The U.S. has more jails than colleges. Here’s a map of where those prisoners live.

[American]

Re: The U.S. has more jails than colleges. Here’s a map of where those prisoners live

Late to the game, I did edit my previous post to include the War On Drugs, the major cause of the huge growth of the US prison system over the last few decades. "moving the goal posts" sounds so much like football, and suggests one would 'rather not talk about it'. Maybe because it's "too true to talk about" or something. eace

Maybe because I agree generally with the War on Terror, and don't need to add anything. You thought you could add that in while I was agreeing with you, but I read better than you think. Nice try though.

 

[blackjack50]

Re: The U.S. has more jails than colleges. Here’s a map of where those prisoners live

30,923 inmates in a county?

The U.S. has more jails than colleges. Here’s a map of where those prisoners live. - The Washington Post

We should have a jail for every county. Or maybe one for every 2-3 counties. Jails are temporary. Did you mean prisons?

 

[CycloneWanderer]

Re: The U.S. has more jails than colleges. Here’s a map of where those prisoners live

I'm confused, so it is easier to commit a crime than get educated? Am I supposed to be surprised?

 

[blackjack50]

Re: The U.S. has more jails than colleges. Here’s a map of where those prisoners live

I'm confused, so it is easier to commit a crime than get educated? Am I supposed to be surprised?

You would think this forum would be proof of that concept. Avoiding breaking laws is so easy, but I guess that is why it is supposed to be surprising.

 

[Thoreau72]

Re: The U.S. has more jails than colleges. Here’s a map of where those prisoners live

You would think this forum would be proof of that concept. Avoiding breaking laws is so easy, but I guess that is why it is supposed to be surprising.

Obeying the law is so easy?

Why does the government and its minions have such a difficult time doing that?

It seems to me that Eric Holder and Barack Obama have a very difficult time ENFORCING the law, and thereby obeying another law they took an oath to do.

Yes, why is it so damn hard to obey the law?

 

[RDS]

Re: The U.S. has more jails than colleges. Here’s a map of where those prisoners live

We should have a jail for every county. Or maybe one for every 2-3 counties. Jails are temporary. Did you mean prisons?

Jail is a prison and prison is a jail.



1.


a place for the confinement of people accused or convicted of a crime.
"he spent 15 years in jail"


synonyms: prison, penal institution, place of detention, lock-up, place of confinement, guardhouse, correctional facility, detention centre;

Source: Any dictionary.

 

[CycloneWanderer]

Re: The U.S. has more jails than colleges. Here’s a map of where those prisoners live

Has anyone mentioned that size of institutions may play a role in the number of them? Last I checked, the largets state prison holds roughly 5,000 inmates (Louisiana State Pen.). 5,000 students is a small college.

 

[CycloneWanderer]

Re: The U.S. has more jails than colleges. Here’s a map of where those prisoners live

Also, there are some really small jails. One of the local jails around here only has capacity for 10-15 inmates at a time. Wouldn't a better comparison be number of jails versus number of high schools?

 

[Fearandloathing]

Re: The U.S. has more jails than colleges. Here’s a map of where those prisoners live

Exactly, running the highest incarceration rate of all reporting nations all over the planet has both economic and sociological consequences. We see them, we know they exist yet the entire debate is shelved in the context of "tough on crime" even when there is no victim. It should tell us something, very strongly, that we have more jails than colleges.

In October 2013, the incarceration rate of the United States of America was the highest in the world, at 716 per 100,000 of the national population.[2] While the United States represents about 5 percent of the world's population, it houses around 25 percent of the world's prisoners.[3][4] Imprisonment of America's 2.3 million prisoners, costing $24,000 per inmate per year, and $5.1 billion in new prison construction, consumes $60.3 billion in budget expenditures.
United States incarceration rate - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Canada's problem is much different, it is racial involving astronomically high rates for natives,. usually serial petty crime. To that end, they have been experimenting with new, non incarceration methods which have reduced crime.

