We have a Spending Problem, NOT a tax revenue problem

[VanceMack]

At least one dollar more than they are paying now? If you want more revenue there is a beginning instead of taking from the people who pay 38% of the income taxes now

We currently have approximately 140 million people working today and if 47% of them paid a dollar in income taxes that would be about 66 million dollars.

At the very least they would stop being a burden to those that are actually productive in society. And hey...they might even develop a little self esteem along the way...stop reeking so much of that faliure and 'fear and ignorance'

 

[VanceMack]

Nope - a mandate to long term cuts won't work. That's been done in the past and guess what - it was overturned. It has to be a Constitutional Amendment, anything less is just dinner theater.

Thats what I mean by mandate. It cant just be a provision or a law...they too easily find excuses to ignore them. And the mandate HAS to be in plcae BEFORE tax increases. Congress is like that bar in Ireland...Spending cuts 'tomorrow'...promise!

 

[Conservative]

At the very least they would stop being a burden to those that are actually productive in society. And hey...they might even develop a little self esteem along the way...stop reeking so much of that faliure and 'fear and ignorance'

I want to know why every income earned cannot pay something in income taxes and agree with you that those that do not pay any Federal Income taxes but could should stop being a burden and stop demanding that others pay a greater share of the taxes than they already pay.

Notice how liberals are always confused by actual logic and common sense as well as facts? This country is in desparate shape right now with liberalism creating that entitlement mentality that destroys countries, look at Europe. They maintain their power by keeping people dependent and they brainwash the youth which keeps their "gravy train" moving. It certainly isn't the rich that is leading this country to a debt crisis but instead it is liberalism that spends in order to buy votes.

 

[haymarket]

I never thought I would live long enough when an entire ideology would be structured around the lie that a budget only has one side to it.

 

[liblady]

Notice how republicans are always confused by actual logic and common sense as well as facts? This country is in desperate shape right now with republicans creating that corporate/wealthy entitlement mentality that destroys countries. They maintain their power by keeping people scared and they brainwash the idiots which keeps their "big business train" moving. It certainly isn't the poor who are leading this country to a debt crisis but instead it is republicans who spend in order to buy votes.

fixed it for you. spelling, grammar and all.

 

[VanceMack]

I want to know why every income earned cannot pay something in income taxes and agree with you that those that do not pay any Federal Income taxes but could should stop being a burden and stop demanding that others pay a greater share of the taxes than they already pay.

Notice how liberals are always confused by actual logic and common sense as well as facts? This country is in desparate shape right now with liberalism creating that entitlement mentality that destroys countries, look at Europe. They maintain their power by keeping people dependent and they brainwash the youth which keeps their "gravy train" moving. It certainly isn't the rich that is leading this country to a debt crisis but instead it is liberalism that spends in order to buy votes.

Its always thems what is afraid of losing the gravy that shreik the shrillest. Me...I dont mind paying taxes. I expect my taxes to be spent responsibly. I dont mind providing for those that cannot provide for themselves (I believe it should be done at the state level). I expect that money to be spent on those truly in need. I dont mind providing a hand up for people that have for whatever reason failed to be able to provide for themselves. I expect that money to be spent in a positive manner and those individuals to find their balls and stand up on their own two feet. I personally believe it is far more loving and humane than to expect (and assist) people to stand and even struggle but become self reliant than to continue to enable them to grovel for handouts for the rest of their life.

If people provided for themselves it amounts to a positive delta...less people at the trough, responsible government, AND more taxes to pay down the debt incurred by irrseponsible politicians...we could actually make a dent in this mess.

 

[Whovian]

Notice how republicans are always confused by actual logic and common sense as well as facts? This country is in desperate shape right now with republicans creating that corporate/wealthy entitlement mentality that destroys countries. They maintain their power by keeping people scared and they brainwash the idiots which keeps their "big business train" moving. It certainly isn't the poor who are leading this country to a debt crisis but instead it is republicans who spend in order to buy votes.

fixed it for you. spelling, grammar and all.

Interesting... last time I corrected someones post like that (they were a liberal), I got a warning (by a liberal mod) in the thread not to do it... I dont see any warning for you.

Gee....wonder why.

