teacher said:
Now pay attention. This is the last time I repeat myself. I freely admit that humans CONTRIBUTE to the problem. Just as I say we are not the SOLE cause. Ny contention when I jumped into this debate was just that. REMEMBER? When I jumped in my main question was to what PERCENTAGE we contribute to it, as opposed to normal global cycles.
Yes I know what you argued. But here's the issue, what matters of what percentage when what it is that we are doing is. In terms of Ozone, the hole's accelerated gap is 100% anthropogenic.
AS for the issue with the current CO2 spike, it too is 100% anthropogenic. The argument within the scientific community is no longer of whether or not humans are the cause, but what to do, and how to do it. There's precisely zero question that CO2 emissions need to be cut, but how and what's the alternative to fossil fuels?
There is where the argument lays.
teacher said:
The Earth over ages has been in many ice ages. So it stands to reason that the Earth can warm without our friggin help at all. Why do you feel that THIS time it is completely human caused?
Simple, I provided a source. If you read it you would see that there is more CO2 in the atmosphere now then there ever has been in the atmosphere in over 6,500,000 years. This doesn't say anthropogenic directly, but it first establishes that there is an exceptionally high concentration. No argument there right?
Next, all studies have clearly shown an ongoing sharp spike in CO2 since the industrial revolution. It continues to rise and correlates with current energy consumptions.
teacher said:
My colossal brain. The science that says CFC's contibute to ozone depletion is rock solid. But the atmospere's of the two hemispheres stay largely seperate. The north produces way more CFC's than the south. Tells me the hole over the north pole should be way larger. Something is not adding up.
Though what you explain is largely true, the Equator does "cut off" weathern patterns and other atmosphereric conditions. However substances that do not decay naturally, do eventually cross down into the southern atmosphere from the northern hemisphere.
teacher said:
I don't have a problem with that. I'm asking to what percent we accelerate it.
100%
teacher said:
Like I said before. I don't cite sources. I try to go this with my understanding of basic science, common knowledge, and logic. I refuse to get in a war over which scientist is correct or more credible. They all can blow me. I try to get the raw facts, apply science and logic, and figure it out for myself. When I'm bored out of my friggin mind I may go look at the Nature data. Don't hold your breath. Saw a report on CNN not an hour ago that said that the scientist's models are way off. But they were dead sure a year ago. That's why I don't blindly listen to all that they say.
Way off in what way? They overestimated? Or underestimated. With more and more data that is coming in, we are finding that all the models are considerably off from cautious conservative estimates. Also with global dimming being newly acknowledged indeed these models are way off.
teacher said:
Yes Father.....Not sure what you mean there. Please extrapolate.
http://www.debatepolitics.com/298592-post24.html
REMEMBER? I'm between the sky is falling, (you) and the ostrich mentality. If you are gonna sit there and claim this is 100 percent caused by humans, I'm not gonna waste my time. Unless you can prove to me that the Earth has not warmed and cooled over history without human influence. And to do that you'll have to explain why ice ages have come and gone.
I've never said natural cycles do not occur. What I'm saying is that the current trend is un-natural. For one, as per the data collected in the 70's we should be in a cooling trend towards another ice age, however the data shows we're heading contrarily.
Either way, as per my arguments made, releasing ancient carbon sources is going to result in drastic changes that will cause huge ecological, economic and social downfalls. The other side is that we can not rely on constant imports from unstable regions, thus it's very much a security issue as well.
There's no way around it, alternatives must be used.