universal healthcare would save us trillions

[Jay59]

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

That you can laugh at your own mistake gives me hope.

Now learn to laugh at those who claim universal health care would save money.

 

[vegas giants]

That you can laugh at your own mistake gives me hope.

Now learn to laugh at those who claim universal health care would save money.

Hang on.....I'm still laughing


HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA


HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

 

[BlueTex]

That you can laugh at your own mistake gives me hope.

Now learn to laugh at those who claim universal health care would save money.

Why does every other country spend less per person?

 

[vegas giants]

Why does every other country spend less per person?

Somehow it will be magically different if we do it

 

[washunut]

Universal healthcare would save money it costs more for the system that we got right now
so people complaining about how much america spends should be happy about a single payer system
it would save us alot.

Study: More Than 335,000 Lives Could Have Been Saved During Pandemic if U.S. Had Universal Health Care

If the U.S. had had a single-payer universal health care system in 2020, nearly 212,000 American lives would have been saved that year, according to a new study

ysph.yale.edu

FACT CHECK: Medicare for All Would Save the U.S. Trillions; Public Option Would Leave Millions Uninsured, Not Garner Savings - Public Citizen

Medicare for All opponents repeatedly claim that Medicare for All is “too expensive” by presenting misleading numbers without the proper…

www.citizen.org

https://www.fiercehealthcare.com/practices/new-study-says-medicare-for-all-will-save-u-s-money-lower-healthcare-costs

Seems the article made a easy to fnd math error. Next can't find how they came to this number. Then lets understand that Medicare is not as good insurance as is the insurance that major corporations give. Nor does it show what happens to the cost of Medigap when so many will be forced into it.

 

[Razoo]

The bottom line is because all patients will be covered the health care service will no longer take hits of non-payment.

Thus each service wii cost less per patient because the loss of profits will not be passed on to those
who can afford to pay.

Thus we each pay less money from day one.

Single Payer will act as a proactive service that should prevent conditions from becoming a worse condition or maybe life threatening = saves money.

Bankruptcy as a result of health care will never happen again. At least 50% of bankruptcies in the USA are a result of heath care.

 

[Razoo]

Let's make it free at point of service

It will never be free and no organization has offered the service up as free. And we are talking insurance not health care per se. Thus health care is to remain a private industry. Also keep in mind that insurance pays only
60% OF INVOICE as we speak.

PNHP Research: The Case for a National Health Program

pnhp.org

PNHP has been involved in this issue for at least 25 years. = tons of research.

 

[vegas giants]

It will never be free and no organization has offered the service up as free. And we are talking insurance not health care per se. Thus health care is to remain a private industry. Also keep in mind that insurance pays only
60% OF INVOICE as we speak.

PNHP has been involved in this issue for at least 25 years. = tons of research.

Free AT POINT OF SERVICE means you pay nothing when the service is provided. Like Canada

 

[Razoo]

Universal Healthcare doesn't increase demand for Healthcare, it increases access to healthcare and imperical evidence shows our Healthcare system costs more while providing worse results all while still leaving millions under insured.

BENEFITS AND PORTABILITY.
(a) In General.—The health care benefits under this Act cover all medically necessary services, including at least the following:
(1) Primary care and prevention.
(2) Approved dietary and nutritional therapies.
(3) Inpatient care.
(4) Outpatient care.
(5) Emergency care.
(6) Prescription drugs.
(7) Durable medical equipment.
(8) Long-term care.
(9) Palliative care.
(10) Mental health services.
(11) The full scope of dental services, services, including periodontics, oral surgery, and endodontics, but not including cosmetic dentistry.
(12) Substance abuse treatment services.
(13) Chiropractic services, not including electrical stimulation.
(14) Basic vision care and vision correction (other than laser vision correction for cosmetic purposes).
(15) Hearing services, including coverage of hearing aids.
(16) Podiatric care.
(b) Portability.—Such benefits are available through any licensed health care clinician anywhere in the United States that is legally qualified to provide the benefits.
(c) No Cost-Sharing.—No deductibles, copayments, coinsurance, or other cost-sharing shall be imposed with respect to covered benefits.

