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And if corporations are so bad, can you tell me what would happen say in the diamond industry, if corporations suddenly disappeared from the landscape?
An 'open, and free market' as you describe it, would have to ensure that the people are freed from socialism no?
Not at all... of course it depends what you think "socialism" is.
As in what aspect?
Sometimes. That's why I posted the information. That worked and at the time was probably the best solution. Authority was exerted and problem resolved. Circumstances vary. Think about how you are going to address Global Warming for your children's and grandchildren's sake. Paradoxical, don't you think?
Hey you are the one saying they have to be "freed from socialism".. so you have to define it.
Corporations weren't the problem, dictators, and socialist political elite classes that siphoned profit from the oil boom off the top, and kept the middle class, and poor to benefit from the economic boom that could generate through out the economy is the problem...That they refuse to address their currency supply problem, and think that governmental micro management of private industry through nationalization, and Socialistic top down control is the way forward, but instead it is a failure!
Not much of a difference between the power of large corporations and the dictators. And those and others are only interested in their own affairs.
I know that. I lived for 40 years under socialism. The authorities have always spoken about friendship and brotherhood between people, but the shelves of stores were empty and people were afraid to smile at each other.True, that's human nature. However, corporations are made up of people, whereas socialist dictatorships work in their own self interests, population be damned....when you have a corporation, they have to satisfy the market or see their profit dry up, and they go out of business.
I know that. I lived for 40 years under socialism. The authorities have always spoken about friendship and brotherhood between people, but the shelves of stores were empty and people were afraid to smile at each other.
I'm just afraid that socialism takes hold minds of the American people.I can't imagine...I have friends here that grew up in Romania under communism of the Soviets, and often tell stories of just how that was....I just have to wonder, with great people like you here that can tell exactly the path we are on, why some here choose to not listen, and lurch toward that hell anyway.
I'm just afraid that socialism takes hold minds of the American people.
It is so sweet nothing to think and would not respond.
Ok, that's rather broad, so in those terms, I guess I would say, state controlled redistribution of wealth, and abdication of property rights.
Hmm well "state controlled redistribution of wealth" includes paying police and military.
Does that mean that a progressive tax system is "socialist"?
How about a UHC system?
As for abdication of property rights.. yes that would be more communist than anything else, and would hinder any growth. But saying that, your "property rights" are screwed with in any type of system.. imminent domain I think it is called in the US... so claiming it is an exclusively "socialist" idea is a bit harsh to say the least.
No, unless you are talking about a "Federal Policing body" like the FBI, then local police are paid through local taxation. And the Military is Constitutional...I have no problem with that.
Absolutely!
"In 1848 Marx and Engels proposed that progressive taxation be used “to wrest, by degrees, all capital from the bourgeois, to centralize all instruments of production in the hands of the state.” Although communism has failed, the idea of progressive taxation, as a means of achieving “social justice,” remains ingrained in the modern liberal psyche."
Ending Tax Socialism | Cato Institute
Again, Hell yeah!
Not that you will actually listen to it. But here it is, as salient today as it was then...
Harsh? The notion that imminent domain was in this nation to only be used for constitutional purposes like the building of roads for example, and under, and only after "just compensation" for that property is limited in its use. The recent case of Kelo v New London broadened those powers of the government to take private property to redevelop, and increase tax revenue. This is a travesty...
"The Supreme Court's decision in Kelo v. City of New London, 545 U.S. 469 (2005) affirmed the authority of New London, Connecticut, to take non-blighted private property by eminent domain, and then transfer it for a dollar a year to a private developer solely for the purpose of increasing municipal revenues."
Eminent domain - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
This is socialism.
A simple question for our family here at DP....
With progressive liberals often taking this kind of hyperbolic line against Corporations, and business in general, are we to see this type of open attack against business? I think that some in America believe in this sort of thing, and would love to see this....
Your thoughts?
This is Venezuela, not the US.
Then pretty much every country on the planet is socialist and that pretty much ends the discussion does it not?
So there is only 1 non socialist country in the western world then..
