The justification for wealth-redistribution.[W:2037]

[PMZ]

Re: The justification for wealth-redistribution.

Few on this forum could care less about "unbiblical". I'm not knocking religion, believe whatever you wish, but there is little room for religion in economics.

That said, I always thought that Jesus was somewhat of a socialist, Marx even paraphrased the socialist sections of the bible.

Most Conservatives only recognize wealth redistribution down. They believe that when it's up, it's earned, and those that don't need it are entitled to it.

 

[PMZ]

Re: The justification for wealth-redistribution.

And the saddest part is that most do not want to get out of that situation.

For several years I was associated with a non-profit Veteran shelter. This was not run by the VA, but a private organization. And they would take just about any Veteran that came to them, so long as they were drug and alcohol free for at least 30 days.

And the 2 biggest problems they had was keeping out those that were not Vets, and of getting Vets who were clean the mandatory time and would stay clean. I think the fail rate for their 6 month program was about 60%, primarily because of drugs. But of course, the largest problem was actually getting real Vets in the first place.

I was living there and helping out at various "Homeless Vet Stand-Downs", and I saw the problem first hand. Most of those events are during 3 day weekends, like Veterans and Memorial Days.

First day, we would have tents and showers and medical care and the like set up for the "Homeless Vets". We would clean them up, give them new clothes, and get them help with either us or the VA. And we would be swamped, literally 400-500 people filling the "Tent City", and the VA would be scrambling to get confirmation of military service for these individuals.

By day 2, we might have 200-300 people, almost all of the others asked to leave when the VA could not verify any kind of military service.

On Day 3, literally only a few were left. On average, 75-80% were shown to have no military service at all. And the rest normally had dependence issues, and did not want help getting cleaned up at all, they just wanted some free stuff.

But we normally helped 100 or so real veterans to some degree, generally arranging some kind of program for around 10-15% of those.

I was lucky, in that I never lost hope. My homelessness was economic, not because of drugs or alcohol or mental illness. In LA, if you are out of work for more then 2 months you are in serious danger of loosing your home, because unemployment does not even pay the rent, let alone all your other expenses. So I would cycle between loosing my home, working to get back into a place again, then loosing it again when I had to look for work. That was my main motivation for leaving that area, I could not stand living in that kind of cycle anymore.

There are many people of all ages who will never get out of that rut. They just live on the edge of survival. They can't hold their lives together long enough to have any cushion.

 

[PMZ]

Re: Supreme Court Responsibilities

Even animals have the concept of property. Try hopping over the fence belonging to a well-trained dog and tell him what's inside doesn't belong to him. Let us know how that conversation goes.

Again, the conversation was about real property.

 

[Oozlefinch]

Re: The justification for wealth-redistribution.

We are presently at about 7% of those who want to work are unemployed. You're saying they don't really want to?

No, there are a great many factors involved.

In the US right now, unemployment runs from as low as 2.6% (where they are often offering insane bonuses even for jobs like McDonalds), all the way to 9% in Nevada and Rhode Island (where even fast food jobs are fought over).

To me, a lot of the major differences between today and 60 years ago is the unwillingness to relocate. During the Depression, millions of people moved, many of them to the West which still had jobs and was not hit as bad as the Midwest and East coasts were. And today, many areas like Dakotas are starving for workers, nobody however seems to be moving there.

When I left Active Duty 2 years ago, we had several reps of Oil Drilling and support companies offering big bonuses to work in North and South Dakota. Security, truck drivers, mechanics, even Fast Food.

Food Preparation Person
Hours: Morning, Afternoon, Evening
Pay: $11.00 D.O.E. & Availability
Description: Work closely with co-workers to prepare our quality products. Coordination and concentration come in handy as ou master a variety of menu items. Fits all walks of life: *Seniors * Moms * Teens * Adults.