A few interesting by products emerged, one, that the earlier you expose someone to the jail system, even being held for trial, the more he is likely to move on to more serious crime. The other thing was to move off the drug enforcement model of users as criminals to one of patients, which reduced the initial incarceration of course, but halted the recidivism. So, when we stopped jailing people for pot possession, shop lifting and so forth, the crime rate plummeted.

The first thing the US must do is stop jailing minor drug and other so called street crimes, thus turning them into harder criminals.

Also, having worked in drug addiction recovery, when you put a kid in jail for using pot, her emerges addicted to speed.

 

[matchlight]

Re: The U.S. has more jails than colleges. Here’s a map of where those prisoners live

However many jails and prisons we have, the scummy bastards I see on the streets make me sure we need a lot more of them. Anyone who doesn't like a criminal law can call on his representatives to amend or repeal it. Until that time, people who break those laws and are found guilty by juries are going to jail. To hell with them. From what I've seen, most of them get off far, far easier than they deserve.

The recent spectacle of people who dare to go around hitting unsuspecting people in the face as hard as they can, just for cruel fun--in a few cases, this has killed the poor victim--is sickening and infuriating. It makes me dearly wish to read about more victims shooting their attackers to death, and it shows just how low the deterrent effect our system of criminal law has sunk. We should make the cowardly sons of whores we catch doing such vicious, evil things pay so dearly for it that they curse their mothers (whoever they may have been) for ever having given birth to them.

I would like to see more states put prisoners at hard labor on chain gangs. Nothing like the misery of hard, uncomfortable, manual labor to focus a criminal's attention on the need to be a very good boy in future, so he never, ever has to go through that again. Stop wringing your hands for the plight of criminal SOB's, and focus on protecting potential victims by creating very strong disincentives to crime.

 

[OrphanSlug]

Re: The U.S. has more jails than colleges. Here’s a map of where those prisoners live

However many jails and prisons we have, the scummy bastards I see on the streets make me sure we need a lot more of them. Anyone who doesn't like a criminal law can call on his representatives to amend or repeal it. Until that time, people who break those laws and are found guilty by juries are going to jail. To hell with them. From what I've seen, most of them get off far, far easier than they deserve.

The recent spectacle of people who dare to go around hitting unsuspecting people in the face as hard as they can, just for cruel fun--in a few cases, this has killed the poor victim--is sickening and infuriating. It makes me dearly wish to read about more victims shooting their attackers to death, and it shows just how low the deterrent effect our system of criminal law has sunk. We should make the cowardly sons of whores we catch doing such vicious, evil things pay so dearly for it that they curse their mothers (whoever they may have been) for ever having given birth to them.

I would like to see more states put prisoners at hard labor on chain gangs. Nothing like the misery of hard, uncomfortable, manual labor to focus a criminal's attention on the need to be a very good boy in future, so he never, ever has to go through that again. Stop wringing your hands for the plight of criminal SOB's, and focus on protecting potential victims by creating very strong disincentives to crime.

I am sorry, but that is just not very bright at all and is in fact the contributor to the problem. Some general notion that "scummy bastards I see on the streets" means we need more prisons at tax payer expense. Fiscal conservatism and any sense of reality just flew out the window with this epic post absent of facts.

 

[matchlight]

Re: The U.S. has more jails than colleges. Here’s a map of where those prisoners live

I am sorry, but that is just not very bright at all and is in fact the contributor to the problem. Some general notion that "scummy bastards I see on the streets" means we need more prisons at tax payer expense. Fiscal conservatism and any sense of reality just flew out the window with this epic post absent of facts.

No need to be sorry that you think my comments are not very bright. I'm just a typical dumb lawyer, and I don't hope to achieve your preternatural grasp of the facts about this subject.

I repeat: We need more prisons to take these lousy bastards off the streets, and I'd be more than glad to help pay for them. And if more states brought back chain gangs, it would probably defray the expense by making the bums help pay for their keep. Here in California, we should start up the gas chamber and begin clearing out the huge backlog of filthy SOB's taking up space on death row. To hell with criminals--obey the law, or pay the price.

