This Is Not The Time For Stimulus Spending[W:279]

[Incisor]

Re: This Is Not The Time For Stimulus Spending

Like you won in 2010 and 2014

Bragging about your victories in two midterm elections that saw record low voter turnout is like saying you're the prettiest girl in Wasilla, Alaska.

 

[Fenton]

Re: This Is Not The Time For Stimulus Spending

Well, they didn't vote for it because they're party-before-country. But your guy Romney saw fit to put it in place in Massachusetts. Oh right, he's not a Conservative according to the definition as of 3:51PM EST today, October 25th, 2016. I'm sure the definition of "Conservative" will change again by 5:00PM today.




I'm not denying that CA still has a lot of work to do. But what I can say with certainty is that the economic climate in California is better than it is in Texas. Namely, because California isn't tying its fortunes to the price of oil. California hasn't lost jobs this year, but Texas has.




OK, so here's an instance of a Conservative fudging numbers in order to magnify the talking point. So 9000 "businesses" (which? We don't know) left CA for TX. Out of how many businesses? Well, according to the Census, in 2013 there were over 874,000 "employer establishments" in California. So what you're trying to turn into a big deal amounts to a grand total of 1% of all California businesses over an 8 year period. Again, not even one year...eight years. So that's an average of 1,125 a year. Out of 874,000. Which is less than 1% a year.




The Conservative base was toast the minute they nominated Trump. Indicators look to a "wave" election this year, with Democrats gaining as many as 7 Senate Seats and 25 House seats. Not to mention the electoral landslide Hillary Clinton will achieve.




Texas has nearly the same debt per capita California has ($10,331 vs. 12,033). And California has a surplus. Texas does not. Both have debt-to-GDP of 18%, however Texas has a higher % of its population on SNAP than California (14% vs. 11%). Oops. [URL="http://www.usdebtclock.org/state-debt-clocks/state-of-texas-debt-clock.html"]Oops.[/URL]

California's largest increase in new jobs over the last 8 yeara is public sector

Lol !! Like they can afford that. The State is broke, several Californian cities are in default, they have over 500 Billion dollars in unfunded pension liabilities

California is a laughing stock to anyone who's not blinded by their own ideology

We have a LOT of Califonrian transplants in the Houston area for some reason and the one's Ive met claim they got the hell out ASAP.

That California is comprised of the very rich and a masiive amount of people in poverty. Well, thats what the Progressive agenda does.

It destroys the Middle class, and Texas at least has offered a place for those people to go. We also have transplants from NY, Michigan, Illinois, LA, Oregon, Washington State, etc

You people have your own messes to clean up, stop worrying about Texas. Texas applies Conservative economic principles you people claim " dont work" and because of that we've seen a LOT of new bussiness invest in the Texas economy.

Bet Cali misses Toyota right about now

 

[Fenton]

Re: This Is Not The Time For Stimulus Spending

Bragging about your victories in two midterm elections that saw record low voter turnout is like saying you're the prettiest girl in Wasilla, Alaska.

A record low turnout of Democrats ? Lol !! I thought the results of your ideology was going to sink the Conservative base ? It doesn't even energize the Liberal base.

Yea good luck guys. As bad a Trump is Hillary's barely beating him. So how does that translate to destroying my ideology ?

 

[Gina]

Re: This Is Not The Time For Stimulus Spending

Moderator's Warning:

The persona comments and attacks as well as the flame baiting, need to stop now. Please refocus and stick to commenting about the topic: This Is Not The Time For Stimulus Spending And not each other.

 

[Geoist]

https://www.yahoo.com/finance/news/...wrong-for-us-economy-right-now-110539235.html


Lefties on here think that all times are OK for stimulus or infrastructure spending but this is clearly not the case. Inflation and interest rates are ticking up and the debt clock ticks closer to blowing up every day.

1. Lower/remove taxes on labor and fruits of labor.
2. Replace those taxes with a ground/resource rent.
3. Watch the economy improve and stabilize.

 

[Incisor]

Re: This Is Not The Time For Stimulus Spending

California's largest increase in new jobs over the last 8 yeara is public sector

You sure about that? According to the BLS, between January 2009 and today, California has added just 12,000 government jobs. Total non-farm jobs increased by 1.7M from January 2009 to today. So by using simple math, we see that between January 2009 and today, California has added just under 1.7M private sector jobs.

