The FACTS of COVID are that it is an East Coast problem in Democrat strongholds

[Ethel2]

right, lies only exist with Trump, certainly not Biden, Pelosi, Schumer, Warren, Sanders. What is it about people like you with such selective memories that you buy liberal rhetoric and ignore liberal results? Were almost 7 million jobs created by Trump policies in 3 years? Was 900 billion dollars per year GDP growth generated the first three years of Trump? Was there historic and record low unemployment numbers for minorities due to Trump policies? Did NATO become stronger thanks to Trump? Does putting America first really bother you that much?

I think the liberal ideology has bought millions of votes as you don't bite the hand that feeds you. I believe 150000 votes gave Biden the electoral college win and those votes were manipulated. I do believe there are millions of people like you who think solely with your heart, buy rhetoric, and ignore results.

All politicians and nearly all people lie. But the jackass does it far more than anyone I have ever had the displeasure to witness. As I have written here many times no president is all bad or all good. That said, the incessant lying and the pandemic response that cost hundreds of thousands of Americans their lives are the deciding factors that I judge him on.
Who won the election? Is it the jackass or the guy now sitting in the White House?

 

[ElChupacabra]

I will continue to repeat the minimum wage argument until you admit being wrong, the federal gov't has no business setting a minimum wage when the states have that authority.

You can repeat it all you like, but the it is currently within the Federal government's ability to make changes to the minimum wage. Until that is changed legally, that's what it is.

As for the pipeline you again confused part time jobs with part time jobs for economic reasons believing that length of the job is what matters vs the hours on the job.

No, what I did was attribute your position on temporary jobs during the Obama years based on my memory of those posts. Since I was going off of memory alone, I gave you the benefit of the doubt. In the case of the pipeline, those are temporary jobs and never did I say they were part time.

As for the spread of the pandemic, it is interesting how the left ignores the largest blue state and the nation and the rapid growth there just like they ignore that blue cities lead the way in growth but because blue cities are in red states the red states are all that matters.

In this thread alone I have provided citations which include data from both a red state and a blue state; I kept it specific to the two states you originally cited in one of your posts. If you're referring to California, well let's have a look:




Some additional deaths per million data (cumulative):
Texas: 1,524
California: 1,328

Based on the data, there's no indication Texas has fared significantly better than California at preventing deaths. Texas also leads California in cases per million as well (91,924 to 90,079). Texas has a lower weekly fatality rate than California from April through mid-July, but then it surpassed California after the August spike. Since then it's only until the January spike that Texas fared better.

As for cities, they don't lead the way in growth because they are "blue", they do so because contagious diseases spread much quicker among denser populations who interact more often than in rural areas where that isn't the case. The best example of this is the spread of COVID 19 in rural areas that had meat packing plants. These were rural areas, but the spread occurred where people congregated in large groups.

 

[ElChupacabra]

Yes I bought rhetoric for years and probably have voted for more Democrats than you Republicans. I can see how easy it is to be fooled by rhetoric but after years of verifying rhetoric to results I dropped my liberal ideology and went with the only one that makes sense, being a conservative and accepting personal responsibilities not placing blame

Except placing blame is exactly what you have just done. You are blaming Democrats for having fooled you, when it was your responsibility to make decisions on which political party best represented your interests. Political party policies and results are all readily available, so it's not as if the Democratic Party was hiding the results and all of a sudden they were magically revealed. So from a personal responsibility perspective, the Democrats/liberals/ et.al didn't fool you, you made the choice based on the same information available to everyone else.

Unfortunately your double standard is on full display or should I say the liberal double standard for anyone that disagrees with a liberal has to be personally attacked and destroyed, results don't matter to the left as perception and rhetoric is reality.

What double standard? I certainly haven't attacked anyone personally. It's actually results and data that I have been providing throughout this thread.

 

[Rawley]

Sir...how is that 50%?

42% Close enough for COVID

 

[ElChupacabra]

The Trump "camp"? Did he take his fishing pole and tent?

 

[Conservative]

They don't want to talk about Florida because it destroys their belief system.

