What turned me off to conservativism.

[calamity]

If they are growing pot, or using pot, then they are not "innocent". Are you against police stopping criminals then? Of course not. So shut up.

Someone having dope in their home should be no one's business, not yours nor the cops. And, walking a dog up someone's porch steps to sniff at their front doors is now a violation of their rights. 5-4. Done deal.

 

[Sparkles]

Time to lobby for a change. Legalize it, tax it, and quit wasting money on jailing non-violent offenders

Debatable. Simply not being violent, isn't a valid reason to not jail someone. There are thousands of non-violent criminals that need to be jailed.

Nor is taxing it a plus in my book. So we are going to intentionally setup a system to take more money from the poorest of our citizens... and this is a positive how?

I'll reserve my final judgement after a few years of legalization in some states. See what the fall out is.

 

[Sparkles]

Someone having dope in their home should be no one's business, not yours nor the cops. And, walking a dog up someone's porch steps to sniff at their front doors is now a violation of their rights. 5-4. Done deal.

Or grenades or VX gas, or whatever. It's none of your business, and my 50 cal machine gun doesn't hurt anyone. That fertilizer bomb doesn't bother anyone either.

Of course, we don't see the fall out from drug crime in our society....

Yes it's what the court has agreed to. The court is wrong. We can change the law, like we can anything else.

Regardless, they are not innocent. They are scummy drug dealing human waste, and should be shot.

 

[Sparkles]

I'm not still living in the 1700s. As an Independent I am an issue voter.

Who isn't an issue voter?

 

[calamity]

Or grenades or VX gas, or whatever. It's none of your business, and my 50 cal machine gun doesn't hurt anyone. That fertilizer bomb doesn't bother anyone either.

Of course, we don't see the fall out from drug crime in our society....

Yes it's what the court has agreed to. The court is wrong. We can change the law, like we can anything else.

Regardless, they are not innocent. They are scummy drug dealing human waste, and should be shot.

How do you know they're drug dealing and not just grandma easing the side effects from her cancer meds by smoking some herb?

 

[Sparkles]

How do you know they're drug dealing and not just grandma easing the side effects from her cancer meds by smoking some herb?

Grandma doesn't start violating the law. She gets a prescription, and buys legal drugs.

 

[calamity]

Grandma doesn't start violating the law. She gets a prescription, and buys legal drugs.

THe laws against personal use of drugs are not very conservative. They are an excellent example of nanny state nonsense. Not to mention it gives government thugs license to commence a war on the people, i.e. police state fascism.

http://news.yahoo.com/kansas-couple-indoor-gardening-prompted-pot-raid-182449463.html

LEAWOOD, Kan. (AP) — Two former CIA employees whose Kansas home was fruitlessly searched for marijuana during a two-state drug sweep claim they were illegally targeted, possibly because they had bought indoor growing supplies to raise vegetables.

Maybe those people should have been shot for buying grow lights. Eh?

 

[Sparkles]

THe laws against personal use of drugs are not very conservative. They are an excellent example of nanny state nonsense. Not to mention it gives government thugs license to commence a war on the people, i.e. police state fascism.

Kansas couple: Indoor gardening prompted pot raid

Maybe those people should have been shot for buying grow lights. Eh?

I'm not sure what your point is. You cite an example of people not breaking the law, as if I ever advocating shooting non-criminals?

I'll give you a second chance to make a point. Please proceed.

 

[calamity]

I'm not sure what your point is. You cite an example of people not breaking the law, as if I ever advocating shooting non-criminals?

I'll give you a second chance to make a point. Please proceed.

Lots of people not breaking the law are shot dead by our drug warriors, most by Cops barging through their front doors looking for drugs.

Drug War Victims « Drug WarRant

 

[Sparkles]

Lots of people not breaking the law are shot dead by our drug warriors, most by Cops barging through their front doors looking for drugs.

Drug War Victims « Drug WarRant

Well yippy. I'm against that. And never suggested otherwise.

Now back to the discussion about those that are growing, using, and/or selling drugs... they should be shot.

 

[calamity]

Well yippy. I'm against that. And never suggested otherwise.

Now back to the discussion about those that are growing, using, and/or selling drugs... they should be shot.

This particular discussion is about privacy in the home. I stated that I don;t want cops barging into a home looking for drugs. You seem to think it's a good idea, are even in favor of dogs sniffing at people's front door so that cops can then barge right in.

Cops charging into people's homes gets innocent people killed. Even when the cops have warrants and such, innocent people end up dead. The Drug War is stupid, allowing cops to raid people's houses even more so.

 

[Dittohead not!]

This particular discussion is about privacy in the home. I stated that I don;t want cops barging into a home looking for drugs. You seem to think it's a good idea, are even in favor of dogs sniffing at people's front door so that cops can then barge right in.

