The final GOP tax bill is complete. Here’s what is in it.

Rogue Valley · Dec 15, 2017

The final GOP tax bill is complete. Here’s what is in it.

By Heather Long December 15, 2017

Republicans were joyful Friday as they finalized their tax plan, bridging differences between the House and Senate bills and moving another step closer to getting legislation to President Trump by Christmas. They also appear to have locked down the votes they need to pass the measure through the House and Senate after Sens. Marco Rubio (R-Fla.) and Bob Corker (R-Tenn.) pledged their support. Overall, the Tax Cuts and Jobs Act represents the largest one-time reduction in the corporate tax rate in U.S. history, from 35 percent down to 21 percent. The bill also lowers taxes for the vast majority of Americans, as well as small-business owners — at least until the cuts expire after eight years.

Last-minute changes to the GOP's big plan give a larger tax break to the wealthy and preserves certain tax savings for the middle class, including the student-loan interest deduction, the deduction for excessive medical expenses and the tax break for graduate students. A change made Friday morning to win over Rubio would expand the benefits of a child tax credit to give more money to working-class families.

What is changing.....

continued @ link above

Above: Quick run-down of important points in the final GOP tax legislation document.

Related: The entire 505 page GOP tax legislation ... Read the full GOP tax bill

cpwill · Dec 15, 2017

Some parts of this look very good. The changes to the 529 plan will help my family, and it's hard to imagine that business will do worse under those lower rates.

Anagram · Dec 15, 2017

Is passing the Alexander-Murray deal still attached to this? I haven't heard it being mentioned here or in any of these House-Senate negotiations and I don't see how premiums would not skyrocket without those payments and with the insurance mandate going away.

If they pass the tax bill as is, and don't pass Alexander-Murray or something comparable that could be really bad.

cpwill · Dec 15, 2017

Anagram said:
Is passing the Alexander-Murray deal still attached to this? I haven't heard it being mentioned here or in any of these House-Senate negotiations and I don't see how premiums would not skyrocket without those payments and with the insurance mandate going away.

If they pass the tax bill as is, and don't pass Alexander-Murray or something comparable that could be really bad.

I saw where the Mandate is done as of 2019, but didn't see a re-expansion of Cost Sharing.

CriticalThought · Dec 15, 2017

Anagram said:
Is passing the Alexander-Murray deal still attached to this? I haven't heard it being mentioned here or in any of these House-Senate negotiations and I don't see how premiums would not skyrocket without those payments and with the insurance mandate going away.

If they pass the tax bill as is, and don't pass Alexander-Murray or something comparable that could be really bad.

Nope. They are kicking it down the road to 2019.

Anagram · Dec 15, 2017

cpwill said:
I saw where the Mandate is done as of 2019, but didn't see a re-expansion of Cost Sharing.

Don't like that at all. From what I've seen there's nothing in this to control premiums. And 13 million mostly healthy people off insurance is going to cause them to rise absent some other measures. That combined with the cost sharing payments ending will not be good.

You just can't keep all the "popular" measures in the ACA and only nix the unpopular mandate.

If they want to pass Alexander-Murray and relax some of the regulations and restore the payments that's one thing, but I think this is a poor half-measure.

Exquisitor · Dec 16, 2017

cpwill said:
Some parts of this look very good. The changes to the 529 plan will help my family, and it's hard to imagine that business will do worse under those lower rates.

They'll do worse, because all the Money will be going to the pool from whence it never goes except to bring back more Money, and how will people have money to spend at your business?

Rogue Valley · Dec 16, 2017

Anagram said:
Is passing the Alexander-Murray deal still attached to this? I haven't heard it being mentioned here or in any of these House-Senate negotiations and I don't see how premiums would not skyrocket without those payments and with the insurance mandate going away.

If they pass the tax bill as is, and don't pass Alexander-Murray or something comparable that could be really bad.

Pressure remains on Sen. Collins as vote on Republican tax bill looms next week

Collins has made it clear that she wants to see two bills become law that would help stabilize the Affordable Care Act’s health insurance marketplace, and for Congress to waive $25 billion in automatic Medicare spending cuts that the bill would trigger. But the timing remains tricky, as it looks increasingly likely that the ACA-stabilization bills would be brought up after tax reform is voted on early next week. Collins said this week that she would be “much more comfortable” if the votes for ACA stabilization occurred before the tax reform vote. On Nov. 30, she told reporters in Washington at a Christian Science Monitor breakfast that having the ACA votes go first was “hugely important” to her. The fixes Collins touts would mitigate the mandate’s repeal with $5 billion per year for two years of reinsurance, which would help alleviate the cost spikes of having fewer young people in the insurance pools. Another bill, Alexander-Murray, would restore the “cost-sharing payments” to insurers that the Trump administration halted this year.

