The problem with education in the US today....

[Josie]

There are many, but this one is the lead problem BY FAR:

 

[Summerwind]

There are many, but this one is the lead problem BY FAR:

I was neither loved at home nor did I seek it out at school. WTF bull**** is this. You want to see the most hungry for acceptance, which could be construed as "seeking love" are the popular girls and boys who need it so much as to demonize others in order to get it. And rarely does anyone get the sense those self-centered kids "unloved" at home.

This is just ridiculous. Please provide some sense of research to back it up if you really think it isn't complete crap.

 

[MaggieD]

There are many, but this one is the lead problem BY FAR:

Wow, that img is powerful, Josie. Just imagine...

 

[Summerwind]

The biggest and most real problem with education is that the teaching is underfunded while administration and certain sports are both over-funded and over-valued.

 

[Summerwind]

Wow, that img is powerful, Josie. Just imagine...

It's also a total fallacy. Think about it, the kids not loved at home, they are the ones usually picked on or trying to disappear in the corner, how are they being a problem?

I can't believe y'all are going to try to validate blaming unloved kids for problems with education.

What a monstrous position.

 

[sangha]

The problem is that we have far too many children with parents who lack the skills needed to succeed and therefor are unable to pass those skills onto their children.

 

[Your Star]

It's also a total fallacy. Think about it, the kids not loved at home, they are the ones usually picked on or trying to disappear in the corner, how are they being a problem?

I can't believe y'all are going to try to validate blaming unloved kids for problems with education.

What a monstrous position.

It's not the kids it's the parents.

 

[Summerwind]

The problem is that we have far too many children with parents who lack the skills needed to succeed and therefor are unable to pass those skills onto their children.

And many of those parents with the skills have no time to teach the skills as they work 2-3 jobs and have no time or energy for their children.

 

[mtm1963]

The problem is that we have far too many children with parents who lack the skills needed to succeed and therefor are unable to pass those skills onto their children.

yes, its about the parents for the most part.

 

[Summerwind]

It's not the kids it's the parents.

It's also not the parents' fault. Somehow these days we are expecting people to be able to work 2-3 jobs to stay afloat and still be great parents. Until people can earn a living wage in a normal days worktime, it's stupid to blame parents.

 

[sedan]

I believe that the children are the future. Now listen, you can teach them, but buddy, you have got to let them lead the way. Let the children's laughter just remind us how we used to be. That's what I decided long ago.

 

[sangha]

yes, its about the parents for the most part.

Yes, it's about the parents, but not *just* about the parents. There are cultural issues involved; specifically the culture of poverty

It's going to take more than a welfare check to solve this problem

 

[Summerwind]

Yes, it's about the parents, but not *just* about the parents. There are cultural issues involved; specifically the culture of poverty

It's going to take more than a welfare check to solve this problem

Exactly, it's going to take average folks making a living wage while working normal hours. It's also going to take a change in the national attitude about those people and parents who aren't enriched.

I know there is a lot more pressure from students and teachers and administrators on children whose parents are of lower income, and inappropriately high levels of excuse are offered to those with parents of higher incomes, constantly re-affirming to children of the lower income parents that their parents, their lives are less worthy.

 

[Josie]

You can grow up in poverty and still be loved by your parents. It's not about income level or jobs or money - it's about parents who don't give a damn.

 

[Josie]

The biggest and most real problem with education is that the teaching is underfunded while administration and certain sports are both over-funded and over-valued.

Please tell me how paying teachers more is going to stop a 1st grader from worrying if his dad is going to beat up his mom again. How does it stop the single mom who stays out all night partying, never returns calls about her child and doesn't give a flying crap what grades he gets? How does paying teachers more change ANYTHING about the main reason why kids fail in school --- their homelife.

 

[nota bene]

Yes, it is, Josie, and some of those unconcerned, uninvolved parents are very comfortable too.

Parents and others talk about how important education is, but they don't walk the talk. They themselves don't instill in their children the essential value of an education; they simply demand expect grades.

You can throw all the money in the world after education, but it won't change anything until folks genuinely value education. That means parents allowing their children to fail. That means not forcing teachers to call failure "delayed success."

What I see in college students now are the most underprepared, culturally (historically, economically, mathematically) ignorant kids I've ever seen. Profs don't have time (unless they simply fail underperforming students, and many are pressured not to because every student "deserves" to know that they can be "successful") to cover the material they should because they're having to do so much remedial--often junior-high level--work.

These kids have never had any practice in critical thinking and are unfamiliar with basic words such as "argument" and "controversy" and basic concepts such as facts vs opinions. Just pathetic. I'm not blaming the teachers; I realize that most are doing the very best they can under difficult circumstances--pressure from bean-counting admins from above and helicopter parents from below.

But the day is coming when the "best and the brightest" who enter the professions, including medicine, are going to be the dummies who never would have been considered for graduate work even 15 years ago. And that, dear readers, will have a profound effect on us all.

 

[Risky Thicket]

There are many, but this one is the lead problem BY FAR:

I was neither loved at home nor did I seek it out at school. WTF bull**** is this. You want to see the most hungry for acceptance, which could be construed as "seeking love" are the popular girls and boys who need it so much as to demonize others in order to get it. And rarely does anyone get the sense those self-centered kids "unloved" at home.