So when the Americans stole Indian land wholesale.. then that was socialism too?
To different degrees, this is happening right here in the US.
To some degree yes. This is the 80 year slide, or 100 year slide if you count when the 'pregressive taxation system' was adopted. Which is why we must recognize, and re affirm the Constitution as the law, and not some "living, breathing" mash of what ever some cynical politician says it is.
Like I said, to varying degrees, yes. It is that progressive tide we must reverse, and become the shinning beacon again.
Separate issue. But no, that was expansion...
Which is irrelevant in a thread about Venezuela.
So you are saying that 80-100 years ago that the average American was better off than he or she is today?
Shinning beacon for what? Genocide, slavery, sexism and racism? ...
LOL yea right. It was conquest and genocide.
Maybe you missed, or ignored this part of my opening post....
"I think that some in America believe in this sort of thing, and would love to see this...."
this is a thread about how some in America embrace the socialism of a Venezuela, and want to see it here.
Better off? That is a subjective term I don't think I used...Define "better off"
Oh boy....There's that Anti Americanism we so love about you Europeans...
How you can be so judgmental, when you have a far longer history of crime against humanity, the hypocrisy is almost too much to bear without laughing out loud...
And they are in such a minority that they can barely be counted let alone actually carry out the idea. If you seriously think that the mainstream left wing wants to enforce price controls and worse across the board.. dream on. In fact it is more than often the right wing and their corporate backers that want to control the markets... Tesla and the car dealerships for example. Or banning importation of pharma.... the list goes on and on. You allow the creation of defacto corporate monopolies in geographical areas and that pushes up prices and services down.
While I in no way support what they are doing in Venezuela (but understand why), I also can clearly see that in the US it is the right wing and corporations that want to stifle the free market more than opening it up... which is the ironic part.
You said that "re affirm the Constitution as the law" which must mean you want to go back in time, where women were not allowed to vote, blacks were 3/4s of citizen or whatever it was and so on. The changes you are advocating or seem to advocate, would push the US back into the 1800s, pushing 100s of millions into poverty overnight. No SS, no health insurance, no emergency rooms.. and you only get protection if you pay for it or have massive guns. Is that the kind of country you want?
Has nothing to do with anti Americanism, it is a fact. The American "expansion" was conquest and genocide... and the American people have denied this forever. But let me throw you a bone... the Europeans started it, and admit it!
We dont deny our past transgressions.. well most of us. That is the difference.
We are also not judgemental unless being accused of things that the accuser has done as well or worse. It is calling out a hypocrite, and when it comes to the American right wing.. that is almost 24 hour job.
That is pure leftist, collectivist pap. To deny that price controls have not been tried in the US as a means of misguided political application is to deny that Jimmy Carter was President. It caused massive self imposed shortage, and misery.
Your rail against 'corporations' as you type away on a corporate manufactured, and marketed product, that without these 'evil' corporations would not even be affordable to you, is to truly bite the hand that feeds you. Remember this gem?
Your mis characterizations of what someone like me 'wants' is only fueled by the platitudinous, cartoonish silliness of the far left pablum that has been successfully spoon fed to you, and you lap up.
And we admit our wrongs as well, hell, in fact we teach them in primary education. We deny nothing.
But that is not good enough for the Euro hypocrite that continues to beat America over the head, as they hold out their hand for help.
Oh please....:roll: Europeans would do better to address their own substantial problems with poverty, immigration, socialism, and out of control spending before they have one word to say in chastisement of a country that they all too often ask for help in solving their problems.
A simple question for our family here at DP....
With progressive liberals often taking this kind of hyperbolic line against Corporations, and business in general, are we to see this type of open attack against business? I think that some in America believe in this sort of thing, and would love to see this....
Your thoughts?
Oh yeah, no doubt...How do you think the anti corporatism folks in here think about this...I mean there is a strong support for this type of thing right here in America...Everything from anti Walmart, oil companies, banks, to health insurance....This is what some of our progressive posting family right here think is the solution.
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