Annie Clark, a Collins spokeswoman, said “it’s our expectation” that next week, the two ACA fixes would be attached to a must-pass continuing resolution government-funding bill. And Clark said Collins wasn’t concerned that the Affordable Care Act bills she supports might be in jeopardy now that the Senate appears to have the votes it needs to pass tax reform regardless of how Maine’s senior senator votes. “We remain very confident in the agreements we have,” Clark said in an email Friday night. Critics argue that House conservatives will balk at passing the Collins bills, and that House Speaker Paul Ryan was not part of any deal made between Collins and Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell. McConnell promised Collins that the bills would be voted on by the end of the year. McConnell and Ryan issued a joint statement on Dec. 1 promising to avoid the automatic spending cuts to Medicare. But after tax reform passes, Collins would have much less leverage to make sure the bills are approved, critics have said.

The two ACA bills have been the subject of several studies by health policy experts, but one analysis released Thursday indicates that the Collins-Nelson reinsurance bill and Alexander-Murray would, for two years, more than offset the 10 percent premium increases caused by the mandate’s repeal. “This means that the package of provisions would more than offset the impact of repealing the individual mandate, and result in premiums that are roughly 10 percent lower,” according to Oliver Wyman Health, an actuarial consulting firm.

It seems that Sen. Collins has assurances from Senate GOP Majority Leader Mitch McConnell, but nothing from House Speaker Paul Ryan. Even so, the extra reinsurance funding is temporary (2018/2019), while the ACA mandate repeal is permanent with no promise of extending Collins-Nelson/Alexander-Murray. It seems to me that either Sen. Collins is naive and has been played by GOP leadership, or she is disingenuously using the two temporary bills as a "I care" fig-leaf cover for voting yes on the GOP tax package.

chuckiechan · Dec 16, 2017

GOP releases its final tax plan — here's what's in it

https://www.cnbc.com/2017/12/15/gop-releases-its-final-tax-plan--heres-whats-in-it.html

I hate to be a jerk, but you really have to read the article, follow the links, and apply them to your personal situation. There is a whole lot of misinformation out there. The vote I understand is Tuesday. Merry Christmas!

The democrat argument is this:

A "very preliminary" projection by the Joint Committee on Taxation, the congressional scorekeeper, estimated that the bill would lead to budget deficits increasing by $1.46 trillion over a decade. That falls just shy of the maximum $1.5 trillion it could add to the deficit under rules set by the Senate earlier this year.

The republican argument is basically:

"If you believe the economy won't grow due to the tax plan then the deficit numbers from the Join Committee on Taxation will prevail." It's that simple.

So your job as a responsible person is to cut away from the bull**** you are seeing from the media, get out a calculator, last years tax returns, and work it out. (or ballpark your '16 earnings) You can't ignore the two competing forces: Democrats out of power, and Republicans in. Republicans are writing the plan in the plain daylight the way things of this magnitude are supposed to be done.

If the plans fails and the economy flops, then fine. The Republicans failed, Democrats can cheer, but historically, betting against tax cuts has been a losing bet.

Note: There will be a quiz on Monday...

<alt>doxygen · Dec 16, 2017

Re: GOP releases its final tax plan — here's what's in it

chuckiechan said:
https://www.cnbc.com/2017/12/15/gop-releases-its-final-tax-plan--heres-whats-in-it.html

I hate to be a jerk, but you really have to read the article, follow the links, and apply them to your personal situation. There is a whole lot of misinformation out there. The vote I understand is Tuesday. Merry Christmas!

The democrat argument is this:

The republican argument is basically:

"If you believe the economy won't grow due to the tax plan then the deficit numbers from the Join Committee on Taxation will prevail." It's that simple.

So your job as a responsible person is to cut away from the bull**** you are seeing from the media, get out a calculator, last years tax returns, and work it out. (or ballpark your '16 earnings) You can't ignore the two competing forces: Democrats out of power, and Republicans in. Republicans are writing the plan in the plain daylight the way things of this magnitude are supposed to be done.

If the plans fails and the economy flops, then fine. The Republicans failed, Democrats can cheer, but historically, betting against tax cuts has been a losing bet.

