US suicides hit an all-time high last year; a main driver is the growing availability of guns

[Rich2018]

The infrastructure required will be massive. But, I am sure you knew that. Typically the law and order diatribes are vocalized by those who dislike paying taxes more than they dislike crime.

But it would reduce the number of gun owners.

 

[Paradoxical]

The infrastructure required will be massive. But, I am sure you knew that. Typically the law and order diatribes are vocalized by those who dislike paying taxes more than they dislike crime.

When you don't punish crime, you just invite more crime. Hence, store robberies, looting, car hijackings, muggings, and murder with guns since we have Marxist DAs installed by Soros who don't want any extra time in jail when a gun is used in a crime.

So much for the left claiming they are anti-gun, eh?

 

[poppopfox]

When you don't punish crime,

Let me stop you right there. According to the latest available data at the World Prison Brief on May 7, 2023, the United States has the sixth highest incarceration rate in the world, at 531 people per 100,000. While the United States represents about 4.2 percent of the world's population,[5] it houses around 20 percent of the world's prisoners.[6] (Wiki)

When you lead with a false premise the rest of the argument may be discarded.

 

[RF667799]

Let me stop you right there. According to the latest available data at the World Prison Brief on May 7, 2023, the United States has the sixth highest incarceration rate in the world, at 531 people per 100,000. While the United States represents about 4.2 percent of the world's population,[5] it houses around 20 percent of the world's prisoners.[6] (Wiki)

When you lead with a false premise the rest of the argument may be discarded.

How many of those incarcerated are on the revolving door plan?

 

[Spock]

When you don't punish crime, you just invite more crime. Hence, store robberies, looting, car hijackings, muggings, and murder with guns since we have Marxist DAs installed by Soros who don't want any extra time in jail when a gun is used in a crime.

So much for the left claiming they are anti-gun, eh?

Are you under the misimpression that the exclusive reason why crimes do NOT occur is because there are penalties?

If so, that is quite wrong. Law and order in a community exists primarily because there is a mutual willingness by members of the society to follow the rules. Unwillingness to follow the rules is not proportional to the criminal sanctions. No one steals a car because the penalty is just 10 years rather than 20 years.
While a few people might do the calculation of "what is the risk vs benefit of taking this item, hurting this person, or committing this XYZ crime", most people do not. There is no level of police presence or criminal sanction that will prevent all crime. Crime is largely prevented by reducing the opportunity rather than by increasing the punishment.

 

[Rich2018]

Are you under the misimpression that the exclusive reason why crimes do NOT occur is because there are penalties?

If so, that is quite wrong. Law and order in a community exists primarily because there is a mutual willingness by members of the society to follow the rules. Unwillingness to follow the rules is not proportional to the criminal sanctions. No one steals a car because the penalty is just 10 years rather than 20 years.
While a few people might do the calculation of "what is the risk vs benefit of taking this item, hurting this person, or committing this XYZ crime", most people do not. There is no level of police presence or criminal sanction that will prevent all crime. Crime is largely prevented by reducing the opportunity rather than by increasing the punishment.

I think there is some merit to this point. You can see a lot of videos on you tube showing the surprise and horror of defendants when they are sentenced
I think that the punishment for many crimes is too abstract in the minds of would be criminals
We do many released convicts re-offend ? Clearly the punishment offers inadequate deterrence.

 

[RF667799]

Are you under the misimpression that the exclusive reason why crimes do NOT occur is because there are penalties?

If so, that is quite wrong. Law and order in a community exists primarily because there is a mutual willingness by members of the society to follow the rules. Unwillingness to follow the rules is not proportional to the criminal sanctions. No one steals a car because the penalty is just 10 years rather than 20 years.
While a few people might do the calculation of "what is the risk vs benefit of taking this item, hurting this person, or committing this XYZ crime", most people do not. There is no level of police presence or criminal sanction that will prevent all crime. Crime is largely prevented by reducing the opportunity rather than by increasing the punishment.

Seems incarceration would limit the opportunity to some extent.....



What's your scheme? House arrest for everyone? Because the way I see it, there are hundreds of opportunities to commit crimes just taking a trip to the store.

 

[Rich2018]

When you don't punish crime, you just invite more crime.

Like issuing pardons to Trump ?

Hence, store robberies, looting, car hijackings, muggings, and murder with guns since we have Marxist DAs installed by Soros who don't want any extra time in jail when a gun is used in a crime.

So much for the left claiming they are anti-gun, eh?

The left is, generally, anti-gun

Why are you pro-gun ?

 

[RF667799]

Like issuing pardons to Trump ?



The left is, generally, anti-gun

Why are you pro-gun ?