Benefits: Advancement Opportunities * Free Uniforms * Free meals while working * 401(k) * McDonald's Crew Insurance * AFLAC Insurance * Direct Deposit * Eligible for wage increase every 750 hours worked * Work schedule that helps manage your life and your time * $300 sign on bonus * $50/month Perfect Attendance Bonus

Job Opportunities - Kelley's McDonald's

This is in a state where the minimum wage is only $7.25 per hour.

 

[FederalRepublic]

Re: The justification for wealth-redistribution.

You see that "framework" as only the rules benefiting you?

More or less, yeah. It doesn't directly benefit be that I'm not allowed to steal from my neighbor. It does directly benefit me that he's not allowed to steal from me.

 

[FederalRepublic]

Re: The justification for wealth-redistribution.

What do you suggest for the "bloodsuckers" at the poor end of the spectrum? Starve them? Shoot them. Make them responsible? Enslave them?

As long as they don't infringe on someone else's rights, leave them be. There's no reason to deny them the ability to buy food, shoot them, enslave them, or force them to do anything. That was a nice straw man though.

 

[Hard Truth]

Re: The justification for wealth-redistribution.

....

I was lucky, in that I never lost hope. My homelessness was economic, not because of drugs or alcohol or mental illness. In LA, if you are out of work for more then 2 months you are in serious danger of loosing your home, because unemployment does not even pay the rent, let alone all your other expenses. So I would cycle between loosing my home, working to get back into a place again, then loosing it again when I had to look for work. That was my main motivation for leaving that area, I could not stand living in that kind of cycle anymore.

People who are not mentally ill or addicted before they became homeless are likely to end up that way if they stay homeless too long. Being despised and sleeping on the ground will do that to most people. Preliminary evidence is indicating that when people are housed without being required to kick their addictions first often will clean up shortly after their lives are stabilized with housing.

 

[FederalRepublic]

Re: The justification for wealth-redistribution.

Workers create wealth. You obviously have no respect for work. Yet you've found a way to get customers to pay you for the mere fact that you (and probably the bank) own the means of production.

Do you tell your workers and customers often how little regard you have for them?

I've been a worker all my life. I've dug ditches, waited tables, delivered pizza, rounded up grocery carts I have great regard for them (and myself). I found a way to get a customer (my employer) to pay me to help them make profits. I have great regard for them as well. If I didn't, I would work for someone else. The best part about being a worker is that I could walk away tomorrow and lose nothing. The same could not be said of my employer.

 

[FederalRepublic]

Re: The justification for wealth-redistribution.

What else can a group be within a population than a minority or majority?

Majority rule = tyranny.

 

[FederalRepublic]

Re: The justification for wealth-redistribution.

I see, like all conservatives, you don't do solutions.

Then we don't need any of you in government.

You don't have solutions. You create problems, and then blame others for the problems you create. Typical.

 

[FederalRepublic]

Re: The justification for wealth-redistribution.

So, you agree with your fellow skin heads that the cure for poverty is more of it.

Like I said, there is no need for brilliance like that in politics.

No. The cure for poverty is to be productive. Another nice straw man though. Also another problem that you've compounded with your "good intentions", yet insist on blaming others for.

 

[Gina]

Re: The justification for wealth-redistribution.

Moderator's Warning:

The personal comments need to stop. Attack the post, not the poster and stick to the topic.

 

[FederalRepublic]

Re: The justification for wealth-redistribution.

And businesses have also been known to use violence against unions...and no one can deny that businesses are sometimes involved in organized crime, too.

In other words, your post is like the pot calling the kettle black.

Am I the pot calling the kettle black if I point out that someone else is a pot calling the kettle black? In that case, your post is like the pot calling the kettle black.

 

[FederalRepublic]

Re: Supreme Court Responsibilities

I have no idea what you're disagreeing with.

Which makes it even funnier. Thanks again.:donkeyfla

 

[FederalRepublic]

Re: The justification for wealth-redistribution.

Uh-huh.

And how many ghettos have you lived in?