Cops charging into people's homes gets innocent people killed. Even when the cops have warrants and such, innocent people end up dead. The Drug War is stupid, allowing cops to raid people's houses even more so.

And yet we continue to allow it. Why? Is it because of fear of drugs? Drugs can't do anything to you without your consent, but the cops can.

We also allow the government to take property without due process of law, which is unconstitutional, and to fill our prisons with so many drug offenders that there isn't room for thieves and even violent offenders.

Maybe the government likes thieves, being one itself.

 

[Sparkles]

This particular discussion is about privacy in the home. I stated that I don;t want cops barging into a home looking for drugs. You seem to think it's a good idea, are even in favor of dogs sniffing at people's front door so that cops can then barge right in.

Cops charging into people's homes gets innocent people killed. Even when the cops have warrants and such, innocent people end up dead. The Drug War is stupid, allowing cops to raid people's houses even more so.

wait wait wait wait....

So in your world...... breaking down someone's door, barging into someone's home, ransacking the place looking for drugs..... is exactly the same as walking a dog up the sidewalk?

And no.... read on your own link, the police did not just barge right in after the dog went nuts. They got a warrant to search the property.

Even when the cops have warrants and such, innocent people end up dead.

Yeah, and that's true in any situation, in regards to any law. Are you suggesting police shouldn't investigate crime at all, because someone innocent could get killed?

I'm all for minimizing innocent people getting caught in a law enforcement action, as much as possible. But you don't just say "well lets legalize theft, to prevent innocent people from getting hurt by police investing theft!"

That's the kind of logic an idiot uses. Sorry, you fail. Try again.

 

[Sparkles]

And yet we continue to allow it. Why? Is it because of fear of drugs? Drugs can't do anything to you without your consent, but the cops can.

We also allow the government to take property without due process of law, which is unconstitutional, and to fill our prisons with so many drug offenders that there isn't room for thieves and even violent offenders.

Maybe the government likes thieves, being one itself.

If we simply SHOT thieves, and violent offenders... we wouldn't have that problem. Heck, if we simply SHOT the drug offenders, we wouldn't have that problem.

Further, if we SHOT these people, fewer people would be willing to take the risk of committing those crimes. And it would solve the problem of repeat offenders almost entirely.

As for the confiscation of property without due process of law, I'm against that.

Ironically, it is exactly because of arguments like this, that the government has resorted to this.

You people prevent our government from adequately dealing with the problem. Yet the public still demands that crime be dealt with. So the government is forced into a situation where it can't deal out punishment high enough to deter the crime, yet is constantly pressured to "do something" about it.

As a result they pass laws to allow them to "do something", while not actually solve the problem the only way it can, but dealing out harsh enough punishment. Of course that "do something" involves violating other rights.

If we just put these people to death, the problem would be solved. Singapore is proof of that. And we wouldn't need illegal confiscation of property, or worrying about illegal search, because no one would risk growing pot in their home, knowing they'll lose their life if caught.

 

[Jerry]

Conservatives are fine as long as they aren't extremists. Same for liberals. Partisans are worthless.

Liberal = extremist. No exceptions. Like socialists, the only thing liberals need to worry about is conversion or suicide. Liberals and socialists alike have nothing of value to add to society and need to stop existing.

 

[TheNextEra]

Liberal = extremist. No exceptions. Like socialists, the only thing liberals need to worry about is conversion or suicide. Liberals and socialists alike have nothing of value to add to society and need to stop existing.

Conservative = child molester. No exceptions. Like fascists, the only thing conservatives need to worry about is conversion or suicide. Conservatives and fascists alike have nothing of value to add to society and need to stop existing.

 

[Dittohead not!]

If we simply SHOT thieves, and violent offenders... we wouldn't have that problem. Heck, if we simply SHOT the drug offenders, we wouldn't have that problem.

Further, if we SHOT these people, fewer people would be willing to take the risk of committing those crimes. And it would solve the problem of repeat offenders almost entirely.

As for the confiscation of property without due process of law, I'm against that.

Ironically, it is exactly because of arguments like this, that the government has resorted to this.

You people prevent our government from adequately dealing with the problem. Yet the public still demands that crime be dealt with. So the government is forced into a situation where it can't deal out punishment high enough to deter the crime, yet is constantly pressured to "do something" about it.

As a result they pass laws to allow them to "do something", while not actually solve the problem the only way it can, but dealing out harsh enough punishment. Of course that "do something" involves violating other rights.

If we just put these people to death, the problem would be solved. Singapore is proof of that. And we wouldn't need illegal confiscation of property, or worrying about illegal search, because no one would risk growing pot in their home, knowing they'll lose their life if caught.

