Us provokes Iraq civil war, surge is for another war

[kathaksung]

Us provokes Iraq civil war, surge is for another war

The real people behind the insurgence are US and Israel intelligence and Pentagon. They try to provoke a civil war in Iraq. The purpose is to let Iraqis to kill Iraqis, so US Army can stay in Iraq until next war: Iran's or Syria's.

Will a peaceful Iraq needs US occupation troop any more? No, US will have no excuse to stay.

How can US troops stay in Iraq? When there is riot, car bombing, death squad killing, civil war.

Well, the terrorist is there, withdraw troops is cut and run, Bush says. So Bush can have US troops stay in Mid-east until the next war - a war on Iran or Syria. The new war needs more troops, so Bush demand a surge.
That's why we saw Al Qaida (a special force to act on behalf of US intelligence) launched attack at Shiite shrine to start the conflict between Sunni and Shiite. We already know the 911 attack was in the name of Al Qaida which gave Bush the justification to start the war in Mid-east - war on Afghanistan and Iraq.

The US and Israel intelligence controlled death squad of Iraqis government which is used to kill Sunni people. On the other hand they controlled insurgence and Al Qaida to kill Shiite civilians by car bombing. That is how they create a civil war in Iraq.

 

[Simon W. Moon]

It seems decidedly more expensive and thus less efficient to keep our troops in rotation this whole time.
If thats the plan, it's a piss-poor one.

 

[Lerxst]

Very poor logic here. Bush doesn't have enough time left in his administration to make a plan like that even remotely possible. We don't have the manpower on hand, surge or not, to both occupy Iraq and fight a ground war in Iran or Syria. Further, we don't need a civil war to protract our time there. If it ended tonight we would be there for at least two to three more years, even with Dems at the helm. We can deal with Iran or Syria via massive aerial campaign. We can't occupy another nation, it's just not possible. Therefore an aerial and naval strike campaign would be the plan of choice. We could very easily cripple their infrastructure and never need to place a single troop on enemy ground.

 

[bhkad]

Us provokes Iraq civil war, surge is for another war

The real people behind the insurgence are US and Israel intelligence and Pentagon. They try to provoke a civil war in Iraq. The purpose is to let Iraqis to kill Iraqis, so US Army can stay in Iraq until next war: Iran's or Syria's.

Will a peaceful Iraq needs US occupation troop any more? No, US will have no excuse to stay.

How can US troops stay in Iraq? When there is riot, car bombing, death squad killing, civil war.

Well, the terrorist is there, withdraw troops is cut and run, Bush says. So Bush can have US troops stay in Mid-east until the next war - a war on Iran or Syria. The new war needs more troops, so Bush demand a surge.
That's why we saw Al Qaida (a special force to act on behalf of US intelligence) launched attack at Shiite shrine to start the conflict between Sunni and Shiite. We already know the 911 attack was in the name of Al Qaida which gave Bush the justification to start the war in Mid-east - war on Afghanistan and Iraq.

The US and Israel intelligence controlled death squad of Iraqis government which is used to kill Sunni people. On the other hand they controlled insurgence and Al Qaida to kill Shiite civilians by car bombing. That is how they create a civil war in Iraq.

 

[Gladiator]

Financing Al Qaida in Iraq:

Money is contributed outside Iraq for al Qaida operations inside Iraq.

Al-Qaeda 'financier' arrested in Iraq - Financial Times - MSNBC.com

 

[winston53660]

Financing Al Qaida in Iraq:

Money is contributed outside Iraq for al Qaida operations inside Iraq.

Al-Qaeda 'financier' arrested in Iraq - Financial Times - MSNBC.com

AQ is a world wide org.

 

[mikhail]

Well the US army precence in Germany hasnt worked to provoke a civil war has it.There doesent have to be any problems with having army bases in other countries.The insurgence are trying to bring about a civil war.

 

[Gladiator]

Different actions provoke different people with differing religious and social customs. Here again, WWII is getting confused with Vietnam, Afghanistan and Iraq. Also, Germany started the WWII.

Is there any doubt that Bush wants Iran? Bush just has not provoked enough reaction to justify his attack. Lord knows he is lying awake nights trying.


.

 

[mikhail]

Different actions provoke different people with differing religious and social customs. Here again, WWII is getting confused with Vietnam, Afghanistan and Iraq. Also, Germany started the WWII.

Is there any doubt that Bush wants Iran? Bush just has not provoked enough reaction to justify his attack. Lord knows he is lying awake nights trying.


.

Your suggesting the idea of irreconcilable civilisations i must warn you people have said that about many different people with "differing religious and social customs"and they have always been wrong.

 

[Gladiator]

Dear Mik Hail,

Islamic countries are more sensitive about occupation by a foreign power and more sensitive about having their doors broken down to their houses.

