[W:293]Abortion is the deliberate killing of a live human

[Vidi]

Re: Abortion is the deliberate killing of a live human

Well, that is between you and your brother. :lol:



They each have their own DNA, they each have their own body comprised of cells derived from their own DNA, the unborn human develops it's own heart, its own separate circulatory system and other organs. The ONLY thin they share is nutrients and oxygen which they pass back and forth between their own discrete circulatory systems. They are no more the same person than a baby becomes it's mother by nursing.



I haven't made a religious statement, I have only commented on the science of life.

That’s what I mean. I do not share your interpretation of the science.

For example, prior to week 8, it’s not even called a fetus. It’s an embryo.

There are these terminology distinctions for a reason.

 

[AGENT J]

Re: Abortion is the deliberate killing of a live human

You have more projection that Rave Cinemas.




Already done many times. You just ignore it and blue screen when I do.

Again nobody honest educated and objective is buying your dodges and lies

this is your claim:

#3 is an establish and irrefutable fact, it's not an opinion.

so by all means it should be VERY EASY to post ONE single fact that makes your statement true . . one is all we need . . can ANYBODY do so . . . . please do so now, thanks!

 

[Vidi]

Re: Abortion is the deliberate killing of a live human

Except nobody claims that the zygote is a human being. We say it's a living human. Do you dispute this?


Why do you think an entity that carries human DNA is not a part of humanity?


Just because you do not understand what someone is saying, it does not make it sophistry.

What Jmotivator is saying is that Agent J is wrong for saying ALL of the points in OP were opinions. This is false, because one of these points is that "there are laws that allow abortion". This is a fact, not an opinion.


So? Just because a zygote miscarries, it does not mean it hadn't been alive. It is just a then-alive organism that is now dead.


They do indeed. And what's your point? Nature or God do not kill?

Nobody is saying having human DNA makes an entity alive. We are saying it makes the entity a human.

That life begins at conception is not an opinion. Why do you think the zygote keeps drawing nutrients from the mother and grows bigger everyday? It's certainly not because it's dead.

No it doesnt. But I see that you have a vendetta against religion.

Except nobody said anything about people needing to believe in any sort of religion. Learn to read.



That the zygote draws nutrients from the mother and grows bigger everyday. A dead organism cannot do this.


If you are claiming that ALL of the statements in OP are opinions, you are wrong. That there are laws allowing abortion is a fact, not an opinion.

I am not talking about miscarriages. Eggs fail to implant all the time. 50% of the time in fact.

That’s not a miscarriage. It’s a “never was pregnant”.

So that leads us to the following:

If an egg can be fertilized but the woman is not actually pregnant, how can that be life?

Logically, it cannot.

So that makes implantation the soonest that we could consider the embryo as life.

Personally, I don’t think it’s life even then, but I can see why some would make the argument.

But life begins at fertilization? Well, that’s just ridiculous because science tells us it cannot begin then.

 

[jmotivator]

Re: Abortion is the deliberate killing of a live human

Again nobody honest educated and objective is buying your dodges and lies

this is your claim:


so by all means it should be VERY EASY to post ONE single fact that makes your statement true . . one is all we need . . can ANYBODY do so . . . . please do so now, thanks!

I have posted links to actual laws that allow abortion, proving that such laws exist.

See here.

Here, I will quote the law here so you don't even have to click through:

"§ 2599-bb. Abortion. 1. A health care practitioner licensed,
certified, or authorized under title eight of the education law, acting
within his or her lawful scope of practice, may perform an abortion
when, according to the practitioner's reasonable and good faith
professional judgment based on the facts of the patient's case: the
patient is within twenty-four weeks from the commencement of pregnancy,
or there is an absence of fetal viability, or the abortion is necessary
to protect the patient's life or health."

There, that is New York state law allowing abortion. I've linked to it a couple of times. I even marked the key passage in red so you can't miss it.

