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The US doesn't have a "crime problem"?

aociswundumho said:
The primary reason why the US has so many people in prison is because there are so many laws criminalizing actions which have no victim.
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The most consequential crimes as far as systemic damage to U.S. society, are committed by those with too much "juice" to be held accountable as far as ever experiencing an extended period of incarceration.

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www.washingtonpost.com

I’ve prosecuted Trump. Documents matter more than Weisselberg now.​

In New York’s civil case in 2013, we turned up a trove of emails and files​

July 3, 2021
"...The last time the People of the State of New York took the Trump Organization to court, it was in the Trump University case filed in 2013, a civil prosecution I helped lead. Our case featured testimony from Trump University’s executives, to be sure — plus the often-heart-rending stories of dozens of defrauded victims — but at its core, our case was built on a foundation of documents. In our initial filings alone, we attached multiple boxes’ worth of exhibits, most importantly, the transcripts of Trump University “seminars,” as well as the playbook used by its “instructors,” financial and human resources records and a large number of internal emails, including from people who are now household names, like Weisselberg, Jeff McConney and Michael Cohen."

Tennessee Sen. Lamar Alexander statement on impeachment ...​

https://www.tennessean.com › news › politics › 2020/01/31
Jan 31, 2020 — The Tennessee Senator said that he would not break ranks with fellow ... Ukraine to investigate the Bidens; the House managers have proved ...

Lamar Alexander's yes-he-did-it statement on Trump ...​

https://www.washingtonpost.com › politics › 2020/01/31
Jan 31, 2020 — Sen. Lamar Alexander (R-Tenn.) on Capitol Hill in 2017. ... In fact, he says Democratic House impeachment managers proved their case — that ...
 
It is amazing how many threads are turned into bash Trump threads. Our idiotic war on drugs is what causes these high incarceration rates.
 
TurtleDude said:
It is amazing how many threads are turned into bash Trump threads. Our idiotic war on drugs is what causes these high incarceration rates.
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So, you believe "high incarceration rates" resulting from drug trafficking prosecutions are a greater problem than this,
despite the deceiving of a sizeable portion of the electorate resulting in a lack of accountability for the systemic crminal behavior described? This "perp" also nominated...:

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July 9, 2021
https://www.washingtonpost.com/outl...9fd0e4-d5c7-11eb-a53a-3b5450fdca7a_story.html
Review

An indictment of William Barr’s tenure as attorney general​


"..Instead, Honig writes, Barr “lied to the American public time and time again” and “willingly, affirmatively, and aggressively used the Justice Department as a political tool to help Trump.”
(Harper)
“Hatchet Man” catalogues Barr’s time in office from his effort to spin the damning contents of the Mueller report in Trump’s favor, to his meddling in the prosecutions of Trump associates Michael Flynn and Roger Stone, to his role in helping Trump spread falsehoods about the supposed prevalence of voter fraud in the 2020 election. Honig doesn’t hide his contempt for Barr, and he isn’t out to convince those who disagree; no one enthusiastic about Barr will come away with their view changed. Likewise, the book doesn’t attempt to uncover new information about Barr’s tenure, relying instead on the existing public record. But for readers looking for an accessible overview of Barr’s time as attorney general — or dizzied by the sheer volume of scandals that took place during the Trump presidency — Honig provides a useful rundown..."

May 5, 2021 : Fed. Judge Amy Berman Jackson :

A Federal Judge Finds That Bill Barr Was a Fixer and Corrupter of Justice​

Drew Angerer - What remains of Bill Barr’s sullied reputation was blown up when federal district Judge Amy Berman Jackson ruled that the government must turn over the memorandum, which the public has yet to fully see and that the Justice Department relied upon in declining to prosecute the 45th...
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And fourteen months earlier, Fed. Judge Reggie Walton.:

Federal judge blasts Barr for 'misleading' comments on Mueller report​

The judge wondered whether Barr's intention "was to create a one-sided narrative about the Mueller report."
www.nbcnews.com
51244193621_9df942f380_c.jpg




Six revelations in Senate intel report on 2016 Russian interference​

The bipartisan report provides new details on Trump’s conversations with Roger Stone and the activities of the president’s former campaign chairman Paul Manafort.
www.nbcnews.com

www.nbcnews.com
August 18, 2020
".."Page's responses to basic questions were meandering, avoidant, and involved several long diversions. Despite the meticulous records Page kept on his personal hard drive detailing his daily routines, he was unable to recall any details of his trips to Moscow, or the names of senior Russian officials with whom he met, despite using his engagements with them to build his credentials within the Campaign."

In a footnote, the report adds, “The Carter Page FISA order and renewals are examined in detail in the DOJ OIG FISA Report. While there were several problems with the FBI's FISA renewals for Page, the Committee assesses that Page's previous ties to Russian intelligence officers, coupled with his Russian travel, justified the FBI's initial concerns about Page.".."
 
tl dr: @post your wall of sound nonsense is not worth reading. Your anti Trump arguments are irrelevant here
 
TurtleDude said:
tl dr: @post your wall of sound nonsense is not worth reading. Your anti Trump arguments are irrelevant here
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I must be confusing you with some other poster using your sig...

