[W: #837] Active shooter situation with multiple injuries at multiple locations in Lewiston, Maine

[Rucker61]

What the **** ever.
Glad you can mcgyver a gun from spit and grit. I don't give a ****. And your self congratulatory statement doesn't change one bit of what I said about Rep. Golden

It makes what you said about Golden superfluous. He never used an "assault weapon" in the Middle East. His experiences make zero difference with regards to the Constitutionality of any AWB bill in Congress.

 

[ALiberalModerate]

The worst shooting by a single shooter was committed in Norway by a man using a firearm that has been exempted by name in every single AWB submitted to Congress. The worst recent mass shooting was committed in Paris by men using firearms totally banned in France. The worst mass shooting in history was committed by one man using a .22 Walther Model 2 pistol. He took out about 22,000 Polish officers and cadets.

And the countries you mention still have homicide rates that are a small fraction of ours. If we had the firearm ownership rate of France, we would still have murders, just not nearly as many. We would likely have the same overall homicide rate that France has. There would be approximately 20,000 fewer Americans murdered in the average year if we simply had the same homicide rate of other wealthy peer nations.

 

[Rucker61]

No, you cannot. But I have always been in favor of amending the 2A - as it is currently worded it is an anachronism.

As I've noted before, find a recent red/blue map of thecstates. Start counting red states. Stop when you get to 13.

 

[Pound4abrown]

Another. Disc golf guy too.

It is with a heavy heart that I share with you all that Joshua Seal has passed away… no, he was murdered, in the 10/25 shooting in Lewiston. It still feels surreal…

For those of you who knew him, first and foremost, he was the world’s BEST father to our four pups. He was always there for them, lending an eye or a hand and going to their sporting/extracurricular activities. He always loved spending time with them, traveling, going for a day trip to the beach, or going camping for the weekend. Not only was he an amazing father, he was a wonderful husband, my best friend, and my soulmate. He was also a wonderful boss, an incredible interpreter, a great friend, a loving son, brother, uncle, and grandson. He loved his family and always put them first. That is what he will always be remembered for. We love and miss you so so much already, Joshua Alfred Seal. Forever & Always, No Matter What…

 

[ScrambledEggs]

Are you suggesting ignoring it or and end run around it?

No. I'm suggesting we talk about amending it

 

[Rucker61]

And the countries you mention still have homicide rates that are a small fraction of ours. If we had the firearm ownership rate of France, we would still have murders, just not nearly as many. We would likely have the same overall homicide rate that France has. There would be approximately 20,000 fewer Americans murdered in the average year if we simply had the same homicide rate of other wealthy peer nations.

All you have to do, evidently, is reduce the gun ownership rate of the US to that of France, the UK or Japan. How would you accomplish that?

 

[Pound4abrown]

It makes what you said about Golden superfluous. He never used an "assault weapon" in the Middle East. His experiences make zero difference with regards to the Constitutionality of any AWB bill in Congress.

As I said before. What the **** ever. Has it occurred to you that you may not know everything you think you know. Either way I don't ****ing care.

 

[ScrambledEggs]

show me an army that uses an AR15 that is semi-auto only, not selective fire

Good lord dude. No where did I say that armies use semi auto only AR15s. Or even AR15s for that matter.

 

[ScrambledEggs]

if you knew guns, you know that handguns are the #1 used in killings, and until recently #1 used in mass murders too. You'd also know an AR15 type in the USA is just a small caliber semi-automatic rifle, nothing more, nothing less, just glamourized by media

None of that has anything to do with what I posted.

Try listening

 

[Rucker61]

No. I'm suggesting we talk about amending it

What's to talk about? Step one is getting someone to introduce the necessary legislation. The last time this happened in the early 90s there was just a single sponsor. The last thing you'll need is ratification by 38 states. Given that we have have 28 states with Constitutional Carry, it seems unlikely that you'll have enough votes.

If you can't get it started, and can't get it completed, it seems like a fool's errand at this point.

 

[Rucker61]

As I said before. What the **** ever. Has it occurred to you that you may not know everything you think you know. Either way I don't ****ing care.

That's nice.

 

[nota bene]

So to return to the thread topic, which is NOT gun control, Card may have used a jet ski to escape; his vehicle was found near the water, and the Coast Guard is now part of the search: https://www.cbsnews.com/news/maine-shooting-robert-card-boat-search/

He had a serious "mental issue" in July. He was hearing voices. But what under existing laws could anybody do to help him or prevent this tragedy? It isn't a crime to hear voices. Did he indicate in any way to his family or others that he intended to commit these murders? I was flipping channels awhile ago and heard on some network (News Nation?) that he may have been planning his attacks for some time. Has there been any corroboration of this?