Soooo.. does that law establish statement #3 as fact sufficiently for you?

 

[Wan]

Re: Abortion is the deliberate killing of a live human

I am not talking about miscarriages. Eggs fail to implant all the time. 50% of the time in fact.

That’s not a miscarriage. It’s a “never was pregnant”.

So that leads us to the following:

If an egg can be fertilized but the woman is not actually pregnant, how can that be life?

Logically, it cannot.

So that makes implantation the soonest that we could consider the embryo as life.

Personally, I don’t think it’s life even then, but I can see why some would make the argument.

But life begins at fertilization? Well, that’s just ridiculous because science tells us it cannot begin then.

Is there any reason why you think an entity that draws nutrients and grows bigger everyday is not alive? Do you think millions of babies came from dead entities?

Please define "alive".

 

[soylentgreen]

Re: Abortion is the deliberate killing of a live human

Just because I do not talk about what you want to talk about, it does not mean I am "dodging".


I do not care whether my logic is "torn apart". Maybe it's important to you, but not me.


I literally did not say the woman is of no concern. Please stop putting words in my mouth.

I literally did not say this either.


I did not state, not even imply, that the woman has no say.


Let's try to keep things civil and keep insult, snark..etc out of this.

I have not said anything insulting. Pointing out that you have made a mistake about your claim of how logic works is no more than what you have also done.

Your whole argument is based on your opinion that you are following a logical course, yet when shown that it is not that logical suddenly you do not care about logic.

You are dodging when you fail to deal with the logical train of thought you yourself have projected.

You have not said anything about the woman involved. You have completely ignored the fact that a woman is involved. Your entire concern has been over assuming a right for the life within her while ignoring the woman let alone her rights.

Your argument fails because you have said nothing about the woman.

You cannot use the fact that you have said nothing about the woman as an excuse.

 

[AGENT J]

Re: Abortion is the deliberate killing of a live human

1.) I have posted links to actual laws that allow abortion, proving that such laws exist.

See here.
2.) Here, I will quote the law here so you don't even have to click through:

3.) B]"§ 2599-bb. Abortion. 1. A health care practitioner licensed,
certified, or authorized under title eight of the education law, acting
within his or her lawful scope of practice, may perform an abortion
when, according to the practitioner's reasonable and good faith
professional judgment based on the facts of the patient's case: the
patient is within twenty-four weeks from the commencement of pregnancy,
or there is an absence of fetal viability, or the abortion is necessary
to protect the patient's life or health."[/B]

4.) There, that is New York state law allowing abortion. I've linked to it a couple of times. I even marked the key passage in red so you can't miss it.
5.) Soooo.. does that law establish statement #3 as fact sufficiently for you?

1.) no you have not because thats just your your subjective opinion of them , your subjective claim and feelings about them but NOT a fact. this isnt rocket science its a simple fact you dont get
2.) awesome PLEASE do so i can further destroy your claims
3.) PERFECT!!!!
4.) yep thats how YOU subjectively view it based on your subject opinion
5.) it has nothing to do with me, it established no such thing. You posted a law, nobody said those dont exist but what it doesnt do is make #3 a "fact"
all you did is give me your subjective opinion of that law

some feel that law protects womans rights
some feel that law violates human rights
allow from what? what doesnt allow it?

all OPINIONS none fact. You do understand what a fact is right? you get an opinion can exist and not be a fact right

again like i said before this isnt rocket science, #3 remains an opinion and not a fact, thanks for completely owning yourself and proving yourself wrong AWESOME!

maybe if i dumb it down this will help

I think alexandra daddario is mega hot . . is that fact? nope is it "factually wrong" nope . . is it "factually right?" nope

how about this, "that girls dress allows me to see just enough of her" . . . is that fact? nope is it "factually wrong" nope . . is it "factually right?" nope

well that was easy, thanks for sharing your OPINIONS but the facts remain, happy trails!