....

States where recreational marijuana is legal:​


Sessions terminates US policy that let legal pot flourish​

https://apnews.com › article › biden-cabinet-cory-gardn...
Jan 4, 2018 — Atty General Jeff Sessions ... in states where the drug is legal and outraged both marijuana ...

Trump Goes Full Duterte, Suggests “Death Penalty” for Drug ...​

https://www.vanityfair.com › News › donald trump
Feb 26, 2018 — Five sources say he is deadly serious about the issue.

Trump: Death Penalty for Drug Dealers Like Duterte—Report ...​

https://fortune.com › 2018/02/26 › trump-dealth-penalt...
Feb 26, 2018 —Trump reportedly wants capital punishment for drug dealers, reflecting Philippines President's death penalty ...

​

 
Trump is no longer relevant
 
TurtleDude said:
Trump is no longer relevant
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Except no one can receive his party's support without his approval, not to mention his "cancel culture".

Pro-Trump Republicans determined to oust GOP incumbents ...​

https://abcnews.go.com › Politics › story
Jun 25, 2021 — Forty Republicans have filed candidacies to run against 10 of the 11 Republicans who supported President Donald Trump's impeachment and are ...

Republicans who voted with Cheney to impeach Trump face ...​

https://www.washingtonpost.com › politics › 2021/05/09
May 10, 2021 — If Rep. Liz Cheney (R-Wyo.) is ousted from her leadership post, it would highlight how much the January vote by 10 GOP lawmakers to impeach ...

It doesn't pay to be a congressional Republican opposing Trump​

https://www.washingtonpost.com › politics › 2021/05/13
May 13, 2021 — Republicans in Congress who oppose Donald Trump are usually consigned to the same fate: a quick end to their political careers.

TurtleDude said:
It is amazing how many threads are turned into bash Trump threads. Our idiotic war on drugs is what causes these high incarceration rates.
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You obviously feel strongly but only three states that have decriminalized marijuana voted in the majority for Trump in 2020,
so drug convicts occupying prison beds are not an overriding concern of yours when it comes to who you've chosen to vote for?

Do you discern any racial bias behind the Trump-Sessions record of drug decriminalization policy or of the overwhelming number of Trump party majority state governments that have not been moved to decriminalize marijuana posession and small quantity sales?
 
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Lafayette said:
From here: Countries with largest numbers of prisoners
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And, if you want to know who in the US locks 'em up, see here:
pie2020.webp


The above seems convincing in the respect that crimes by nature are at a "local level" - unless one is using the internet to perform the crime. Which, for the moment, is not that massive but not unknown either

Meaning typically that fraud can be committed in the US whilst sitting comfortably on your boat off the coast of France by means of the Internet! No, it is not mission-impossible - just mission-improbable. But doable nonetheless.

What I must underline in the above graphic - and it is truly-shocking - is the predominance of "violent crime" in the figures. Ouch ... !

PS: And would anyone care to dispute the notion that violent-crime in the US is caused significantly by Hollywood-movies? No? (Ok, so I got that wrong too!!!!! ;^)
 
TurtleDude said:
Trump is no longer relevant
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Yeah, so you TELL HIM that ... and see what he says!

I don't know how he did it. His drawbacks are manifest to the intelligent-eye but people show up in highly significant numbers at his public appearances. (Yet another example of the dumbing-down of America?)

Does that make him "innocent" of all that he's done wrong? Nope!

But, the guy has nothing better to do with his life than become PotUS again, and for two more consecutive-terms! Yeah, Bossy-Gillis just loves to command people. It serves his penchant for "internal power" with which he thinks he was born.

Any bonafide psychiatrist would have a field-day with him as a patient ... !
 
aociswundumho said:
The primary reason why the US has so many people in prison is because there are so many laws criminalizing actions which have no victim.
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Yes, but because it their crime if not of only one victim but many! Besides, in communal-fraud, the "victims" are highly numerous!

You may get away without incarcerated-punishment if you collect too many illegal-parking tickets but unlikely if you have committed a real felony.

And this is happening on the Internet more and more. Someone puts up a photo of an expensive used-iPhone and when a customer bites at the amazingly low-price they've been "had". (How such fraud gets on the Amazon-site here in France I will never understand!)

Meaning what? Meaning that you should avoid any site that will not hold your payment in abeyance until you have received the product and accepted the transaction definitively. If not, you send the product back and the seller must confirm reception whereupon you are refunded the cost. (And all that process with "reception certificates" managed by the seller-site itself!)
 
