Magnvs I
New member
- Joined
- Mar 26, 2006
- Messages
- 23
- Reaction score
- 3
- Location
- A rural town in Indiana.
- Gender
- Male
- Political Leaning
- Moderate
Magnvs I said:The purpose of education, as its etymology suggests, is to "lead on" the students, from childhood to adulthood, all the while giving them a sense of identity, purpose, and independence. So there lies my argument. Is this happening? Are students being educated? Or is the system flawed?
Education's intention is benevolent, but I believe that the students are not truly learning. By today's standards; knowledge, value, and general character are all defined by grades. If a student brings home A's, he/she is doing well. If a student brings home F's, he/she is doing poorly.
But do these grades reflect knowledge? I recall one incident at school in which I forgot to take an assignment home. It was a simple mistake; a mere slip-up. That particular assignment was worth 100 points. And this was a course in which there were only 4 or 5 grades, so that little mistake landed me a solid F. Despite the fact that I had mastered the material and could have easily aced a test given the opportunity, I was a failure. Now imagine how I felt, going home to my parents and explaining why my grade card read A A A A B B F.
They were ticked, naturally. It's disheartening to see that even the parents of school students are only worrying about the grades. Get good grades! Get A's and B's! Forget about the arts; forget about literature; just focus on that report card! Then we students can move on to more testing and more busywork! We can continue to cram for our tests, memorizing pointless facts and then forgetting them after the exam! We don't need to LEARN in school!
Several years later, the students graduate from high school. Congratulations! You got straight A's! Now, what did you learn? Who cares, you got straight A's! Here's a high-paying job.
These grades, these letters upon which we base our entire educational system, are flawed. These mere symbols on a sheet of paper stand for nothing. Good intentions aside; we are not learning in school.
Here I stand, a young student with reasonably high "grades", ranting about the inaccuracy of our educational principles.
Am I alone?
Magnvs I said:A reform of education. I'm aware that such a thing would be difficult, given the large amount of schools and children. Administering to such a large group of people would be quite a task. But my main hope is that schools will at least adopt a better sense of priority. We're so locked down with all the standards and nobody cares about anything but those special letters. Can't we just learn for the sake of learning, the way it was meant to be?
liberal1 said:Okay, this might be a bit of a stretch but here I go. All across the U.S.; we build three different "classes" of schools, each dependent on the student's intelligence or work ethics. One would be for "sub-average students," another for "average students," and one other for "gifted students." If a student did work that exceeded or did not meet the standards of their school, they would move up or down to another school accordingly. Grades would be non existant, though if the student's work was incompetent, they would move up or down as I mentioned before. Unfortunately, my system would still rely on the current grading system for placement. Damn!
Magnvs I said:I recall one incident at school in which I forgot to take an assignment home. It was a simple mistake; a mere slip-up. That particular assignment was worth 100 points. And this was a course in which there were only 4 or 5 grades, so that little mistake landed me a solid F. Despite the fact that I had mastered the material and could have easily aced a test given the opportunity, I was a failure.
Am I alone?
BodiSatva said:Did I miss something as well?
It sounds as if this teacher has a silly method of grading. How does revamping the entire schooling system help this situation? Perhaps it is up to the teacher to modify the method of grading...for the goal is to have the student understand the material...not t osimply get a grade.
Chalk it up to life's lessons? Yes. This is what school is actually about in the first place. Teaching students to understand life and to learn how to think so that they can make informed decisions.
It also sounds like you place to much importance on grades...
You mastered the material, and you will move on...good job.
Kelzie said:Does this teacher really have a silly grading method? Try missing a major deadline at work. You'll be fired. Or given an "F" if you will. Doesn't matter how much of the info you know or how well you would have done the assignment. One of a teacher's jobs is preparing their students for the outside world. Some students will have a problem with this.
BodiSatva said:Kelzie -
"Does this teacher really have a silly grading method? Try missing a major deadline at work. You'll be fired. Or given an "F" if you will. Doesn't matter how much of the info you know or how well you would have done the assignment. One of a teacher's jobs is preparing their students for the outside world. Some students will have a problem with this."
But this is not work...this is school.