The State is broke, several Californian cities are in default, they have over 500 Billion dollars in unfunded pension liabilities

Doesn't TX have $300B in unfunded liabilities? Furthermore, that liability funding of $500B is over how long a period? 1 year? 10 years? 50 years? I see Conservatives throw those numbers around quite a bit, but the way you post makes it sound like that $500B is due right now, but it's not. That's a liability spread out over decades, isn't it? And the state is not broke. It has a surplus. Texas doesn't anymore. Their surplus is going to disappear because the price of oil is so low.

We have a LOT of Califonrian transplants in the Houston area for some reason and the one's Ive met claim they got the hell out ASAP.

I don't accept anecdotal evidence.

That California is comprised of the very rich and a masiive amount of people in poverty. Well, thats what the Progressive agenda does.

I don't deny there is a massive gap between the rich and poor in CA. In fact, it's like that nationwide. That's been the problem the last 35 years. These issues didn't come up overnight in CA, they've been 35 years in the making. Also, California provides far more benefits to its citizens than Texas. Texas didn't even expand Medicaid because party-before-country.

It destroys the Middle class, and Texas at least has offered a place for those people to go.

Two points:

1. They haven't been going there, as the numbers I posted show.
2. The argument you seem to be making is that Texas doesn't create jobs, they just poach them from places that do. But that comes as no surprise, given that TX ranks at the bottom for high school graduation, among other education metrics. In other words, the people in Texas are so dumb that they have to import labor from other states because the people who already live in Texas are unemployable.

I live in GA which is doing the same thing. Lots of transplants from blue states, but it's turning the state blue. It's now a competitive toss-up state in this election. One Hillary seems like she could win. So yes, there are people moving to red states from blue states, but they're bringing their blue state ideas with them. You're welcome.

 

[Incisor]

Re: This Is Not The Time For Stimulus Spending

A record low turnout of Democrats ? Lol !! I thought the results of your ideology was going to sink the Conservative base ? It doesn't even energize the Liberal base.

Yes, there is an enthusiasm gap in midterm elections. That's because Conservatives bank on the outrage industry. Which is why you're lucky it's Hillary and not Bernie that you are running against. With Hillary, the outrage industry stays in business which keeps Conservatives employed and in office.

 

[Geoist]

Re: This Is Not The Time For Stimulus Spending

As bad a Trump is Hillary's barely beating him.

Just about any other GOP nominee would be destroying Clinton at this point, especially with the email scandals. The joke is on the Republicans.

 

[Moderate Right]

Re: This Is Not The Time For Stimulus Spending

Rejection is not a valid refutation. Are you trying to tell me; that you don't have a valid argument for a rebuttal?

It depends on the job; unemployment compensation does not include any bonuses.

You don't have a valid argument for rebuttal, not to mention many of us have already rebutted it. We shouldn't have to rebut it twice. If you can't get it the first time, how are you going to understand the tenth time?

 

[Moderate Right]

Re: This Is Not The Time For Stimulus Spending

McCain and Romney were not moderates. Both of whom subscribed the Conservative Platform; tax cuts for the rich, pointless military occupations, deregulation, bigotry. That's the Conservative platform. It has remain unchanged in 35 years. That's why, to my point, it doesn't matter who you nominate. The problem isn't your nominee. The problem is the ideology.

Too funny. Most far right conservatives call McCain and Romney and many others RINOs. Why do you think that is? You are too partisan to comprehend politics.

 

[Incisor]

Re: This Is Not The Time For Stimulus Spending

Too funny. Most far right conservatives call McCain and Romney and many others RINOs. Why do you think that is? You are too partisan to comprehend politics.

Everyone is a Conservative until they're not, right? You must have Michelle Obama arms from moving the goalposts so many times!

 

[Moderate Right]

Re: This Is Not The Time For Stimulus Spending

Everyone is a Conservative until they're not, right? You must have Michelle Obama arms from moving the goalposts so many times!

Just like the left having various levels of partisanship so to does the right. But, you are too partisan to even understand that. To you there is only the far left and the far right, nothing else.