No, they prefer pitting red vs. blue without context. It is truly amazing how there are no blue voters in red states according to liberals when the issue suits their ideology

 

[Conservative]

Conservatives sometimes act like two year old children. They want to do whatever they want to do RIGHT NOW! Businesses get locked down because of excessive viral transmission in a community. When that happens people get INFECTED when they gather in groups indoors-like in churches, restaurants, and gyms. When people get infected transmission increases. Thats when even stricter mandates are required. You can open businesses but when viral activity is high they won't make money anyway: people aren't going shopping in numbers when they see large numbers of cases and deaths in their community-at least the sane ones will stay home. Now if we simply shut down for six weeks (three viral cycles) then the whole country would be out of the woods. THEN economic recovery can happen. Two year olds however cannot comprehend the concept of "delayed gratification". Too many conservatives are behaving like two year olds.

Now if everyone was responsible and wore masks when indicated and kept their distance from others and avoided unnecessary gatherings lockdowns would be much less common. But thats a fantasy world dreamed up by conservatives; its not reality. Not everyone is responsible. I do my part: I wear a mask when indicated; I got my two doses of vaccine and I am now immune and likely can't spread the virus much either.
However not everyone takes personal responsibility seriously. One poster here said that if he contracted Covid he would still go to work. It is because of the covidiots that mandates are required.
Its really not that complicated at all.

OMG, do you even pay any attention to what you post? Trump in 4 years obviously created all the problems that you feel exist in this country totally ignoring the previous 47+ from Biden. Why do you continue to buy rhetoric and ignore personal responsibility issues? Why haven't you contracted the disease and exactly what bureaucrat prevented you from getting that disease? you really don't understand personal responsibility issues do you?

People gathering make the choice to gather. You don't want to run the risk then DON'T GATHER!!

I learned a long time ago to stop trying to control others and only control myself. Suggest you adopt that approach. You are right, it isn't complicated, it is about gov't control over you and your life. You want that?? Move to a major blue state that has everyone in lockdown. How is that working in California?

 

[Conservative]

Except placing blame is exactly what you have just done. You are blaming Democrats for having fooled you, when it was your responsibility to make decisions on which political party best represented your interests. Political party policies and results are all readily available, so it's not as if the Democratic Party was hiding the results and all of a sudden they were magically revealed. So from a personal responsibility perspective, the Democrats/liberals/ et.al didn't fool you, you made the choice based on the same information available to everyone else.



What double standard? I certainly haven't attacked anyone personally. It's actually results and data that I have been providing throughout this thread.

No, they haven't fooled me as I am not as stupid as supporters as I understand that it is my responsibility to take care of my family not a bureaucrat. I learned a long time ago to trust but verify, obviously you haven't grasped that concept yet.

You focus so much on rhetoric and nothing on results. I have posted the official results which you ignored and I have also posted the 10th amendment which you ignored showing it is easier to place blame than accept responsibility.

I also haven't attacked you personally, only your ideology and supported that attack with data and FACTS!!

 

[Ethel2]

OMG, do you even pay any attention to what you post? Trump in 4 years obviously created all the problems that you feel exist in this country totally ignoring the previous 47+ from Biden. Why do you continue to buy rhetoric and ignore personal responsibility issues? Why haven't you contracted the disease and exactly what bureaucrat prevented you from getting that disease? you really don't understand personal responsibility issues do you?

People gathering make the choice to gather. You don't want to run the risk then DON'T GATHER!!

I learned a long time ago to stop trying to control others and only control myself. Suggest you adopt that approach. You are right, it isn't complicated, it is about gov't control over you and your life. You want that?? Move to a major blue state that has everyone in lockdown. How is that working in California?

California has fewer deaths per 100k than Florida last I checked.
Unfortunately where your lack of reasoning is most apparent is here: when people gather they don’t just risk their own life: they risk the lives of everyone they come in contact with at the grocery store, the hardware store etc after they do it. Like I told you over and over again: if you want to run in front of a locomotive have at it.
But you have no right to risk the health of anyone else but yourself without their permission.

 

[rocket88]

Coup? how many leftists were in those riots promoting and being active in inciting riots. You have been bought and paid for by rhetoric and ignorance of reality. As for the Constitution, suggest you read it and realize where the control actually lies, the 10th Amendment. When are you going to hold liberals accountable for their failures in issues like racial equality? When are you going to stop blaming others for your own personal failures?