 

[VanceMack]

I never thought I would live long enough when an entire ideology would be structured around the lie that a budget only has one side to it.

And yet here you are...mindless fools demanding greater debt and more taxes and equally mindless people holding an ideological line regarding tax increases. You BOTH out to be kicked in the ass. Stop pretending less deficit spending is a spending 'cut' and stop pretending that bailing out your sinking boat with a dixie cup is going to help...grab a ****ing bucket or we all go under.

 

[Conservative]

fixed it for you. spelling, grammar and all.

You fixed it to suit your ideology but that fix isn't based up facts, logic, and common sense. I have given you the non partisan sites that report actual data, you choose to buy projections and predictions which have never been accurate. When 47% of the income earners pay zero in Federal Income Taxes you have a serious problem and people who have no problem raising the taxes on others. Liberals play on this ignorance and reality.I keep waiting for you or anyone else to refute the facts presented or your own that refute anything I have posted.

Please explain to me what it is about liberalism that creates such loyalty especially when that ideology is such a failure. Guess feelings always trump actual facts.

 

[VanceMack]

Interesting... last time I corrected someones post like that (they were a liberal), I got a warning (by a liberal mod) in the thread not to do it... I dont see any warning for you.

Gee....wonder why.

Well...it was like...2 minutes ago...did you report it?

 

[Conservative]

And yet here you are...mindless fools demanding greater debt and more taxes and equally mindless people holding an ideological line regarding tax increases. You BOTH out to be kicked in the ass. Stop pretending less deficit spending is a spending 'cut' and stop pretending that bailing out your sinking boat with a dixie cup is going to help...grab a ****ing bucket or we all go under.

Great point! It has been posted here that Democrats have agreed to 1 trillion dollar in spending cuts over the next 10 years. That is 100 billion a year if it materializes and leaves us with a 1.5 trillion deficit instead of a 1.6 trillion deficit. That means nothing but fuels the liberal talking points of the brainwashed.

 

[Conservative]

Well...it was like...2 minutes ago...did you report it?

Unlike the liberals on this thread I never report anyone and am a big boy who can take care of themself. I don't need anyone to defend me thus I don't report infractions, maybe I should. I just ignore those people and refuse to play their silly game

 

[pbrauer]

1 trillion dollars over 10 years off a 3.7 trillion dollar budget. Let's see how good at math you are. What does that do to the deficit? How great of Obama Administration! So now instead of a 1.6 trillion dollar deficit it is 1.5 trillion. Still waiting for how much raising the taxes on the rich will generate in tax revenue and how much will that affect the people they hire?

Raising the capital gains tax back to 20% for a hedge fund manager who makes $1 billion a year would result in an additional $5 million to the treasury and many hedge fund managers make much more. Taxes have little effect on the work force because the real job creators are consumers like you and me. That's how capitalism works, conservative. Pay people decent wages - they consume and cause more people to be hired. That's how capitalism works, conservative. Adam Smith must be rolling in his grave because how this country has be sold down the river by people who profess garbage like you do.

Pay people crappy wages and send there jobs overseas, is way to destroy our economy which the right wing is doing.

BTW, former conservative Senator Alan Simpson (R,WY) was on The Last World with Lawerence O'Donnell last night and he says you're wrong, we need to raise taxes.

 

[Conservative]

Raising the capital gains tax back to 20% for a hedge fund manager who makes $1 billion a year would result in an additional $5 million to the treasury and many hedge fund managers make much more. Taxes have little effect on the work force because the real job creators are consumers like you and me. That's how capitalism works, conservative. Pay people decent wages - they consume and cause more people to be hired. That's how capitalism works, conservative. Adam Smith must be rolling in his grave because how this country has be sold down the river by people who profess garbage like you do.

Pay people crappy wages and send there jobs overseas, is way to destroy our economy which the right wing is doing.

BTW, former conservative Senator Alan Simpson (R,WY) was on The Last World with Lawerence O'Donnell last night and he says you're wrong, we need to raise taxes.

You can thank "your" President for promoting sending jobs overseas, i.e. Boeing in South Carolina and all the regulations he has added since taking office. There has to be incentive for private business for they cannot print money like the govt. does. Raising taxes on the rich makes great print but serves no purpose other than promoting activities that you whine about.