 

[blackjack50]

Re: The U.S. has more jails than colleges. Here’s a map of where those prisoners live

Obeying the law is so easy?

Why does the government and its minions have such a difficult time doing that?

It seems to me that Eric Holder and Barack Obama have a very difficult time ENFORCING the law, and thereby obeying another law they took an oath to do.

Yes, why is it so damn hard to obey the law?

Obeying the law for regular citizens.*

Besides...you actually don't have the proof they broke the law. If you did, we wouldn't have to deal with those idiots anymore. But what laws did they allegedly break? What laws are they supposed to enforce?

 

[blackjack50]

The U.S. has more jails than colleges. Here’s a map of where those prisoners ...

Jail is a prison and prison is a jail.



1.


a place for the confinement of people accused or convicted of a crime.
"he spent 15 years in jail"


synonyms: prison, penal institution, place of detention, lock-up, place of confinement, guardhouse, correctional facility, detention centre;

Source: Any dictionary.

Anyone using them interchangeably is incorrect:

http://sheriff.org/faqs/displayfaq.cfm?id=4f892698-5c5d-40f8-b159-c9a0b6ed66f3

Paraphrased the above is that jail is for people not convicted, and prison is for convicted.

There is a legal definition. A jail and a prison is not the same thing. Though some JAILS can be used for short sentences of those convicted of crimes (Florida this is a 364 day maximum).

Source: sheriff's department...the people who run jails.

 

[blackjack50]

Re: The U.S. has more jails than colleges. Here’s a map of where those prisoners live

Also, there are some really small jails. One of the local jails around here only has capacity for 10-15 inmates at a time. Wouldn't a better comparison be number of jails versus number of high schools?

That was my point. Jail vs prison is a big difference. You aren't actually convicted of a crime in jail usually. That comes later.

 

[RDS]

Re: The U.S. has more jails than colleges. Here’s a map of where those prisoners ...

Anyone using them interchangeably is incorrect:

FAQ: What's the difference between jail and prison?

Paraphrased the above is that jail is for people not convicted, and prison is for convicted.

There is a legal definition. A jail and a prison is not the same thing. Though some JAILS can be used for short sentences of those convicted of crimes (Florida this is a 364 day maximum).

Source: sheriff's department...the people who run jails.

The true meaning can be found here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zqjzng6A6MA

 

[blackjack50]

Re: The U.S. has more jails than colleges. Here’s a map of where those prisoners ...

The true meaning can be found here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zqjzng6A6MA

lol. Funny. And an amusing game to play with friends if you like music and got females present.

 

[OrphanSlug]

Re: The U.S. has more jails than colleges. Here’s a map of where those prisoners live

No need to be sorry that you think my comments are not very bright. I'm just a typical dumb lawyer, and I don't hope to achieve your preternatural grasp of the facts about this subject.

I repeat: We need more prisons to take these lousy bastards off the streets, and I'd be more than glad to help pay for them. And if more states brought back chain gangs, it would probably defray the expense by making the bums help pay for their keep. Here in California, we should start up the gas chamber and begin clearing out the huge backlog of filthy SOB's taking up space on death row. To hell with criminals--obey the law, or pay the price.

The facts of the subject you say? Lets look at those facts.

• There are now well over 1.5 million people currently in our nation's prisons (well over 2.2 million if we included jails and other temporary holding facilities.)
• There are over 7 million people in the US under some form of "correctional control." (Probation, monitoring, alternate "controlled" living, etc.)
• We have seen over a 500% increase in prison population in just the past 30 years (Federal inmates have increased over 800% in the same period.)
• Our incarceration rate is well over 700 per 100K, and we lead the planet in this category. No one else is even close, not even China or Russia or India or Iran or Afghanistan or Mexico.
• We now have 102 federal prisons, 1,719 state prisons, 2,259 juvenile correctional facilities, 3,283 local jails, various Indian Country jails, military prisons, immigration detention facilities, civil commitment centers, and prisons in the U.S. territories... all on our dime (those were 2010 numbers, odds are that did not go down.)
• Drug charges account for over 50% of our Federal Prison population, less than 9% of the population is there for "violent" crime.
• By every stat you can find our prison population by race is disproportionate to crimes committed, length of sentence per crime found guilty of, or even American Medical Association reported drug use statistics by race. From arrest to trial to sentencing there is no standard for all US citizens and disparity by both race and income is wildly apparent.

