The importance of civility when discussing History

[I_Gaze_At_The_Blue]

But your whinge FAILS in that there was a CLEAR outside link in the original post of what was a VERY short post anyway, which even just common sense shows the sensible thing would be to see what it was about.

You lot all tout your greater sense of awareness than we supposedly have, yet ALWAYS look for any reason, no matter how feeble, to explain away your lacking in knowledge.

The link was CLEARLY to a dictionary ... surely, even you lot would wish to see what it was saying ... you all "think" your so switched-on and good at research after all, but not even simple curiouslty tends to cross the collective twoofer brain.

 

[I_Gaze_At_The_Blue]

Blue
The biggest reason is that the government tells the story, and I seriously question ANYTHING the government puts out, ESPECIALLY having to do with the events of the day.
.

Yet you will "believe" in any government hand-outs you undoubtably get though ... won't you !!!

and my jobs involve flying.

Sure they did HD ... sure they did ... :liar

I know from many many many efforts that cell phone screens go to the message NO SERVICE somewhere above 1500 feet, and that is at about 120 knots max.

WHY ever would a "supposed" pilot need make many efforts with cell phones during his "supposed" piloting ???

The faster the airspeed, the worse it becomes.
.

SHOW the technical data then ???

There is some controversy as to whether the Airfones were even operational during that time frame.
.

Yet you CANNOT prove that ... can you HD ???

I wonder why !!!

All in all, the stories defy physics and common sense.
.

USE physics then and explain it ... come on some actual data ???

SHOW THIS "PHYSICS" !!!

Your claiming this that or the other, complete with neat little graphs, proves nothing at all.

Translation ^^^ its too difficult for me to understand !!!

 

[phoenyx]

Truther, OCT supporter, or shill, everyone deserves some basic respect.

Not so ... respect is EARNED,

I agree that respect is earned. That being said, I think that everyone deserves some -basic- respect, regardless of how much they've earned apart from that.

and since truther actually **** on the memories of the victims by trying so hard to place guilt in the WRONG places

More unsubstantiated assertions on your part. I'd ask you to prove your statement or retract it, but I'm fairly certain that you'll simply ignore this request as you've done so many times before.

Try it out in the REAL WORLD ... go to ANY Firehouse in New York and see IF you get "respect" for your stance from the FDNY ... take lots of bandages, you'll need them !!!

Your mind is so filled with violence, whether verbal or physical. 911 is certainly a controversial issue, but violence solves nothing. As to Firefighters:
Fire Fighters For 9-11 Truth » FF 911 Truth

I suppose you never considered that I simply stopped reading after the first sentence or so of your caps locked, insult ridden post.

And therein lies the reason WHY you are a twoofer ... deep examination and full reading of stuff seems not to be their forte !!!

There's no need for a deep examination of your vitriolic posts. If you read between the lines, all you're generally doing is spewing out hatred. Hatred resolves nothing.

 

[I_Gaze_At_The_Blue]

I agree that respect is earned. That being said, I think that everyone deserves some -basic- respect, regardless of how much they've earned apart from that.

I have yet to meet any twoof worthy of respect ... sorry but true !!!

More unsubstantiated assertions on your part. I'd ask you to prove your statement or retract it, but I'm fairly certain that you'll simply ignore this request as you've done so many times before.

Again wrong ... for you DO **** on the victims and the day you realise how wrong you have been in all this I HOPE you at least APOLOGISE to the familes and survivors.

Here ... SHOW the common decency and manners to ASK the families groups IF you are right.

Support Resources - 9/11 Groups - Families of September 11

NOT that you ever would ... which shows you DO dump on them !!!

As to Firefighters:

MEGA FAIL ... he is NOT nor EVER was a member of the FDNY ... NOR ever at 9/11 or Ground Zero ... craptacular fail !!!

There's no need for a deep examination of your vitriolic posts. If you read between the lines, all you're generally doing is spewing out hatred. Hatred resolves nothing.

So FACTS such as NO money missing, NO freefall, NO blast injuries, NO intercepts in CONUS, etc, etc, etc are just my "vitriol" ... what a delightfully delusional little world you live in !!!

