[W:423]Ritterhouse just got a bump by a good judge

[bave]

Judge only dropped the curfew charge, the misdemeanor gun charge isn't dismissed.

Ah, thanks for the correction. I haven't followed that too closely, but it seems like that one might stick depending on the interpretation.

 

[ASHES]

Ah, thanks for the correction. I haven't followed that too closely, but it seems like that one might stick depending on the interpretation.

I don't think so. Pretty clear exception in it for over 16 and possessing a rifle/shotgun. Will find out soon though.

 

[RaleBulgarian]

What does the opinion he should not have been there have to do with anything?
He was there and he was defending himself.

I was responding to @bave ’s opinion.

Get a grip.

 

[RaleBulgarian]

100%. Bad parenting more than anything else. 17 year old boys will do stupid shit no matter what, it is a parent's job to make sure they don't do shit *this* stupid. It looks like the judge dropped all the misdemeanor charges, focusing purely on the primary criminal charges. At this point I would bet he walks.

I don’t know enough about Rittenhouse’s mother to make any judgment of her parenting, but it does appear at least, that she failed to maintain any control of her son’s activities.

Having said that, Kyle Rittenhouse was well past the age of reason when he went to Kenosha, and rightfully is being treated as an adult by the court.

 

[Buckeyes85]

they could assume his actions were legitimate instead of presuming they were malicious
they chose to attack a juvenile for defending himself

That argument has multiple flaws. First, you once again assume the correctness of the position that the kid's initial shooting(s) were in self defense. That obviously is what this trial is about. I don't know exactly what every person present knew, but 2 people had already been shot, this kid was carrying an semi auto rifle; he clearly was not law enforcement, and may have been fleeing a shooting. Are you telling me in the same circumstance the average person should "reasonably" presume his actions were innocent?

As also pointed out to you, you now play the "juvenile" card in order to make the kid who chose to drive to a riot and parade around with an assault rifle, the innocent looking victim of mob justice. That doesn't work.

 

[RaleBulgarian]

I don't think so. Pretty clear exception in it for over 16 and possessing a rifle/shotgun. Will find out soon though.

The law isn’t clear. Judge Schroeder has already said that he will include instructing the jury regarding WI’s firearms possession law as part of his deliberation instructions before the jury begins it’s deliberations.

 

[justabubba]

That argument has multiple flaws. First, you once again assume the correctness of the position that the kid's initial shooting(s) were in self defense. That obviously is what this trial is about. I don't know exactly what every person present knew, but 2 people had already been shot, this kid was carrying an semi auto rifle; he clearly was not law enforcement, and may have been fleeing a shooting. Are you telling me in the same circumstance the average person should "reasonably" presume his actions were innocent?

As also pointed out to you, you now play the "juvenile" card in order to make the kid who chose to drive to a riot and parade around with an assault rifle, the innocent looking victim of mob justice. That doesn't work.

i assume a wise person who is not absolutely certain the jogging juvenile gun bearer is an active malicious shooter should not take hostile, aggressive actions toward him under the assumption he might be

 

[RaleBulgarian]

RB is on record as saying the most serious charges wont stick,

Not correct.

I am on record, saying that I believe Rittenhouse may be found innocent of the two murder and attempted murder charges.

but that some lesser charges might.

Correct.

Specifically, the two “recklessly endangering” charges.

 

[jaypatriot]

I was responding to @bave ’s opinion.

Get a grip.

My grip on the issues is getting stronger knowing I have you around to help me.
Stay on your meds.

 

[RaleBulgarian]

My grip on the issues is getting stronger knowing I have you around to help me.

You’re welcome.

Stay on your meds.

Your tired, childish insults mean nothing to me.

* Friendly heads up; “meds” comments can get you in trouble with the mods.

 

[jaypatriot]

You’re welcome.

Your tired, childish insults mean nothing to me.

* Friendly heads up; “meds” comments can get you in trouble with the mods.

You are prescient. Like in an NFL game, sometimes I just can't figure out why a player received a taunting penalty. l gotta clean up my vocabulary.

 

[Buckeyes85]

i assume a wise person who is not absolutely certain the jogging juvenile gun bearer is an active malicious shooter should not take hostile, aggressive actions toward him under the assumption he might be

I was not aware Rittenhouse was jogging when he shot the first 2 victims. And where do you get the idea someone has to be an active shooter in order for anyone to take action?

And is your standard of "absolute certainty" also applicable to Rittenhouse? He had to be absolutely certain that the victims posed and imminent of serious bodily harm to him before he shot? After all, at least as to the two decedents, Rittenhouse was the only one with a deadly weapon in his hands.

And again, you mention juvenile. Was that a factor when he asked someone to ilegally purchase the AR15 for him, or only applicable when he's claiming self defense?