Teachers are to help students understand what it takes to succeed in their jobs...but it is not the teachers job to fail students that know the material or that try because they are teaching them to get ready for jobs...unless this class was "Preparing for the Real World 101"
People will whine about "try" but the fact is that teachers are also supposed to motivate students. Helping them learn to try. School is not hard core get prepared to meet every deadline or get fired training. It is about including students and motivating them to take responsibility for their own learning that will then flow int otheir grown up world.
I assume that the teacher takes into account all sorts of learning styles and learning challenges...so I will assume that in this case with this studnet, the outcome was not the end of the world...but this case is not how it should be for every student...that is all I am saying.
Kelzie said:High school is "preparing for the real world 101". If not then, when? When a student graduates and tries to hand in his work assignment three days past a deadline with a cheesy smile and a "Well, at least I know the material." what then? Sorry, that doesn't cut it. One of the purposes of school is to teach personal reponsibility and consequences for your actions. This is even more valuable in high school.
BodiSatva said:"High school is "preparing for the real world 101". "
High School is NOT "preparing for the real world 101". Period. End of Story.
People may want it to be this, they may think that it is this, but this is neither how it is or how it should be.
School, and high school in general is about helping students percieve the complexity of social, economic, and political problems. It is to help them differentiate between what is important and what is not important. It is about teaching them their rights and responsibilities. It is about teaching them to take responsibility for their own learning. It is about teaching them respect for others that might be different. It is about teaching them to think and to understand all points of view. It is about teaching them to be aware of ethics and to care about quality of life and democracy.
If a student hands something in late with a cheesy smile, it is not for the teacher to sit back with a stern look and tell them that they are a failure or that they failed in their efforts. This is not the military. This is about helping to motivate.
BodiSatva said:No I am not incorrect...sorry.
School is a socialization process...sure. But it is not the schools or the teachers JOB to make these lesson a part of their curriculum or the goal of teaching. Socialization is a by-product of the lessons that are taught.
Kelzie - "Following your logic, we wouldn't even need due dates in school, now would we? "
I never said that there should not be due dates...that is a strange thing to say.
Let me repost this, it seems that it was overlooked...
Schhol, "is about including students and motivating them to take responsibility for their own learning that will then flow int otheir grown up world.
I assume that the teacher takes into account all sorts of learning styles and learning challenges...so I will assume that in this case with this studnet, the outcome was not the end of the world...but this case is not how it should be for every student...that is all I am saying. "
Due dates...yes.
Grades...yes.
Failing...yes.
All sorts of yes things out there.
Should these be a blanket rule for all students and is this what school is all about...No. A person that thinks yes does not understand teaching or people very well.
PARENTING is the platform used to teach "preparing for the real world 101".
Axismaster said:There are children hungering to go to school in the Third World and you are talking about PAYING students?!?!
BodiSatva said:I did.
Bodi - "School is a socialization process...sure. But it is not the schools or the teachers JOB to make these lesson a part of their curriculum or the goal of teaching. Socialization is a by-product of the lessons that are taught."
School is NOT a socialization process? You say that it is....and good for you friend...good for her, something that she plans and strives for. "It is one of the many goals in teaching." ...It is something that does happen...but it is not part of any curriculum in high school. A goal does not mean that it is part of a job description. "Socialization is a by-product of the lessons that are taught" See how I addressed this. You are into the "deliberate" part. It can be, but it is not required. But this is not about socialization...this is about unbending rules that result in bad grades for SOME students and not taking into account learning styles and individuality. Instead of thinking that you have me against the ropes here over this non-issue, ask your friend if she has a blanket rule on grading and does not take into acount differences...which is what my entire point was in the first place...something that, again, you are not taking into account.
I guess that you missed this. There is a purpose. Yes. They are needed. Yes. Do not assume to much. Failing kids happens a lot, and it should when necessary. Helping them learn to succeed is the goal though.
No it is not. It is done every day even by some who have 5 classes that average 32-37 students.
Right. Standards are what the education system in CA is all about. I would like you to find the "Socialization" standard within the California Content Standards for high school curriculum. Like I said, it is a by-product and something that is incorporated so that it helps students understand concepts (outside speakers on topics and filling out applications also help, but they are not required)...but
It is not the job of the teacher to socialize the student.
BodiSatva said:If a student hands something in late with a cheesy smile, it is not for the teacher to sit back with a stern look and tell them that they are a failure or that they failed in their efforts. This is not the military. This is about helping to motivate.
BodiSatva said:I said that individual student learning styles need to be taken into account.
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?