You ONLY focus on my tone BECAUSE you have NOTHING better ... grow up, your supposed to be a big boy or girl now !!!

 

[phoenyx]

I have yet to meet any twoof worthy of respect ... sorry but true !!!

That so? Prove it.

 

[I_Gaze_At_The_Blue]

That so? Prove it.

Do it every day ... my posts drip with the sarcasm due you all ... no truther is worthy of respect for they DO **** over the victims ... and it is ONLY when they grow enough to see how low they were they are due any ... IF they have the good grace to show embarassment at how niave and gullible they were ...

(There are no facts in the 9/11 Truth Movement. Just a lot of theories, which eventually break down to "hey, we're just asking questions" if someone questions the validity of such. No structural, civil, or any engineers agree with the truthers. Yet, most of my friends will try to explain the hard physics involved in structural collapses. None of these people are engineers, physicists, or even in a scientific field, for that matter. Someone's supposed to take their word over an expert's?

The truthers will just tell you that all the experts are "in on it." Yeah, sure. Every engineer in the world is complicit in the government's murder of 3,000 people. And so are the firemen, who apparently ordered Larry Silverstein to "pull" Building 7. The truthers' misrepresentation of Silverstein's quote is one of the most popular "facts" to spit out, but in doing so, you are effectively in agreement that firefighters were not only involved in the controlled demolition of WTC7, but they are also aiding and abetting in the government's cover-up. Yeah, every firefighter who was out there on 9/11 is going to be complicit in the MURDER OF 343 OF THEIR FALLEN BROTHERS! To quote Loose Change co-creator Jason Bermas, "the firefighters are paid off."

This is absolute horse****, which brings me to why I've formally distanced myself from this sorry excuse for a movement.)

Confessions of an Ex-Truther

JREF Forum - Threads Tagged with ex-truther

 

[phoenyx]

I have yet to meet any twoof worthy of respect ... sorry but true !!!

That so? Prove it.

Do it every day ...

In your dreams. You've always been arrogant IG, but arrogance doesn't prove anything.

[Alleged Ex-Truther]There are no facts in the 9/11 Truth Movement. Just a lot of theories, which eventually break down to "hey, we're just asking questions" if someone questions the validity of such.

Another unsubstantiated assertion. It gets rather dull pointing them out, but I suppose someone should do it -.-

[Alleged Ex-Truther]:No structural, civil, or any engineers agree with the truthers.

I suppose World Trade Center Building 7 Demolished on 9/11? | AE911Truth is just a figment of truthers' imagination . Incidentally, their most recent video on PBS has hit the top spot:
Controversial 9/11 film soars to #1 on PBS, breaks local records (Includes interview)

 

[I_Gaze_At_The_Blue]

In your dreams. You've always been arrogant IG, but arrogance doesn't prove anything.

So rampant sarcasm is yet ANOTHER thing that passes you by !!!

Wee hint ... NO truther has ever shown me wrong ... you WON'T be the first either !!!

Another unsubstantiated assertion. It gets rather dull pointing them out, but I suppose someone should do it

Wrong ... the person speaking those words WAS a truther ... a true believer ... much MORE vocal and active than you have ever been, MORE at the coal face ... UNTIL he finally realised just how easily led by nobodies he was.

It just sticks in your craw that one of your own has turned ...

I suppose World Trade Center Building 7 Demolished on 9/11? is just a figment of truthers' imagination

Nope ... just another twoofer wet dream !!!

But isn't it so funny how Gage is targetting KIDS ... INSTEAD of professionals now ???

Then again kids are soooooooooo much more gullible and easily fooled !!!

Not that it matters for the numbers Gages gets are minute ... AND falling too ... reality, ain't it a bitch !!!

Oh! and I get all that crud anyway ... what with being a signatory to Gages Gaggle with FAKED credentials and all ... so, please. no need to give me anything of theres, I get it already and know it for the junk it is.

Incidentally, their most recent video on PBS has hit the top spot:

Awww bless ... you "think" the rise in viewers DUE to it being shown ON the anniversary really means anything ???