This is just ridiculous. Please provide some sense of research to back it up if you really think it isn't complete crap.

The problem is that we have far too many children with parents who lack the skills needed to succeed and therefor are unable to pass those skills onto their children.

Having had more experience than I ever wanted as a school board member (if you are committed to it, it is a difficult job) I found one thing concerning education to be axiomatic; consistently, the children who work closest to and even exceed their potential are the children whose parents are involved in their education. Yes, there are exceptions to the rule. There are few absolutes in life. I seem to find myself saying that a lot on DP.

Yes, there are kids who do well regardless. Yes, there are kids who have all the love and support they can get from home yet remain largely unmotivated. It is to my thinking silly to believe that all children are ready to learn all things at the same time. That just doesn't happen. However, if you take all students who reach or exceed their learning potential in school, at any given time you will find that the greatest common denominator is that their parents are actively involved in their education. It is true across the board, even for children with special needs.

I agree with Josie.

 

[rabbitcaebannog]

I think of Maslow's pyramid. Certain basic needs need to be met before the highest can be attained. Never mind just love, I still have kids without physiological or safety needs being met. If they are hungry or suffering anxiety, how are they going to achieve the same as those who are not? They don't have to expend the same resources needed in order to truly concentrate on learning.

 

[Summerwind]

You can grow up in poverty and still be loved by your parents. It's not about income level or jobs or money - it's about parents who don't give a damn.

You can be loved by a parent and still have a parent without the time or energy to help you succeed in school. Clearly you have no clue how much time some people spend working, on their way to and from working, and so on.

 

[Summerwind]

Please tell me how paying teachers more is going to stop a 1st grader from worrying if his dad is going to beat up his mom again. How does it stop the single mom who stays out all night partying, never returns calls about her child and doesn't give a flying crap what grades he gets? How does paying teachers more change ANYTHING about the main reason why kids fail in school --- their homelife.

If those were the only impoverished kids with issues that can be traced to parents, then you'd have a point. Some otherwise really good people are parents with simply no time or energy left, even though they don't beat anyone or do drugs or stay out drinking.

What a piece you are to stereotype impoverished parents thusly.

 

[Summerwind]

I think of Maslow's pyramid. Certain basic needs need to be met before the highest can be attained. Never mind just love, I still have kids without physiological or safety needs being met. If they are hungry or suffering anxiety, how are they going to achieve the same as those who are not? They don't have to expend the same resources needed in order to truly concentrate on learning.

Exactly and though parents may try, we live in a society that if the parents can't (note the word "can't" as opposed to "won't") meet all the needs of health, hunger, and safety, society simply blames the parents, which is what we are seeing here in this thread.

 

[rabbitcaebannog]

Exactly and though parents may try, we live in a society that if the parents can't (note the word "can't" as opposed to "won't") meet all the needs of health, hunger, and safety, society simply blames the parents, which is what we are seeing here in this thread.

I worked in a low income school and saw many cases where parents had no other choice but to work two or more shifts/jobs just to put food on the table. Now working in a pretty middle income school, parents still are struggling to make ends meet. I don't think things are as easy as when I grew up and only one of my parents who had to work to put food on the table. Even my husband's mother could do this as a single parent just 40 years ago. I had young parents and my dad worked a deli job to put himself through college after the Vietnam War and raise a family. Have a college kid do that now without a child on a deli job. College is just so unaffordable and things are harder than ever for kids to make a living without a leg up. I think it's sad.

 

[Josie]

If those were the only impoverished kids with issues that can be traced to parents, then you'd have a point. Some otherwise really good people are parents with simply no time or energy left, even though they don't beat anyone or do drugs or stay out drinking.

What a piece you are to stereotype impoverished parents thusly.

You're totally missing or misconstruing the point of the OP. We're not talking about parents who work their asses off to take care of their kids. We're talking about parents who DON'T care about their kids. I work in a low income school. Most of the kids whose parents don't give a damn don't even work. Those who work like crazy because they don't want their kids to starve come to meetings, answer phone calls and make sure their kid has her homework done.

You're trying to turn this into an income thing when it's a HEART thing.

 

[Summerwind]

You're totally missing or misconstruing the point of the OP. We're not talking about parents who work their asses off to take care of their kids. We're talking about parents who DON'T care about their kids. I work in a low income school. Most of the kids whose parents don't give a damn don't even work. Those who work like crazy because they don't want their kids to starve come to meetings, answer phone calls and make sure their kid has her homework done.

You're trying to turn this into an income thing when it's a HEART thing.

You're trying to ignore the income thing and that's hateful to both the child and the parent. Surely when your school is entirely impoverished you fail to see the differences between how the impoverished are treated vs those that aren't. And though your excellent impoverished kids have parents with the ability to make time and energy to help them succeed, those kids will still not hold a candle to a not-impoverished kid of lazy parents, much less one not-impoverished with active parents.

Just for clarification, I used lazy parents, and should've used "lazy" parents as I was paraphrasing your opinion, not mine.

 

[mtm1963]

Yes, it's about the parents, but not *just* about the parents. There are cultural issues involved; specifically the culture of poverty

It's going to take more than a welfare check to solve this problem

over 20% of students don't graduate high school. take that 20% and look at their parents. what do you think you will find?