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US vs Russia

Do you want the US to directly intervene in Ukraine even if it leads to a nuclear conflict?

  • Total voters
    26
reinaert said:
Are you hinting that it should be okay to roll the nuclear dice and risk the only place we're sure intelligent life (crows, elephants, dogs, that one owl who stole my lunch, otters...) exists?
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At first I was against it.
Now that he is attacking women and children and shooting up nuclear power plants I have changed my mind

Putin is a wealthy man. He lives a fabulous lifestyle. He has a lot to live for. I don't think he is suicidal.

We have been fighting the Russians in small countries around the world my entire lifetime. That didn't bring about nuclear war. Why should Ukraine.
 
Lloyd Christmas said:
Even if conflict, why does it automatically lead to nuclear conflict? It would be moronic for either side to destroy the world by launching any
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When it comes to a direct confrontation between two nuclear powers the potential for nuclear use is there. When India and Pakistan have had wars after becoming nuclear powers the world was fearful of nukes being used. Imagine you are Pakistan and India is crushing your conventional military and you fear India is going to take much of your country, do you let that happen or do you nuke India in a last ditch attempt to stop that or at least hurt India very badly before your country is destroyed.

A direct war between NATO and Russia over Ukraine would not likely just stay in Ukraine. Military bases would be hit in Europe and Russia. Russia might try to hit bases in the US, but I am not sure of their capacity to do so beyond icbms. It would likely move to a wider war and potentially a war to take Russia out. I doubt Putin or Russians in general want another European military invading, and in that situation given the weakness of the Russian military they would use nukes on the invading military forces, tactical nuclear weapons and likely when they are just outside of Russian territory. If the US just put lost 50 000 soldiers and military aircraft to tactical nuclear weapons, do you not think it would respond with nukes of their own?

There is a reason no direct military confrontations between nuclear powers ( India and Pakistan the current exceptions) have occurred and that proxy wars have been the norm
 

Sadly, there is much truth in your comment. Let's never forget how Walter Duranty of the NYT spent his time in Russia covering up Holodomor, along with collogues.
 
But you're wagering those children's lives too, no?
 

"We fight small wars so we don't have to fight big ones" Harry Truman.
 
Europe would be laid to waste. Actually, not metaphorically. Given that fact, what European govts have come together to do, and with popular support, is already pretty damned extraordinary.
 

Which makes the use of nukes on his side higher not lower if a direct military confrontation occurs.

There is a near zero chance any direct confrontation would be limited to Ukraine. When it goes beyond Ukraine the chance for nukes being used jumps drastically. It would not be right away, but when a large nato force is amassed at the Ukraine/Russian border. Nukes will fly then
 

Could be even Putin would come to the negotiation table then.

Nobody in the world ever wants to see nuclear weapons used. It would be the end of civilization as we know it.

Why would Putin want to end it all that way any more than we do?
 
I would support engaging in war with Russia for the same reason I was in support of fighting Iraq.

A government and their army is murdering civilians. It is cowardess to sit back and watch someone bigger, and stronger beat on someone smaller. I don't fear Russia. I would be happy to fight, to have my children fight, to put an end to countries invading and murdering innocent people for no reason. My opinion is the world should put an end to this by any means necessary and if Russia wants to play the nuke game, we erase them. They've brought it upon themselves, Ukraine didn't.

Beyond that - taking over Ukraine makes Russia stronger. How strong do we let them get before we stop them? It isn't going to get easier than right now.
 
rickc said:
Do you believe Putin is?
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I'm not calling for WW3 as if it's something that can be won.
The UK would cease to exist entirely in WW3 being a small Island with lots of viable targets.
 

Now would you expect anything different from China?

BEIJING — As Russia wreaks havoc in Ukraine, Moscow has a powerful economic ally to help it resist Western sanctions: China.

Chinese purchases of oil from Russia in December surpassed its purchases from Saudi Arabia. Six days before the military campaign began, Russia announced a yearslong deal to sell 100 million tons of coal to China — a contract worth more than $20 billion. And hours before Russia began bombing Ukraine, China agreed to buy Russian wheat despite concerns about plant diseases.
In a throwback to the 1950s, when Mao Zedong worked closely with Joseph Stalin and then Nikita Khrushchev, Chinah is again drawing close to Russia. As the United States and the European Union have become wary of China, Beijing’s leaders have decided that their best geopolitical prospects lie in marrying their vast industrial might with Russia’s formidable natural resources.
Recent food and energy deals are just the latest signals of China’s economic alignment with Russia.
“What happened up to now is only a beginning for both the Russian expansionism by force and the Chinese economic and financial support to Russia,” Shi Yinhong, a professor of international relations at Renmin University in Beijing, said in a text message. “This does not mean that China directly supports in any degree that expansionism — this only means that Beijing strongly feels the necessity to maintain and boost strategic partnership with Moscow.”
 


Yes!

Profit from being "the Switzerland"
between The West and Russia.



Moi
Ukraine is Rus-land




​
 
Better alternatives.

The West has to show the war criminal that he has gone too far.

The West did nothing when the war criminal stole Crimea.

The West did nothing when the war criminal let rebels shoot down that Dutch plane, with dead bodies (including a baby's) falling from the sky!

If the war criminal had "only" annexed some rebel areas in the east of Ukraine, then -- as President Biden accidentally admitted -- the West would have let that "minor" move pass, too.

But the war criminal has gone too far. He wants to gobble up a whole country!

So the West must make him cry "Uncle!"

STOP buying Russian oil. (Let China buy it!)

Yes, make the Russian people suffer so much that they "retire" him to a nice dacha.

Nuclear war?

If he gives the order, chances are that he will be disobeyed.

Those "supporters" of his want to live, not die.
 
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