This seems to be the same sad deal

[Scrabaholic]

Your comprehension was your teachers job not mine.

My comprehension is just fine.

 

[year2late]

Have a nice day. If you refuse to read my posts then there is no need to read yours. Go Bruins.

It is not my fault that you present articles with shoddy research.

And again....I accept that malpractice occurs in many medical procedures....with fatal consequences.....why would dx of brain death be different?

 

[Peter King]

List of Brain Dead Patients Who've Recovered | KGOV.com

You mean patients who were incorrectly diagnosed as brain dead because as is know, brain dead is brain dead.

Brain death occurs when a person has an irreversible, catastrophic brain injury, which causes total cessation of all brain function (the upper brain structure and brain stem). Brain death is not a coma or persistent vegetative state. Brain death is determined in the hospital by one or more physicians not associated with a transplantation team.

Understanding Brain Death << Finger Lakes Donor Recovery Network

What does it mean to be brain dead?When a person is brain dead, the brain can no longer function. The doctors have done all they can to treat the person’s condition. However, the brain will not recover function, and the person is considered dead. The doctors will support the heart with medication. They will also provide oxygen through a ventilator, or breathing machine. The person’s body can be supported for days and, sometimes, even weeks. However, there is no reason to do so. A brain death diagnosis is final and cannot be reversed. The person will never awaken.

https://www.aan.com/Guidelines/Home/GetGuidelineContent/435

What 'Brain-Dead' Means

 

[year2late]

Your comprehension was your teachers job not mine.

Her is a little for you to comprehend

Case #1 Sam Hemming. Article speaks to "keeping him in a medically incuded coma" . Such drugs eliminate the ability to come to a diagnosis of brain death. (at least in US)

Hemming was a substantial way away from discussion of brain death if proper criteria were used,

4.3 Toxicology screening negative for significant confounding substances. If barbiturates given, serum level < 10 mcg/ml. If significant doses of CNS-depressing medications (e.g. narcotics, sedatives, hypnotics, anticholinergics, etc.) have been administered recently, wait for 5 half-lives of the medication in question or, if serum levels are available, until the level is below therapeutic. Renal or hepatic dysfunction, or preceding hypothermia may prolong clearance. If high suspicion for unknown or unmeasurable CNS-depressants, consider ancillary testing

Determination of Brain Death (MGH Stroke Service)

Taylor Hale does not appear to have been pronounced brain dead. She had been in a medically induced coma and from what I read she started waking up. It is not clear at what point in the weaning from the medically induced coma was. It sounds like she was off just weaned off. Magically :roll: she started waking up when the meds were weaned off. Her herniation was partial, not complete from what I have found out.

The Burns case was just as I explained in multiple posts. The doctors used inappropriate criteria to DX brain death and they were punished for it.

Raleane "Rae" Kupferschmidt’s case is laughable. Here family took her home "brain dead". You cannot be brain dead a breathing spontaneously. Her breathing tubes had already been removed before discharge.

I could go on, but it is kind of like me doing your homework for you.

Now, are you not happy you pushed me to read your "Real Science" article.

Real science? Not so much. At all.

The author could have at least done the 2 minutes of reasearch it took me to find the real story.

 

[AlphaOmega]

Her is a little for you to comprehend.

lol ...Pricless! As I said I am not dicussing this with you. Did you comprehend that?

 

[Cougarbear]

Re: Data

The Nazis began by targeting their own - Germans who had persistent physical or mental defects, or who looked disgusting, & so on. That was for practice. Under fiscal pressure in the years after WWI & before WWII, the German state had to cut back on what we would call welfare benefits - unemployment, food aid, medical aid, & so on. Once Hitler managed to slither into power, Aryans in Germany were privileged over everybody else - Jews, Roma, Slavs, intellectuals, professors, Communists, Socialists, & any political enemies. Their parties, labor organizations, media, schools & universities, churches were all targeted, & individuals were targeted for beatings or execution.