Well, I have lived for years in Compton and Inglewood (as well as others like Stockton and Vallejo). So I think I got a bit more experience there then you do.

I have also been homeless for over 2 years, so I have a good idea what is available for free-cheap food as well. How about you?

The problem here is apparently that you are looking from somewhere up high, looking down at what you think the problem is. Myself, I have lived there and done that. From 1999-2003 I was on the streets about as much as I had a roof over my head. This was my main motivation to get the hell out of LA, and get to a place where I could afford to live off of my income.

I left LA in 2003, and have never been homeless since.

Don't you know you can't escape the ghetto? How dare you eviscerate leftist talking points in such a fashion!

:flame:

 

[Master PO]

Re: Supreme Court Responsibilities

Free will breeds factions. They are an inseparable part of humanity. And, until they become extremists, a useful part. Diversity is good.

by having power of democracy all in only one set of hands, all faction has to be is persuade , seduce, and beguile, THE ONE.

by having power divided, faction has to persuade, seduce and beguile, THE TWO.

and since the TWO, HAVE DIFFERENT INTEREST, it is more difficult for faction to operate.

 

[FederalRepublic]

Re: The justification for wealth-redistribution.

Minimum wage would put a family of 3 well below federal poverty standards. Mom, Dad, baby.

That means we have to subsidize their employer...

Why is that? Oh, right. Leftist policy encouraging people to be unproductive, and then blaming someone else for the problems it causes.:slapme:

 

[Master PO]

Re: Supreme Court Responsibilities

i'm referring to real property.

property is many things, your body, things you create, things you work for...money, or material objects.

 

[Master PO]

Re: Supreme Court Responsibilities

I don't believe that sticking the state legislature in between Senators and constituents accomplishes anything.

but it does, its a check and balance of the constitution, becuase it prevents the federal government from usurping states powers......becuase the senate is in the hands of the states........and the senate is not going to pass any bill which seeks to limit them powers.

this keeps the federal government from creating federal laws, which usurping with states powers and expanding government outside of the constitution.

 

[Master PO]

Re: Supreme Court Responsibilities

One of us doesn't understand Constitutional Law. I will admit that you've invested more in the marketing of the Constitution at the time of its writing, but, if anything, that has made it more difficult for you to understand modern US government.

when you tell me modern u.s. government ....all it tells me is you not for constitutional laws, and the checks and balances of the government, that you want them removed, and they you wonder why government is corrupt.

those checks and balances are there to limit corruption in our federal government, and prevent any one branch from having to much power.

 

[Master PO]

Re: Supreme Court Responsibilities

I respect completely the Constitution as it has evolved and is applied today. You'd like to unravel almost 250 years of progress and return to a completely different time. That's not possible.

i think thing so, since you like the government the way it is today, with its unconstitutional acts, and its far outside its delegated powers.

 

[PMZ]

Re: The justification for wealth-redistribution.

Why is that? Oh, right. Leftist policy encouraging people to be unproductive, and then blaming someone else for the problems it causes.:slapme:

Do you feel like "leftist policy" is encouraging you to be unproductive?

 

[Master PO]

Re: Supreme Court Responsibilities

The good old bogieman.

Democracy gives people power over government. Minority rule is always tyranny. And the triumph of special interests over common interests.

really?.... so you saying the majority can never be tyrannical?

america is not suppose to have minority rule or majority rule, that is why we have a constitution, ..but you wish to turn the constitution upside down, and go to majority rule.

 

[PMZ]

Re: Supreme Court Responsibilities

property is many things, your body, things you create, things you work for...money, or material objects.

I'm referring to real property.

 

[ludin]

Re: The justification for wealth-redistribution.

Do you feel like "leftist policy" is encouraging you to be unproductive?

It is becoming more of a pain to have a job than not have a job. it isn't to fun to see other people get benefits that you have to pay for yet because you work and earn money you get nothing in return except the next tax bill.