[W:592] How is being kind and inclusive a bad thing? Aren't those things objectively good?

[hecatmoggie]

Yes I do. Apparently moreso than you.

Hating on a hate-filled ideology, holds moral merit.

oh so hating is ok and good .... we can probably also extend that and say that NOT being kind is ok and not being inclusive is ok too

its just who's making the decisions right ?

Hating based on bigotry...not so much.
You're fallacious rhetoric rests upon a false equivalence of the two

Depends on the hate being discerned and challenged.

See how that works?

its just who's making the decisions right ?

 

[quip]

oh so hating is ok and good .... we can probably also extend that and say that NOT being kind is ok and not being inclusive is ok too

its just who's making the decisions right ?


its just who's making the decisions right ?

Society.


You know full well where you stand, morally speaking. It's why Reps are so desperately adroit at demonizing the left.

 

[NatMorton]

Or they don't understand the teachings of Jesus Christ while professing to be a 'true Christian' and using it as a weapon against other citizens....
Not magic euphemisms for some but rather willful misuse of the so-called 'Good Book' by others....

I'm not sure there's enough blue for that to come out of.

 

[Crunchtime]

Why would that matter? People insult me here all the time it doesn't render me incapable of defending my positions. Also don't really have any control over whether you feel insulted, that's for you to say.

I've tried to explain my point. You said sex was easily determined by genitals so I'm asking you to determine the sex of someone born with a vagina, xy chromosomes and testes. The point of that is that genitals dont seem to be the determining factor you've made them out to be. The intersex show, biologically, that males and men can have vaginas and females and women testes depending on what sex you determine someone like Caster Semenya belongs to.

I don’t determine anything. I only pointed out the obvious. I saw a young intersex person on a YouTube video that identified as a female. She said she had ovaries and was fertile. That she could become pregnant.

“Soft White Underbelly.” The man that produces the videos is located, for the most part, on Skid Row in Los Angeles. He interviews and records mostly street people but has healthcare professionals as well. I looked for the video but couldn’t find it.

 

[Master Debator]

I don’t determine anything.

Well thats a switch from your earlier claim where you said Yale was full of shit and sex determination was easy and based on genitals.

I only pointed out the obvious. I saw a young intersex person on a YouTube video that identified as a female. She said she had ovaries and was fertile. That she could become pregnant.

Ok... but that isnt what I asked you about. I asked you about a person born with a vagina, testes and XY chromosomes. Can you determine their sex or not?

“Soft White Underbelly.” The man that produces the videos is located, for the most part, on Skid Row in Los Angeles. He interviews and records mostly street people but has healthcare professionals as well. I looked for the video but couldn’t find it.

So what is that supposed to mean to me? I did find you information on Caster Semenya who maintains she's no less a woman than any other woman despite not having a uterus and internal testes.

Caster Semenya: I am no less a woman because I have internal testes

 

[Crunchtime]

It has been determined that about 1.7% of humanity is intersex and some aren’t even aware of it. That is they have both male and female organs or even a mixture thereof. That’s biological. That’s organic plumbing of a sort. But it’s not you or me that determines that. Science does.

I didn’t read the testimony of Caster Semenya. I don’t need to. I’m still unsure as to where you’re trying to go with this. It’s as though you’re laying groundwork for some kind of “gotcha moment”. I mean after all you’re the Master.

 

[Master Debator]

It has been determined that about 1.7% of humanity is intersex. That is they have both male and female organs or even a mixture thereof. That’s biological. That’s organic plumbing of a sort. But it’s not you or me that determines that. Science does.

What does size of population have to do with your argument?

I didn’t read the testimony of Caster Semenya. I don’t need to. I’m still unsure as to where you’re trying to go with this. It’s as though you’re laying groundwork for some kind of “gotcha moment”. I mean after all you’re the Master.

Of course my counter arguments to you are to prove your arguments wrong. Thats not a gotcha, that's the whole idea behind debate.

 

[Crunchtime]

What does size of population have to do with your argument?

Of course my counter arguments to you are to prove your arguments wrong. Thats not a gotcha, that's the whole idea behind debate.

How am I wrong?

 

[Master Debator]

How am I wrong?

I feel like I've explained that a few times but let's go again.

You claimed Yale was full of shit and sex determination is easy and based on genitals. I've presented a real person to you with a vagina, testes and XY chromosomes and so for you've failed to make an easy sex determination in regards to them. Thats my point. That one simple question is all it takes to blow up your argument.

 

[Crunchtime]

I feel like I've explained that a few times but let's go again.

You claimed Yale was full of shit and sex determination is easy and based on genitals. I've presented a real person to you with a vagina, testes and XY chromosomes and so for you've failed to make an easy sex determination in regards to them. Thats my point. That one simple question is all it takes to blow up your argument.

So then sex isn't determined by genitalia? That’s your point?