There are no babies involved in abortion under Roe v. Wade (babies are already born). If a fetus is cut before an abortion, the fetus is already dead by injection (a legal requirement for this kind of abortion). The cutting is in order to avoid injuring the woman during the operation.

I wonder if Nazi's cut up some of the bodies if they needed more space? Your approval because of an injection (not a legal requirement in all states) really makes me sick.

Here is what the Court decided, "The Court divided the pregnancy period into three trimesters. During the first trimester, the decision to terminate the pregnancy was solely at the discretion of the woman. After the first trimester, the state could “regulate procedure.” During the second trimester, the state could regulate (but not outlaw) abortions in the interests of the mother’s health. After the second trimester, the fetus became viable, and the state could regulate or outlaw abortions in the interest of the potential life except when necessary to preserve the life or health of the mother." This means that those states that are restricting third semesters abortions are with their rights because of the "viability" of the fetus making it a baby. Doesn't matter what you think a baby is. Your definition isn't law.

 

[prometeus]

Re: Data

I wonder if Nazi's cut up some of the bodies if they needed more space?

Why not educate yourself instead of wondering and making moronic posts?

Your approval because of an injection (not a legal requirement in all states) really makes me sick.

That is a good thing. Maybe this illness will motivate you to seek some knowledge.

 

[Cougarbear]

Re: Knowledge is your friend

Why would Sanger or PP want to kill Black people? Sanger was very much opposed to abortion, BTW. She also favored giving birth & putting up the baby for adoption, if the woman or family didn't want to keep the child.

& the point to PP is to put decision making on family planning into the hands of the families themselves, or into the hands of the woman.

& Sanger was also completely opposed to sterilizing people. There was a lot of that going on in the US in the 1920s, see War against the weak : eugenics and America's campaign to create a master race / Edwin Black, c2003, Four Walls Eight Windows. But that wasn't Sanger's stance, she preferred to encourage families of means to have bigger families, as they had the resources to take care of their children & bring them up well.

Sanger: "Sanger was indeed a believer in eugenics, but the basic concept that humanity could be improved by selective breeding was an article of faith for many in the years before World War II. Winston Churchill, Herbert Hoover, Theodore Roosevelt, George Bernard Shaw and H. G. Wells all supported the movement. African-American leader W. E. B. Du Bois backed many of its principles as well." Sounds a lot like Hitler. And, by the way, fascists like Hitler also came in different colors, not just white. The "Ayran" concept isn't new nor just a "white" issue.

 

[Cougarbear]

Re: Data

Why not educate yourself instead of wondering and making moronic posts?

That is a good thing. Maybe this illness will motivate you to seek some knowledge.

Killing is a good thing? :shoot

 

[year2late]

lol ...Pricless! As I said I am not dicussing this with you. Did you comprehend that?

Of course you are not. I went case by case and tore you apart. I am not surprised you ran away.

I initially did not want to look further because the first paragraph was senseless, but to appease you, I did read on and found what I expected. No actual thoughtful science in the "Science" journal.

 

[AlphaOmega]

Of course you are not. I went case by case and tore you apart. I am not surprised you ran away.

I initially did not want to look further because the first paragraph was senseless, but to appease you, I did read on and found what I expected. No actual thoughtful science in the "Science" journal.

Like I said.. Have a nice day.

 

[year2late]

Like I said.. Have a nice day.

Like I said, you ran away when your fake article was challenged.

 

[Logician Man]

Like I said, you ran away when your fake article was challenged.

He equates challenges and Burden of Proof requests to 'attacking his integrity' ( his very own words ). Doesn't seem to have any real interest in actual debate or defending that alleged cherished 'integrity.' Seems to prefer just tossing in the towel and conceding defeat.

 

[minnie616]

Of course you are not. I went case by case and tore you apart. I am not surprised you ran away.

I initially did not want to look further because the first paragraph was senseless, but to appease you, I did read on and found what I expected. No actual thoughtful science in the "Science" journal.

You tore the article he posted apart case by case.

He is being dishonest about the article and his dishonesty is apparent anyone following this thread.

