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Understanding the Dutch reaction to the Ukrainian crisis and mh17[W:324]

Shameful neglect of evidence

By NILE BOWIE - 16 August 2014 @ 8:02 AM



NEARLY one month has passed since Malaysia Airlines flight MH17 was shot down over the skies of eastern Ukraine, taking the lives of 298 people. An international investigation is underway, led by the Netherlands, with members from Ukraine, Malaysia, the United States, Russia and others.

Though the team of investigators examining the crash site has yet to publish the findings and assign culpability to the responsible party, prominent media outlets have obediently toed the line of several western capitals with reports that all but categorically blame Russia for the aircraft’s demise.

Journalistic and analytical speculation cannot be avoided in such a tragic and geopolitically-charged situation. Media outlets have the responsibility to provide both critical commentary and impartial reporting to their readers, but in the case of MH17, the lack of balance is breathtaking.

Those parties who unreservedly point fingers at Moscow in the hours immediately following the disaster have yet to make public any forensic evidence that definitively implicates Russia in providing anti-Kiev militias with the training or hardware needed to take down a commercial airliner.

On the other hand, Russia’s Defence Ministry has made available compelling satellite images and military data that calls the Ukrainian government’s official narrative of events into question. Moscow’s findings have either been laxly underreported or dismissed as propaganda by the West.

read more here: Shameful neglect of evidence | New Straits Times
 
Guys, why so much negativity towards Russia ...? I did not really approve of the situation in Ukraine, but think for yourself, there is so much false information, even in this forum, you make conclusions on one side only, without listening to the second one. We need to look at the situation from the other side, for example read what is written on European news channels such as http://en.news-channels.net. Maybe then little has changed its attitude to the situation
 
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How do you know ? Have you seen any evidence of that ?

I only saw us officials saying so and the main stream media parroting that but they refused to provide evidence.

What was up with that fighterjet on his tail ? Where are those air traffick control tapes ? What was on the cockpit vice recorder ?

Maybe the fighterjet took cover behind the passenger liner. Maybe he shot MH17 down himself or maybe the seperatists did it but how is that Russia's fault?

I'm quite sure putin would not aprove of them shooting civilians with the weapons he provided. These are not murderess extremists, they haven't shot at civilians before and not after the crash.

Why where they flying there sounds like a better question then who did it. They never fly over that region but did now.. who sent them over there and why ? Why did the governement continue fighting around the crash site instead of installing a cease fire for a week so we could investigate?

Fishy ....

Are you Russian? You seem completely convinced that they had nothing to do with the murder of 200 Dutch people.
 
Guys, why so much negativity towards Russia ...? I did not really approve of the situation in Ukraine, but think for yourself, there is so much false information, even in this forum, you make conclusions on one side only, without listening to the second one. We need to look at the situation from the other side, for example read what is written on European news channels such as World news channels online. TV-broadcasts of Russia, Ukraine, USA and Europe online. Maybe then little has changed its attitude to the situation

Hello Buk, welcome to DP. Where are you from?

Come to think of it, it would be nice of you to present yourself first here before engaging:

Come in and say Hi
 
Shameful neglect of evidence

By NILE BOWIE - 16 August 2014 @ 8:02 AM


NEARLY one month has passed since Malaysia Airlines flight MH17 was shot down over the skies of eastern Ukraine, taking the lives of 298 people. An international investigation is underway, led by the Netherlands, with members from Ukraine, Malaysia, the United States, Russia and others.

Though the team of investigators examining the crash site has yet to publish the findings and assign culpability to the responsible party, prominent media outlets have obediently toed the line of several western capitals with reports that all but categorically blame Russia for the aircraft’s demise.

Journalistic and analytical speculation cannot be avoided in such a tragic and geopolitically-charged situation. Media outlets have the responsibility to provide both critical commentary and impartial reporting to their readers, but in the case of MH17, the lack of balance is breathtaking.

Those parties who unreservedly point fingers at Moscow in the hours immediately following the disaster have yet to make public any forensic evidence that definitively implicates Russia in providing anti-Kiev militias with the training or hardware needed to take down a commercial airliner.