Irreconsilable is your word. The US is famous for blundering and being insensitive to other cultures.

The point made by kathaksung is that Bush is being deliberately provocative to keep conflict going, to justify a US troop presence in Iraq. Rumsfeld said the insurgency in Iraq was like a bowl of fruit. To me, Rumsfeld meant that the violence in Iraq served the interests of the Neocons.



.

 

[Gladiator]

Winning in Iraq to the Neocons, is actualy a stalemate in Chess. Winning to Neocons is being able to keep finding justifications to keep Western Troops in Iraq and Afghanistan.

Winning, in the ordinary sense of the word, is capturing the King, (as in Chess) or defeating the enemy. Creating a more amenable frame of mind in the enemy.

To Liberals and average people, Winning means withdrawing the troops because the objectives have been won. To Neocons, Winning means finding excuses to keep the troops deployed, and in at least some minimal conflict.

Similarly, the Islamic Militants consider it Winning, if the Western Powers insult the Islamic people, because that creates more students in the Madrass Schools, and more Recruits for the Islamic Militant movements.

.

 

[Monk-Eye]

Peace At Any Cost Is Surrender

"Peace At Any Cost Is Surrender"

Winning in Iraq to the Neocons, is actualy a stalemate in Chess. Winning to Neocons is being able to keep finding justifications to keep Western Troops in Iraq and Afghanistan.

Ridiculous.

Those concerned with stopping the dysfunctional spread of arab hegemony, as islamofascism and cultural brain washing, via a proactive approach, don't undercut the mindset and the means to do so.

The expectations of instant gratification are pathetic.

Winning, in the ordinary sense of the word, is capturing the King, (as in Chess) or defeating the enemy. Creating a more amenable frame of mind in the enemy.
To Liberals and average people, Winning means withdrawing the troops because the objectives have been won. To Neocons, Winning means finding excuses to keep the troops deployed, and in at least some minimal conflict.

Iraq is militarily defensible as a base of operations in support of the non-arab afghanistan and pakistan targets.

Please, obtain, keep, and share the overall focus.

 

[Gladiator]

Why are the Neocons allowing General Patraeus to actually begin partnering with the moderates in Iraq? Perhaps there was too much of an objection from the American People about the WWII cowboy style antagonism of the people in Iraq. Perhaps the Neocons estimate that the instilled level of insurgence in Iraq is sufficient that even good insurgent tactics implimented lately, will not be enough to overcome the embitterment of past insults and collateral damage.

"stopping the dysfunctional spread of arab hegemony, as islamofascism"

This is partly a Western Creation by Israel expaning settlements in non-clearly legal manner. The violence by Palestinians and other agasint Israel can be tracked by the expansion of Israeli settlements. US Secy State Rice is recently waking up to the incendiary nature of the Israeli-Palestinian conflict.

http://www.firstpr.com.au/nations/

Palestine Monitor Factsheet - Israeli settlements

MERIP Op-Eds: Israeli Settlements Illegal and Getting Worse, by Stephanie Koury

http://www.chicagopeacenow.org/MF_issue6_9-5-04.pdf


It is probably good for hte Neocons if the Military actually believes that the problem is entirely the fault of the Moslem extremists, so the US Military will continue to act disrespectfully to Islamic traditions, to further antagonize the Moslems, which will continue the conflict in Iraq, justifying the continued deployment of Western troops.



.

 

[Monk-Eye]

Amnesia Puppets

"Amnesia Puppets"

Why are the Neocons allowing General Patraeus to actually begin partnering with the moderates in Iraq? Perhaps there was too much of an objection from the American People about the WWII cowboy style antagonism of the people in Iraq. Perhaps the Neocons estimate that the instilled level of insurgence in Iraq is sufficient that even good insurgent tactics implimented lately, will not be enough to overcome the embitterment of past insults and collateral damage.

The US military functions to create an iraqi military loyal to its democratic government.
Social systems of government are additional measures.

"stopping the dysfunctional spread of arab hegemony, as islamofascism"
This is partly a Western Creation by Israel expaning settlements in non-clearly legal manner. The violence by Palestinians and other agasint Israel can be tracked by the expansion of Israeli settlements. US Secy State Rice is recently waking up to the incendiary nature of the Israeli-Palestinian conflict.

Arabs recognize the torah and the land of canaan decreed to israel, not ishmael, by their supposed patriarch and god.
If the the jews cannot establish the state of israel, then islam and judaism become illegitimate, and their god is dead - a myth.
So keep pushing palestine - fool.

Islam is arab culture and it should not be practiced by non-arabs.
That includes, iran, iraq, syria, turkey, lebanon, africa, egypt, malaysia, india, china, russia, europe, america, and any other land outside of arabia.