Since you care so much about revenue going to the govt. how much more of your paycheck are you sending in than required? I am still waiting for your explanation as to how much Obama has added to the debt in his 2 1/2 years in office? All liberals do is increase the credit limit so they can spend more and keep more people dependent. Raising taxes isn't going to put 15 million unemployed workers back to work and thus increase tax revenue.

 

[haymarket]

And yet here you are...mindless fools demanding greater debt and more taxes and equally mindless people holding an ideological line regarding tax increases. You BOTH out to be kicked in the ass. Stop pretending less deficit spending is a spending 'cut' and stop pretending that bailing out your sinking boat with a dixie cup is going to help...grab a ****ing bucket or we all go under.

All that bitter vitriol directed against me .... calling me a mindless fool and threatening physical harm ...... all because I dare to point out that a budget has two sides!?!?!?!?!?!?!?

Amazing. Simply amazing.

You perfectly illustrate the problem that my post spoke to

I never thought I would live long enough when an entire ideology would be structured around the lie that a budget only has one side to it.

 

[Conservative]

Raising the capital gains tax back to 20% for a hedge fund manager who makes $1 billion a year would result in an additional $5 million to the treasury and many hedge fund managers make much more. Taxes have little effect on the work force because the real job creators are consumers like you and me. That's how capitalism works, conservative. Pay people decent wages - they consume and cause more people to be hired. That's how capitalism works, conservative. Adam Smith must be rolling in his grave because how this country has be sold down the river by people who profess garbage like you do.

Pay people crappy wages and send there jobs overseas, is way to destroy our economy which the right wing is doing.

BTW, former conservative Senator Alan Simpson (R,WY) was on The Last World with Lawerence O'Donnell last night and he says you're wrong, we need to raise taxes.

Here is where you start, this is the 2008 Federal Budget by line item expense. Start there then we can talk about tax increases. Simply raising the credit limit is a liberal's dream, look, more money to spend. Current Obama budget 3.7 trillion and a proposed cut of 100 billion makes that 3.6 trillion. Thanks, President Obama, for showing that you aren't serious about the debt but are serious about placating your base

Fiscal year 2008 Federal Budget

Expenses

Defense 616.1
International Affairs 28.9
Gen. Science, Space 27.8
Energy 0.5
Natural resources/env 31.9
Agriculture 18.4
Commerce 27.7
Transportation 77.6
Community Dev 23.9
Education/Train/Social 90.9
Health 280.7
Medicare 390.8
Income Security 427.4
Social Security 617.0
Veterans Benefits 84.6
Justice 47.1
General Govt. 20.3
Net Interest 252.8


Total 3064.4

 

[VanceMack]

Unlike the liberals on this thread I never report anyone and am a big boy who can take care of themself. I don't need anyone to defend me thus I don't report infractions, maybe I should. I just ignore those people and refuse to play their silly game

I agree...just think its kinda silly for Whovian to complain about it. It shouldnt take long to figure out the game. Play the game or dont...

 

[VanceMack]

All that bitter vitriol directed against me .... calling me a mindless fool and threatening physical harm ...... all because I dare to point out that a budget has two sides!?!?!?!?!?!?!?

Amazing. Simply amazing.

You perfectly illustrate the problem that my post spoke to

Thats cute that you took it personally and pretended I threatened you. Seriously...do you work childrens parties? Like...with balloon toys and stuff? :lamo

Your little diatribe was meant as an attack on conservatives who demand there be no tax increases. Well...if you decide you want to own it, you are just the other tail to the same coin. You are the mindless liberal yang to the mindless conservative yin. You yelp like a scalded puppy at the thought of honest and effective cuts...God forbid the government ever inititiate responsible spending limits-they might impact your blessed Unions or impact social programs. But dont worry...the mindless conservatives do the same kneejerk dance when the subject of tax increases are discussed.

 

[digsbe]

Moderator's Warning:

Everyone needs to knock it off. Quit with the personal attacks and stick to the topic, not the posters. Infractions will be handed out if this continues.