Thread is not about Trump.

Suicide shouldn't be a partisan issue. The anti-gun zealots like to try to make it a partisan issue.

 

[Rich2018]

When you lead with a false premise the rest of the argument may be discarded.

Or a straw-man argument.

 

[RF667799]

Or a straw-man argument.

Where's the strawman argument?

 

[Paradoxical]

Are you under the misimpression that the exclusive reason why crimes do NOT occur is because there are penalties?

If so, that is quite wrong. Law and order in a community exists primarily because there is a mutual willingness by members of the society to follow the rules. Unwillingness to follow the rules is not proportional to the criminal sanctions. No one steals a car because the penalty is just 10 years rather than 20 years.
While a few people might do the calculation of "what is the risk vs benefit of taking this item, hurting this person, or committing this XYZ crime", most people do not. There is no level of police presence or criminal sanction that will prevent all crime. Crime is largely prevented by reducing the opportunity rather than by increasing the punishment.

While the criminal is in jail he cannot commit crimes.

 

[Paradoxical]

Like issuing pardons to Trump ?



The left is, generally, anti-gun

Why are you pro-gun ?

Where do you get I am a leftist?

 

[Rich2018]

Where do you get I am a leftist?

Did I say you were ?

 

[Spock]

While the criminal is in jail he cannot commit crimes.

The best way to prevent crime is to incarcerate the entire population of a society. You must favor the North Korean model.

 

[RF667799]

The best way to prevent crime is to incarcerate the entire population of a society. You must favor the North Korean model.

How else are you going to comprehensively deny opportunity to commit crimes? Remember this was your "thought" on the matter.

 

[Daddyo]

You claim to concealed carry and have been ranting about all the justifications. It should be obvious that you are apprehensive.

One of us rants endlessly about how scared they are over all the guns in this country while the other explains personal experiences that caused him to make the decision to carry. One is scared the other prepared. And friend a banana is not being prepared lol.

 

[Daddyo]

I'm not surprised that someone oblivious to the risks of firearms would also be clueless about the risks to OTHERS by unvaccinated libertarians.

Risk to others? Seriously? Was he a risk to others when he worked and there was no vaccine?

And here is a question for you. If the vaccine is so ****ing good and you have no problem taking it, then just take it and you are protected. Now there is little risk from the unvaccinated. Ever stop to think that those they claimed were at risk could simply get the vaccine themselves and problem is solved? Didn’t think so. Face it you got played like a fiddle. They needed fear and you gave them fear.

Over 50 percent of demonrats agreed with jailing the unvaccinated. That would have caused a serious problem within the country. It does go to show how quickly government can become tyrannical.

 

[Daddyo]

Why step off the edge. . You got a gun in your home. Besides, you may live in a one story home

One step vs one trigger pull was the point.

Some don’t have a gun and some don’t have heights. The point doesn’t change though does it? Both are easy and final once the step is taken or trigger pulled.

 

[Paradoxical]

The best way to prevent crime is to incarcerate the entire population of a society. You must favor the North Korean model.

Just the criminals. Not the ones who are attacked.

 

[Paradoxical]

Where do you get I am a leftist?

You asked why I am pro gun.

 

[Spock]

One of us rants endlessly about how scared they are over all the guns in this country while the other explains personal experiences that caused him to make the decision to carry. One is scared the other prepared. And friend a banana is not being prepared lol.

My concern about firearms is based in fact. Your concerns are your paranoia and an expectation of a crimeless totalitarian society.

Concerning the banana, you would shoot or assault someone for stealing food??

 

[Spock]

Risk to others? Seriously? Was he a risk to others when he worked and there was no vaccine?

And here is a question for you. If the vaccine is so ****ing good and you have no problem taking it, then just take it and you are protected. Now there is little risk from the unvaccinated. Ever stop to think that those they claimed were at risk could simply get the vaccine themselves and problem is solved? Didn’t think so. Face it you got played like a fiddle. They needed fear and you gave them fear.

Over 50 percent of demonrats agreed with jailing the unvaccinated. That would have caused a serious problem within the country. It does go to show how quickly government can become tyrannical.

You do not seem to process difficult subjects well and seem determined for forego learning for regurgitation of RW propaganda.

 

[RF667799]

My concern about firearms is based in fact. Your concerns are your paranoia and an expectation of a crimeless totalitarian society.

Concerning the banana, you would shoot or assault someone for stealing food??

If it was my last food and my kids were hungry?

 

[RF667799]

You do not seem to process difficult subjects well and seem determined for forego learning for regurgitation of RW propaganda.

You seem to resort to throwing mud when you are out of ammo.