Wee hint ... there is ALWAYS a rise in twoofer site internet traffic ON the anniversary which RETURNS to the low figures of before and after ... it means nothing and has NEVER translated into a groundswell of support.

NOT everyone watching will agree, and the mere FACT that the traffic and viewing numbers does NOT stay increased shows that people watch (out of interest DUE to it being in the current thinking, due to a historic anniversary) it but DON'T buy into it.

Wee hint phoenyx ... EVEN us debunkers watch twoof movies ... NOT everyone watching them is a believer or supporter ...

Sorry ... that's a FAIL ... the numbers do NOT stay high, therefore it is NOT an ongoing success !!!

 

[phoenyx]

I have yet to meet any twoof worthy of respect ... sorry but true !!!

That so? Prove it.

Do it every day ...

In your dreams. You've always been arrogant IG, but arrogance doesn't prove anything.

So rampant sarcasm is yet ANOTHER thing that passes you by !!!

Wee hint ... NO truther has ever shown me wrong ... you WON'T be the first either !!!

Whatever IG. You can claim that you've conquered the world if it makes you feel any better, but I won't believe it until I see some hard evidence.

 

[Oozlefinch]

(There are no facts in the 9/11 Truth Movement. Just a lot of theories, which eventually break down to "hey, we're just asking questions" if someone questions the validity of such.

To me one of the most telling things is that not even the "truthers" can agree with each others.

I mean, what is it now?

The Hijackers were working for the CIA.

The Hijackers were working for Mossad.

The Hijackers were working for the Saudi Royal Family.

There were no aircraft involved, it was all drones.

There were no drones, it was all special effects.

The buildings were imploded.

The buildings collapsed because the firefighters were not allowed to put the fires out.

A missile struck the Pentagon.

I mean, the list just goes on and on and on and on. Not even the Truthers can agree on any one cause, it is like a hydra, only agreeing in that it was done by The Government (play ominous music).

Personally, I see Truthers and the vast majority of other conspiracy theorists as individuals with a mental illness. A strong dissassociation with reality, and wanting to believe in something other then random chance.

The Psychology of Conspiracy Theories | Wired Science | Wired.com

 

[phoenyx]

Another unsubstantiated assertion. It gets rather dull pointing them out, but I suppose someone should do it -.-

Wrong ... the person speaking those words WAS a truther ...

You think caps locking a word in your sentence is going to make it more credible?

a true believer ... much MORE vocal and active than you have ever been, MORE at the coal face ... UNTIL he finally realised just how easily led by nobodies he was.

You think being "vocal" and "active" means he was truly a part of the truth movement? I just found a page regarding Charles Veitch that believes Charles Veitch to be a "deep under-cover agent for The Shill Police":
The Atlantean Conspiracy: Charlie Veitch and The Shill Police - Everything Isn't Okay

Personally, he doesn't seem to be so "deep under-cover" to me; the guy flip flops his views from day to day. He's an amateur in my book, but that doesn't mean that those behind 9/11 aren't behind him. Personally, I was much more impressed with Lloyde England and His Taxi Cab - The Eye of the Storm - YouTube

 

[I_Gaze_At_The_Blue]

Whatever IG. You can claim that you've conquered the world if it makes you feel any better, but I won't believe it until I see some hard evidence.

See ... you DO have nothing in the end !!!

Just whinging and petulance ... and old, old, old, old stuff from years ago that NOBODY is interested in.

DaTwoof is already dead ... you are late to the party !!!

 

[I_Gaze_At_The_Blue]

You think caps locking a word in your sentence is going to make it more credible?

Nope, but like children most twoofs NEED clarification.

You think being "vocal" and "active" means he was truly a part of the truth movement?

Jealous much ... he clearly did waaay more than you do ... which consists of NOTHING more than whinging on some tiny forum in the dank unpopulated oubliette that is the Conspiracy Theory section.

Not that I was speaking ABOUT Veitch in my previous post anyway !!!

I just found a page regarding Charles Veitch that believes Charles Veitch to be a "deep under-cover agent for The Shill Police":

Of course ... nobody could ever change their minds or learn awareness in Twooferville ... no, they must always be "shills" ... some deep undercover spy ... becaust Twoofs REEEEEELY are that much of a threat.