 

[Incisor]

Re: This Is Not The Time For Stimulus Spending

Just like the left having various levels of partisanship so to does the right. But, you are too partisan to even understand that. To you there is only the far left and the far right, nothing else.

Trying to apply your flawed belief system to me is a waste of your time. The reason you get such awful candidates is because the ideas those candidates base their belief structure on are awful. Donald Trump is the natural result of Conservatism. A vacuous, empty-headed bigot can only get the Conservative nomination if the policies he/she supports are vacuous, empty-headed, and bigoted.

 

[Fenton]

Re: This Is Not The Time For Stimulus Spending

Just about any other GOP nominee would be destroying Clinton at this point, especially with the email scandals. The joke is on the Republicans.

Yup, I agree but do you think Trump spells the end for the Cosnervative base ??

 

[Fenton]

Re: This Is Not The Time For Stimulus Spending

Yes, there is an enthusiasm gap in midterm elections. That's because Conservatives bank on the outrage industry. Which is why you're lucky it's Hillary and not Bernie that you are running against. With Hillary, the outrage industry stays in business which keeps Conservatives employed and in office.

So the Left just cant get through to its base just how important midterms are ? Is the Lefts base that unsophisticated ?

 

[Incisor]

Re: This Is Not The Time For Stimulus Spending

So the Left just cant get through to its base just how important midterms are ? Is the Lefts base that unsophisticated ?

They're just not motivated the same way Conservatives are. Conservatives are motivated by fear, which is why their 2010 and 2014 victories were within the context of "everything is terrible and everyone will die" [paraphrasing, but you get the point]. Conservatives have a larger "lizard brain" which is why they're more susceptible to fear-based and authoritarian arguments. I don't deny that a lot of the Democratic base doesn't turn out for midterm elections unless there's a good reason (2006 is a fine example). It is the fault of the Democratic Party for not doing more to turn out its base, but the demos are different. The more people that vote, the less likely it is that Conservatives will win.

 

[Geoist]

Re: This Is Not The Time For Stimulus Spending

Yup, I agree but do you think Trump spells the end for the Cosnervatige base ??

I don't know if Trump spells the end of conservatives, but he is a threat to the GOP and its platform. His economic positions, especially, run counter to the GOP's agenda. Republican voters seem more divided than ever. I think this will only get worse if Trump begins his own media company.

 

[Incisor]

Re: This Is Not The Time For Stimulus Spending

I don't know if Trump spells the end of conservatives, but he is a threat to the GOP and its platform. His economic positions, especially, run counter to the GOP's agenda. Republican voters seem more divided than ever. I think this will only get worse if Trump begins his own media company.

See, I'm not so sure about that. I don't think Trump's economic positions (what little he has articulated of them) are that wildly different from the Conservative platform. Tax cuts for the rich & businesses, deregulation...these are Conservative orthodoxy, are they not?

 

[danielpalos]

Re: This Is Not The Time For Stimulus Spending

You don't have a valid argument for rebuttal, not to mention many of us have already rebutted it. We shouldn't have to rebut it twice. If you can't get it the first time, how are you going to understand the tenth time?

Rejection is not a valid refutation. Are you trying to tell me; that you don't have a valid argument for a rebuttal?

It depends on the job; unemployment compensation does not include any bonuses.

 

[Fenton]

Re: This Is Not The Time For Stimulus Spending

Trying to apply your flawed belief system to me is a waste of your time. The reason you get such awful candidates is because the ideas those candidates base their belief structure on are awful. Donald Trump is the natural result of Conservatism. A vacuous, empty-headed bigot can only get the Conservative nomination if the policies he/she supports are vacuous, empty-headed, and bigoted.

Your talking points dont equate a Conservatives belief structure.

We've been through this before.

 

[danielpalos]

Re: This Is Not The Time For Stimulus Spending

The right has no valid argument to refute the stimulus effect of a fifteen dollar an hour minimum wage and unemployment compensation simply for being unemployed.

 

[mmi]

Re: This Is Not The Time For Stimulus Spending

I never said Trump would win by any amount. You in your zealous rage have apparently confused me with another poster

Zealous rage, eh? I may have confused with with "someone else." A distinction without a difference.

>>I thought you were going to tune it down a bit. Stop being such a toxic and insulting poster. What happened?