 

[haymarket]

Thats cute that you took it personally and pretended I threatened you. Seriously...do you work childrens parties? Like...with balloon toys and stuff? :lamo

Your little diatribe was meant as an attack on conservatives who demand there be no tax increases. Well...if you decide you want to own it, you are just the other tail to the same coin. You are the mindless liberal yang to the mindless conservative yin. You yelp like a scalded puppy at the thought of honest and effective cuts...God forbid the government ever inititiate responsible spending limits-they might impact your blessed Unions or impact social programs. But dont worry...the mindless conservatives do the same kneejerk dance when the subject of tax increases are discussed.

This is your defense?!?!?!?!?

Go back and look at your post #208. Here it is in its entirety:

Originally Posted by haymarket
I never thought I would live long enough when an entire ideology would be structured around the lie that a budget only has one side to it.

and your comment on that

And yet here you are...mindless fools demanding greater debt and more taxes and equally mindless people holding an ideological line regarding tax increases. You BOTH out to be kicked in the ass. Stop pretending less deficit spending is a spending 'cut' and stop pretending that bailing out your sinking boat with a dixie cup is going to help...grab a ****ing bucket or we all go under.

If your name calling and threats were not directed at me - WHY THEN REPRINT MY COMMENTS WITH MY NAME ATTACHED AND USE THE WORD YOU immediately following?

Man up - own up - fess up for heavens sakes. You want to be loud and proud and be so in your face but then you wither and pretend you did nothing wrong.

 

[Ockham]

haymarket - you're off base this time.

Needless to say, how the hell anyone can argue that getting out of a hole requires more digging is beyond me.

 

[Mach]

I want taxes raised for those who make $350,000 a year or more. No they are not filthy rich, but they are doing pretty damn well, and will not starve if they pay another 3% in income tax. Nor will they stop investing and doing those things that keep them rich.

Someone making 35K a year likewise won't starve at a 3% increase. All you're demonstrating is class warfare argumentation.

You want to force people who make more than you, to pay more, for you. That's as clear as it gets. And cap gains was not 3% increase. If 3% is good to burden others with, surely it's good for you too.

This desire for unequal taxation is a problem, it's gotten into your blood and you think it's OK to punish those who you want to, through government. That is not the solidarity you see in some Europeaen countries that are far less progressive in the way they tax. Either we're all in this together, or you create division. And if you create division, then it's a fight. And everyone loses that fight.

 

[VanceMack]

This is your defense?!?!?!?!?

Go back and look at your post #208. Here it is in its entirety:



and your comment on that


If your name calling and threats were not directed at me - WHY THEN REPRINT MY COMMENTS WITH MY NAME ATTACHED AND USE THE WORD YOU immediately following?

Man up - own up - fess up for heavens sakes. You want to be loud and proud and be so in your face but then you wither and pretend you did nothing wrong.

Ah...good point. I meant to shroud my comment regarding your ideology but sure enough...to be true...I said. You. I will even apologize. Not meant as a personal 'attack'...but certainly an attack on the mindless ideology you represent. Now...in our newfound spirit of honesty and disclosure, are you willing to admit you do the exact same thing on the extreme liberal side as the extreme conservatives you were attacking? I mean...Reddress posted recent a picture with the words 'Irony' on it...and if you cant see it...then...wow. Of course you ignored that I am equally critical of the extreme right...dincha? Im willing to engage the civil and honest discourse. You?

We dont JUST have a spending problem...but we ABSOLUTELY have a spending problem. We dont just have a revenue problem but considering our spending we absolutely do have a revenue problem. You can be a millionaire and live conmfortably within your means or be a millionaire and spend billions more annually than what you earn. If you are ever going to get back into balance we need to spend significantly less than what we take in and until we balance our budget, we need to increase our revenue.

 

[Conservative]

Wow, this on MSNBC? Someone there is finally getting it

Pundit calls Obama ‘a dick’ on air | Strange Bedfellows — Politics News - seattlepi.com

 

[VanceMack]

Wow, this on MSNBC? Someone there is finally getting it

Pundit calls Obama ‘a dick’ on air | Strange Bedfellows — Politics News - seattlepi.com

Wowwwwwwwww! And from the editor of Time Magazine no less...