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They Lost Their Bakery, Now Face Bankruptcy: Government’s ‘Discrimination’ [W:1874]

Re: They Lost Their Bakery, Now Face Bankruptcy: Government’s ‘Discrimination’ Fine B

the declaration of independence is non- postive law, ...it is u.s code..voted on by congress in 1878.

it has legal standing in law....and is used in american law.

You would need to show the legal framework of this. You know, cases and such.
 
Re: They Lost Their Bakery, Now Face Bankruptcy: Government’s ‘Discrimination’ Fine B

And what rights are those, that Madison supports?

madsion is talking about natural rights.

our constititon reconizes natural rights, and states them twice in the constitution.
 
Re: They Lost Their Bakery, Now Face Bankruptcy: Government’s ‘Discrimination’ Fine B

That is not an opinion, that is in fact factually way wrong.

Sure. But what is one without the other?
 
Re: They Lost Their Bakery, Now Face Bankruptcy: Government’s ‘Discrimination’ Fine B


They have done something wrong, they violated federal law, that is why they are being fined.

You can believe all you want, but it does not make it factual. In fact the federal government can punish companies (certain companies) for breaking the civil rights when there is a case of discriminatory behavior.
 
Re: They Lost Their Bakery, Now Face Bankruptcy: Government’s ‘Discrimination’ Fine B

madsion is talking about natural rights.

our constititon reconizes natural rights, and states them twice in the constitution.

Define natural rights?
 
Re: They Lost Their Bakery, Now Face Bankruptcy: Government’s ‘Discrimination’ Fine B

No, just 95% of them.

So you admit you were wrong? I guess that means we are done here.
 
Re: They Lost Their Bakery, Now Face Bankruptcy: Government’s ‘Discrimination’ Fine B

Define natural rights?

those rights which are natrual to us...

you have a natural right to speech, to pray, assemble with people you wish to be with, self defnese, be secure in you body and property. ....to name a few.
 
Re: They Lost Their Bakery, Now Face Bankruptcy: Government’s ‘Discrimination’ Fine B

If the bakery agrees to sell to you, yes, you have a right to buy food at the bakery. If they don't however agree to sell you food then you must leave them be and either go about your business or protest.

The bakery is by law forbidden from discriminatory behavior, they cannot refuse you on discriminatory grounds.

And no, by law you can have the prosecuted, you don't have to go about your business. And this case (and others) prove that.
 
Re: They Lost Their Bakery, Now Face Bankruptcy: Government’s ‘Discrimination’ Fine B

So you admit you were wrong? I guess that means we are done here.

I suppose you could say I am 5% wrong, while you are 95% wrong.


If that means we are done here, then so be it.
 
Re: They Lost Their Bakery, Now Face Bankruptcy: Government’s ‘Discrimination’ Fine B


Yes you can, the bakery is by law banned from discriminating against you. And you can force people to sell to you if they refuse to sell to you on discriminatory grounds and that business is a public accommodation.

The bakery by it's actions broke federal law.
 
Re: They Lost Their Bakery, Now Face Bankruptcy: Government’s ‘Discrimination’ Fine B


federal law does not override rights, or constituional law..which is the highest in the land.

show me where civil rights are in constituional law.

if you force people to labor for you ...by selling....thats illegal under the 13th amendment
 
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Re: They Lost Their Bakery, Now Face Bankruptcy: Government’s ‘Discrimination’ Fine B

those rights which are natrual to us...

you have a natural right to speech, to pray, assemble with people you wish to be with, self defnese, be secure in you body and property. ....to name a few.

How are they natural? What other species enjoys such rights by virtue of existing?
 
Re: They Lost Their Bakery, Now Face Bankruptcy: Government’s ‘Discrimination’ Fine B

I suppose you could say I am 5% wrong, while you are 95% wrong.


If that means we are done here, then so be it.

My argument only needed you to be wrong by any amount. It doesn't matter to my argument if certain laws or even the majority of laws make a free market impossible.
 
