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Vatican orders US bishops to delay taking action on sexual abuse crisis

Xelor

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Have any of the rest of you, with your friends and associates in Western Europe's Catholic countries, discussed the matter of Catholic priests messing with kids?

Ages ago when the big Boston brouhaha came about, I brought it up with friends in Switzerland and France. I got essentially the same feedback from all of them:
Americans are so naive, and then when your naivete bites you in the ass, you go looking for someone else to blame.

Europeans have for centuries known priests are more likely than anyone else to mess with teeangers, boys or girls, depending on whether they're gay because all that "cloistering" and whatnot makes for a lot of "blue balls," so when they see an opportunity that seems rather low risk re: discovery, they'll go for it.

Common sense would tell anyone that canonical vows or not, 17-45 year-old males want sex, and the older the guy, the more appealing be young partners. It's that way with straight and gay guys. Why the hell do you think women are so obsessed with looking young and men aren't? Because men of all ages want nubile, or at least seemingly so, sex partners.

Consequently, folks use common sense and just don't for extended periods leave their kids unaccompanied and sequestered with priests. For example, if your kid is an alter boy, fine, you get him to the church a few minutes before mass and if he's not returned from the sacristy within five minutes after mass, you're on your way in there to retrieve him.

According to my friends, the above described approach people in their communities have used has worked for ages. No, it's not 100% perfect, but it's close enough that they aren't having the sorts of conniptions Americans are. To wit, in Germany there are some ~3700 reported sexual abuse cases that happened between the 1940s and 2014 (~55/year). That seems like a lot (to be sure one is too many, but that's not the point here) but when one considers there are tens of thousands of Catholic priests and some 23M+ Catholics in Germany, the matter is far, far more "sensational" than it is frequent.

Frankly, though the priests' acts are reprehensible, I cannot help but think a material share of the hoopla about the matter stems from the fact and incidences of decades of abuse having come to light much like an earthquake or dam breaking, whereafter, in typical American fashion, there was a lot of outcry and "Oh, my God! I would never have thought a/my priest would have done that." To that, my European friends would say, "Well, that's just it. You didn't think. A cassock and surplice doesn't make a man any less horny, yet you acted as though it does."

Lest some readers misconstrue the above:
  • I am not condoning or absolving the priests or their comportment.
  • I am ridiculing folks for making such a big deal about something they should have been savvy to and circumspect about from the get go.
 

Hawkeye10

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Sounds like the Americans did not conduct the proper political work with Rome, which would make this their fault not Romes.
 

Rexedgar

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What’s the rush? Clergy, not just Catholic, have been abusing their position/power for centuries, what’s a few more months/years?
/sarcasm....
 

bongsaway

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Wonderful, the police will eventually get around to policing themselves. Eventually. Blah, blah, blah, let's hold up on this vote, we don't want to rush into things.
 

Grand Mal

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I knew that. What I didn't know was that you were aware of that fact as well.

It's not a secret, but now and then an article from 'the Onion' is posted here as news or commentary.
 

Tim the plumber

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I'd like to see the Catholic Church in the US prosecuted under the RICO statues as a criminal enterprise.

Yes, existing laws used as they are currently worded would destroy all religious organizations.
 

Lisa

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Yes, existing laws used as they are currently worded would destroy all religious organizations.

It would be a great day when churches would be used as bars, public schools, museums, libraries, and homeless shelters. They would finally have a socially acceptable purpose.
Organized theistic religion is a wart on society and it's about as beneficial as tastebuds on a hemorrhoid.
 

EMNofSeattle

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It would be a great day when churches would be used as bars, public schools, museums, libraries, and homeless shelters. They would finally have a socially acceptable purpose.
Organized theistic religion is a wart on society and it's about as beneficial as tastebuds on a hemorrhoid.

organized theistic religion is what built western society. There would be no North (or South) America or Western Europe as we conceive of without the Christian religion. Christianity is what produced our legal system, universities, hospitals, and virtually the entire foundation of science as we know it. To say otherwise makes you ignorant.
 

Lisa

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organized theistic religion is what built western society. There would be no North (or South) America or Western Europe as we conceive of without the Christian religion. Christianity is what produced our legal system, universities, hospitals, and virtually the entire foundation of science as we know it. To say otherwise makes you ignorant.
The Christian church consolidated its political power and knowledge after the fall of the Roman empire and that is what caused the dark ages for the next millennium.

The Abrahamic religions have held back the human race and were the source of the dark ages where the Christian church held the political power. The Renaissance happened because the power of the Christian church was controlled. Educated logical people are not in the best interests of the theistic religion because they can think logically and see through the propaganda that their religion is based on. The most religious areas of the world are also the poorest, sickest and most violent. Why do you think that the Christian churches have abandoned western Europe and most of North America and instead is focusing their missionary efforts on 3rd world countries where the people aren't educated?
 

EMNofSeattle

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The Christian church consolidated its political power and knowledge after the fall of the Roman empire and that is what caused the dark ages for the next millennium.


Except the dark ages are a lie. The Dark ages saw the beginning of hospitals as we know them, the beginning of universities, the beginning of general education, etc.

The social problems from the dark ages were caused due to the collapse of the Roman empire and extended by the black death. The level of control by the Church had nothing to do with it, in fact if the Church hadn't existed we'd have lost virtually all of the written knowledge of the Roman empire and probably would not have even begun industrializing until the 20th century.


The Abrahamic religions have held back the human race and were the source of the dark ages where the Christian church held the political power.

False
The Renaissance happened because the power of the Christian church was controlled.
also false, the renaissance as a historical era was driven by the increase in stability in Western Europe, in part because of the end of the plaque, the end of the advance of muslim civilization, and re-urbanization
Educated logical people are not in the best interests of the theistic religion because they can think logically and see through the propaganda that their religion is based on.
This is also false, the Catholic Church invested heavily in general education throughout the middle ages and virtually all top colleges in the US and Western Europe were founded as Seminaries.
The most religious areas of the world are also the poorest, sickest and most violent.
What does that prove? It doesn't change that some secular states in Western Europe are Christianity based societies.
Why do you think that the Christian churches have abandoned western Europe and most of North America and instead is focusing their missionary efforts on 3rd world countries where the people aren't educated?

My Church has not in fact abandoned North America or Europe. The greatest number of unbelievers are in Africa and so we've focused large missionary efforts there. And to that end Catholic missionary efforts have always come with massive programs for education of the population. in many parts of Africa virtually all literate people were educated by the Church. In fact the Catholic church has traditionally been the number one supporter of science and education in the world.
 

Grand Mal

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It would be a great day when churches would be used as bars, public schools, museums, libraries, and homeless shelters. They would finally have a socially acceptable purpose.
Organized theistic religion is a wart on society and it's about as beneficial as tastebuds on a hemorrhoid.

If it was in your power, would you take religion out of the lives of everyone in the world?
 

Lisa

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If it was in your power, would you take religion out of the lives of everyone in the world?

No, I would not. I would require the teaching of logic as a part of graduation because I don't support authoritarian governments. I'd rather give people the tools to think critically on their own than to either force or prohibit any idea(s).
 

Grand Mal

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No, I would not. I would require the teaching of logic as a part of graduation because I don't support authoritarian governments. I'd rather give people the tools to think critically on their own than to either force or prohibit any idea(s).

Can't argue with that. But there's a lot of people in the world who secular life offers absolutely nothing in terms of consolation for their poor existance. Religion, if it's Theravada Buddhism in Laos or Hinduism in Sri Lanka or Catholicism in Peru is literally what it claims to be, hope and salvation.
 
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