No doubt a band of military police carrying assault rifles and licensed to shoot any wrongdoer would bring an end to thievery, drugs and such, or at least diminish the problem. Such a plan might work in, say, North Korea or perhaps Iran.
But, along with our prohibition of taking property without due process, there is also a clause about life and liberty as well.

But, no doubt, simply ignoring the Bill of Rights would make fighting the war on drugs a bit easier.

 

[calamity]

wait wait wait wait....

So in your world...... breaking down someone's door, barging into someone's home, ransacking the place looking for drugs..... is exactly the same as walking a dog up the sidewalk?

And no.... read on your own link, the police did not just barge right in after the dog went nuts. They got a warrant to search the property.

The dog did not sniff from the sidewalk. The cops took the dog to the door.

Warrant? That's still barging in, especially after violating someone's privacy by taking a police dog up to the front door.

And, before you gt all "no one's privacy was violated by the dog sniffing a front door", you should realize that the court already ruled on that issue. So. You're wrong.

Yeah, and that's true in any situation, in regards to any law. Are you suggesting police shouldn't investigate crime at all, because someone innocent could get killed?

I'm all for minimizing innocent people getting caught in a law enforcement action, as much as possible. But you don't just say "well lets legalize theft, to prevent innocent people from getting hurt by police investing theft!"

That's the kind of logic an idiot uses. Sorry, you fail. Try again.

How can you be for minimizing innocent people getting caught up in the war on drugs when you favor the cops violating our rights? You're not very consistent.

 

[calamity]

And yet we continue to allow it. Why? Is it because of fear of drugs? Drugs can't do anything to you without your consent, but the cops can.

We also allow the government to take property without due process of law, which is unconstitutional, and to fill our prisons with so many drug offenders that there isn't room for thieves and even violent offenders.

Maybe the government likes thieves, being one itself.

I blame conservatives and their misguided idea that you can legislate morality. You saw it. Dude up there wants to execute drug users. WTF?

US Conservatives are fascists in business attire instead of Brownshirts.

 

[wolfie]

I blame conservatives and their misguided idea that you can legislate morality. You saw it. Dude up there wants to execute drug users. WTF?

US Conservatives are fascists in business attire instead of Brownshirts.

Not used to your problems..but watching a program called ''hard core pawn''..most of the participants..(who are black!) seem to be out of their minds on crack cocaine...

 

[calamity]

Not used to your problems..but watching a program called ''hard core pawn''..most of the participants..(who are black!) seem to be out of their minds on crack cocaine...

Reality shows are designed to draw an audience. Make of that what you will.

 

[wolfie]

Reality shows are designed to draw an audience. Make of that what you will.

I know..it just showed me a sad insight into the haves..and the have not's..

 

[Risky Thicket]

Liberal = extremist. No exceptions. Like socialists, the only thing liberals need to worry about is conversion or suicide. Liberals and socialists alike have nothing of value to add to society and need to stop existing.

Interesting. Seeing how you are an extremist that would make you a liberal.

 

[Dittohead not!]

I blame conservatives and their misguided idea that you can legislate morality. You saw it. Dude up there wants to execute drug users. WTF?

US Conservatives are fascists in business attire instead of Brownshirts.

and liberals are better, how again? Without some serious gun control, those cops with permission to shoot wrongdoers would have a pretty dangerous job, don't you think?

 

[washunut]

I grew up in a conservative household and respect my parents as much as I love them. They laid a great foundation for me. I voted for Reagan in 1980 when I was still living at home. What started turning me off was the fact conservatives think they can legislate morality while pretending they are for freedom. When Reagan stabbed us drug users in the back with his war on drugs and undermined the gains made by labor in this country I realized the right was not for freedom at all and not for the poor and the down and out. In fact the GOP is the party of greed and selfishness to go with their false morality.

If the right changed their view on civil liberties and stopped trying to stick their nose in our personal lives I might be able to meet with them halfway on some fiscal issues but as it stands now with the party swinging even further to the right and increasing their attacks on entitlements I can't see how anyone with half a brain can vote for these regressive dinosaurs.I am glad the country has swung to the left on social issues and has rejected the slash and burn of the fiscal hawks and if the right wants to turn it around they have to change on everything from immagration,fiscal and social issues.

The GOP used to stand for freedom and civil liberties. The GOP used to stand up to big business and reel them in when they needed it. The GOP used to be against big brother sticking its nose in our personal lives. What the hell happened? I don't see what happened to the party of Lincon or Teddy Roosevelt. What happened to progressive thinking in the Gop? Is it gone forever.

So someone self identified as very liberal sees things close to the conservative view except for a couple of issues. If you ever visit Brooklyn, I have a bridge to sell you.