The reality of the Capitol is that it was Trump supporters. When are you going to hold them accountable? It was an attempt to stop tge wheels of democracy from rolling and install Trump as a dictator. When are you going to stop blaming liberals for something that we know was Trumpists?

None of the riots had anything to do with my personal failures. So I don't kniw why you'd bring that up except that you're using a script.

 

[minnie616]

Oh by the way I got my first shot on January 6 long before Biden took office. The Pfizer vaccine was approved on December 11, Moderna in Mid December but by all means give Biden credit not only for distribution but for development as that is what liberals do, take credit for someone else's work

They have already increased gas prices by 20% and interest rates are climbing as well as the influx of illegals and spending us into oblivian. Some success.

And when was that vaccine created and procedures in place to distribute? Are you really that desperate to give Biden credit for something?

Of course President Trump deserves credit for operation warp speed in getting a Covid 19 created and getting vaccines delivered to individual states. Too bad many states had no Federal help or aide ( like instructions ) on how best to get shots into the arms of the health care workers , nursing home staff and residents etc. in a timely manner.

 

[rocket88]

Unlike Biden, trump wasn't a dictator and could not order states to do anything.

Good thing, too, because Florida would be screwed now if they shut down and wore masks.

Bullshit. Biden is no more of a dictator than Trump except in the "minds" of those completely divorced from reality

 

[minnie616]

America is as divided now than it ever has been.

Doesn't it suck to pay 20% more for gas in just one month that Biden has been in? I am betting gas will DOUBLE in a year hurting mainly poor people. ...

The price of gasoline has nothing to do with the administration.

OPEC is producing far less crude oil ...therefore the rise in price.

Read the following article

OPEC's Influence on Global Oil Prices

OPEC’s Influence on Global Oil Prices

OPEC affects the price of oil by coordinating supply cuts when the price is deemed too low and supply increases when its members believe prices are too high.

www.investopedia.com

 

[Conservative]

California has fewer deaths per 100k than Florida last I checked.
Unfortunately where your lack of reasoning is most apparent is here: when people gather they don’t just risk their own life: they risk the lives of everyone they come in contact with at the grocery store, the hardware store etc after they do it. Like I told you over and over again: if you want to run in front of a locomotive have at it.
But you have no right to risk the health of anyone else but yourself without their permission.

Yes they do but over 51,000 totals, 8000 more than TX which you and the left demonize. Your double standards and placing blame is all you radicals show. Don't know about you but I go to the grocery store, I wear a mask, I social distance and guess what, I didn't need a bureaucrat to force me to do that and I DON'T have the virus!!

Oh by the way do you realize that states get reimbursed for Covid19 costs?? What is the incentive to report flu costs and deaths to the federal gov't?

 

[Conservative]

Of course President Trump deserves credit for operation warp speed in getting a Covid 19 created and getting vaccines delivered to individual states. Too bad many states had no Federal help or aide ( like instructions ) on how best to get shots into the arms of the health care workers , nursing home staff and residents etc. in a timely manner.

Why would this be a federal responsibility to tell states how to distribute the vaccines? Have you bothered to read the 10th Amendment? Do you even know the official role of the Federal Gov't? Do the Federal taxpayers pay for the vaccine and Covid19 expenses? What is the incentive for the states and cities to report Covid19 expenses?

Liberals have a real gravy train, create dependence and adhere to the statement that you "don't bite the hand that feeds you" creates permanent jobs and multi millionaire public servants

 

[Conservative]

The reality of the Capitol is that it was Trump supporters. When are you going to hold them accountable? It was an attempt to stop tge wheels of democracy from rolling and install Trump as a dictator. When are you going to stop blaming liberals for something that we know was Trumpists?

None of the riots had anything to do with my personal failures. So I don't kniw why you'd bring that up except that you're using a script.

