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What is wrong with law and order? It makes no sense.

rhinefire

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If you have "law" then you have order. It's like steak and meat.
 
The problem is that some people who are overly concerned about "law and order" are usually the same kind of people who are willing to violate human rights and civil rights in the process, and of throwing basic constitutional values out of the window.
 
If you have "law" then you have order. It's like steak and meat.

Nope - law is just a set of rules while order requires actual enforcement of those laws. Many areas have plenty of law but are sorely lacking of order.
 
Nothing is wrong with "law and order", but nothing is right about it either. Laws are neutral. They can be good or bad. Order is desirable to a point, but most people would say it should be balanced with liberty. Supermax prisons are very orderly, but I doubt many folks would want to live in a society based on that model.

As German Guy said, the biggest problem with so called "law and order" types is some of them tend to be dismissive of safeguards against abuse like due process, the notion of innocent till proven guilty, and constitutional guarantees of privacy.
 
The problem is that some people who are overly concerned about "law and order" are usually the same kind of people who are willing to violate human rights and civil rights in the process, and of throwing basic constitutional values out of the window.
Couldn't have said it better myself.
 
If you have "law" then you have order. It's like steak and meat.

Nothing wrong with law and order, so long as the law stays in order.
 
steak is meat. law is not order. order is a bi-product of law.

Steak is to Herford what order is to Law.
 
If you have "law" then you have order. It's like steak and meat.

Many, probably most laws have unintended consequences, and those consequences frequently contribute to disorder and chaos.

As another poster noted, law unenforced contributes to disorder and chaos and lack of respect. As elected criminals are not investigated or prosecuted by their successors, a huge lack of respect in the populace is created.
 
This is why I favor being very careful and selective in which laws we do pass, and believe we should wipe off the books laws that are neither enforced or broken/used.
 
This is why I favor being very careful and selective in which laws we do pass, and believe we should wipe off the books laws that are neither enforced or broken/used.


Absolutely, with an emphasis on repeal, the proper remedy for poor laws.
 
A perfect example of "law and order".

"Everything Hitler did was legal." - Martin Luther King Jr.
 
The problem is that some people who are overly concerned about "law and order" are usually the same kind of people who are willing to violate human rights and civil rights in the process, and of throwing basic constitutional values out of the window.

Woot! Broad sweeping generalizations.

"The problem is that some people who are overly enthusiastic about being ice cream truck drivers are usually the same kind of people who are willing to violate a young boy or girl with their penis."

It plays off of stereotypes...... They aren't okay to use when talking about people of a certain race, and they aren't okay to accuse a group of people of having no regard for human rights either.
 
Things is, for good or for bad, stereotypes are almost never made up out of thin air. They have a root.

You could argue that stereotypes may not apply to a majority, so maybe it only seems so because the ones who do fit go out of their way to make themselves noticeable.
 
Absolutely, with an emphasis on repeal, the proper remedy for poor laws.

ALL laws should have a sunset clause of no more than 2 years. This way our legislators have something to do. Sort of making holes and filling them so they don't bug us.
 
We have lots of laws, and more being written every day.

We must be enforcing those laws, at least the criminal ones, as we have more prisoners than anyone else.

Therefore, we have order. Right?

Funny thing about liberty: Sometimes it leads to disorder.
 
I have this theory. We've been at this USA thing for 200+ years. One would think that we've got most of it pretty much figured out by now. Hence, one would think that the numbers of new laws that need to be passed would decrease every year. Decrease to the point that there should be no more than a dozen or so new laws needed every year*. Barring the occasional new issue or technology that gets invented, really our elected representatives should be more caretakers than active lawmakers.

So, why do our lawmakers continually pass new laws and tweak everything to the point of absurdity?

To make themselves look important to us**, IMO, so we will think they're relevant and effective and we'll vote to re-elect them. Personally, not only do I see no shame in a representative not proposing any new laws at all, I would applaud that person for not making things worse.

*-Not including appropriation bills, that need to be continually renewed.
**-And to please special interest groups.
 
So, why do our lawmakers continually pass new laws and tweak everything to the point of absurdity?

It's called raison d'etre. It serves as a profit center for the legislative/police/justice/prison industrial complex. The same as an endless war serves as a profit center for the military/industrial/intelligence/surveillance complex.
 
This is why I favor being very careful and selective in which laws we do pass, and believe we should wipe off the books laws that are neither enforced or broken/used.

I think all laws should have an expiration date.

If its important enough it'll get renewed. If its stupid, it can be allowed to die the death it should.
 
Iced Tea was never a great actor, this is part of the problem too.
 
I think all laws should have an expiration date.

If its important enough it'll get renewed. If its stupid, it can be allowed to die the death it should.

On the one hand I don't see the point in having to renew laws against murder every 2/5/10 years, but the idea does intrigue me.

Question: Wouldn't they just pass a blanket renewal bill and do it all at once? They could have one bill with each existing law referenced.
 

Time to start repealing some of those laws. I'm pretty sure they need an expiration date.
 
Time to start repealing some of those laws. I'm pretty sure they need an expiration date.

Better yet, create an independent, revolving constitutional jury with no ties to government, whose purpose is to review every law on the books and validate or invalidate those laws based on constitutional compliance. I'm sure over 90% of those laws would be invalidated.
 

yes. Maybe we could call it a "Supreme Court" or something.
 
yes. Maybe we could call it a "Supreme Court" or something.

Why would you want the fox in the hen house to police itself? The Supreme Court is just as corrupt as the other two branches of government.
 
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