

 

[NonoBadDog]

Re: Where do you stand?

Right, we really need to worry about your right to put a loaded weapon in the hands of a mass murderer. That's a really important right to defend...

Well, if the person asking for a gun says that he wants it so that he can kill 20 people at a shopping mall I figure that would fall into the "danger to themselves and/or others" category. Other than that, how do you propose we determine whether someone will decide to become a mass murderer in a week or a month or a year?

Maybe put it on the yellow sheet. There could be a box to check. There could be a question added:
"Are you or do you plan to murder or harm massive amounts of people with the firearm that you are purchasing today?"
I am sure that would work, really, it would.

 

[Lovebug]

Re: Where do you stand?

Someone argued that those lawfully deemed a danger to themselves and/or to others should be restricted from having guns. Not sure how that would work, but if we notice someone about to go postal...and there are enough signs...have the balls to say something to the authorities.
As for federal regulations...no problem. If I get my permit in OR, I should be able to carry in all 50 States without having to worry about State laws. Why?....
'Honest mistake' leads to Philly mother facing three years on gun charge | Fox News
This is absurd.

 

[DifferentDrummr]

Re: Where do you stand?

The only people that should not be allowed have guns are violent criminals in Prison and those in mental health institutions. If they're not in prison or mental health institutions then obviously the system thinks they're safe enough to be let out. If they end up not being safe enough then the system is to blame since the prison system and mental health institutions are supposed to be exactly for locking up dangerous people.

That would be a good approach under two conditions:

1. Everyone who should be in prison is in prison.
...and...
2. Everyone who should be in a mental health institution is in a mental health institution.

I'm sure that everyone agrees we aren't there yet. Maybe we can achieve #1 in the foreseeable future, if we can improve the fairness and efficiency of the criminal justice system. As for #2, medical science has barely scratched the surface of understanding and treating mental health issues.

 

[DifferentDrummr]

Re: Where do you stand?

A good example of anal retentive.

I repeat read it slowly. I recognised a serious inability to comprehend, so much so I decided to do it one step at a time so you could grasp the content of what was previously presented to you since you had failed abysmally to comprehend

What are you babbling about? Get a grip.

I can do it in steps for you so you can understand.

1) Who do you wish to disarm?

You most certainly have expressed on many many pages the desire to disarm certain people. I am now asking who do you wish to disarm? List them please, all of them.

Is that a question you do not understand and why is it not understood?

No. I am not making lists for giant, whiny babies who don't back up their accusations.

You are the one who accused me of wanting to disarm crime victims:

Says a guy who want to disarm the victims of crime as a crime reduction measure.

Now a man who makes an accusation points out evidence to support it.

So it's your responsibility (as a man) to quote at least one post - just like I did above - where I say what you're accusing me of. Or even where I imply it. Understand?

If you can't do this, you're done. QED.

There is absolutely nothing else to discuss on this point.

 

[Crimefree]

Re: Where do you stand?

No, guns are not safe and they are not a toy. You need to figure that out before you touch one. Its a weapon and you can hurt someone if youre are going to be an idiot about it.

Guns like power tools are safe. I don't know what world you live that has unsafe rocks, waterfalls, dams, seas.... and what experience you have with idiots but in this world rocks like guns are safe until used. It requires human intervention just like a dam is safe. Is that so difficult to understand? Try it that way you may not be so keen to blame an object for "doing" something. Hoverer if you want to animate metal and credit it with the ability to control humans then you must be on some other world.

BTW we try to make things idiot proof but the world just develops better idiots. There is not much point to try and legislate for them and others who are keen to join the Darwin award recipients.

See what I mean

Darwin Awards. Chlorinating The Gene Pool.

 

[MisterLogical]

Re: Where do you stand?

Guns like power tools are safe. I don't know what world you live that has unsafe rocks, waterfalls, dams, seas.... and what experience you have with idiots but in this world rocks like guns are safe until used. It requires human intervention just like a dam is safe. Is that so difficult to understand? Try it that way you may not be so keen to blame an object for "doing" something. Hoverer if you want to animate metal and credit it with the ability to control humans then you must be on some other world.

BTW we try to make things idiot proof but the world just develops better idiots. There is not much point to try and legislate for them and others who are keen to join the Darwin award recipients.

See what I mean

Darwin Awards. Chlorinating The Gene Pool.

Yeah, you are going to end up shooting someone. I was taught how to shoot by cops, and they stressed the fact that guns are not a toy, they are very dangerous and safety was important. Cops carry guns in the US. They are clearly a lot smarter about these issues than you. I think if someone wanted to stress gun laws, you are are great reason to. These are not toys, and power tools are dangerous too. Jesus Christ, what is wrong with you? They need to put you in a padded room, wrapped in bubblewrap since you are clearly going to murder someone or hurt yourself playing with something dangerous.

 

[MisterLogical]

Re: Where do you stand?

Yes they are safe. It is a tool until it is used to harm innocent people.

No, they are not, why when you are taught to shoot a gun, they teach you gun safety. You people are not children, you should understand that power tools and guns are not TOYS. What do you have to shoot yourself in the foot to understand this? Power tools can be dangerous too but you use them to do construction.

 

[Crimefree]

Re: Where do you stand?

