[W:1721] [W:2837] Post Conception Opt-Out FOR MEN

[MrNiceGuy]

Yes. They can and do.

They don't have an "opt out" -- there are circumstances in which they can give the child up for adoption, yes. So can fathers in applicable circumstances and adoption is controlled by strict requirements and is generally supervised by a Court.

 

[MrNiceGuy]

a link to what?
you dont know what safe haven laws are?

well they vary from state to state so here's a wiki link where you can see yourself and look them up if you like:

Safe-haven law - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

here's info from my own state

https://www.chp.edu/~/media/chp/about-us/documents/pennsylvania-safe-haven-law.ashx?la=en

Fathers can avail themselves of safe haven laws, too.

 

[Lursa]

I'm willing to accept this if you prove it. Do you have a link?

Men can also take infants/kids to Safe Havens in at least some states.

And the woman that's had the baby didnt opt-out of the consequences of a pregnancy...she still went thru the sacrifices to work and family, pain and suffering, possibly even permanent health harm.

 

[AGENT J]

Fathers can avail themselves of safe haven laws, too.

what?????
how do they do that without the mother?

 

[AGENT J]

Men can also take infants/kids to Safe Havens in at least some states.

only with the woman's permission consent agreeing etc

 

[AGENT J]

They don't have an "opt out" -

yes they factually do, this fact hs been proven over and over again

 

[vegas giants]

Men can also take infants/kids to Safe Havens in at least some states.

And the woman that's had the baby didnt opt-out of the consequences of a pregnancy...she still went thru the sacrifices to work and family, pain and suffering, possibly even permanent health harm.

Well if she takes a pill she might get a upset tummy. Lol

 

[lwf]

Dude, nobody is dying out there because the man did not pay a couple hundred dollars. That was my point. Just relax.

Correct. But if it comes down to either the father paying that couple hundred dollars, or the rest of us paying it, it should be the father's responsibility regardless of any "contract" he may have signed with the mother.

 

[lwf]

Well then it should be the someone that agreed to it IN WRITING preconception

What if she can't?

 

[vegas giants]

Correct. But if it comes down to either the father paying a couple hundred dollars, or the rest of us paying it, it should be the father's responsibility regardless of any "contract" he may have signed with the mother.

Or she could do the right thing and not have the child


But somehow the man is the bad guy

 

[vegas giants]

What if she can't?

Then the state.


AND BLAME HER. SHE TOOK ON THE RESPONSIBILITY OF HER OWN FREE WILL

 

[lwf]

If the woman is incapable of caring for the child why shouldn't she be forced to forfeit custody of the child to the father?

Sometimes she is. Sometimes the father is judged to be the better provider. But sometimes the mother is. In either case, the responsibility of supporting the child is on both of them before it should be on the state.

 

[FreeStorm84]

But somehow the man is the bad guy

If we think both the bio daddy and bio mommy should pay/care for the child than how do you conclude that we only think the bio daddy is bad?

 

[lwf]

Or she could do the right thing and not have the child

But somehow the man is the bad guy

The man isn't the bad guy. He is just responsible for children he creates along with the mother.

 

[vegas giants]

The man isn't the bad guy. He is just responsible for children he creates along with the mother.

Not if she agreed to take full responsibility

 

[AGENT J]

The man isn't the bad guy. He is just responsible for children he creates along with the mother.

but the mom has post birth opt-out option where she is factually not
the man does not and can be forced

 

[MrNiceGuy]

yes they factually do, this fact hs been proven over and over again

It's been proven that they can sign a piece of paper and "opt out" just like in the OP?

Or do you mean the false equivalence of the idea that some women (and men) can leave a child at a fire house as a safe haven, or that sometimes mothers and fathers can give a child up for adoption without the father's consent (after some strict requirements are met)?

 

[vegas giants]

If we think both the bio daddy and bio mommy should pay/care for the child than how do you conclude that we only think the bio daddy is bad?

I don't if she agreed to do it alone

 

[lwf]

Not if she agreed to take full responsibility

What if she can't?

 

[vegas giants]

What if she can't?

The state can raise the child. Clearly she is incompetent

 

[AGENT J]

It's been proven that they can sign a piece of paper and "opt out" just like in the OP?

its been proven that woman have post-birth opt-out options that she can do all on her own and the man can not.
disagree? factually prove otherwise . . . .

 

[lwf]

but the mom has post birth opt-out option where she is factually not
the man does not and can be forced

True. This is not fair. But it is not inequality. Her option is only a function of her unalienable right to bodily autonomy, which the man also has. It is biology that puts the unfair burden of pregnancy on the woman, and it is the right to bodily autonomy that gives her the right to take the fetus out of her body if she so chooses.

We don't need to give men extra rights that the woman does not have in order to compensate for biology. If you don't like that only women can be pregnant and therefore choose to have abortions, take it up with God, not the government,

 

[lwf]

The state can raise the child.

Why should I have to pay for it if the father is capable of doing so?

 

[vegas giants]

Why should I have to pay for it if the father is capable of doing so?

Because he gave up all parental rights preconception AND SHE AGREED TO IT


ESSENTIALY THERE IS NO FATHER

 

[AGENT J]

True. This is not fair. But it is not inequality.

by definition it is legal inequality

Her option is only a function of her unalienable right to bodily autonomy, which the man also has. It is biology that puts the unfair burden of pregnancy on the woman, and it is the right to bodily autonomy that gives her the right to take the fetus out of her body if she so chooses.

while i agree that biology puts a PHYSICAL burden on the woman none of that matters to the legal inequality, like the OP says biology is meaningless to this discussion of post birth opt-out options

We don't need to give men extra rights that the woman does not have in order to compensate for biology. I

one again biology is meaningless
they factually would NOT be receiving anything "extra" legally it would be equal and they would have the same options

if you don't like that only women can be pregnant and therefore choose to have abortions, take it up with God, not the government,

and more stuff that factually has nothing to do with the discussion
the take up IS with the government because they made the LEGAL inequality