 

[rahl]

None of your links address the fact that demand for healthcare would drastically increase. One of your links has this dumb shit:



The three bold ones would drive demand through the stratosphere.

Lol demand for healthcare would not change. It’s not a 70 inch tv. It’s life or death which is why healthcare does not and can not function in a free market system.

 

[Individual]

It's not insanity and it's paid for by taxes....not nothing

If Federal government spending was paid for by taxes there would be no Federal debt.

 

[vegas giants]

If Federal government spending was paid for by taxes there would be no Federal debt.

Oh we spend more than we take in....which is fine with me

 

[Razoo]

Oh we spend more than we take in....which is fine with me

it's good for the economy and job security .......

 

[aociswundumho]

Lol demand for healthcare would not change.

Great, another law of demand denier.

It’s not a 70 inch tv. It’s life or death which is why healthcare does not and can not function in a free market system.

People shop for prices just to get a ride to the hospital even when they are bleeding and injured:

People Are Using Ubers As Ambulances — And Drivers Hate It

Sick people are increasingly using ride-hail to get to the emergency room, putting drivers in an uncomfortable position and a potentially tricky legal bind.

www.buzzfeednews.com

If you were right, people would simply call an ambulance.

Then there is the large and growing medical tourism market where people do exactly what you say they can't do - shop for healthcare:

Medical tourism - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[vegas giants]

Great, another law of demand denier.


People shop for prices just to get a ride to the hospital even when they are bleeding and injured:

People Are Using Ubers As Ambulances — And Drivers Hate It

Sick people are increasingly using ride-hail to get to the emergency room, putting drivers in an uncomfortable position and a potentially tricky legal bind.

www.buzzfeednews.com

If you were right, people would simply call an ambulance.

Then there is the large and growing medical tourism market where people do exactly what you say they can't do - shop for healthcare:

Medical tourism - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Let's take it out of the market.

 

[rahl]

Great, another law of demand denier.

Healthcare isn’t a commodity or cleaning service. Which is why it doesn’t and can’t function in a free market.

People shop for prices just to get a ride to the hospital even when they are bleeding and injured:

No they don’t. If you have a heart attack or are in an auto accident, you can’t shop around for the cheapest ride or the cheapest hospital to receive treatment.

If you were right, people would simply call an ambulance.

They do.

Then there is the large and growing medical tourism market where people do exactly what you say they can't do - shop for healthcare:

Yes, and handful of anecdotal examples. Peer reviewed emprical evidence remains. Single payer and universal healthcare systems are superior to ours cause they provide better care at a fraction of the price.

 

[aociswundumho]

No they don’t.

Yes, they do, and I gave you evidence that they do.

If you have a heart attack or are in an auto accident, you can’t shop around for the cheapest ride or the cheapest hospital to receive treatment.

Depends. If you are unconscious, then you can't shop around. If your injury is such that you need immediate medical attention, then you can't shop around.

But for everything else, you can shop around, and emergency care is only 2% of all healthcare spending.

They do.

But many don't, hence you're wrong.

Yes, and handful of anecdotal examples.

That's all it takes. If you say there are no white squirrels, all I need to do is find one white squirrel to falsify the claim.

And it's not just a "handful of anecdotal examples":

Patients who travel to another country to seek health care are
referred to as medical tourists ... In 2007, it is estimated that
750,000 Americans traveled to other countries for health
care.1 In 2017, more than 1.4 million Americans sought
health care in a variety of countries around the world.2

https://www.amjmed.com/article/S0002-9343(18)30620-X/pdf

Aren't you getting tired of being wrong?

Peer reviewed emprical evidence remains. Single payer and universal healthcare systems are superior to ours cause they provide better care at a fraction of the price.

If single-payer was superior to the market regarding healthcare, then single payer should also be superior in many other markets. Do you support single payer for housing, food, or transportation?

 

[vegas giants]

Yes, they do, and I gave you evidence that they do.



