The design purpose of guns

[Sweden]

Well yes the most popular gun in the USA is the 9mm handgun and it's the gun that has the most ownership in the country so it does sell the most.

Being the most numerous it is fair to assume that it kills and wounds the most people. No on legally owns a handgun in Sweden I am pleased to say.

 

[DebateChallenge]

There’s no point to this.

Sure there is, the point is that it's the gun control crowd that tends to be physically puny, even though they often accuse the gun rights crowd of that.

 

[DebateChallenge]

Prove it.

Most firearm deaths are suicides

In 2021, 54% of firearm deaths in the US were suicides.

usafacts.org

Even Everytown admits most gun deaths are suicides.

Gun Suicide | Everytown

Gun suicide claims the lives of more than 25,000 people in America every year. We must address this public health crisis to reduce gun violence.

www.everytown.org

And even if that is so, all that it does is to prove the OP thesis that guns are designed to kill.

No guns are designed to send projectiles flying at high speeds. When such projectiles flying at high speeds are used for suicide, that is the purpose of the user not the gun or projectile.

See post #345.

My response was in response to post #345.

 

[hecatmoggie]

Thank you for admitting that the design purpose of an automobile is for transportation. Now you are finally on your way to acknowledging that the primary design purpose of guns is to kill, and not to drive nails with the butt end.

auto's also collectibles, they are used in sports, daily use etc

HOW people use them is irrelevant to their DESIGN

 

[rahl]

While that all may be true, the ultimate design purpose of guns is to kill either humans or animals, and always has been from the beginning.

Repeatedly proven false.

 

[watsup]

Sure there is, the point is that it's the gun control crowd that tends to be physically puny, even though they often accuse the gun rights crowd of that.

Not physically puny, but having a puny ego that requires them to bang bang! in order to feel “manly”, and especially those who need an AR-15 to destroy things and put the video on the internet. What does it prove? Nothing, except that they essentially have a poor sense of self that needs bolstering by showing themselves being “big men”.

 

[LouC]

The design purpose of the majority of guns is to move, using controlled explosions, a projectile down range, with sufficient speed and force to damage or cause to demise the target.

 

[watsup]

It's the gun control crowd that lacks logic.

And yet you and the others can’t seem to even acknowledge the fact that the primary design purpose of guns is to kill. You all spend days and even weeks dancing all around that simple fact, and I can’t quite figure out why. What would it hurt to acknowledge that? Why do you all dig all sorts of rabbit holes in which to try to escape instead?

 

[RF667799]

And I explained why. What did you find lacking in my rationale?

Okay, for my comparison, I pick on the basis of CNA. Countries of North America. I note that the US is below average in rate of homicide.

Their principle design purpose. But we don't need to rehash that.

I bet you don't want to. You've never proven it true, nor it's relevance if it was true. It's really just a way to shout "False equivalence!"

I have expressed my admittedly incomplete policy approach to reducing gun violence in other threads. I'm for keeping guns out of the hands of criminals - even if that makes owning a firearm more expensive and onerous for law-abiding citizens - and for making certain weapons less deadly (e.g., bumpstocks, large magazines, etc.).

Who doesn't want to keep guns out of the hands of criminals?

In addition, I'm for keeping criminal asses out from behind the steering wheels of motor vehicles, even if it slightly inconveniences law abiding citizens. But that gets no traction from those who otherwise tout the benefits of backgroundchecks.
I'm forced to conclude the difference in support is because of who is being inconvenienced.

 

[RF667799]

That's because we need to take guns away from people with mental health issues.

That seems rather indiscriminate.

 

[RF667799]

And yet you and the others can’t seem to even acknowledge the fact that the primary design purpose of guns is to kill. You all spend days and even weeks dancing all around that simple fact, and I can’t quite figure out why. What would it hurt to acknowledge that? Why do you all dig all sorts of rabbit holes in which to try to escape instead?

Why is it so important to you, that you must repeat it over and over, even when you can't support it and it isn't reflected in reality?

 

[RF667799]

Not physically puny, but having a puny ego that requires them to bang bang! in order to feel “manly”, and especially those who need an AR-15 to destroy things and put the video on the internet. What does it prove? Nothing, except that they essentially have a poor sense of self that needs bolstering by showing themselves being “big men”.

Fruit shooting again.

You must have been really traumatized by those watermelons.

 

[watsup]

auto's also collectibles, they are used in sports, daily use etc

HOW people use them is irrelevant to their DESIGN

If people use them in ways different from their primary purpose of design, I suppose that is up to them, but it does not change the fact that there IS a primary purpose of design. When used to meet that, cars are used for transportation and guns are used to kill animals or humans. Those are their primary purposes of design, and all the dancing that you do will not change that. Why are you so afraid to acknowledge that? What could possibly be the reason?

 

[watsup]

The design purpose of the majority of guns is to move, using controlled explosions, a projectile down range, with sufficient speed and force to damage or cause to demise the target.

In other words, exactly as stated in the OP. Why won’t they acknowledge that? What are they afraid of?

 

[jaeger19]

Here's Royce Gracie, famous for being a martial arts champion and who's also a hunter, target shooter, and gun owner.


View attachment 67534269

Here's David Hogg, a skinny little boy whose famous for being a gun control fanatic.


View attachment 67534270


Who do you think is stronger?