TurtleDude said:
It is amazing how many threads are turned into bash Trump threads. Our idiotic war on drugs is what causes these high incarceration rates.
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Which is used by the GOP as campaign tools. Trump ran in 2016 portraying the country as a post-apocalyptic hell hole.

Republicans run on LOR AND ORDER and their version of it is precisely the kind of shitty arrests that you folks claim you hate.
 
RetiredUSN said:
If you choose to be a criminal then you have to accept the consequences that go along with it.
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Not if you’re a white male, and especially not a wealthy white male.
 
TurtleDude said:
It is amazing how many threads are turned into bash Trump threads. Our idiotic war on drugs is what causes these high incarceration rates.
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This is probably the case imo but are there stats that confirm it?
 
Let's not forget a few years ago, Great Britain surpassed the US as the most violent first world nation - less homicides, but more assaults. And we can't really believe most third world country crime statistics.
 
TurtleDude said:
It is amazing how many threads are turned into bash Trump threads. Our idiotic war on drugs is what causes these high incarceration rates.
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Well the bashing is cathartic and so well deserved! The man's behaviour has a way of sparking a feeling of both the good-and-bad in his character.

The man may indeed be sick-sick-sick in the head as many psychologists have suggested. But he seems nonetheless to be a very popular individual in the US. When I try to explain why to my European friends here, they just roll their eyes.

Interesting essay about him here: The Mind of Donald Trump ...

PS: And a quote from the article as food-for-thought:
A large and rapidly growing body of research shows that people’s temperament, their characteristic motivations and goals, and their internal conceptions of themselves are powerful predictors of what they will feel, think, and do in the future, and powerful aids in explaining why. In the realm of politics, psychologists have recently demonstrated how fundamental features of human personality—such as extroversion and narcissism—shaped the distinctive leadership styles of past U. S. presidents, and the decisions they made.
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Lafayette said:
Well the bashing is cathartic and so well deserved! The man's behaviour has a way of sparking a feeling of both the good-and-bad in his character.

The man may indeed be sick-sick-sick in the head as many psychologists have suggested. But he seems nonetheless to be a very popular individual in the US. When I try to explain why to my European friends here, they just roll their eyes.

Interesting essay about him here: The Mind of Donald Trump ...

PS: And a quote from the article as food-for-thought:
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I suspect Trump will be the answer lefties will use to defend any and all failures by the Democrats over the next 4-10 years
 
TurtleDude said:
I suspect Trump will be the answer lefties will use to defend any and all failures by the Democrats over the next 4-10 years
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It really is funny how totally you can "pwn" one of those "libtards" by noting that they're still discussing something as irrelevant as the last president of America.

I wonder if TD ever mentioned Obama. Recently.

TurtleDude said:
yet another lie-I blame those who do the crimes. Obama was a beneficiary of affirmative action. He didn't even make honors at Columbia. what is hilarious is watching people who never attended top echelon universities and never competed to do so, pretending they understand what went on in the admissions game for those schools
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So...around an hour ago. Let's continue....
TurtleDude said:
Judge King-who I know well-is a gun banning zealot. However, there is a danger to overturning this and having it go up to the supremes. It is an Obama heavy court.
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TurtleDude said:
instead of Obama?
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TurtleDude said:
Robert Reich is a left wing extremist so I don't put much stock in his rants. what is funny is that GOP justices often uphold contentious democrat laws (Roberts with Obama care for example) while Democrat justices are almost always lock step with their party
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TurtleDude said:
<>While President Obama has declared a push to ban or limit types of guns, the nation’s major newspapers are nearly unanimous in their support of gun control. The New York Times, Washington Post, USA Today and other most-popular papers led the list.
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A simple search yields 10+ pages of results of TD going on about Obama-this/Obama-that. Those are just a few from the first page results. Sure, he's almost always trying to brag himself up about something at the same time. But Obama, Obama, Obama.

It's only natural we find him here trying to create the appearance of dunking by mocking their reference to things Trump did.




tl;dr Few debate board moves are more dishonest and stupid than what TD just attempted to pull
 
TurtleDude said:
It is amazing how many threads are turned into bash Trump threads. Our idiotic war on drugs is what causes these high incarceration rates.
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That, and the mandatory sentences that often go with drug convictions. And the three-strikes rule that puts people into jail for life for minor stuff.
 
Visbek said:
Mass incarceration is definitely a problem.

However, if you want to know whether "there are high crime rates in the US," what you need to look at are actual crime rates. Not incarceration rates.

Do you really need someone to explain why?
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Both are needed to get a complete overview of crime in any country. Crime rates affect those who suffer the damage or indignity of crime and our taxes pay for the incarceration of criminals.

Both are important aspects of crime - and curiously, neither come up for any great debate. Which means what?

That we Yanks take crime to be a "given". With that attitude there is not a hope-in-hell that we'll ever do anything about crime in America.

And it is more pernicious in the US than elsewhere in the world. We should be asking ourselves "Whyzzat" ... ?
 
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