And you know that all were Trump supporters how?? Do they have Trump tattooed on their foreheads? You keep buying what the left tells you and keep ignoring the radical leftists in cities all over this country. Trump as a dictator?? Right, putting America first makes Trump a dictator, certainly not the over 50 EO's in the last 30 days from Biden. You going to tell us how stopping the Keystone pipeline, having a $15 minimum wage, and continued lockdowns in the cities is going to put over 10 million Americans back to work? You keep focused on Trump as that is exactly what the left wants you to do and watch your country implode

 

[ElChupacabra]

No, they haven't fooled me as I am not as stupid as supporters as I understand that it is my responsibility to take care of my family not a bureaucrat. I learned a long time ago to trust but verify, obviously you haven't grasped that concept yet.

Except that's what you said:

It is very easy to negatively talk about liberals as I was once one and realized what a fool they were making out of me as the results never match the rhetoric. It is easy being a liberal as you don't have to have any guts to make tough decisions. you just buy rhetoric and blame someone else. Doesn't it feel good to hear that your money is being spent in the name of compassion??? How about the results of that spending?

So instead of taking responsibility for your previous choices, you now blame them for making a fool out of you.

You focus so much on rhetoric and nothing on results. I have posted the official results which you ignored and I have also posted the 10th amendment which you ignored showing it is easier to place blame than accept responsibility.

I have been posting all sorts of comparative data, which you then deflect by asking questions about pipelines and the minimum wage. The 10th amendment does not prevent a president from promoting disease prevention protocols anymore than it prevents him from doing the opposite, which is what he chose to do.

I also haven't attacked you personally, only your ideology and supported that attack with data and FACTS!!

In this case I have brought in facts as well, and you deflect those too with blue state vs. red state or urban vs. rural comments.

 

[Conservative]

The price of gasoline has nothing to do with the administration.

OPEC is producing far less crude oil ...therefore the rise in price.

Read the following article

OPEC's Influence on Global Oil Prices

OPEC’s Influence on Global Oil Prices

OPEC affects the price of oil by coordinating supply cuts when the price is deemed too low and supply increases when its members believe prices are too high.

www.investopedia.com

Oh, really, you going to tell me exactly how shutting down the Keystone Pipeline benefits the American people? You going to tell us all how a $15 minimum wage is going to put 10 million Americans back to work? You don't think Presidential and Congressional policies impact prices?? Wow, that is liberal indoctrination at its core

 

[Conservative]

"ElChupacabra, post: 1073583969, member: 32739"]
Except that's what you said:

Very selective understanding of my post, Yes, they fooled me for years until I grew up and realized results matter and don't support the rhetoric. I learned to trust but verify, something that escapes you

So instead of taking responsibility for your previous choices, you now blame them for making a fool out of you.

I did take responsibility, I don't vote for liberals.

I have been posting all sorts of comparative data, which you then deflect by asking questions about pipelines and the minimum wage. The 10th amendment does not prevent a president from promoting disease prevention protocols anymore than it prevents him from doing the opposite, which is what he chose to do.

Right and proposing and talking does what to generate results in states and cities controlled by local government? You didn't vote for Trump and continued to find a way to not do it again buying the liberal Covid19 issue and diverting from the actual results generated.

In this case I have brought in facts as well, and you deflect those too with blue state vs. red state or urban vs. rural comments.

You aren't the only person I am responding to and stand by my point there is a difference between federal tax revenue coming from the states to the gov't vs the federal mandates going back to the states. Bill Clinton will explain it to you if you bothered to do some research. I will always post data in context, maybe you ought to learn what context means? Why would anyone spend so much time talking about givers and takers of tax dollars without adding context?

 

[minnie616]

De Santis could be the next president. No shutdown. Restaurants and beaches open. People happy. Economy booming.
...

Think again.

From the Wall Street Journal:

Fearing Covid-19 Surge, Florida Officials Crack Down on Spring Breakers
Miami Beach beefs up rules on social distancing, alcohol and noise; ‘Go to Vegas’

 

[ElChupacabra]

Very selective understanding of my post, Yes, they fooled me for years until I grew up and realized results matter and don't support the rhetoric. I learned to trust but verify, something that escapes you

Selective? They were your words. To claim a political party fooled you, implies they misrepresented policies, ideas, etc. All of that information has always been available, so the "making a fool" out of you is more about you than it is the party or liberalism. What does seem at play here, is what is the broader trend of people turning to conservatism as they age. It's understandable in that a person's scope and idealism tend to narrow as they age.