Like I said, you ran away when your fake article was challenged.

He equates challenges and Burden of Proof requests to 'attacking his integrity' ( his very own words ). Doesn't seem to have any real interest in actual debate or defending that alleged cherished 'integrity.' Seems to prefer just tossing in the towel and conceding defeat.

This needs to be repeated.

You have described his MO in just a few we’ll worded sentences.

 

[Peter King]

Re: Data

I wonder if Nazi's cut up some of the bodies if they needed more space? Your approval because of an injection (not a legal requirement in all states) really makes me sick.

Here is what the Court decided, "The Court divided the pregnancy period into three trimesters. During the first trimester, the decision to terminate the pregnancy was solely at the discretion of the woman. After the first trimester, the state could “regulate procedure.” During the second trimester, the state could regulate (but not outlaw) abortions in the interests of the mother’s health. After the second trimester, the fetus became viable, and the state could regulate or outlaw abortions in the interest of the potential life except when necessary to preserve the life or health of the mother." This means that those states that are restricting third semesters abortions are with their rights because of the "viability" of the fetus making it a baby. Doesn't matter what you think a baby is. Your definition isn't law.

a few facts because you clearly seem very light on facts:

1. most abortions take place before the first trimester is even over

2. and not only did the Nazi's cut up bodies (they did all sort of things) but they actually tried to exterminate all Slavic and Jewish people from the East of Europe/Russia because they wanted more living space and all those vermin Slave people were a bit of a bother for the Germans. And the best way to deal with that bother for the Nazi's was murdering the lot.

3. And you are right, the law is not of the side of the women's right deniers.

 

[year2late]

You tore the article he posted apart case by case.

He is being dishonest about the article and his dishonesty is apparent anyone following this thread.







This needs to be repeated.

You have described his MO in just a few we’ll worded sentences.

And here is another one from his article

‘Brain dead’ woman recovers after husband refuses to withdraw life support | News | LifeSite

Doesn't look like any kind of official pronouncement. For goodness sake, she was able to breath off the ventilator.

But my personal favorite is Val Thomas. The report was that she was in rigor mortis and then placed on the ventilator,:lamo

I am sure that there are cases of malpractice. And protocols in general ask for evaluation of brain death to occur only in certain situations and by clinicians skilled in the evaluation.

 

[southwest88]

Re: Data

I wonder if Nazi's cut up some of the bodies if they needed more space? Your approval because of an injection (not a legal requirement in all states) really makes me sick.

Here is what the Court decided, "The Court divided the pregnancy period into three trimesters. During the first trimester, the decision to terminate the pregnancy was solely at the discretion of the woman. After the first trimester, the state could “regulate procedure.” During the second trimester, the state could regulate (but not outlaw) abortions in the interests of the mother’s health. After the second trimester, the fetus became viable, and the state could regulate or outlaw abortions in the interest of the potential life except when necessary to preserve the life or health of the mother." This means that those states that are restricting third semesters abortions are with their rights because of the "viability" of the fetus making it a baby. Doesn't matter what you think a baby is. Your definition isn't law.

No, you shouldn't read my approval into anything that the Nazis did. I was merely offering information - which you didn't seem aware of.

As for Roe, yes, I've read through it a couple of times. Fetal viability does not transform the fetus into a baby. If that were the case, any abortion after viability would make it murder - whereas Roe specifically states that abortion under Roe is not murder.

& it's not my definition of baby, it's the definition that the US Supreme Court held in Roe v. Wade. If you're going to wade out into the arena, you might as well know what the arguments & logic are.

 

[southwest88]

Re: Knowledge is your friend

Sanger: "Sanger was indeed a believer in eugenics, but the basic concept that humanity could be improved by selective breeding was an article of faith for many in the years before World War II. Winston Churchill, Herbert Hoover, Theodore Roosevelt, George Bernard Shaw and H. G. Wells all supported the movement. African-American leader W. E. B. Du Bois backed many of its principles as well." Sounds a lot like Hitler. And, by the way, fascists like Hitler also came in different colors, not just white. The "Ayran" concept isn't new nor just a "white" issue.