 

[ClaraD]

That argument has multiple flaws. First, you once again assume the correctness of the position that the kid's initial shooting(s) were in self defense. That obviously is what this trial is about. I don't know exactly what every person present knew, but 2 people had already been shot, this kid was carrying an semi auto rifle; he clearly was not law enforcement, and may have been fleeing a shooting. Are you telling me in the same circumstance the average person should "reasonably" presume his actions were innocent?

As also pointed out to you, you now play the "juvenile" card in order to make the kid who chose to drive to a riot and parade around with an assault rifle, the innocent looking victim of mob justice. That doesn't work.

It seems that it has been testified to, that Rittenhouse pointed his gun at people....if you point your gun at someone, it is assumed your intention is to shoot them....whether they are aggressive or not aggressive....I point my gun at someone, it is because I am going to pull the trigger....it is the first thing you learn in handling a weapon(after basic safety) never, ever point your gun unless you are ready to use it....and never use it to injure someone, you kill them.

 

[ClaraD]

What separated Grosskruetz from everyone else that were chasing after Rittenhouse at that time was the fact that Grosskruetz was the only one with a pistol in their hand.

yes, but it is also pointed out, he didn't originally have it in his hand....it is also testified to that Rittenhouse pointed his gun at people that were not a threat at that moment....being chased is not a reason to point a gun...he wanted him not to chase him, is not an excuse to kill someone. Why he decided to go back to an area where he wasn't supposed to be is insane....he knew it was a dangerous situation...his stammering and running around on his answers makes him sound like he is thinking of what to say, instead of just answering...it is insanely a bad idea to put the accused on the stand...especially someone as immature as Rittenhouse.
He essentially admitted to being the aggressor against Rosenbaum.

 

[Clicker III]

The poor excuse for a prosecutor has dug a hole so deep that he can't possibly win this case unless the jury is totally biased against the right to defend yourself. Simply asking the jury to put themselves in the defendants place should only take about 30 sec to return a not guilty. The stupidest thing was the prosecutors claim that the defendant didn't have the right to defend himself until after he was shot!!!!!

 

[ClaraD]

The poor excuse for a prosecutor has dug a hole so deep that he can't possibly win this case unless the jury is totally biased against the right to defend yourself. Simply asking the jury to put themselves in the defendants place should only take about 30 sec to return a not guilty. The stupidest thing was the prosecutors claim that the defendant didn't have the right to defend himself until after he was shot!!!!!

really? You must not have been watching today then....
The prosecutor pointed out...that Rittenhouse turned around and shot Rosenbaum ...he pointed his gun at him, before Rosenbaum lunged at him...a reasonable person would think when someone points a gun at you, that they are going to kill you....why in the hell would anyone point a gun so that someone would stop chasing them? That made him the aggressor....a gun is a deadly threat.....chasing is not.

The defendant insisted that the reason he pointed his gun at Rosenbaum was so he "would stop chasing me."

 

[Clicker III]

really? You must not have been watching today then....
The prosecutor pointed out...that Rittenhouse turned around and shot Rosenbaum ...he pointed his gun at him, before Rosenbaum lunged at him...a reasonable person would think when someone points a gun at you, that they are going to kill you....why in the hell would anyone point a gun so that someone would stop chasing them? That made him the aggressor....a gun is a deadly threat.....chasing is not.

The defendant insisted that the reason he pointed his gun at Rosenbaum was so he "would stop chasing me."

I was.
That poor excuse for a prosecutor kept playing the fantasy as tho his descriptions of what happened were true. The reasonable man would see that Rittenhouse acted completely in self defense. The premise that shooting someone aiming a pistol at you at a range of inches can't be shot until the pistol waver shoots ya is absurd.
Skateboards were used in the riots as weapons to attack others as it was used in the riot in Kenosha. It's also been used as a self defense weapon.

Man dies after being hit in head with skateboard during fight in Santa Ana Starbucks

A man was killed after being hit in the head with a skateboard in an act of self-defense during a fight in a Santa Ana Starbucks.

abc7.com

The prosecutors attempts to get Rittenhouse to self incriminate were met with a scathing dressing down by the judge as well. He's desperately grabbing at straws to get his face on camera again after getting his ass handed to him by the witnesses even those that he called. Ritterhouse played him like a Stradivarius.

 

[ClaraD]

I was.
That poor excuse for a prosecutor kept playing the fantasy as tho his descriptions of what happened were true. The reasonable man would see that Rittenhouse acted completely in self defense. The premise that shooting someone aiming a pistol at you at a range of inches can't be shot until the pistol waver shoots ya is absurd.
Skateboards were used in the riots as weapons to attack others as it was used in the riot in Kenosha. It's also been used as a self defense weapon.