"Tune it down"? All I did was show how yer, as always, full of it with yer endless TX-CA comparisons. I wouldn't even visit Texass, much less reside there.

Like you won in 2010 and 2014 ?

As the excerpt you quoted indicates, I was referring to presidential elections. We'll see if you can now hold onto anything in the Congress.

California's largest increase in new jobs over the last 8 yeara is public sector Lol!!

No need to call out this BS as Incisor has done it for me.

>>stop worrying about Texas.

We don't worry about Texass, just the unfortunate souls living there who can't get out for whatever reason.

As bad a Trump is Hillary's barely beating him.

She'll get something close to 350 electoral votes — a crushing defeat of the Clown.

>>how does that translate to destroying my ideology?

Ignorance won't be destroyed anytime soon, just further marginalised.

you're lucky it's Hillary and not Bernie that you are running against. With Hillary, the outrage industry stays in business which keeps Conservatives employed and in office.

They'd be after Sanders just as much. Not with the same lies, but rather different ones.

I don't think Trump's economic positions (what little he has articulated of them) are that wildly different from the Conservative platform. Tax cuts for the rich & businesses, deregulation...these are Conservative orthodoxy, are they not?

He's a protectionist on trade and a xenophobic bigot on immigration. He doesn't get along with COC types cuz he's not rally a businessperson. He's a lying, thieving fraud.

 

[Ganesh]

Re: This Is Not The Time For Stimulus Spending

Fwiw, I don't this is a very good example. For the discussion here, anecdotal evidence would be something like, "I work in a manufacturing facility (or I deal with manufacturers), and here's the way we/they use robots." ocean515 is saying that he's Mr Businessman and he's made wholesale purchases from manufacturers located overseas and so he can expound knowledgeably about the effects of automation on global trade. Yer just an uninformed proglib who wants to steal from successful people to line yer gilded cage.

Otoh, he wonders what "labor-intensive manufacturing" is. I'd say Kush got it right: "When asked a question, you run away under the guise of superior knowledge."

The Dunning-Kruger effect.

Good points, and I think we see a lot of this from the right wing on the campaign trail. To be fair, it's normal for people to try to relate an issue to what they know, but it is also a fair expectation that people should try and understand what they do not know.

A common claim from the right is that if a candidate has experience in business, that qualifies him or her for a leadership position in public administration. If candidate X has sold a lot of cars, that means he can improve trade relations, or increase economic activity, or if he has made a lot of real estate deals, he will be good at negotiating treaties to limit nuclear weapons, or make peace in the Middle East.

Business is not the same thing as economics, although the most negligent observer may think so, as both concern money to a degree. And business in no way prepares one for international relations, or indeed in making determinations on the social issues of the day.

These sort of assumptions are of course nonsense, but serve a dual purpose for the neo-con establishment. First, it reinforces the spin that society is all about markets and trading, and that is all of importance when considering the issues facing society today. Second, most candidates for that philosophy come from the business community, so this is a self-serving bit of propaganda. Those that cannot see through this really have a duty to dig up some information before casting their vote. Not that it is likely to happen.

 

[Moderate Right]

Re: This Is Not The Time For Stimulus Spending

Trying to apply your flawed belief system to me is a waste of your time. The reason you get such awful candidates is because the ideas those candidates base their belief structure on are awful. Donald Trump is the natural result of Conservatism. A vacuous, empty-headed bigot can only get the Conservative nomination if the policies he/she supports are vacuous, empty-headed, and bigoted.

You are seriously uninformed and blindly partisan. In case you haven't noticed, most Republicans are stampeding over each other exiting Trump's building. Many are outright rejecting him. No moderate Republican newspapers have endorsed him. It's laughable that you think McCain was far right and a bigot. While a small minority of Trump supporters were "deplorables" the majority of them just wanted the establisment out. They were not racists and bigots but you can't see anything past your liberal bias.

 

[Moderate Right]

Re: This Is Not The Time For Stimulus Spending

Rejection is not a valid refutation. Are you trying to tell me; that you don't have a valid argument for a rebuttal?

It depends on the job; unemployment compensation does not include any bonuses.

I and others have already made numerous rebuttal arguments but I guess the only bullet you have left is deflections. Anyone who wants to read back can see for themselves that the rebuttals have already been done. If your attention span is that short there are some medicines which can help you with that.