The Modern GOP in a Nutshell

[aociswundumho]

How many Democratic politicians are communists, as in full supporters of Stalinism or Maoism, the way this Republican is a full supporter of Nazism?

Bernie, for decades, advocated for the US to nationalize industry, and he had his honeymoon in the USSR. His personal hero was eugene debs, who called himself a bolshevik and proud of it. For those who don't know, the bolsheviks were extremely murderous. He named his softball team "the vermont reds". He had a soviet flag hanging in his office in burlington. When closing letters, instead of "yours truly" or "sincerely", Sanders would often use "venceremos", as a shout out to mass murderer Che Guevara.

I'll stop there, but there's a lot more.

 

[TangoNoCash]

They will say AOC or Bernie or Mamdani are “communists”, and that the social democracy/democratic socialism they support is “communism”, but when we point to social democracies as examples of successful communism they will get butthurt and say “that’s capitalism!”

So they don’t know what communism is? Figured as much.

Edit: You called it. The ignorance is profound but not surprising.

 

[Questerr]

Bernie, for decades, advocated for the US to nationalize industry, and he had his honeymoon in the USSR. His personal hero was eugene debs, who called himself a bolshevik and proud of it. For those who don't know, the bolsheviks were extremely murderous. He named his softball team "the vermont reds". He had a soviet flag hanging in his office in burlington. When closing letters, instead of "yours truly" or "sincerely", Sanders would often use "venceremos", as a shout out to mass murderer Che Guevara.

I'll stop there, but there's a lot more.

Sanders advocates for Stalinism?

European countries have a bunch of nationalized industries. So we can point to them as examples of communism, yes?

 

[aociswundumho]

They will say AOC or Bernie or Mamdani are “communists”,

All three describe themselves as socialists. Aoc and Mamdani are both active members of the dsa.

and that the social democracy/democratic socialism they support is “communism”,

Those two are not the same thing.

but when we point to social democracies as examples of successful communism they will get butthurt and say “that’s capitalism!”

Because in a mixed economy, all of the wealth is created on the capitalist side. You'll note that every single country which as eliminated the capitalist side turns into a dirt poor, authoritarian shit hole.

 

[aociswundumho]

Sanders advocates for Stalinism?

No socialist advocates for stalinism. But when the state owns everything and controls everything, stalinism appears all by itself.

European countries have a bunch of nationalized industries. So we can point to them as examples of communism, yes?

No, they're called mixed economies.

 

[Questerr]

All three describe themselves as socialists. Aoc and Mamdani are both active members of the dsa.



Those two are not the same thing.



Because in a mixed economy, all of the wealth is created on the capitalist side. You'll note that every single country which as eliminated the capitalist side turns into a dirt poor, authoritarian shit hole.

And all the human wellbeing metrics are created on the socialist side. The capitalist side is great for making billionaires into human dragons on piles of gold. If isn’t very good at keeping disabled people from starving to death, or keeping a highly educated populace, or having a functional civil society.

But thank you for confirming we can point to the social democracies of Europe as examples of successful communism since you want to call advocates for policies like those in Europe “communists”.

 

[Questerr]

No socialist advocates for stalinism. But when the state owns everything and controls everything, stalinism appears all by itself.



No, they're called mixed economies.

So then advocating for nationalized industries doesn’t make one a communist and isn’t communism.

You don’t get to have it both ways.

 

[aociswundumho]

And all the human wellbeing metrics are created on the socialist side.

If that were true, socialism would work just fine with no capitalism. It doesn't. Remove capitalism and you get shit holes like north korea or cuba.

Therefore the "human wellbeing metrics" do not come from socialism, because if they did, they would exist in north korea and cuba.

The capitalist side is great for making billionaires into human dragons on piles of gold. If isn’t very good at keeping disabled people from starving to death, or keeping a highly educated populace, or having a functional civil society.

Even the people who hate libertarians know that the above is total bullshit. You are not fooling anyone.

But thank you for confirming we can point to the social democracies of Europe as examples of successful communism since you want to call advocates for policies like those in Europe “communists”.

 

[Questerr]

Just a reminder to counter the Rights desperate attempts to derail the thread:

The GOP is being silent about a leading gubernatorial nominee openly supporting Nazism.

The GOP is okay with Nazis in their party.

 

[Questerr]

If that were true, socialism would work just fine with no capitalism. It doesn't. Remove capitalism and you get shit holes like north korea or cuba.

Therefore the "human wellbeing metrics" do not come from socialism, because if they did, they would exist in north korea and cuba.



Even the people who hate libertarians know that the above is total bullshit. You are not fooling anyone.

Remove DEMOCRACY and you get North Korea and Cuba. Capitalist dictatorships don’t exactly have high ratings of human wellbeing either. But democracy is anathema to capitalism. You’ve said so yourself.

 

[NJBob]

Communist regimes killed more people than the nazis. Of course the holocaust horrifies us, but Stalin's famines and purges, Mao's great leap backward, cultural revolution, and pol pot's genocide in Cambodia all involved mass death, forced labor, and totalitarian terror - often targeting their own people. Communist governments killed at least 5x more than the nazis did, from starvation, gulags, executions, and forced collectivization.