Yeah, you are going to end up shooting someone. I was taught how to shoot by cops, and they stressed the fact that guns are not a toy, they are very dangerous and safety was important. Cops carry guns in the US. They are clearly a lot smarter about these issues than you. I think if someone wanted to stress gun laws, you are are great reason to. These are not toys, and power tools are dangerous too. Jesus Christ, what is wrong with you? They need to put you in a padded room, wrapped in bubblewrap since you are clearly going to murder someone or hurt yourself playing with something dangerous.

I am beginning to pound my head at your total lack of sense or comprehension. Which part of "human intervention" did you not understand?

A gun as any dimwit or moron knows is an inanimate object. It cannot be safe or unsafe. It cannot hurt or injure on its own. The obvious alludes those who cloud their minds with crap.

Logic defies you does it not. It would seem so becasue all this is perfectly logical.

Did I say they were toys?

Now as for cops the majority are borderline morons when it comes to guns. Your trainer was a perfect example unless you have mangled what he said to accord with your mad hatter version ( a distinct possibility). Idiots, morons, cretins and planet 51 citizens are dangerous and unsafe with guns, power tools, crossing our streets.... Human intervention LOOK IT UP. The poor trainer was trying to instil some fear in the dimwits he was trying to train so they would not forget and shoot themselves in the foot. He knew exactly what would happen if he explained factually. One of the dimwits would put a bullet in his foot or his head as he tried to see how it came out or if it was stuck.

And I'm done with you until you learn some manners and civility.

 

[MisterLogical]

Re: Where do you stand?

I am beginning to pound my head at your total lack of sense or comprehension. Which part of "human intervention" did you not understand?

A gun as any dimwit or moron knows is an inanimate object. It cannot be safe or unsafe. It cannot hurt or injure on its own. The obvious alludes those who cloud their minds with crap.

Logic defies you does it not. It would seem so becasue all this is perfectly logical.

Did I say they were toys?

Now as for cops the majority are borderline morons when it comes to guns. Your trainer was a perfect example unless you have mangled what he said to accord with your mad hatter version ( a distinct possibility). Idiots, morons, cretins and planet 51 citizens are dangerous and unsafe with guns, power tools, crossing our streets.... Human intervention LOOK IT UP. The poor trainer was trying to instil some fear in the dimwits he was trying to train so they would not forget and shoot themselves in the foot. He knew exactly what would happen if he explained factually. One of the dimwits would put a bullet in his foot or his head as he tried to see how it came out or if it was stuck.

And I'm done with you until you learn some manners and civility.

Seriously what is wrong with you? How old are you? How do you not understand how to be safe with guns and power tools. Yes, they are dangerous. They are tools and weapons they are NOT ****ING TOYS! This is coming from someone who shot a gun before on a gun range. ITS NOT A ****ING TOY! I am not saying "Guns kill people" since they dont, So you can not use that bull**** argument against me. I said that they are dangerous and have the potential of hurting someone if you are not careful. People who use these type of tools and weapons can hurt themselves if they are not careful. They have to train people who use stuff like power tools, and sewing machines, and guns. Its not a joke! This is serious! No, hes not an idiot, hes just way way more intelligent than you are. He knows not to play with guns and power tools. This is common sense! People who teach people to shoot have problems with people they teach sometimes. You are the one who is thinks weapons and power tools are toys, they are not TOYS! I never said anything that was not civil, I just suggesting people not be idiots with weapons and tools like you are suggesting. My Uncle works with power tools all the time and he cut off his thumb by accident, and he is a professional. So no, its not wise to play with power tools. People who work with power tools even professionals have hurt themselves before. I know you think its funny to play with power tools and guns but its not ITS STUPID! REALLY REALLY STUPID! There is labor workers who do stuff like Construction who work with heavy powerful tools all the time, and its not the safest environment but they are taught safety.

 

[Crimefree]

Re: Where do you stand?

No. I am not making lists for giant, whiny babies who don't back up their accusations.

You trying to tell me not once have you advocated the restriction, removal or denial of firearms to certain people?

You really want me to go find them becasue you cannot remember or deny they exist?

 

[Crimefree]

Re: Where do you stand?

Seriously what is wrong with you? How old are you? How do you not understand how to be safe with guns and power tools. Yes, they are dangerous.

No you said GUNS are UNSAFE. Dangerous means something completely different.

Apparently reason and logic is beyond you.

You are changing the goal posts. Not once have I discussed "How to be safe" and as any idiot can clearly see that is how the USER can be safe. Do you understand the difference between user and object?

You are attempting to ARGUE EMOTIONAL CRAP as LOGIC and you are trying to deal with somebody who will not respond to your emotional crap. If you cannot deal with this logically and factually them we are done.

That is now three or four ties I have shown you how you are wrong. A gun cannot be safe or unsafe any more than a rock or dam can be safe. You want to explain how a rock is unsafe? Rock, gun both inanimate objects.

You teach and train PEOPLE TO BE SAFE. Try training a rock or a gun for that matter. Oops sorry never meant to say that you will probably try.:lol:.

Now stop having tantrums and try to comprehend

 

[Crimefree]

Re: Where do you stand?

Seriously what is wrong with you? How old are you? How do you not understand how to be safe with guns and power tools. Yes, they are dangerous

Snip.

Should one of the mods read your posts you may end up with an infraction for personal remarks