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The Role of the Sun in Global Warming

Ha ha, You fell for the MODELING SIMULATIONS as evidence, they are not real data, but guesses. Over and over she admits they know little about the sun in many ways, don't you use glasses?

Then you now concede that there is good evidence of solar variability. She also stated this which you overlook and actually contradicts herself:



She does allow for solar variability after all.

By the way CO2 warm forcing doesn't warm anything more because the increased outflow of energy from the planet greatly exceeds the postulated increased warm forcing of CO2, but warmists ignore this inconvenience all the time.

Cheers.

What a joke. You clearly don't get science. They know they need refining, but they also know the big picture conclusions won't change. Solar variability is not going to change the conclusions of unprecedented temperature rises of past decades being due to global warming. The gradual changes she is talking about also would not explain it. And the increased outflows you mentioned get trapped in case you did not know.

But sure, you think this scientist is contradicting herself in a single piece because you want to misrepresent what she is talking about and don't like her conclusions... Yeah, you... :lamo
 
What a joke. You clearly don't get science. They know they need refining, but they also know the big picture conclusions won't change. Solar variability is not going to change the conclusions of unprecedented temperature rises of past decades being due to global warming. The gradual changes she is talking about also would not explain it. And the increased outflows you mentioned get trapped in case you did not know.

But sure, you think this scientist is contradicting herself in a single piece because you want to misrepresent what she is talking about and don't like her conclusions... Yeah, you... :lamo

Approximately half of 20th century warming was solar-driven.
 
Acclaimed Israeli Astrophysicist Suggests The Sun Drives Earth's ...


Acclaimed Israeli Astrophysicist Suggests The Sun Drives Earth's Climate, Not CO2 - Electroverse...



Sunday, August 11, 2019 ... Nir Shaviv is an Israeli astrophysicist and chairman of Jerusalem's Hebrew ... But I thought that 97% of climate scientists agreed that human activity is the main driver of ... Both Galactic and Solar Cosmic rays hitting Earth's atmosphere create aerosols which, in turn, seed clouds (Svensmark et al) ...
 
She make's the same error as the IPCC, underestimating the solar contribution by a full order of magnitude.

I hope you let her know right away
 
Approximately half of 20th century warming was solar-driven.

I would say close to 3/4ths or more of the warming since the maunder minima. I think our skies are about as clear as they were in 1750. Since then, the sun's effect directly accounts for little surface warming, except the oceans. However, the extra heat on the surface, provides more initial energy to drive the greenhouse effect. On a strictly TSI related factor, this is already about half of the warming we have seen. However, since the TSI increased since 1713, and increases are significantly more in the shortwave spectra than longwave, the added heat in the oceans if more yet, and have a thermal lag that peak around out current time.

As for the last half of the 20th century alone, much of that is the clearing of the skies of aerosols, and letting more sun in, rather than CO2.
 
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Approximately half of 20th century warming was solar-driven.

I would say close to 3/4ths or more of the warming since the maunder minima. I think our skies are about as clear as they were in 1750.

Aww... Common guys... Just admit it... 200% was solar-driven but human activities are giving us Global Cooling which fortunately counteracts the Suns warming. We should burn some more fossil fuels.
 
Aww... Common guys... Just admit it... 200% was solar-driven but human activities are giving us Global Cooling which fortunately counteracts the Suns warming. We should burn some more fossil fuels.

"Don't criticize what you can't understand." --Bob Dylan
 
[h=2]Forbes censored an interview with me[/h][FONT=&quot]Blog topic:
cosmic rays, global warming, personal research, politics, weather & climate


A few days ago I was interviewed by Doron Levin, for an article to appear online on forbes.com. After having seen a draft (to make sure that I am quoted correctly), I told him good luck with getting it published, as I doubted it will. Why? Because a year ago I was interviewed by a reporter working for Bloomberg, while the cities of San Francisco and Oakland were deliberating a climate change lawsuit against Exxon-Mobil (which the latter won!), only to find out that their editorial board decided that it is inappropriate to publish an interview with a heretic like me. Doron’s reply was to assure me that Forbes’ current model of the publication online allows relative freedom with “relatively little interference from editors”. Yeah Sure.
[/FONT]
 
The AGW Consensus Enforcement Squad seems to have angered Professor Shaviv. I think they'll be sorry.

[h=2]Solar Debunking Arguments are Defunct[/h][FONT=&quot]Blog topic:
global warming, personal research, weather & climate


An article interviewing me was removed yesterday from forbes. Instead, they published an article by Meteorologist Prof. Marshall Shepherd that claims that the sun has no effect on climate. That article, however, falls to the same pitfalls that pointed out on my blog yesterday.
Specifically, why is Shepherd’s arguments faulty? Although I addressed them yesterday, here they are brought again more explicitly and with figures.
[/FONT]
 
The AGW Consensus Enforcement Squad seems to have angered Professor Shaviv. I think they'll be sorry.