 

[ALiberalModerate]

I truly don't know because it seems to me that at some point a painful rebalancing of civil rights and the public welfare must happen. But perhaps not...if only we paid more attention from early years on to mental health issues rather paying only lip service, we might not need to. I have sadly significant experience with juvenile services and MHMR, and the money is simply not there. It is not there for CPS either. Stronger efforts to recognize neuro-divergencies are now being made in the schools, but social services are crippled by the lack of MONEY.

This also breeds incompetence, to identify just one issue. My sister is the pharmacy liaison for 13 MHMD clinics, and half of them are never-ending nightmares. As beefheart said regarding Minnesota, "they spend more money upfront, so they don't have to spend much much more later."

I agree that we need to devote far more resources to mental health in the United States.

That being said, I am fortunate to be able to travel a lot. For example, this year I have been to Turkey, Argentina and France, and will be going to Portugal next month. I have been to a lot of places in this world, and I don't do tours, I stay in working class neighborhoods, take public transportation and so on. Everywhere I have ever been, there were mentally ill people. Canada, mentally ill people. Ireland, mentally ill people. Turkey, mentally ill people. Argentina, mentally ill people. Ireland, mentally ill people. China, mentally ill people. France, mentally ill people. Hell, I have walked past people in Dublin injecting fentanyl on the sidewalk.

My point is mental illness is not just an epidemic in this country. It is a reality everywhere I have ever been in this world. Yet, I have never been to a wealthy country that didn't have a fraction of our homicide rate. If we simply had the same homicide rate of other peer nations like Canada, the UK, France, Germany and so on, about 20,000 less Americans would be murdered in a given year. The fact is, we have way too many guns in circulation. Over 400 million guns floating around in private hands in this country. We have a 2nd Amendment, so there is nothing that can be done about that, but it's the problem. Its why you are 3 times more likely to be murdered here than in Canada, a diverse country with the same culture just north of us. 400 million guns floating around makes them very easy to get ahold of, and as a result our homicide rate is much higher than it otherwise would be.

 

[ALiberalModerate]

All you have to do, evidently, is reduce the gun ownership rate of the US to that of France, the UK or Japan. How would you accomplish that?

I am not saying there is a way to. I am just saying, lets admit reality. We are a more dangerous country than we otherwise would be because we have a right to own firearms and have 400 million in circulation as a result.

 

[RF667799]

You make those points as if they are relevant to large portions of the US populace. So you get this week’s disingenuous award, given to those who pretend to miss the point. Sure, farmers and others wander around their land on tractors and other vehicles that may never go on to public roads. What percentage of the population are they. And I guarantee you that when they need to buy feed and seed, they have someone with a license go to town. But my point holds: you don’t need a license to buy a vehicle, but you do need it to drive it from the lot or showroom. And of course, you need a person with a license to tow your vehicle home.

So what? Just because you aren't aware, doesn't mean there is a sizeable number of people who own vehicles that are exclusively used on private property. Drag strips...off road parks...hell, SXS UTVs are almost as ubiquitous as cars around here. Nearly every home has one or two. Within an hour and a half there are two off road venues

The number of those people doesn't matter anyway. That's just a deflection from the fact you have admitted that a license is not required to possess a motor vehicle. Your point is worthless. Repeat after me...a license is not required to possess a motor vehicle.

You need a license to use the public highways. This might be analogous to the permit required to carry a firearm in public.

Regardless, the idea that a license should be required to buy a gun because a license is required to buy a car is completely discredited...by YOU.

 

[Pound4abrown]

Another. And these are the Good news ones

Thank you all for reaching out, as of right now Justin Karcher has suffered 4 gunshots. He was shot in his shoulder, liver, spinalcord and stomach, I was at work when I received the call saying he was at Schmangees I immediately went to CMMC were I waited many hours after being brought into the conference room. Finally I was told they had did surgery for close to 5 hours and had to stop to get him more stable. He is currently in ICU on a ventilator, they will be doing a follow up surgery tomorrow morning. My family appreciates everyone reaching out and I will try and keep people updated. The doctors told us right now all we can do is pray, Please do that. We are #LewistonStrong

 

[Parrish]

She is doing well she had time to paint her Grandmother a painting for Christmas. And she will have no school tomorrow either. Thank you for asking.