Man dies after being hit in head with skateboard during fight in Santa Ana Starbucks

A man was killed after being hit in the head with a skateboard in an act of self-defense during a fight in a Santa Ana Starbucks.

abc7.com

The prosecutors attempts to get Rittenhouse to self incriminate were met with a scathing dressing down by the judge as well. He's desperately grabbing at straws to get his face on camera again after getting his ass handed to him by the witnesses even those that he called. Ritterhouse played him like a Stradivarius.

um, Rittenhouse admitted on the stand to pointing his gun at more than one person....and knowing that these people were not a threat to his life.....he knew that Rosenbaum was not armed.....what was really damning is his moronic claim that he was there to provide medical attention(which he is not qualified to provide) and then when the last guy he shot, begged for medical attention....he left the scene.

 

[Clicker III]

I was.
That poor excuse for a prosecutor kept playing the fantasy as tho his descriptions of what happened were true. The reasonable man would see that Rittenhouse acted completely in self defense. The premise that shooting someone aiming a pistol at you at a range of inches can't be shot until the pistol waver shoots ya is absurd.
Skateboards were used in the riots as weapons to attack others as it was used in the riot in Kenosha. It's also been used as a self defense weapon.

Man dies after being hit in head with skateboard during fight in Santa Ana Starbucks

A man was killed after being hit in the head with a skateboard in an act of self-defense during a fight in a Santa Ana Starbucks.

abc7.com

The prosecutors attempts to get Rittenhouse to self incriminate were met with a scathing dressing down by the judge as well. He's desperately grabbing at straws to get his face on camera again after getting his ass handed to him by the witnesses even those that he called. Rittenhouse played him like a Stradivarius.

I forgot to mention that when someone is chasing you that makes them the aggressor.

 

[ClaraD]

I forgot to mention that when someone is chasing you that makes them the aggressor.

is chasing you a deadly threat? I wonder, why in the hell anyone goes into a situation like that claiming they aren't looking for trouble? Especially carrying a loaded AR 15......why weren't they using non lethal rounds?

 

[Clicker III]

um, Rittenhouse admitted on the stand to pointing his gun at more than one person....and knowing that these people were not a threat to his life.....he knew that Rosenbaum was not armed.....what was really damning is his moronic claim that he was there to provide medical attention(which he is not qualified to provide) and then when the last guy he shot, begged for medical attention....he left the scene.

None of which makes guilty of any of the charges.
Gotta remember, this isn't the view, it's a real trial.

 

[RaleBulgarian]

yes, but it is also pointed out, he didn't originally have it in his hand....

Grosskruetz had the Glock in his hand when he approached Rittenhouse. Whether or not Grosskruetz had the pistol in his hand before he approached Rittenhouse isn’t pertinent to their interactions.

it is also testified to that Rittenhouse pointed his gun at people that were not a threat at that moment....

I heard that too.

being chased is not a reason to point a gun...

Depends on the circumstances.

he wanted him not to chase him, is not an excuse to kill someone.

Agree.

Why he decided to go back to an area where he wasn't supposed to be is insane....he knew it was a dangerous situation...

Logical/mature thought is not a Rittenhouse strength.

his stammering and running around on his answers makes him sound like he is thinking of what to say, instead of just answering...

A reasonable view. It’s also reasonable that any teen (or adult) in Rittenhouse’s position would be very nervous, and fearful of choosing the wrong words in answering questions.

it is insanely a bad idea to put the accused on the stand...especially someone as immature as Rittenhouse.

Generally, I’d agree with your sentiment, 100%. Today though, it appeared to me that the defendant managed to avoid torpedoing his own defense.

I think the prosecutor’s boring, pedantic questioning and testing of Judge Schroeder’s limits also benefitted the defense.

He essentially admitted to being the aggressor against Rosenbaum.

I didn’t get that impression.

 

[RaleBulgarian]

the first thing you learn in handling a weapon(after basic safety) never, ever point your gun unless you are ready to use it....

Correct. “Ready” to and intending to are two different things.

It is not unreasonable to aim a firearm at someone who presents a potential for grave danger as a signal that you are prepared (ready) to use deadly force if required.

Police frequently draw and aim their service weapons at potentially dangerous individuals even when they aren’t certain that the individual is armed.

and never use it to injure someone, you kill them.

The only legal justification in a self defense shooting is to stop the individual from causing severe injury/killing you.

Example; If you shoot a bad guy coming at you with a knife, hitting him in the hip, and he drops to the ground, unable to continue his attack, you are no longer justified in continuing to shoot the bad guy.

 

[KLATTU]

Rittenhouse testified! You would only do that if you were confident he would do well or if you thought it was the only chance. Based on the testimony from the prosecution witnesses it clearly isn’t the latter so it must be the former. We shall see.

 

[bave]

This case is over, anyone wanna take bets the kid walks?

He should be starting his appearance/book tour by the New Year.