[h=2]Solar Debunking Arguments are Defunct[/h][FONT=&quot]Blog topic:
global warming, personal research, weather & climate


An article interviewing me was removed yesterday from forbes. Instead, they published an article by Meteorologist Prof. Marshall Shepherd that claims that the sun has no effect on climate. That article, however, falls to the same pitfalls that pointed out on my blog yesterday.
Specifically, why is Shepherd’s arguments faulty? Although I addressed them yesterday, here they are brought again more explicitly and with figures.
[/FONT]

Fringe science meets reality.
 
What a joke. You clearly don't get science. They know they need refining, but they also know the big picture conclusions won't change. Solar variability is not going to change the conclusions of unprecedented temperature rises of past decades being due to global warming. The gradual changes she is talking about also would not explain it. And the increased outflows you mentioned get trapped in case you did not know.

But sure, you think this scientist is contradicting herself in a single piece because you want to misrepresent what she is talking about and don't like her conclusions... Yeah, you... :lamo

Yet another climate fanatic who does not know the meaning of the word "unprecedented." Why am I not surprised?
 
I would say close to 3/4ths or more of the warming since the maunder minima. I think our skies are about as clear as they were in 1750. Since then, the sun's effect directly accounts for little surface warming, except the oceans. However, the extra heat on the surface, provides more initial energy to drive the greenhouse effect. On a strictly TSI related factor, this is already about half of the warming we have seen. However, since the TSI increased since 1713, and increases are significantly more in the shortwave spectra than longwave, the added heat in the oceans if more yet, and have a thermal lag that peak around out current time.

As for the last half of the 20th century alone, much of that is the clearing of the skies of aerosols, and letting more sun in, rather than CO2.

I wouldn't put much stock in the so-called Maunder Minimum (1645 to 1715). We didn't began to actually track sun spot activity until February 1755 - Solar Cycle #1. The Maunder Minimum was never observed, unlike the Dalton Minimum (1790 to 1830) which was observed. The Maunder Minimum was actually calculated by Edward Maunder in 1890 and 1894.

It does seem rather silly that these climate fanatics would dispute the contribution the sun makes. Especially considering that there wouldn't be ANY warming at all without the sun, regardless of the amount of greenhouse gases. The ever changing climate is a direct result of the sun. Without it we would be a frozen ball of ice, without any climate whatsoever. Nobody has ever accused these socialists of being very bright.
 
The Galactic Cosmic Rays (GCR) hypothesis is not a "new paradigm", it's a failed old hypothesis with no real evidence to support it and plenty of evidence to refute it. A couple of fringe dwellers like Svensmark and Shaviv keep struggling to keep it alive for ideological reasons, not science.

The IPCC reports are an assessment of all the latest published research at the time of the report. See what was said about the GCR hypothesis:

From the IPCC 5th Assessment report. WGI – The Physical Science Basis. Chapter 7 pg 573

https://archive.ipcc.ch/pdf/assessment-report/ar5/wg1/WG1AR5_Chapter07_FINAL.pdf

“the effect on the concentration of cloud condensation nuclei is too weak to have any detectable climatic influence during a solar cycle or over the last century (medium evidence, high agreement). No robust association between changes in cosmic rays and cloudiness has been identified. In the event that such an association existed, a mechanism other than cosmic ray-induced nucleation of new aerosol particles would be needed to explain it. {7.4.6}”​




Since that report in 2013 there have been more research papers putting the nail in the coffin for the failed GCR hypothesis:


Note the one from the CERN CLOUD team because it also pre-addresses the issues with Svensmark's latest paper which is based on CERN CLOUD data.

Dunne, E. M., Gordon, H., Kürten, A., Almeida, J., Duplissy, J., Williamson, C., ... & Barmet, P. (2016). Global atmospheric particle formation from CERN CLOUD measurements. Science, 354(6316), 1119-1124.


"New particle formation in the atmosphere produces around half of the cloud condensation nuclei that seed cloud droplets. Such particles have a pivotal role in determining the properties of clouds and the global radiation balance. Dunne et al. used the CLOUD (Cosmics Leaving Outdoor Droplets) chamber at CERN to construct a model of aerosol formation based on laboratory-measured nucleation rates. They found that nearly all nucleation involves either ammonia or biogenic organic compounds. Furthermore, in the present-day atmosphere, cosmic ray intensity cannot meaningfully affect climate via nucleation."​


Erlykin, A. D., Sloan, T., & Wolfendale, A. W. (2013). A review of the relevance of the ‘CLOUD’ results and other recent observations to the possible effect of cosmic rays on the terrestrial climate. Meteorology and Atmospheric Physics, 121(3-4), 137-142.