Israel did not state that it was the ideal practices of all peoples, israel intelligently bounded its traditions to specific land.

It is the arrogance of arabian empirialism, its hegemony perpetrated by conjecture to be ideal cultural practices for all people, and unbounded by territory which is to blame.
It is the root cause of the ignorant failure to acknowledge the authority and directives of their supposed patriarch.
And non-arabs are fighting ancestral dissent on behalf of arabs, of which non-arabs share no part except through delusion of arab cultural superiority.

It is probably good for hte Neocons if the Military actually believes that the problem is entirely the fault of the Moslem extremists, so the US Military will continue to act disrespectfully to Islamic traditions, to further antagonize the Moslems, which will continue the conflict in Iraq, justifying the continued deployment of Western troops..

Arabs had their day ripping the genius from other cultures and supplanting it with dysfunctional, antiquated, antilibertarian arabian manners of unacceptable conduct.

 

[Trajan Octavian Titus]

Us provokes Iraq civil war, surge is for another war

The real people behind the insurgence are US and Israel intelligence and Pentagon. They try to provoke a civil war in Iraq. The purpose is to let Iraqis to kill Iraqis, so US Army can stay in Iraq until next war: Iran's or Syria's.

Oh I do so love the conspiratorial rhetoric from the Islamist Fascists, the Ummah can not be blamed for anything now can it? It makes a whole bunch of sense for the U.S. to try to bring about our own failure in Iraq, just ****ing genius on your part. :roll:

 

[kathaksung]

Oh I do so love the conspiratorial rhetoric from the Islamist Fascists, the Ummah can not be blamed for anything now can it? It makes a whole bunch of sense for the U.S. to try to bring about our own failure in Iraq, just ****ing genius on your part. :roll:

Tell me what you conclusion you got from this story?

Where the car bomb came from?

Here is another case that US Army plant it to provoke a civil war in Iraq.
18. Quote, "He got suspicious because the Americans call him ask if he is already in the market

Quote, "Iraqirabita tell a story about an Iraq interpreter working in an American military base was sent to the city by his bosses to by computer hardware, he took the car but he stopped by friends.

He got suspicious because the Americans call him every now and then asking him if he already in the market, he parked the car in the middle of nowhere and answered yes, few minutes after that the car exploded. The guy left the country after that to Turkey.

For more information in English on American black budget special operations money being used to set up so called suicide bombing, below

http://www.thewe.cc/contents/more/a...ies.htm#us_special_operations_suicide_bombing

 

[Trajan Octavian Titus]

Tell me what you conclusion you got from this story?

That you're a nutter reading conspiracist Islamist propaganda which posits absolutely 0 evidence to back up its bullshit, that's "what I conclusion from this story." :roll:

 

[TheHonestTruth]

That you're a nutter reading conspiracist Islamist propaganda which posits absolutely 0 evidence to back up its bullshit, that's "what I conclusion from this story." :roll:

He's giving you facts...we are state sponsors of terror the proof is everywhere.

You are so brainwashed Trajan. Anybody with a clue knows we've been arming all sides of all conflicts in the mid east for decades now, its nothing new. Its the divide and conquer strategy.

Some evidence for you:

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/06/11/world/middleeast/11iraq.html

*Note that the corporate media hacks can't even report this accurately. They say we are doing it so the Sunni's can "attack al-qaeda" but thats just the corporate media acting as scribes for the military officials in this country who use that kind of doublespeak for attacking the warring factions in Iraq. The fact that we are arming the outlaw groups in the region shows we're just trying to stir things up.

This is a planned quagmire. Cheney knew it would be one back in 1994. This is all plain as can be.

YouTube - Cheney '94: Invading Baghdad Would Create Quagmire C-SPAN

 

[Shayah]

For more information in English on American black budget special operations money being used to set up so called suicide bombing, below

  Sadr City, Basra, Fallujah, Ramadi, Baghdad, Mosul, Kirkuk, Najaf...   US UK created Iraq - Death Squads - Devastated cities    The WE News Archives    

Your link points to a website hosted on a private server located in the obscure Coco Islands in southeast Asia. Hardly a reputable information outlet.

 

[Trajan Octavian Titus]

He's giving you facts...

He is giving me ****, and you are a complete joke and just exposed yourself for the conspiracist that you are.

we are state sponsors of terror the proof is everywhere.

Really where? Let's see some that aint off a conspiracist pro-jihadi website there son.

You are so brainwashed Trajan.

Kiss my boney white Irish ***.

Anybody with a clue knows we've been arming all sides of all conflicts in the mid east for decades now, its nothing new. Its the divide and conquer strategy.