Depends. If you are unconscious, then you can't shop around. If your injury is such that you need immediate medical attention, then you can't shop around.

But for everything else, you can shop around, and emergency care is only 2% of all healthcare spending.



But many don't, hence you're wrong.



That's all it takes. If you say there are no white squirrels, all I need to do is find one white squirrel to falsify the claim.

And it's not just a "handful of anecdotal examples":

https://www.amjmed.com/article/S0002-9343(18)30620-X/pdf

Aren't you getting tired of being wrong?



If single-payer was superior to the market regarding healthcare, then single payer should also be superior in many other markets. Do you support single payer for housing, food, or transportation?

Your last paragraph is simply untrue

 

[MAGAnificent]

Universal healthcare would save money it costs more for the system that we got right now
so people complaining about how much america spends should be happy about a single payer system
it would save us alot.

Study: More Than 335,000 Lives Could Have Been Saved During Pandemic if U.S. Had Universal Health Care

If the U.S. had had a single-payer universal health care system in 2020, nearly 212,000 American lives would have been saved that year, according to a new study

ysph.yale.edu

FACT CHECK: Medicare for All Would Save the U.S. Trillions; Public Option Would Leave Millions Uninsured, Not Garner Savings - Public Citizen

Medicare for All opponents repeatedly claim that Medicare for All is “too expensive” by presenting misleading numbers without the proper…

www.citizen.org

https://www.fiercehealthcare.com/practices/new-study-says-medicare-for-all-will-save-u-s-money-lower-healthcare-costs

Medicare for all is simly an insanely stupid concept. It would not save us money at all. It would cost a minimum of 60 trillion dollars in just the first ten years and would largely result in massive rationing of healthcare.

 

[Greenbeard]

But for everything else, you can shop around, and emergency care is only 2% of all healthcare spending.

"Shoppable" and "emergency care" are different concepts. That figure is meaningless in this context, and yet you continue to cite it.

 

[rahl]

Yes, they do, and I gave you evidence that they do.

No they don’t, and no you didn’t.

Depends. If you are unconscious, then you can't shop around. If your injury is such that you need immediate medical attention, then you can't shop around.

Correct. Which is why healthcare is not workable in a free market system.

But for everything else, you can shop around, and emergency care is only 2% of all healthcare spending.

You can’t really shop around though.

But many don't, hence you're wrong.

Except they do, which is why I’m correct.

That's all it takes.

No it isn’t lol.

Aren't you getting tired of being wrong?

I have yet to be wrong lol.

If single-payer was superior to the market regarding healthcare, then single payer should also be superior in many other markets. Do you support single payer for housing, food, or transportation?

I understand that you need to deflect because your position has been refuted. I really do get that.

Once again, we know empirically that single payer and universal healthcare systems are superior to our system. They are cheaper and provide better care than ours. You understand what empirica means right?

 

[Razoo]

Let's take it out of the market.

immediately

 

[Razoo]

Medicare for all is simly an insanely stupid concept. It would not save us money at all. It would cost a minimum of 60 trillion dollars in just the first ten years and would largely result in massive rationing of healthcare.

Anyone making BS statements such as this must be a profiteer = blah blah blah your numbers are misinformation ......... the insurance industry is chief source for rationing health insurance thus health care and they interfere with health care depending on how much one can afford to spend
on health insurance. Health care in the USA depends on how much money one can afford to spend on insurance.

Some of the wealthiest are self insured I would imagine because the insurance industry sucks and costs too much money.

 

[aociswundumho]

"Shoppable" and "emergency care" are different concepts. That figure is meaningless in this context, and yet you continue to cite it.

Ok, how about "the overwhelming majority of healthcare is not emergency care". If you don't need urgent medical attention then you can shop around.

 

[aociswundumho]

Medicare for all is simly an insanely stupid concept. It would not save us money at all. It would cost a minimum of 60 trillion dollars in just the first ten years and would largely result in massive rationing of healthcare.

That would make them look bad. I think it's more likely that they would just keep printing money to pay for it.