You know..when I hear anti gunners saying, stuff like " ammo sexuals"..and firearms " to be more manly".

I think they are projecting their own feelings of inadequacy.

 

[watsup]

You know..when I hear anti gunners saying, stuff like " ammo sexuals"..and firearms " to be more manly".

I think they are projecting their own feelings of inadequacy.

What is the point of destroying things with an AR-15 and then putting the video on the internet?

 

[RF667799]

If people use them in ways different from their primary purpose of design, I suppose that is up to them, but it does not change the fact that there IS a primary purpose of design. When used to meet that, cars are used for transportation and guns are used to kill animals or humans. Those are their primary purposes of design, and all the dancing that you do will not change that. Why are you so afraid to acknowledge that? What could possibly be the reason?

No, the primary purpose of cars is to kill pedestrians in crosswalks. It doesn't matter that hardly any car owners use them in that way. That's their primary purpose.

 

[hecatmoggie]

If people use them in ways different from their primary purpose of design, I suppose that is up to them, but it does not change the fact that there IS a primary purpose of design.

to fire - that's what they're designed to do

When used to meet that, cars are used for transportation and guns are used to kill animals or humans.

or

cars are used to kill animals and humans and guns are stored in safes for collectors values - see? its all about how something is used

Those are their primary purposes of design, and all the dancing that you do will not change that. Why are you so afraid to acknowledge that? What could possibly be the reason?

primary purpose of a gun is to fire, and auto to drive and all the dancing that you do will not change that

that's just fact

 

[RF667799]

What is the point of destroying things with an AR-15 and then putting the video on the internet?

What's the point of putting birthday party pictures on the internet?

 

[LouC]

In other words, exactly as stated in the OP. Why won’t they acknowledge that? What are they afraid of?

Being wrong?

 

[LostInSeattle]

Okay, for my comparison, I pick on the basis of CNA. Countries of North America. I note that the US is below average in rate of homicide.

Now THAT's cherry picking. You haven't even offered a rationale for picking those three. I explained my rationale in post #309. And I'd add to that list low levels of official corruption. If you don't think my criteria are sound, explain why not.

I bet you don't want to. You've never proven it true, nor it's relevance if it was true.

I don't see the point as I don't have anything really to add to what I've already said. I think I made a strong case, you don't agree. Not to mention that you already agreed that some guns are designed as weapons. What else is there to say?

It's really just a way to shout "False equivalence!"

Not sure what this refers to.

Who doesn't want to keep guns out of the hands of criminals?

People who complain about registration, gun storage and security requirements, severe penalites for illegal sales, no private gun sales without passing through a FFL, national firearms database tracking all guns and their owners, etc. In other words, measures to drastically reduce the primary pathways for guns to fall into the hands of criminals.

In addition, I'm for keeping criminal asses out from behind the steering wheels of motor vehicles, even if it slightly inconveniences law abiding citizens. But that gets no traction from those who otherwise tout the benefits of backgroundchecks.
I'm forced to conclude the difference in support is because of who is being inconvenienced.

What measures would you propose?

 

[DebateChallenge]

And yet you and the others can’t seem to even acknowledge the fact that the primary design purpose of guns is to kill. You all spend days and even weeks dancing all around that simple fact, and I can’t quite figure out why. What would it hurt to acknowledge that? Why do you all dig all sorts of rabbit holes in which to try to escape instead?

Even if the primary purpose of guns is to kill what matters is what they're used for. The primary purpose of the nuclear reactor was to kill on a massive scale and today nuclear reactors are used for other purposes, such as producing energy.

 

[watsup]

Even if the primary purpose of guns is to kill what matters is what they're used for. The primary purpose of the nuclear reactor was to kill on a massive scale and today nuclear reactors are used for other purposes, such as producing energy.

What they are used for is to kill 40,000 humans per year in the United States by being used for their primary purpose. What AR-15s are used for is to kill lots of humans in a short period of time when in the hands of potential mass murderers. That is, when they are not being used by rubes in videos to show just how much destructive powers they do have.

 

[jaeger19]

What is the point of destroying things with an AR-15 and then putting the video on the internet?

Well in some of the videos..tgey are demonstrating the reliability of the firearm. I.e. to be able to handle so many rounds

Sometimes they are demonstrating a weapons recoil.

Sometimes demonstrating accuracy.

My son sent me one the other day. Where a you tuber was testing the reliability etc of a firearm he had bought to test.

He fired I think 1000 rounds at a table of fruit taking heat measurements of the rifle every 100 rounds.

The firearm got to hot to handle and he set tge firearm down to put on a pair of heat gloves when the gun on the table went off. ( good that it was pointed downrange).
The gun continue to have several " cook offs" as the chamber was so hot tge firearm was going off on its own.

A good safety lesson.

 

[Lethargic Aptitude]

The design purpose of handguns is for self defense by wounding or killing an attacker and, unfortunately, they are also used quite broadly in murder and other crimes.
The design purpose of rifles is to kill animals, sometimes for food, but way too often for supposed “sport”.
The design purpose of assault style weapons such as the AR-15 is to kill as many people as possible in the shortest amount of time due to very lethal bullets, large magazines, and quite rapid fire. Again, unfortunately, the purpose of the design has indeed been proven very effective by way too many mass murderers.