Our strategy for Iraq is not divide and conquer it is Democratize and leave, the policy of the Jihadists is to start a civil war because they thrive on chaos, I suggest you read the Zawahiri-Zarqawi letters, their tactic is to attack Shia and try to spark a civil war so they can build their caliphate out of the ashes. Sectarian violence is antithetical to our interests you ****ing idiot.

Some evidence for you:

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/06/11/world/middleeast/11iraq.html

*Note that the corporate media hacks can't even report this accurately. They say we are doing it so the Sunni's can "attack al-qaeda" but thats just the corporate media acting as scribes for the military officials in this country who use that kind of doublespeak for attacking the warring factions in Iraq. The fact that we are arming the outlaw groups in the region shows we're just trying to stir things up.

This is a planned quagmire. Cheney knew it would be one back in 1994. This is all plain as can be.

Wow you're a ridiculous human being, we are helping the tribal sheiks who are now at war with AQ, that is one of the main reasons why the surge is working but in your twisted conspiratorialist aluminum hat wearing ****ed up head aiding the native Iraqi Sunni's in their fight against AQI is akin to false flag operations in an attempt to start a civil war. Get a life nutter.

 

[TheHonestTruth]

He is giving me ****, and you are a complete joke and just exposed yourself for the conspiracist that you are.



Really where? Let's see some that aint off a conspiracist pro-jihadi website there son.



Kiss my boney white Irish ***.



Our strategy for Iraq is not divide and conquer it is Democratize and leave, the policy of the Jihadists is to start a civil war because they thrive on chaos, I suggest you read the Zawahiri-Zarqawi letters, their tactic is to attack Shia and try to spark a civil war so they can build their caliphate out of the ashes. Sectarian violence is antithetical to our interests you ****ing idiot.



Wow you're a ridiculous human being, we are helping the tribal sheiks who are now at war with AQ, that is one of the main reasons why the surge is working but in your twisted conspiratorialist aluminum hat wearing ****ed up head aiding the native Iraqi Sunni's in their fight against AQI is akin to false flag operations in an attempt to start a civil war. Get a life nutter.

This is what happens when you kick somebody's *** in a debate. Ad hom attacks and childish name calling.

He can't explain why its logical to be handing out weapons to unstable warring factions, while at the same time our troops are patrolling looking for weapons caches.

And Trajan could not address what Cheney said in the video I just linked. He has to ignore it because it exposes what a fraud this whole thing has been. Cheney called the idea of an Iraq invasion a quagmire, his own words.

 

[Shayah]

Cheney called the idea of an Iraq invasion a quagmire, his own words.

You lambaste Cheney at every opportunity, and yet you embrace selective Cheneyisms. Which is it?

 

[WI Crippler]

You lambaste Cheney at every opportunity, and yet you embrace selective Cheneyisms. Which is it?

Whichever serves their purpose. C'mon, you know this Shayah.....

 

[TheHonestTruth]

You lambaste Cheney at every opportunity, and yet you embrace selective Cheneyisms. Which is it?

I am correctly exposing him when he flip flops.

We know he was telling the truth in 1994 because almost everything he describes in that interview has come true. And yet he didn't tell the public these things when he was selling us this war. Just as he predicted, it has become a very bloody, very messy sectarian battle for control of the region that will not be easily resolved.

In this case the flip flop is so atrocious and lies in selling the war so blatant as to be almost laughable if it weren't so tragic.We were told this war would be quick.

Notice immediately after invading the administration said it would be prolonged. Just listen to the first words of this news report on the day of the invasion.NPR : U.S. Military Strikes on Iraq

He made those comments about Iraq being a "quagmire" in 1994 when he had nothing to personally gain from a war with Iraq. But after being hired as Halliburton CEO in 1995 and retiring with millions in stock in 2000, he certainly had some things to gain, especially in a prolonged war -- which he knew would be inevitable should we invade.


This blatant deceit is clear evidence of corruption -- the revolving door in politics between industry and politicians. This is especially present in the defense sector where the relationship between govt officials and industry is so cozy as to be nearly indistinguishable.

Look at this graph of Halliburton stock since the invasion.

 

[Shayah]

I am correctly exposing him when he flip flops.

We know he was telling the truth in 1994 because almost everything he describes in that interview has come true. And yet he didn't tell the public these things when he was selling us this war. Just as he predicted, it has become a very bloody, very messy sectarian battle for control of the region that will not be easily resolved.

In this case the flip flop is so atrocious and lies in selling the war so blatant as to be almost laughable if it weren't so tragic.We were told this war would be quick.

What politician doesn't flip-flop? Are you telling me that you actually believed Cheney et. al. in that Iraq would be a day at the beach in 2003? The murderous and genocidal Ba'ath Party of Saddam Hussein could just barely keep the lid on internal combustion. This reality should have been painfully obvious to anyone who possessed even a cursory knowledge of Iraq.