Re: They Lost Their Bakery, Now Face Bankruptcy: Government’s ‘Discrimination’ Fine B

Civil rights: the right to not be refused service if you go to a bakery to buy a cake.

And my argument is simple, that bakery was a public accommodation and it is banned from discriminating by federal law.

Where, in the Constitution, does it say anything about the federal government having the authority to force anyone to engage in commerce with anyone else?

(Hint: It doesn't. Therefore, per the Tenth Amendment, the federal government has no such authority. Period.)
 
Re: They Lost Their Bakery, Now Face Bankruptcy: Government’s ‘Discrimination’ Fine B


Rights do not come from god or whatever you believe, rights are granted, taken away and limited by governments and the law.

You seem to forget the title is the bill or rights and it was passed by men, not by the church or a deity.
 
Re: They Lost Their Bakery, Now Face Bankruptcy: Government’s ‘Discrimination’ Fine B

My argument only needed you to be wrong by any amount. It doesn't matter to my argument if certain laws or even the majority of laws make a free market impossible.

And with that, I need make no further comment, lol.



Have a nice day.
 
Re: They Lost Their Bakery, Now Face Bankruptcy: Government’s ‘Discrimination’ Fine B

You do not usually just walk into a bakery, and buy an already-made wedding cake off the shelf. A wedding cake is nearly always a unique, custom-created artistic work, specific to the wedding at which it is to be served.
That's very true. I've made many wedding cakes in days gone by before fondant became popular, we used buttercream and royal icings and they tasted a heck of a lot better. The cake is designed around the couple. The first stage is a taste test where the couple samples all your goods. After you figure out what flavors and fillings, you start to focus on them as a couple and the symbolisms that have meaning to them incorporated into their cake. Many would choose types of flowers for their meaning. Others would take on a humorous theme. etc. Each one was definitely individualized. The whole process isn't like ordering a generic cake from Krogers. These cakes are pieces of art. The building of them at times almost takes a degree in physics. Delivery of them and setting them up without damage takes a lot of prayers.
 
Re: They Lost Their Bakery, Now Face Bankruptcy: Government’s ‘Discrimination’ Fine B

Rights do not come from god or whatever you believe, rights are granted, taken away and limited by governments and the law.

You seem to forget the title is the bill or rights and it was passed by men, not by the church or a deity.

And the citizen allows government to interfere with citizens' free expression of religious or political opinions at his own peril.
 
Re: They Lost Their Bakery, Now Face Bankruptcy: Government’s ‘Discrimination’ Fine B

How are they natural? What other species enjoys such rights by virtue of existing?

only man has rights..and no citizen can excerise a right or privldege on the rights of another person.
 
Re: They Lost Their Bakery, Now Face Bankruptcy: Government’s ‘Discrimination’ Fine B

Rights do not come from god or whatever you believe, rights are granted, taken away and limited by governments and the law.

You seem to forget the title is the bill or rights and it was passed by men, not by the church or a deity.

if rights are granted as you say they are....fine..please produce the statute which created our rights...

the bill of rights does not grant anyone a right...it only reconizes rights which exist in nature..

the bill of rights are only restrictions on the federal government...read your bill of rights preamble.
 
Re: They Lost Their Bakery, Now Face Bankruptcy: Government’s ‘Discrimination’ Fine B

Anarchy? So a market that is free of any government intervention is anarchy? Why couldn't government exist while the society has a free market?

To those especially on the authoritarian end of the far-wrong side of the spectrum, “anarchy” is any freedom that they don't want people to have.

Just watch—very likely, within a dozen posts, someone is going to point to Somalia as a place where all of us should move who don't want Big Brother dictating every minute detail of every bit of commerce in which we might wish to engage.
 
Re: They Lost Their Bakery, Now Face Bankruptcy: Government’s ‘Discrimination’ Fine B

And with that, I need make no further comment, lol.



Have a nice day.

If you were wise you wouldn't laugh at your own foolishness. You said that the free market equal anarchy and because of that all I had to do to prove you wrong was to show that laws could exist while society had a free market. However, even before I did that you admitted that your statement was in fact wrong and with it canceled out my need to prove you wrong.
 
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