On the other hand, Russia’s Defence Ministry has made available compelling satellite images and military data that calls the Ukrainian government’s official narrative of events into question. Moscow’s findings have either been laxly underreported or dismissed as propaganda by the West.

read more here: Shameful neglect of evidence | New Straits Times

After the ma17 hit I found the fingers pointing at the rebels and those at Kiev distributed along the usual lines, though, the options were all presented on BBC or France24 but not on rt as far as I noticed. Russia was never seriously suspected of the actual shooting until recently. And there is no doubt that Russia supplied rockets whether this was good, evil or smart depends on ideology and intelligence.

But that is beside the point. I think it is good to keep a lid on the results, till they are all in and understood. It is almost certain that the story will be interpreted differently by the parties. That is probably the reason it is taking so much time. Therefore we can only hope that every bit of information will be made public.
 
Are you Russian? You seem completely convinced that they had nothing to do with the murder of 200 Dutch people.

Well, it seems improbable that Russia shot down ma17 themselves. If it was the separatists, it was very probably collateral damage. We have shot down the wrong plane in the past. It happens.
 
Are you Russian? You seem completely convinced that they had nothing to do with the murder of 200 Dutch people.

I am Dutch and I am very convinced I have not seen enough evidence to blame anyone yet.
 
Guys, why so much negativity towards Russia ...? I did not really approve of the situation in Ukraine, but think for yourself, there is so much false information, even in this forum, you make conclusions on one side only, without listening to the second one. We need to look at the situation from the other side, for example read what is written on European news channels such as World news channels online. TV-broadcasts of Russia, Ukraine, USA and Europe online. Maybe then little has changed its attitude to the situation
Negativity against Russia probably stems from their forced starvation of the Ukrainian people, their enslavement of Eastern Europe and the deaths of millions of people around the world at their hands.

They may have some good points as well, however. Perhaps you can recall one or two.
 
I am Dutch and I am very convinced I have not seen enough evidence to blame anyone yet.

Yet you seem to go out of your way to discredit the west and defend Putin in every one of your posts. Very fishy.
 
Yet you seem to go out of your way to discredit the west and defend Putin in every one of your posts. Very fishy.

That all depends on perspective doesn't it ? The west has made enough screw ups that can be adressed in times like these. If you find an objective point of view Fishy your media and government have done a very good job on you :)
 
That all depends on perspective doesn't it ? The west has made enough screw ups that can be adressed in times like these. If you find an objective point of view Fishy your media and government have done a very good job on you :)

You're either with us or agin us David_H, we'll have no rational political analysis poisoning this board. :)
 
That all depends on perspective doesn't it ? The west has made enough screw ups that can be adressed in times like these. If you find an objective point of view Fishy your media and government have done a very good job on you :)

Distrusting Western media is one thing but you seem to have completely embraced the pro-Russian view of it...
 
Distrusting Western media is one thing but you seem to have completely embraced the pro-Russian view of it...
I like facts to build up an opinion, not gut feelings. There is no evidence Russia is involved. So there is no case against them to embrace. If the evidence proves Russian blame , my point of view will shift. If there is non it will stand.

not being anti Russia is not the same as being pro Russia. I am pro evidence.
 
Germany blames pro-Russian rebels for MH17 passenger plane crash - Spiegel

Oct 19 (Reuters) - Germany's BND foreign intelligence agency has concluded that pro-Russian rebels are to blame for the downing of Malaysia Airline MH17 in Ukraine in July, Der Spiegel weekly reported on Sunday, the first European agency to say so.

Gerhard Schindler, president of the BND, told a secret parliamentary committee on security affairs earlier this month that separatists had used a Russian Buk missile defence system from a Ukrainian base to fire a rocket that exploded directly next to the Malyasia Air plane, Der Spiegel reported.

Germany blames pro-Russian rebels for MH17 passenger plane crash - Spiegel | Reuters

Are you watching their hands? Where is the Buk delivered directly from Russia, from Kremlin, from evil Putin??? Now it's from a Ukrainian base.
 
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