Facts
#1 is factually wrong
#2-5 are opinions and not facts

if you disagree by all means factually prove otherwise, post one fact that makes #3 more than opinion..... ONE . . . . . . thanks!

 

[Lursa]

Re: Abortion is the deliberate killing of a live human

Except nobody claims that the zygote is a human being. We say it's a living human.

Angel does. Over and over.

 

[jmotivator]

Re: Abortion is the deliberate killing of a live human

1.) no you have not because thats just your your subjective opinion of them , your subjective claim and feeligns about them but NOT a fact. this isnt rocket science its a simple fact you dont get
2.) awesome PLEASE do so i can further destory your claims
3.) PERFECT!!!!
4.) yep thats how YOU subjectively few it based on your subject opinion
5.) it has nothgin to do with me, it esrtablsidhed no such thing. You posted a law, noboyd said thos dones excist but what it doesnt do is make #3 a "fact"
all you did is give me your subjective opinion of that law

some feel that law protects womans rights
some feel that law violates human rights
allow from what? what doesnt allow it?

all OPINIONS none fact. You do understand what a fact is right? you get an opinion can exist and not be a fact right

again like i said before this isnt rocket science, #3 remains an opinion and not a fact, thanks for completely owning yourself and proving yourself wrong AWESOME!

maybe if i dumb it down this will help

I think alexandra daddario is mega hot . . is that fact? nope is it "factually wrong" nope . . is it "factually right?" nope

how about this, that girls dress allows me to see just enough of her . . . is that fact? nope is it "factually wrong" nope . . is it "factually right?" nope

well that was easy, thanks for sharing your OPINIONS but the facts remain, happy trails!

Facts
#1 is factually wrong
#2-5 are opinions and not facts

if you disagree by all means factually prove otherwise, post one fact that makes #3 more than opinion..... ONE . . . . . . thanks!

Oh dear, you blue screened again. Maybe it's a driver issue.

 

[AGENT J]

Re: Abortion is the deliberate killing of a live human

Oh dear, you blue screened again. Maybe it's a driver issue.

LMAO thats what I thought! you got zip zero ziltcha nadda!!!
so delicious, i love it!!!

Facts
#1 is factually wrong
#2-5 are opinions and not facts

if you disagree by all means factually prove otherwise, post one fact that makes #3 more than opinion..... ONE . . . . . . thanks!

 

[CMPancake]

Re: Abortion is the deliberate killing of a live human

Calling someone a racist, is one of the largest signs that you've got no real chance of standing against them legitimately.

The only people that legitimately believe this are racists and friends of racists.

CThen try it for the time being. What is the basis/standard of human life?

The standard/basis of human life is completely subjective and relative to different individuals. Whether we would like to admit it or not, we find some lives more important than others, and some people we dehumanize consistently. I value the lives of my coworkers than I value the lives of the people we fight against. I hold more value in my dog than I do a fetus.

 

[jmotivator]

Re: Abortion is the deliberate killing of a live human

LMAO thats what I thought! you got zip zero ziltcha nadda!!!
so delicious, i love it!!!

Facts
#1 is factually wrong
#2-5 are opinions and not facts

if you disagree by all means factually prove otherwise, post one fact that makes #3 more than opinion..... ONE . . . . . . thanks!

No, see, here is the thing, Agent J, you just posted a wall of text trying to prove that a demonstrable fact isn't a demonstrable fact because other people have differing views on what it is. When I get some time I'll crack into that long post fully for you, because I'm a nice guy and think your efforts should be rewarded with a proper response, but it did feel good taking the Agent J route and ignoring in favor of a flippant response... for now.

I won't respond to a response to this post, so you can get the last word in if you need, for now, because I will be constructing a response to your previous post.

 

[PTF]

Re: Abortion is the deliberate killing of a live human

Hi. I just want to say the following:

1. Abortion is the deliberate killing of a live human.
2. The deliberate killing of a live human is wrong.
3. There are laws that allow abortion.
4. These laws allow something wrong.
5. Therefore, these laws need to be changed.