Sanger would go anywhere, anytime, before any audience, in order to talk about birth control, PP, & fund raise. She believed in positive eugenics - encouraging couples with the means to raise more children, rather than fewer or none.

Eugenics was quite the rage after one of Darwin's nephews (I think it was), applied the concepts of evolution to society (maybe mid-1860s), & coined social Darwinism. An ugly theory, & one that Darwin himself did not approve of. Hitler, BTW, may have gotten his notions of racial purity & assordid from either the US or British eugenics movement. There was a lot of visitation back & forth among the enthusiasts for saving WASP humanity. Hitler hated the Jews particularly, but he was quite catholic in that regard - he was perfectly willing - eager, even - to wipe out Slavs (for the land - he wanted to plant German Aryan colonies all over Poland & Ukraine - & anything else that wasn't nailed down, I imagine.) Socialists, Communists, labor unions, intellectuals, religious who didn't toe the line, & any & all political enemies - he was determined to beat down or outright kill any opposition whatsoever.

 

[year2late]

Re: Knowledge is your friend

Sanger would go anywhere, anytime, before any audience, in order to talk about birth control, PP, & fund raise. She believed in positive eugenics - encouraging couples with the means to raise more children, rather than fewer or none.

Having children when you have the means to raise them? Sounds like personal responsibility :2wave:

Shouldn’t that be applauded?

 

[Lursa]

Is there anything you think the American taxpayer should not subsidize?

People's religious choices.

 

[Lursa]

Like I said...whatever makes you feel better about supporting the killing if innocent human beings.

Why do you value an attribute that is only emptiness? There's no ability to act, no intent. It's the same 'innocence' of a flower or a couch...a vacuum, nothing. Why do you give credit to something for literally 'nothing?'​

And certainly, why do you value that void more than women?

(Cue: "you just compared the unborn to flowers and couches!" Er nope, read it again and own it :roll: )

 

[Lursa]

Only in cases such as rape and incest as the woman did not make that choice. It was forced on her. Feel free to put me on that list.

Is the unborn less of a human being (as you've been using it) in those cases? Is the unborn less 'innocent?' Why is ok to kill it then?

 

[Lursa]

I would say, Abortion is violence unacceptable but currently legal but not moral.

97.5% of all abortions consist of painlessly flushing a pea-sized or smaller unborn from the womb...that's not 'violence.' (And the rest are going to be medically necessary and the unborn are given anesthetic lethal injections before removal and also know nor feel anything).

Now...self-defense often involves violence...and yet, just like abortion, is justifiable and morally acceptable.

 

[Lursa]

Why not just let the doctor take the baby C section and then adopt the baby away? Why can't women just give birth and then adopt? I know women who did that. I know teenagers who did that. Those are holy women.

There are more than 100,000 kids in the US waiting to be adopted. How cruel and immoral is it to encourage women to give birth unnecessarily to more unaffordable/unwanted kids? For each new infant added to that huge pool...another child, already waiting and hoping for a family goes without.

Sources:

"Waiting for a family is the longest wait of all."

Adopt America Network | Children for Adoption

Adoption Statistics | Adoption Network

Waiting Children | Kids Available for Adoption | The Adoption Exchange | The Adoption Exchange

 

[Lursa]

Re: Knowledge is your friend

Sanger: "Sanger was indeed a believer in eugenics, but the basic concept that humanity could be improved by selective breeding was an article of faith for many in the years before World War II. Winston Churchill, Herbert Hoover, Theodore Roosevelt, George Bernard Shaw and H. G. Wells all supported the movement. African-American leader W. E. B. Du Bois backed many of its principles as well." Sounds a lot like Hitler. And, by the way, fascists like Hitler also came in different colors, not just white. The "Ayran" concept isn't new nor just a "white" issue.

Like that matters now? It's like saying the US and Constitution arent valid anymore because some of the FFs kept slaves :doh

It's not remotely relevant today.