I did take responsibility, I don't vote for liberals.

Yet you continue to blame them for making a fool out of you.

Right and proposing and talking does what to generate results in states and cities controlled by local government? You didn't vote for Trump and continued to find a way to not do it again buying the liberal Covid19 issue and diverting from the actual results generated.

That you can't make the connection between rhetoric and results isn't surprising since that seems to be your stance in general, but it does have tangible impact. If it didn't there would be no campaign slogans, or rallies since the main purpose is to promote a candidates rhetoric about what they will do. If that weren't the case, campaign events would play out more like a CSPAN policy hearing. I didn't need to buy anything other than being a witness to how Trump managed it.

You aren't the only person I am responding to and stand by my point there is a difference between federal tax revenue coming from the states to the gov't vs the federal mandates going back to the states. Bill Clinton will explain it to you if you bothered to do some research.

Not a topic I was discussing with you.

I will always post data in context, maybe you ought to learn what context means?

I know what it means, which is why I provided that contextual data in this thread regarding COVID 19 deaths per million. Post 1,727 is an example of providing contextual data, since I covered both the weekly deaths per million stats for CA and TX as well as the cumulative stats.

Why would anyone spend so much time talking about givers and takers of tax dollars without adding context?

Not a topic I was discussing with you.

 

[minnie616]

Why would this be a federal responsibility to tell states how to distribute the vaccines? Have you bothered to read the 10th Amendment? Do you even know the official role of the Federal Gov't? Do the Federal taxpayers pay for the vaccine and Covid19 expenses? What is the incentive for the states and cities to report Covid19 expenses?

Liberals have a real gravy train, create dependence and adhere to the statement that you "don't bite the hand that feeds you" creates permanent jobs and multi millionaire public servants

I was referring to guidedence and funding to help get the vaccines into arms in a timely manner and in rural localities.

The Pfizer vaccine needed low temp freezers to store the vaccine and only a few hospitals already had those.

 

[rocket88]

And you know that all were Trump supporters how?? Do they have Trump tattooed on their foreheads? You keep buying what the left tells you and keep ignoring the radical leftists in cities all over this country. Trump as a dictator?? Right, putting America first makes Trump a dictator, certainly not the over 50 EO's in the last 30 days from Biden. You going to tell us how stopping the Keystone pipeline, having a $15 minimum wage, and continued lockdowns in the cities is going to put over 10 million Americans back to work? You keep focused on Trump as that is exactly what the left wants you to do and watch your country implode

You tell us who attempted the coup at the Capitol. Considering how many of those arrested have used "Following what Trump said" as part if their defense, I find it hard to believe that they aren't cultists. Trump as dictator was the aim of that group. You are simply buying the rhetoric, I'm going with the results of that.

 

[Conservative]

Think again.

From the Wall Street Journal:

Fearing Covid-19 Surge, Florida Officials Crack Down on Spring Breakers
Miami Beach beefs up rules on social distancing, alcohol and noise; ‘Go to Vegas’

right, we need the gov't to be our parent, is that the way you were raised? Are you exposing yourself to people without masks? Stunning how people like you ignore your own actions and personal responsibility issues trying to change the actions of others. Not going to work, you can only control your own actions

 

[Ethel2]

Yes they do but over 51,000 totals, 8000 more than TX which you and the left demonize. Your double standards and placing blame is all you radicals show. Don't know about you but I go to the grocery store, I wear a mask, I social distance and guess what, I didn't need a bureaucrat to force me to do that and I DON'T have the virus!!

Oh by the way do you realize that states get reimbursed for Covid19 costs?? What is the incentive to report flu costs and deaths to the federal gov't?

I don't care what the incentive is to report flu costs. That is not the topic we are discussing. And I don't "demonize" any state; I demonize the jackass we had for an excuse for president for four years.
I am glad you are behaving yourself in public. So am I. Unfortunately there are those who are not, those who decide to gather indoors with friends and not wear masks nor keep their distance, and that is what is the main driver of infections now.
You are assuming that everyone is as responsible as you and me; they aren't. Thats why lockdowns and mandates are needed-to control the behavior of the covidiots out there. My only regret about the mandates is that they are not being enforced as strongly as they should be.