Yes people, logic just happened. Believe it.

Spot on !!!

You can thank the liberal/Demos for this abortion nonsense running way way out of control.

 

[AGENT J]

Re: Abortion is the deliberate killing of a live human

No, see, here is the thing, Agent J, you just posted a wall of text trying to prove that a demonstrable fact isn't a demonstrable fact because other people have differing views on what it is. When I get some time I'll crack into that long post fully for you, because I'm a nice guy and think your efforts should be rewarded with a proper response, but it did feel good taking the Agent J route and ignoring in favor of a flippant response... for now.

I won't respond to a response to this post, so you can get the last word in if you need, for now, because I will be constructing a response to your previous post.

another failed deflection that changes nothing, nor will any other long winded dishonest opinion filled deflection you make. It will also fail and facts will remain. BUT it will be fun to read knowing it changes nothing since facts dont care about your feelings. Cant wait to read it and post the same facts proving it wrong again!
Facts
#1 is factually wrong
#2-5 are opinions and not facts

if you or ANYBODY disagree by all means factually prove otherwise, post one fact that makes #3 more than opinion..... ONE . . . . . thanks!

 

[AGENT J]

Re: Abortion is the deliberate killing of a live human

Spot on !!!

You can thank the liberal/Demos for this abortion nonsense running way way out of control.

oh oh look out, now theres what . . . 3 posters that claim the OP is true? yet ZERO facts that support that claim.

THis should be fun, so far nobody can, please try your best, step up to the plate and post the facts that make 1-5 true . . we'll be waiting, thanks!

 

[Angel]

Re: Abortion is the deliberate killing of a live human

Troll Crossing. Reduce Speed.

 

[jmotivator]

Re: Abortion is the deliberate killing of a live human

1.) no you have not because thats just your your subjective opinion of them , your subjective claim and feelings about them but NOT a fact. this isnt rocket science its a simple fact you dont get

No, it'snot a subjective opinion, it is an objective fact that the law exists, and precisely allows abortions.

2.) awesome PLEASE do so i can further destroy your claims

sigh.

3.) PERFECT!!!!

Glad you liked it.

4.) yep thats how YOU subjectively view it based on your subject opinion

Nope. The existence of the law is objective fact, it is also objective fact that the verbiage of the law allows abortions.

5.) it has nothing to do with me, it established no such thing. You posted a law, nobody said those dont exist but what it doesnt do is make #3 a "fact"
all you did is give me your subjective opinion of that law

You said it was opinion that such laws exist.

some feel that law protects womans rights

To an abortion.

some feel that law violates human rights

Because it allows abortion.

allow from what? what doesnt allow it?

It does allow it, in clear text, verbatim.

all OPINIONS none fact. You do understand what a fact is right? you get an opinion can exist and not be a fact right

All fact, no opinion. You are just so desperate to avoid admitting you are wrong that your are waging war on the very concept of the word "Fact".

again like i said before this isnt rocket science, #3 remains an opinion and not a fact, thanks for completely owning yourself and proving yourself wrong AWESOME!

Nah, I'm just stating facts.

maybe if i dumb it down this will help

I'm not sure you can afford to dial it any lower.

I think alexandra daddario is mega hot . . is that fact? nope is it "factually wrong" nope . . is it "factually right?" nope

Stating opinions trying to prove that a completely different statement isn't fact is... a weird tactic.

how about this, "that girls dress allows me to see just enough of her" . . . is that fact? nope is it "factually wrong" nope . . is it "factually right?" nope

A second attempt at a bizarre analogy doesn't make it better.

well that was easy, thanks for sharing your OPINIONS but the facts remain, happy trails!

I'm sure it must be very easy to act foolish, but your attempts aren't smart, or sensible.

Facts
#1 is factually wrong
#2-5 are opinions and not facts

if you disagree by all means factually prove otherwise, post one fact that makes #3 more than opinion..... ONE . . . . . . thanks!