 

[Str8shooter]

Being kind and inclusive is a good thing as long as it is reciprocated. For example, we have two new neighbors. Our neighborhood is booming. Both families are gay. During Pride Month, both families put up lights in the same style as Christmas lights to celebrate Pride Month. They violated our HOA rules when both got carried away and were turned in by a neighbor. I signed a petition created by these two new families to allow them to keep their light displays up. In fact, the majority of our neighborhood signed the petition, and by the time the HOA moved on a fine or any other action, Pride Month had passed. These families were not hurting anything with their light displays. My neighborhood has Christians, Buddhists, Muslims, along with every race imaginable. The doctors I have commented on in my neighborhood who refuse to take care of their lawn are Hindu and from India.

The problem today seems to be when politics enters the equation. Finally, one issue that I have and might, at some point, make a thread about is the idea of equality. I don't believe in equality. I believe that you get what you earn in life and are entitled to your success or responsible for your failures. I have worked my entire life trying to prove that I am unequal to others.

 

[Master Debator]

So then sex isn't determined by genitalia? That’s your point?

Not definitively, no as you've been so kind to prove with your inability to answer. Sex determination is based on a combination of factors like genitals, chromosomes, and hormone production. That's why biologists are more open to the idea of sex as a spectrum than as a simple binary because that explanation is inadequate to account for the intersex.

Sex Redefined: The idea of 2 sexes is overly simplistic

 

[Crunchtime]

Not definitively, no as you've been so kind to prove with your inability to answer. Sex determination is based on a combination of factors like genitals, chromosomes, and hormone production. That's why biologists are more open to the idea of sex as a spectrum than as a simple binary because that explanation is inadequate to account for the intersex.

Sex Redefined: The idea of 2 sexes is overly simplistic

I beg to differ. Male, female, and intersex are all determined by genitalia and hormones. Intersex has both male and female genitalia. Males produce testosterone. Females produce estrogen and progesterone. Intersex produce both in some cases. It matters very little that biologists are open to the idea of sex as a spectrum. It’s not empirical evidence. Your attempt to complicate the issue doesn’t win the debate. You can scoff all you want to. It’s not been my inability to answer, and answer well, it’s just been my refusal to agree with your speculation.

I’m done. Have a good night.

 

[Master Debator]

I beg to differ. Male, female, and intersex are all determined by genitalia and hormones.

Intersex what? Male or Female?

Intersex has both male and female genitalia. Males produce testosterone. Females produce estrogen and progesterone.

Wrong my guy. Males also produce estrogen and progesterone. Its important to bone health. Without out it male bones would be brittle. Females also produce testosterone. These arent male or female hormones. That's an elementary school understanding of them. Maybe you shouldn't be so quick to dismiss higher education?

Intersex produce both in some cases. It matters very little that biologists are open to the idea of sex as a spectrum. It’s not empirical evidence. Your attempt to complicate the issue doesn’t win the debate. You can scoff all you want to. It’s not been my inability to answer, and answer well, it’s just been my refusal to agree with your speculation.

That is exactly what empirical evidence is. This is another thing higher education could of helped you grasp better.

 

[Crunchtime]

Intersex what? Male or Female?

Wrong my guy. Males also produce estrogen and progesterone. Its important to bone health. Without out it male bones would be brittle. Females also produce testosterone. These arent male or female hormones. That's an elementary school understanding of them. Maybe you shouldn't be so quick to dismiss higher education?

That is exactly what empirical evidence is. This is another thing higher education could of helped you grasp better.

Physiology, Testosterone - StatPearls - NCBI Bookshelf

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Good night.

 

[Master Debator]

Physiology, Testosterone - StatPearls - NCBI Bookshelf

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Good night.

Testosterone and women

Just because testosterone does some things for men doesnt mean it doesnt do other things for women. You dont do logic or critical thinking so well do you?

 

[Crunchtime]

Testosterone and women

Just because testosterone does some things for men doesnt mean it doesnt do other things for women. You dont do logic or critical thinking so well do you?

What is the definition of intersex?​

Intersex is an umbrella term for unique variations in reproductive or sex anatomy. Variations may appear in a person’s chromosomes, genitals, or internal organs like testes or ovaries. Some intersex traits are identified at birth, while others may not be discovered until puberty or later in life.

People with intersex traits have always existed, but there is more awareness now about the diversity of human bodies. People with intersex bodies sometimes face discrimination, including in healthcare settings, as early as infancy. There are over 30 medical terms for specific combinations of intersex traits. Every intersex person is different.

Sex characteristics is a term that often refers to the internal and external traits of an individual’s body. Gender and sexual orientation are different concepts. Intersex people can have any gender identity and sexual orientation.

Potential causes of intersex traits include random genetic variations, changes in a person’s number of sex chromosomes, gonadal differences, natal exposure to unusual levels of sex hormones, or different responses to sex hormones. Intersex traits in and of themselves are not life-threatening, although they are sometimes associated with other serious medical symptoms, such as with salt-wasting congenital adrenal hyperplasia (SW CAH) and turner syndrome.

 

[Master Debator]

What is the definition of intersex?​

Intersex is an umbrella term for unique variations in reproductive or sex anatomy. Variations may appear in a person’s chromosomes, genitals, or internal organs like testes or ovaries. Some intersex traits are identified at birth, while others may not be discovered until puberty or later in life.