Note: There will be a quiz on Monday...

It's designed so that it will goose the economy in the near term - that's what the 1.5 trillion does, at least hopefully. You need to look down the road and think about what happens when portions of this package expire. Either they won't be allowed to expire and the result will be added government debt, or they will expire and the middle class will get hit with a tax increase.

The "tax cuts pay for themselves and more" myth has been disproved by Reagan, GWB and more recently Kansas.

chuckiechan · Dec 16, 2017

Re: GOP releases its final tax plan — here's what's in it

<alt>doxygen said:
It's designed so that it will goose the economy in the near term - that's what the 1.5 trillion does, at least hopefully. You need to look down the road and think about what happens when portions of this package expire. Either they won't be allowed to expire and the result will be added government debt, or they will expire and the middle class will get hit with a tax increase.

The "tax cuts pay for themselves and more" myth has been disproved by Reagan, GWB and more recently Kansas.

They will be renegotiated.

Obviously, we can't keep plopping along at 2% growth. That is a non starter.

Dittohead not! · Dec 16, 2017

Re: GOP releases its final tax plan — here's what's in it

Tax cuts are popular.
And, we want to believe that they will magically pay for themselves.

History does not support that idealistic myth, but what the heck, let's go ahead and cut taxes anyway.

RabidAlpaca · Dec 16, 2017

Re: GOP releases its final tax plan — here's what's in it

chuckiechan said:
If the plans fails and the economy flops, then fine. The Republicans failed, Democrats can cheer, but historically, betting against tax cuts has been a losing bet.

In reality when the Republicans run the economy into the ground again, it will inevitably be reframed by the base as the fault of the Democrats. Bush drove the economy off a cliff and let the next president clean up the mess, and the GOP base still blames Obama for the economic downturn. There is no accountability, so whatever damage done by Trump and his corporate goons will inevitably be shrugged off as liberalism destroying America.

And no, trickle-down has never worked, it's always been a failure and they've always had to step it back a few years down the road.

Chomsky · Dec 16, 2017

Re: GOP releases its final tax plan — here's what's in it

chuckiechan said:
https://www.cnbc.com/2017/12/15/gop-releases-its-final-tax-plan--heres-whats-in-it.html

I hate to be a jerk, but you really have to read the article, follow the links, and apply them to your personal situation. There is a whole lot of misinformation out there. The vote I understand is Tuesday. Merry Christmas!

The democrat argument is this:

The republican argument is basically:

"If you believe the economy won't grow due to the tax plan then the deficit numbers from the Join Committee on Taxation will prevail." It's that simple.

So your job as a responsible person is to cut away from the bull**** you are seeing from the media, get out a calculator, last years tax returns, and work it out. (or ballpark your '16 earnings) You can't ignore the two competing forces: Democrats out of power, and Republicans in. Republicans are writing the plan in the plain daylight the way things of this magnitude are supposed to be done.

If the plans fails and the economy flops, then fine. The Republicans failed, Democrats can cheer, but historically, betting against tax cuts has been a losing bet.

Note: There will be a quiz on Monday...

One massive overarching problem though:

In 2024 all the individual rate reductions go away. Corporate reductions stay.

How is this possibly good?

Chomsky · Dec 16, 2017

Re: GOP releases its final tax plan — here's what's in it

<alt>doxygen said:
It's designed so that it will goose the economy in the near term - that's what the 1.5 trillion does, at least hopefully. You need to look down the road and think about what happens when portions of this package expire. Either they won't be allowed to expire and the result will be added government debt, or they will expire and the middle class will get hit with a tax increase.

The "tax cuts pay for themselves and more" myth has been disproved by Reagan, GWB and more recently Kansas.

Exactly.

And they're not even trying, they made the middle-class stuff temporary! It's just a temporary bone thrown to obfuscate their real actions --> payback to their donors.

Don't get sold by this blatant snake-oil hucksterism!

Critter7r · Dec 16, 2017

Re: GOP releases its final tax plan — here's what's in it

chuckiechan said:
If the plans fails and the economy flops, then fine. The Republicans failed, Democrats can cheer, but historically, betting against tax cuts has been a losing bet.

The problem with conservatives in general ...

<alt>doxygen · Dec 16, 2017

Re: GOP releases its final tax plan — here's what's in it

Chomsky said:
Exactly.

And they're not even trying, they made the middle-class stuff temporary! It's just a temporary bone thrown to obfuscate their real actions --> payback to their donors.

Don't get sold by this blatant snake-oil hucksterism!