Wait, how can those be facts when I think that Kate Upton is attractive!? :roll: :lamo

Bonus points for claiming that a demonstrable fact about abortion law isn't a fact because you have opinions about an actress and women's dresses though. That is some top shelf weird you got there. And then to top it off by trying to pass your opinions as fact? Magnifico!

 

[Gina]

Re: Abortion is the deliberate killing of a live human

Moderator's Warning:

This thread is under review. Knock off the personal comments and talking towards each other. Stop playing mod. If you see a violation, report it. Don't discuss it. *Moderation can still occur for posts made before this warning.

 

[AGENT J]

Re: Abortion is the deliberate killing of a live human

No, it'snot a subjective opinion, it is an objective fact that the law exists, and precisely allows abortions.

sigh.

Glad you liked it.

Nope. The existence of the law is objective fact, it is also objective fact that the verbiage of the law allows abortions.

You said it was opinion that such laws exist.

To an abortion.

Because it allows abortion.

It does allow it, in clear text, verbatim.

All fact, no opinion. You are just so desperate to avoid admitting you are wrong that your are waging war on the very concept of the word "Fact".

Nah, I'm just stating facts.

I'm not sure you can afford to dial it any lower.

Stating opinions trying to prove that a completely different statement isn't fact is... a weird tactic.

A second attempt at a bizarre analogy doesn't make it better.

I'm sure it must be very easy to act foolish, but your attempts aren't smart, or sensible.

Wait, how can those be facts when I think that Kate Upton is attractive!? :roll: :lamo

Bonus points for claiming that a demonstrable fact about abortion law isn't a fact because you have opinions about an actress and women's dresses though. That is some top shelf weird you got there. And then to top it off by trying to pass your opinions as fact? Magnifico!

took long enough!!

thanks for all that post full of subjective feelings claims, strawmen and opinions but they change nothing just like i said they would. Facts dont care about your feelings, deflections and straw men. again nobody honest educated and objective is buying it. i knew reading all your failed post would be fun, thanks! Now back to facts and reality.

Facts
#1 is factually wrong
#2-5 are opinions and not facts

if you or ANYBODY disagree by all means factually prove otherwise, post one fact that makes #3 more than opinion..... ONE . . . . . . thanks!

 

[jmotivator]

Re: Abortion is the deliberate killing of a live human

took long enough!!

thanks for all that post full of subjective feelings claims, strawmen and opinions but they change nothing just like i said they would.

Well sure, but what did you think about what I wrote? :lamo

Facts dont care about your feelings, deflections and straw men. again nobody honest educated and objective is buying it. i knew reading all you failed post would be fun, thanks! Now back to facts and reality.

... You just tried to prove that a demonstrable fact isn't a demonstrable fact by stating your feelings about Alexandra Daddario. :lamo

Facts
#1 is factually wrong
#2-5 are opinions and not facts

if you or ANYBODY disagree by all means factually prove otherwise, post one fact that makes #3 more than opinion..... ONE . . . . . . thanks!

You blue screened again. Have you made any changes to your overclock settings in BIOS?

 

[AGENT J]

Re: Abortion is the deliberate killing of a live human

Well sure, but what did you think about what I wrote? :lamo



... You just tried to prove that a demonstrable fact isn't a demonstrable fact by stating your feelings about Alexandra Daddario. :lamo



You blue screened again. Have you made any changes to your overclock settings in BIOS?

See . . you still posted NOTHING but feelings, subjective opinions and views, lies and failed strawmen but ZERO facts. Im not the topic.
so here we are int he same spot

heres your statement

#3 is an establish and irrefutable fact, it's not an opinion.

since you FEEL thats true by all means you should be able to VERY EASILY post ONE single fact that makes more than just an opinion . . one is all we need . . please do so now, thanks!