The nazis were racist murderers and the communists were classist murderers. The nazis targeted Jews, roma, and others based on race, while communists targeted the "bourgeoisie," landowners, intellectuals, and even workers who disagreed with them. Both collectivist ideologies dehumanized entire categories of people and justified their extermination in the name of a utopian goal.

Both demanded total control over the individual. Under both kinds of governments, the state was god. There was no free press, no political dissent, no civil liberties. The nazis had the gestapo; the soviets had the nkdv. Same boot, different logo.

Sure, regimes that claimed to be communist. I completely agree with that but communism itself is akin to the early Christian church. As an economic system it isn’t inherently evil.

 

[aociswundumho]

But democracy is anathema to capitalism. You’ve said so yourself.

Yep, but the historical record shows that it's still more compatible than socialism.

 

[Lycanthrope]

Why is anyone surprised by this.

This is a GOP norm. Be as disgusting as possible knowing there will be ZERO backlash from the base.

I have to hope this is not the norm. This guy's soul is clearly twisted.

 

[Hari Seldon]

One of the candidates for the Republican Party nomination in CA posts that that his "0% unemployment plan" is Auschwitz.

California gov. hopeful makes antisemitic Auschwitz comment | The Jerusalem Post

California's candidate Langford said he was proud of his "German ancestry" and called Auschwitz a "great work camp," sparking controversy.

www.jpost.com

Response from the California GOP: *crickets*

No expulsion from the party. No denunciation. Not even a single mention on their social media.

The GOP is okay with Nazis in the party. That's all you need to know about them.

I posted about that asshole. Skychief thought he was terrific until he saw the twitter feed.

 

[reflechissez]

@aociswundumho thinks they are worse because private property and capitalism are the only things he believes in. Human suffering and genocide are okay if they maximize profits.

He's a broken record, and a boring one at that.

 

[Questerr]

Yep, but the historical record shows that it's still more compatible than socialism.

Except it doesn’t because the most successful countries in the world are a blend of democracy and socialism using your own arbitrary and hypocritically applied definition of socialism.

 

[Questerr]

I posted about that asshole. Skychief thought he was terrific until he saw the twitter feed.

Yeah, and then like the GOP at large, he couldn’t bring himself to actually condemn Langford or call for him to be expelled from the party.

 

[aociswundumho]

Except it doesn’t because the most successful countries in the world are a blend of democracy and socialism using your own arbitrary and hypocritically applied definition of socialism.

But the more socialist they become the less democratic they become. We've had close to laissez-faire capitalism and there was no pressure to form a one party state. However no socialist state that I know of has allowed free and fair elections. If you disagree, name the country and government.

 

[Questerr]

But the more socialist they become the less democratic they become. We've had close to laissez-faire capitalism and there was no pressure to form a one party state. However no socialist state that I know of has allowed free and fair elections. If you disagree, name the country and government.

Norway is very socialist by your metrics: nationalized industries, strong unions, huge social welfare systems. And their democracy is stronger than the most capitalist states in Europe.

 

[aociswundumho]

Norway is very socialist by your metrics: nationalized industries, strong unions, huge social welfare systems. And their democracy is stronger than the most capitalist states in Europe.

Norway is a petro-state, but they still have a mixed economy, and on some charts ranks higher in economic freedom than the US. Economic freedom is what you are against, in case you forgot.

 

[Questerr]

Norway is a petro-state, but they still have a mixed economy, and on some charts ranks higher in economic freedom than the US. Economic freedom is what you are against, in case you forgot.

Once again you are trying to have it both ways.

 

[Questerr]

Norway is a petro-state, but they still have a mixed economy, and on some charts ranks higher in economic freedom than the US. Economic freedom is what you are against, in case you forgot.

Also I’m not against economic freedom. I support it more than you do.

I am opposed dictatorships in the economic sphere as much as I am against them in the political sphere. You believe dictatorships in the economy are sacrosanct and should be protected at all costs.

 

[eohrnberger]

One stupid politician says something stupid, and then stupidly doubles down on it, and suddenly he's the exemplar for the entire party?
That, in and of itself, is stupid as well.

 

[Questerr]

One stupid politician says something stupid, and then stupidly doubles down on it, and suddenly he's the exemplar for the entire party?
That, in and of itself, is stupid as well.

The silence of the party speaks volumes.

If this had been a Democrat saying this, the Republicans would have jumped on it, plastered it all over Fox News and OAN, and have nonstop calls for him to resign.

Instead, they can even bring themselves to condemn him, let alone expel him from the party.

Republicans are okay with their party nominees being Nazis.

 

[eohrnberger]

The silence of the party speaks volumes.

In similar fashion, the resounding silence from the then House Speaker Pelosi on Omar trafficking in antisemitism and antisemitic tropes, until forced to say something (and do nothing).

If this had been a Democrat saying this, the Republicans would have jumped on it, plastered it all over Fox News and OAN, and have nonstop calls for him to resign.

Instead, they can even bring themselves to condemn him, let alone expel him from the party.

In my experience, stupid politicians who say stupid things don't go far, but there are exceptions, such as the 'Squad' in the House.

Republicans are okay with their party nominees being Nazis.

This a false equivalency to drive the demanded narrative and innuendo based smearing. Disregarded for being the bullshit that it is.