Grow up ... you lot FAIL SPECTACULARLY all on your own !!!

No twoof effort has EVER achieved its aims or good support ... you are a joke, consigned even now 11 years later (despite all your efforts and "raising awareness") to be laughed at imprisoned in conspiracy sections along with the rest of the nutters whom believe in Nibiru, Hollow Earth and all other such buffoonery.

You ARE the MOST slow and LEAST effective "movement" ... ever !!!

Personally, he doesn't seem to be so "deep under-cover" to me; the guy flip flops his views from day to day. He's an amateur in my book, but that doesn't mean that those behind 9/11 aren't behind him.

And I bet if he hadn't "turned" you would be slavering all over him !!!

Personally, I was much more impressed with

... two dumb kids whom have ZERO expertise in what they spew !!!

You would though phoenyx ... you DON'T have high demands or standards and are way too easily impressed by dumb clowns like these two ...

WHERE are the two dumb kids anyways phoenyx ... the seem to have dropped from view and have NOTHING new ... WHY ???

 

[Thoreau72]

Blue

No truther has shown you wrong (in your mind), but more importantly, YOU have never shown yourself to be RIGHT.

Anger and invective do not prove a thing. Repetition of a myth does not prove it true, it simply reveals a bit o' dissonance on the part of the repeater.

 

[I_Gaze_At_The_Blue]

Blue

No truther has shown you wrong (in your mind), but more importantly, YOU have never shown yourself to be RIGHT.

Anger and invective do not prove a thing. Repetition of a myth does not prove it true, it simply reveals a bit o' dissonance on the part of the repeater.

Yadda, yadda, blah, blah !!!

Funny how it is YOU whom gets shown things like NO air defences or money missing yet in complete impotence TRY to spin it into us not being "right".

REALITY ... I know, I know, a country unknown to you ... shows NO air defences or money missing or that no radio is NOT a hijack flag, or that there was NO freefall ... you know ... the things WE SAY ... but you tout yourself as NEVER having been shown wrong.

It would be hilarious if it wasn't such a searing indictment of your wilful ignorance of the harsh reality THAT YOU DO keep getting shown wrong, every damm day we show you FACTS and REALITY that is the opposite of what your side touts !!!

 

[Thoreau72]

It is impossible to reason with some.

 

[I_Gaze_At_The_Blue]

It is impossible to reason with some.

Indeed it is ... you display that truth so well too, well done on recognising you own shortcomings !!!

 

[phoenyx]

You think caps locking a word in your sentence is going to make it more credible?

Nope, but like children most twoofs NEED clarification.

So you think that the solution to our "misunderstandings" is to yell at us "children"? I keep on telling you that as soon as you start caps locking words I tend to -stop- reading. Doesn't this suggest to you that, instead of clarifying things to me, the actual result is that I don't even read what you have to say? As to yelling, I think it's generally best to avoid doing it barring some emergency, perhaps especially towards children. I'm not alone in this:
Facts on Verbal Abuse Toward Children | eHow.com

Here's a good article from a mother who decided to stop yelling at her children:
How to Stop Yelling at Your Children | eHow.com

 

[I_Gaze_At_The_Blue]

So you think that the solution to our "misunderstandings" is to yell at us "children"? I keep on telling you that as soon as you start caps locking words I tend to -stop- reading. Doesn't this suggest to you that, instead of clarifying things to me, the actual result is that I don't even read what you have to say? As to yelling, I think it's generally best to avoid doing it barring some emergency, perhaps especially towards children. I'm not alone in this:
Facts on Verbal Abuse Toward Children | eHow.com

Here's a good article from a mother who decided to stop yelling at her children:
How to Stop Yelling at Your Children | eHow.com

Yawn ... yawn ... yawn !!!

 

[phoenyx]

Yawn ... yawn ... yawn !!!