 

[Peter King]

Re: Abortion is the deliberate killing of a live human

Let us put it firmly and realistically, the new fake argument of the pro-life and their supporters is:

Live human

As in "it is a live human and by aborting it you are murdering a human". Meant to magically give "live human" which is an new way of saying human being/baby/all the other pro-life crap we have been hearing, with the sole purpose of denying women, the actual live humans/persons/human beings, from what their right is.

This is just the newest fad in the pro-life movement, call it a human and then appeal to people that killing humans is a sin, wrong, immoral, criminal, murder and all the other BS fake arguments the pro-life movement makes so that they can rob women of the right to choose.

They have an obsession with other people's wombs (just like they have it with gays/lesbians/transgenders) and want to make sure that women loose right they now have, but when they are criticized or targeted they start whining freedom of religion/mean liberals/mean atheists. Because freedom of religion and others (like guns) is sacred but the rights of others well, if they don't like them rights they have to go, by hook or by crook.

The live-human argument is the next hook they use to deny women their rights under the constitution and the bill of rights. Why? Well they hate that women have rights.

Today the Netherlands choose to ban a US preacher from coming to the Netherlands and I applaud the Dutch government for doing it. We respect the laws in the Netherlands and if a priest, be it muslim/jewish or christian wants to come here to break out laws then hell no, get the hell out of my country.

 

[AGENT J]

Re: Abortion is the deliberate killing of a live human

Let us put it firmly and realistically, the new fake argument of the pro-life and their supporters is:

Live human

As in "it is a live human and by aborting it you are murdering a human". Meant to magically give "live human" which is an new way of saying human being/baby/all the other pro-life crap we have been hearing, with the sole purpose of denying women, the actual live humans/persons/human beings, from what their right is.

This is just the newest fad in the pro-life movement, call it a human and then appeal to people that killing humans is a sin, wrong, immoral, criminal, murder and all the other BS fake arguments the pro-life movement makes so that they can rob women of the right to choose.

They have an obsession with other people's wombs (just like they have it with gays/lesbians/transgenders) and want to make sure that women loose right they now have, but when they are criticized or targeted they start whining freedom of religion/mean liberals/mean atheists. Because freedom of religion and others (like guns) is sacred but the rights of others well, if they don't like them rights they have to go, by hook or by crook.

The live-human argument is the next hook they use to deny women their rights under the constitution and the bill of rights. Why? Well they hate that women have rights.

Today the Netherlands choose to ban a US preacher from coming to the Netherlands and I applaud the Dutch government for doing it. We respect the laws in the Netherlands and if a priest, be it muslim/jewish or christian wants to come here to break out laws then hell no, get the hell out of my country.

I wouldnt call it "new" its just recycled . . every time new people come to the board or new people fine themselves in some nutcase extremists website thats the info and lies they are feed . .

that is proven because then they come here or go somewhere else and the first thing they say is "i cant believe pro-choicers dont think its a alive or human etc etc" when mean while just about NOBODY thinks that

it never works because its simply a failed spoon fed talking point void of reality

and also just for the record its definitely not all prolifers .. many of them understand facts and logic etc. Its only extremists that come here with scripted lies that they think are true because thats what they were told.

 

[Oborosen]

Re: Abortion is the deliberate killing of a live human

The only people that legitimately believe this are racists and friends of racists.

Believing in what makes someone a racist?

The standard/basis of human life is completely subjective and relative to different individuals. Whether we would like to admit it or not, we find some lives more important than others, and some people we dehumanize consistently. I value the lives of my coworkers than I value the lives of the people we fight against. I hold more value in my dog than I do a fetus.

Then you're admitting that you have no position to decide such things as what is the value of life, or you're just pulling the same copout that I get from the left. Which is it?

 

[Lursa]

Re: Abortion is the deliberate killing of a live human

Then you're admitting that you have no position to decide such things as what is the value of life, or you're just pulling the same copout that I get from the left. Which is it?

That's an interesting statement. Who do you think is?