The problem of the contribution of cosmic rays to climate change is a continuing one and one of importance. In principle, at least, the recent results from the CLOUD project at CERN provide information about the role of ionizing particles in ’sensitizing’ atmospheric aerosols which might, later, give rise to cloud droplets. Our analysis shows that, although important in cloud physics the results do not lead to the conclusion that cosmic rays affect atmospheric clouds significantly, at least if H2SO4 is the dominant source of aerosols in the atmosphere. An analysis of the very recent studies of stratospheric aerosol changes following a giant solar energetic particles event shows a similar negligible effect. Recent measurements of the cosmic ray intensity show that a former decrease with time has been reversed. Thus, even if cosmic rays enhanced cloud production, there would be a small global cooling, not warming

LOL riight, they used a computer model (which can show whatever you want it to show by just inputting the correct numbers) to refute it? I wouldnt trust that kind of analysis with a ten foot pole.
 
LOL riight, they used a computer model (which can show whatever you want it to show by just inputting the correct numbers) to refute it? I wouldnt trust that kind of analysis with a ten foot pole.
LOL riight. As if you have a clue about anything. You don't even know what the papers are about. You couldn't have even clicked on the link to the Dunne et al paper, because I just realized the link I gave in my post was incorrect.

Here's the correct link, which I know you won't click on and read anyway, because you don't actually want to know about any of the science. You just want to push silly conspiracy theories and attack your own lame strawman "arguments".

Global atmospheric particle formation from CERN CLOUD measurements | Science

But hey, you can be the one to tell Jack Hays his pet GCR hypothesis is rubbish as his hero Svensmark's latest paper used the CERN CLOUD chamber and models too. ;)
 
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Fringe science meets reality.

It's like a Creationist who can't accept the theory of evolution so he desperately cites blog posts from fringe scientists about Intelligent Design to try to protect his faith.
 
It's like a Creationist who can't accept the theory of evolution so he desperately cites blog posts from fringe scientists about Intelligent Design to try to protect his faith.

You are afraid to engage the substance so you make up a strawman to show your friends.
 
LOL riight. As if you have a clue about anything. You don't even know what the papers are about. You couldn't have even clicked on the link to the Dunne et al paper, because I just realized the link I gave in my post was incorrect.

Here's the correct link, which I know you won't click on and read anyway, because you don't actually want to know about any of the science. You just want to push silly conspiracy theories and attack your own lame strawman "arguments".

Global atmospheric particle formation from CERN CLOUD measurements | Science

But hey, you can be the one to tell Jack Hays his pet GCR hypothesis is rubbish as his hero Svensmark's latest paper used the CERN CLOUD chamber and models too. ;)

[h=3]Increased ionization supports growth of aerosols into cloud ... - Nature[/h]
[url]https://www.nature.com
› nature communications › articles
[/URL]

by H Svensmark - ‎2017 - ‎Cited by 20 - ‎Related articles
Dec 19, 2017 - Ions produced by cosmic rays have been thought to influence aerosols and clouds. In this study, the effect of ionization on the growth of ...
 
I wouldn't put much stock in the so-called Maunder Minimum (1645 to 1715). We didn't began to actually track sun spot activity until February 1755 - Solar Cycle #1. The Maunder Minimum was never observed, unlike the Dalton Minimum (1790 to 1830) which was observed. The Maunder Minimum was actually calculated by Edward Maunder in 1890 and 1894.

It does seem rather silly that these climate fanatics would dispute the contribution the sun makes. Especially considering that there wouldn't be ANY warming at all without the sun, regardless of the amount of greenhouse gases. The ever changing climate is a direct result of the sun. Without it we would be a frozen ball of ice, without any climate whatsoever. Nobody has ever accused these socialists of being very bright.

There are two things that they actively ignore, as being changing values.

The optical depth of the atmosphere, and the fact that any change of insolation changes the power of the greenhouse gasses.
 
You are afraid to engage the substance so you make up a strawman to show your friends.

Wow, you don't know what a strawman argument is?

Your posts and opinions have no substance. You mostly "argue" by posting copied and pasted conspiracy junkscience blog posts with no commentary of your own and making snide puerile one liners. But keep on being you.
 
Wow, you don't know what a strawman argument is?

Your posts and opinions have no substance. You mostly "argue" by posting copied and pasted conspiracy junkscience blog posts with no commentary of your own and making snide puerile one liners. But keep on being you.

You fear the substance.
 
LOL riight. As if you have a clue about anything. You don't even know what the papers are about. You couldn't have even clicked on the link to the Dunne et al paper, because I just realized the link I gave in my post was incorrect.

Here's the correct link, which I know you won't click on and read anyway, because you don't actually want to know about any of the science. You just want to push silly conspiracy theories and attack your own lame strawman "arguments".

Global atmospheric particle formation from CERN CLOUD measurements | Science

But hey, you can be the one to tell Jack Hays his pet GCR hypothesis is rubbish as his hero Svensmark's latest paper used the CERN CLOUD chamber and models too. ;)

I dont click on your links since your posts have always been dishonest- and this latest one that you even openly admit to. I merely made the argument from the quote you gave me, and thats good enough since the BS you put out is meaningless anyway.
 
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