Did you even click on the links? Just in case you didn't, I'll post an excerpt from one of the links:
***
For many parents, yelling at children is a behavior learned from their own childhood and is nothing more than an expression of frustration stemming from a particular action by the child. However, for others, yelling and discipline easily cross the line into verbal abuse, as chiding turns into humiliation, scare tactics and downright cruelty. In these instances, the discipline is no longer effective and children instead learn to fear their parent and internalize the insults; in the end, these feelings can be destructive and begin a pattern that carries into adulthood.

Read more: Facts on Verbal Abuse Toward Children | eHow.com Facts on Verbal Abuse Toward Children | eHow.com
***

 

[Oozlefinch]

It is impossible to reason with some.

Very true. Which is why I generally consider Conspiracy Theorists to have a mental illness.

After all, what should you tell the guy, that the dog really did not tell him to go out and kill people?

 

[Thoreau72]

Very true. Which is why I generally consider Conspiracy Theorists to have a mental illness.

After all, what should you tell the guy, that the dog really did not tell him to go out and kill people?

You lost me on your dog analogy, and it could be argued that the entire human species suffers from mental illness. At least in the US. Consider how much Paxil and Thorazine is administered in this country, and a host of other drugs to "help" with those illnesses.

Fortunately, I'm not on any of those psychologically active drugs.

There is no treatment for cognitive dissonance--IMO it is engineered into the species. Some have it bad, others not so much.

Seeing crashed Boeings were there are none might be a manifestation, 11 years later.

 

[phoenyx]

You lost me on your dog analogy, and it could be argued that the entire human species suffers from mental illness. At least in the US. Consider how much Paxil and Thorazine is administered in this country, and a host of other drugs to "help" with those illnesses.

Fortunately, I'm not on any of those psychologically active drugs.

There is no treatment for cognitive dissonance--IMO it is engineered into the species. Some have it bad, others not so much.

Seeing crashed Boeings were there are none might be a manifestation, 11 years later.

I responded to this post here:
911: The Pentagon Attack

 

[Oozlefinch]

You lost me on your dog analogy, and it could be argued that the entire human species suffers from mental illness.

During questioning, Berkowitz claimed that his neighbor's dog was one of the reasons that he killed, stating that the dog demanded the blood of young, pretty girls. He said that the "Sam" mentioned in the first letter was his former neighbor, Sam Carr. Berkowitz claimed that Carr's black labrador retriever, Harvey, was possessed by an ancient demon and that it issued irresistible commands that Berkowitz must kill people. Berkowitz said he once tried to kill the dog, but was unsuccessful due to supernatural interference.

David Berkowitz - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Seeing crashed Boeings were there are none might be a manifestation, 11 years later.

As I said, it is like trying to convince an insane person that the dog really did not tell him to go out and kill people. Then you end up in the debate "Then what did the dog really tell him to do?"

And this is pretty much what I was talking about, I guess you are one of those that believes it was all internal explosions, and that there were no planes at all.

However, do not just take my word for it. A lot of psychiatrists have been talking about the connection between conspiracy theories and mental illness. Try looking it up, of course this will probably just give you yet another conspiracy to believe in ("They are trying to say we are all crazy to shut us up!")

Conspiracy Theories Explained | Psychology Today

For one thing, conspiracy theories help us cope with distressing events and make sense out of them. Conspiracies assure us that bad things don't just happen randomly. Conspiracies tell us that someone out there is accountable, however unwittingly or secretly or incomprehensibly, so it's possible to stop these people and punish them and in due course let everyone else re-establish control over their own lives. Conspiracies also remind us that we shouldn't blame ourselves for our predicaments; it's not our fault, it's them! In these ways, believing in conspiracies serves many of the same self-protective functions as scapegoating.

Paranoia and the Roots of Conspiracy Theories | Psychology Today

Empire of Conspiracy: The Culture of Paranoia in Postwar America - Timothy Melley - Google Books

Interestingly enough, a lot of the conspiracy theory sites have been screaming against Psychology Today for years now. Mother Jones, Prison Planet, lots of others absolutely hate this organization and publication, because they have published several articles dealing with Conspiracy Theorists and mental illness.

 

[Thoreau72]

Holy Cow, Oozlefinch, that is not compelling in the least, as any sort of defence of the official story.