Aside from the note, which we know nothing of, we've only heard about his boat and ski doo being unaccounted for. Since the water by his car is the Androscoggin river I would lay a vote on a boat if he did go into the water. We shall see.

That's my thinking. I have a friend whose son-in-law in the USCG is stationed at Boothbay. Plenty of places for Card to hide out. Thinking of you and your friends and your loss @Pound4abrown. It's heartbreaking.

 

[hecatmoggie]

And we're back to the slippery slope of empowering the government to detain citizens they deem "crazy" against their will. Something that would certainly infringe on every right in the long run, including the 2nd.

Bear in mind not every perpetrator of gun violence presents as mentally ill as obviously as this one did.

empowering the Govt to infringe on literally every law abiding, gun owning American isn't an option either

what % of violent people are known criminals/mentally ill - its high

as obvious as this guy? maybe not - but pick the top 30 mass killers and I bet you can google their names and find 25 or more of them were tied to mental illness in some way

lets be honest - its not normal to want to kill a bunch of people. Crimes of passion happen, drug/cartel killing yes .... but mentally ill do these mass killings

 

[Pound4abrown]

That's nice.

The dick measuring posture of all your posts is an attempt to suck the air out of what is going on to real people. I know that is the idea, I just want you to know it isn't fooling anyone.

 

[hecatmoggie]

Canada is not diverse? France is not diverse? You ever been to Paris? France isn't free? That country is terrified of its citizens. They shut the country down when the government wanted to raise the retirement age from 60 to 62.

it was a generalized reference (what % of Can is black compared to the USA? UK ? )

Let's just admit the obvious here. We have a constitutional right to own firearms. They don't in most other countries. However, that right doesn't come without societal costs. The societal costs is a much, much higher homicide rate than in any of our peer nations.

and with Constitutional Rights/freedoms comes citizen responsibility too

and we DO infringe on the 2nd, a LOT more than we did 50-75 years ago and shockingly, we have WAY more mass murders now

people have changed - not guns

 

[Lycanthrope]

So to return to the thread topic, which is NOT gun control, Card may have used a jet ski to escape; his vehicle was found near the water, and the Coast Guard is now part of the search: https://www.cbsnews.com/news/maine-shooting-robert-card-boat-search/

He had a serious "mental issue" in July. He was hearing voices. But what under existing laws could anybody do to help him or prevent this tragedy? It isn't a crime to hear voices. Did he indicate in any way to his family or others that he intended to commit these murders? I was flipping channels awhile ago and heard on some network (News Nation?) that he may have been planning his attacks for some time. Has there been any corroboration of this?

I heard likewise about his plan to attack...something (can't remember what).

It does seem like the justification was there to hold him longer, but it's hard to say without firsthand knowledge why he was released.

 

[Pound4abrown]

That's my thinking. I have a friend whose son-in-law in the USCG is stationed at Boothbay. Plenty of places for Card to hide out.

People think Canada, and that is for sure a possibility, however it is 230+ miles from Lewiston to Canada and he would likely need transportation or help to get there. It will be interesting to see what happens.

 

[ScrambledEggs]

What's to talk about? Step one is getting someone to introduce the necessary legislation. The last time this happened in the early 90s there was just a single sponsor. The last thing you'll need is ratification by 38 states. Given that we have have 28 states with Constitutional Carry, it seems unlikely that you'll have enough votes.

If you can't get it started, and can't get it completed, it seems like a fool's errand at this point.

The only way to change the future is to talk about what the future could be. You want to live in 1776 the rest of your life go for it

 

[ScrambledEggs]

people have changed - not guns

Guns have changed radically over the last century

 

[Pound4abrown]

So to return to the thread topic, which is NOT gun control, Card may have used a jet ski to escape; his vehicle was found near the water, and the Coast Guard is now part of the search: https://www.cbsnews.com/news/maine-shooting-robert-card-boat-search/

He had a serious "mental issue" in July. He was hearing voices. But what under existing laws could anybody do to help him or prevent this tragedy? It isn't a crime to hear voices. Did he indicate in any way to his family or others that he intended to commit these murders? I was flipping channels awhile ago and heard on some network (News Nation?) that he may have been planning his attacks for some time. Has there been any corroboration of this?

I think boat more than ski doo, only because I know how the river is. And he would only be able to get so far as there are dams along it, the closest at the Brunswick/Topsham boarder. But he could just stop anywhere along the river.