The gall of this bunch is astonishing. I'm lucky to be living in a state where they don't tax my income. I hope the dems take over and reverse most of this idiotic bill. It's needlessly cruel, but at least Trump and the GOP are doing it out in front of everyone's face.

Multnomah Pope · Dec 16, 2017

Re: GOP releases its final tax plan — here's what's in it

Let's try it. Look at Obama failed economy. Never got 3% GDP and millions of lost jobs. Trump will #MAGA

Multnomah Pope · Dec 16, 2017

Re: GOP releases its final tax plan — here's what's in it

The Socialist reply: "It's cruel". Is that all you have?

chuckiechan · Dec 16, 2017

Re: GOP releases its final tax plan — here's what's in it

Chomsky said:
One massive overarching problem though:

In 2024 all the individual rate reductions go away. Corporate reductions stay.

How is this possibly good?

Because it sets the table for the next presidential election in 2024 assuming it's Trumps last term. If not, it's a mid term for someone else.

So you get to vote on whether you like your new lot in life or you don't.

<alt>doxygen · Dec 16, 2017

Re: GOP releases its final tax plan — here's what's in it

Chomsky said:
One massive overarching problem though:

In 2024 all the individual rate reductions go away. Corporate reductions stay.

How is this possibly good?

That, and funny math were required to make the numbers seem to add up.

Chomsky · Dec 16, 2017

Re: GOP releases its final tax plan — here's what's in it

<alt>doxygen said:
The gall of this bunch is astonishing. I'm lucky to be living in a state where they don't tax my income. I hope the dems take over and reverse most of this idiotic bill. It's needlessly cruel, but at least Trump and the GOP are doing it out in front of everyone's face.

I live in a highly taxed state. While I'm not thrilled with taxes, for the most part I accept it because I have a pretty high quality of life, with excellent services and great schools, though that's more a function of my local governance than the state's.

But looking on the surface, I'm going to get killed by tax deduction limit. There better be something else in there for me, to make up for my loss.

Chomsky · Dec 16, 2017

Re: GOP releases its final tax plan — here's what's in it

chuckiechan said:
Because it sets the table for the next presidential election in 2024 assuming it's Trumps last term. If not, it's a mid term for someone else.

So you get to vote on whether you like your new lot in life or you don't.

Interesting concept there, that I hadn't thought of.

Well, I still disagree with this tax plan and raising the debt and deficit. Nor do I see this as a shot at "trying something", because we've seen it fail repeatedly in the past (to try something new, would have been to tax the wealthy & corps, and cut the middle-class).

But you have presented a novel way to look at this.

MovingPictures · Dec 16, 2017

Re: GOP releases its final tax plan — here's what's in it

The GOP doesn't really hate taxes. They love to raise sales taxes, consumption taxes, property taxes, and payroll taxes. You know, taxes that effect lower and middle class people.

Income taxes? Corporate taxes? Capital gains? Estate taxes? Now, those are the evil taxes!

Fenton Lum · Dec 16, 2017

Re: GOP releases its final tax plan — here's what's in it

Multnomah Pope said:
The Socialist reply: "It's cruel". Is that all you have?

Just wait. The power structure knows full well it has lost all semblance of legitimacy. That is why it no longer has any compunction about murdering unarmed citizens in the streets. That is why it militarized police depts; it knows full well that at some point, the fweedumb loving befuddled masses will see this society for what it is and does to all sans the aristocracy. That is why you have corporate for profit prisons with convict labor leasing which is a return to profiteering from bondage in a technological age where the substantial people no longer require the people to generate their beloved profit margins; they can turn $40-50K per year, per hominid, and have the public pay for their workforce. That is why concentrated corporate wealth and power has taken over your governance, media machine, and now the internet. You sir are the subject of an empire with no voice or meaningful representation in your own existence, assuming you are not some lobbyist wielding think tank legislation corporate state raconteur.

As it turns out, labels is all the power structure has, once the people figure that out and gather together, this house of cards will collapse; and no one understands that better than the power structure itself. Authority is by definition always on shaky ground, and that all ours is, just another authoritarian system attempting to keep the masses in their place, same as it ever was.

The final GOP tax bill is complete. Here’s what is in it.

Lead or get out of the way

Educator

Lead or get out of the way

"I want MY WALL!"

master political analyst

Engineer

Social Democrat

Social Democrat

"I want MY WALL!"

New member

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Social Democrat

Social Democrat

WE'LL DO IT LIVE!

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