People with intersex traits have always existed, but there is more awareness now about the diversity of human bodies. People with intersex bodies sometimes face discrimination, including in healthcare settings, as early as infancy. There are over 30 medical terms for specific combinations of intersex traits. Every intersex person is different.

Sex characteristics is a term that often refers to the internal and external traits of an individual’s body. Gender and sexual orientation are different concepts. Intersex people can have any gender identity and sexual orientation.

Potential causes of intersex traits include random genetic variations, changes in a person’s number of sex chromosomes, gonadal differences, natal exposure to unusual levels of sex hormones, or different responses to sex hormones. Intersex traits in and of themselves are not life-threatening, although they are sometimes associated with other serious medical symptoms, such as with salt-wasting congenital adrenal hyperplasia (SW CAH) and turner syndrome.

Is that supposed to mean something in regards to your argument? If you read the first line it says intersex is an umbrella term for unique variations in reproductive or sex anatomy. It itself is not a biological sex determination. Intersex people are still identified as intersex males or females.

 

[Crunchtime]

Is that supposed to mean something in regards to your argument? If you read the first line it says intersex is an umbrella term for unique variations in reproductive or sex anatomy. It itself is not a biological sex determination. Intersex people are still identified as intersex males or females.

Exactly. It’s an anomaly. It’s not a gender or sex unto itself. That’s been clear from the beginning. You have implied otherwise. Your argument has been subjective from the start but you have deflected throughout. Also known as splitting hairs.

 

[dairyair]

Nope, your posts are great exemplars of sloppy thinking. Thanks for the negative example!

d because of dumb-ass race-swapping, but because of dumb-ass ultra-feminism.

I don't need to think about anything. Your words are quite explicit.

 

[Parrish]

What's with you guys about LGBT+? What are you worried about? Do who you do.

 

[Ouroboros]

Why aren't they women? Are you the arbiter of womanhood?

Sure, the same way you're the arbiter of all those extra sexualities you like to believe exist.

 

[Ouroboros]

I don't think

Fixed it for you.

 

[Ouroboros]

Yes, transgender women. Notice the "women" part.

You guys have yet to show any evidence that being transgender, gay, lesbian, non-binary, or gender non-conformist makes you incapable of serving in the armed forces. Just because you disagree with their "lifestyle" or preferred pronouns, does not make them less of a person. The congresswoman pointed three examples of transgender servicewomen who have shown to be highly competent and demonstrated elite leadership skills. The booting of transgender people from our military has nothing to do with mental acuity, but everything to do with prejudice and assumption.

And getting the federal government to pay for their corrective surgeries under the guise of "health concerns." Don't forget that little shell game.

Booting people out for their existence goes against the concept of "being inclusive and kind".

So does running scams on the government.

 

[Ouroboros]

I dont know what that is. What even is Calvinball?

Google can be your friend, but you have to reach out. I might give you an answer if you ever address the origins of your fake use of the word "frailty."

What? In my world no, I dont associate Haitians with voodoo any more or less than any other mystical practices or religions. Its all the same to me.

Right, because in your world Irish Catholics do great business in voodoo dolls.

I dont know where the ACLU thing came from or what's that about but it doesnt seem to be connected to anything I've said.

It came from the movie's lack of honesty about what would have happened if a hero like Superman was renditioned, to use a word that you used for the arrest (one the movie did not use).

Thats because you're more of the Mad Lib than I am. You would hear those things before me.

Nope, you're the one adhering to Mad Lib reasoning so it's all you.

It's not weird for me to connect one imaginary thing to another.

Evil, voodoo, magic, its all the same to me guy. Those things all fit into the same bucket labeled make believe.

Religions still don't cease to exist because you don't believe in them. I guess when you were a kid and refused to clap to show belief in Tinkerbelle, you extended that sense of omnipotence to religions in general.

Im confused about what you're laughing about. If you understand what I meant then your comment is about how I didn't word it the same way you would of? So what?

So what you said remains meretricious.

I still don't know what Calvinball even is and I didn't insist on anything. I asked you what you meant by the use of the word proper, you just want to be coy about what your arguments mean for some reason.....

Nothing coy about relying on the dictionary when it's appropriate. Now ask what "appropriate" means.

Whats incorrect about it? Is that an objective thing (without personal sentiment) or a subjective thing (based on personal sentiment)?

No, that would be your subjective definition of what constitutes objectivity.

See how I ask for clarification? Its not that hard.

I'm happy to repeat that you are not in any way interested in clarity of any kind. Your Church Lady game remains obvious. (You can google that one too.)

Is that how that works? If I write story about how the government is shadily detaining someone who they've determined doesnt have any rights that would give me a pass for a prison breakout?

After the government has objectively imperiled the whole planet, sure. Why ever not?

And this highlights the nature of subjectivity. I look at that same defintion and see every reason to use the word frail to describe you and your arguments.

Of course you do, because you think words are governed by your subjective interpretation of them.