So how many more "lousy bastards" and "scummy bastards I see on the streets" do you need off the streets? Face the facts, our criminal justice system is an expensive, prejudicial, fiasco of total failure to deter crime or keep this nation safe. And you are calling for more of it... priceless. Your statements and conclusions prove why we fail at criminal justice by just about every single measure.

 

[fmw]

Re: The U.S. has more jails than colleges. Here’s a map of where those prisoners live

30,923 inmates in a county?

The U.S. has more jails than colleges. Here’s a map of where those prisoners live. - The Washington Post

So would you close jails or build colleges?

 

[OrphanSlug]

Re: The U.S. has more jails than colleges. Here’s a map of where those prisoners live

So would you close jails or build colleges?

End the war on drugs, remove a sizable portion of the existing prison population there because of the war on drugs, and we might find we need more colleges anyway.

 

[RDS]

Re: The U.S. has more jails than colleges. Here’s a map of where those prisoners live

So would you close jails or build colleges?

You got to ask Obama that question.

 

[Thoreau72]

Re: The U.S. has more jails than colleges. Here’s a map of where those prisoners live

Obeying the law for regular citizens.*

Besides...you actually don't have the proof they broke the law. If you did, we wouldn't have to deal with those idiots anymore. But what laws did they allegedly break? What laws are they supposed to enforce?

Do you consider a failure or refusal to uphold their oath of office to be breaking the law?

 

[blackjack50]

Re: The U.S. has more jails than colleges. Here’s a map of where those prisoners live

Do you consider a failure or refusal to uphold their oath of office to be breaking the law?

Is is written somewhere that it is illegal? Do you have proof they actually refused? Or is this merely a subjective question?

 

[CycloneWanderer]

Re: The U.S. has more jails than colleges. Here’s a map of where those prisoners live

The facts of the subject you say? Lets look at those facts.

• There are now well over 1.5 million people currently in our nation's prisons (well over 2.2 million if we included jails and other temporary holding facilities.)
• There are over 7 million people in the US under some form of "correctional control." (Probation, monitoring, alternate "controlled" living, etc.)
• We have seen over a 500% increase in prison population in just the past 30 years (Federal inmates have increased over 800% in the same period.)
• Our incarceration rate is well over 700 per 100K, and we lead the planet in this category. No one else is even close, not even China or Russia or India or Iran or Afghanistan or Mexico.
• We now have 102 federal prisons, 1,719 state prisons, 2,259 juvenile correctional facilities, 3,283 local jails, various Indian Country jails, military prisons, immigration detention facilities, civil commitment centers, and prisons in the U.S. territories... all on our dime (those were 2010 numbers, odds are that did not go down.)
• Drug charges account for over 50% of our Federal Prison population, less than 9% of the population is there for "violent" crime.
• By every stat you can find our prison population by race is disproportionate to crimes committed, length of sentence per crime found guilty of, or even American Medical Association reported drug use statistics by race. From arrest to trial to sentencing there is no standard for all US citizens and disparity by both race and income is wildly apparent.

So how many more "lousy bastards" and "scummy bastards I see on the streets" do you need off the streets? Face the facts, our criminal justice system is an expensive, prejudicial, fiasco of total failure to deter crime or keep this nation safe. And you are calling for more of it... priceless. Your statements and conclusions prove why we fail at criminal justice by just about every single measure.

In 2011, there were ~21 million people enrolled in post-secondary (college) education. What was your point, again?

 

[OrphanSlug]

Re: The U.S. has more jails than colleges. Here’s a map of where those prisoners live

In 2011, there were ~21 million people enrolled in post-secondary (college) education. What was your point, again?

Anyone with an IQ above their shoe size should have been able to conclude from my post that we incarcerate way too much.