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The 1619 Project

"400 years ago the first enslaved Africans were were first brought to Virginia"
True.

"today most Americans still don't know the full story of slavery in America."
Is "the full story" an encyclopedic knowledge of, a PhD level mastery of, the subject? Probably not.

Wouldn't the more reasonable question be 'have sufficient knowledge of'? Sufficient to be a well rounded and well informed person?
To that, I think I'd say 'maybe' leaning to 'probably'.

But to be honest, my education on that subject was back in the 70's, and Lord only knows what passes for education these days, more and more seems like little more than liberal / progressive / Democrat ideological indoctrination to me, something which I do not think serves the students well at all.
Did that education include anything on this? I doubt it.
"“My marster… started out wid two ’omen slaves and raised 300 slaves.” So testified John Smith, a 108-year-old former slave who was interviewed by a Works Project Administration employee in the late 1930s. Smith’s testimony was as sensational as it was disturbing. He recalled that “Short Peggy” and “Long Peggy,” the two women his master “started out wid,” were prized for their fecundity. The sexual exploitation that Smith claimed these women experienced led to the reproduction of slaves who enriched Smith’s master through their labor or sale."

The correct answer would be F.
 
Treating people equally didn't lead to a normative distribution and you have no other recourse than to call the whole system racist. Personal responsibility says otherwise.

critical theorists Wendy Limbert and Heather Bullock explicitly reject the idea of “[promoting] personal responsibility through work,” dismissing it as a ploy to allow white male elites to “avoid responsibility for eliminating structural impediments to economic equality.”41

Critical Race Theory Trades Personal Responsibility for Tyranny​

 
Hannah jones says its not history and is instead an "origin story".

The stench of hypocrisy is overwhelming. The historical view generally put forward by conservatives is likewise an "origin story" anchored to the year 1776. It's not a mere recitation of historical facts either.

1619 is propaganda designed to bring about the 1619 riots.

That's absurd. Nobody wants to see riots except for the knuckleheads who actually start them.

1619 isnt an examination of our society, it is instead an attempt to shape that society.

Again, the stench of hypocrisy. This is exactly what I was talking about earlier when I said the following:

Unfortunately, it's definitely a case of "both sides are doing it" from my perspective.

It's so remarkable: conservatives' sense of entitlement and belief that they are so special that they deputize and empower themselves to dictate to the people they've historically oppressed what their opinion of history needs to be. Talk about the thought police! You folks are very much like communists in this regard. Ban dissent!

Nonsense. Wholly agenda driven.

See my entire sentence:

And this is no more agenda-driven than some of the falsifiable assertions or misrepresentations conservatives try to cram down the throats of students.

You folks are no better in this regard. I find this very comical.
 
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Not according to critical race theory. ANY racial disparity is by definition racism.
This is nonsense.

Actually, it's just pure b.s.

You're not summarizing Critical Race Theory at all. You're summarizing the white-victimhood version of CRT (and just about EVERYTHING else that doesn't literally white-wash both history and current-events in the U.S.).

Dumb comment, Dixon.

All of Critical Theory is the neo marxists path to communism through the destruction of capitalism.
Take 2. Another ignorant statement from you, Dixon.

More ignorant, white-grievance b.s. from you.

Critical Race Theory does NOT subscribe to "Marxism" or "Communism"....nor ANY other economic theory.

Neither does CRT describe/define "ANY racial disparity" as "the definition of racism"

The boldness of the entitlement and dishonesty/ignorance of you people can really be breath-taking at times. :rolleyes:
 
"400 years ago the first enslaved Africans were were first brought to Virginia"
True.

Long before that they were brought to Florida. And before that the Indians from one tribe would enslave the Indians of another tribe they had defeated.
 
The stench of hypocrisy is overwhelming. The historical view generally put forward by conservatives is likewise an "origin story" anchored to the year 1776. It's not a mere recitation of historical facts either.
An origin story isnt a part of history, it is a tool of fiction.
 
An origin story isnt a part of history, it is a tool of fiction.

No more so than yours is. It's the very height of hypocrisy when you folks pass legislation to require that everyone will be indoctrinated with your unprovable opinion. I would note that the 1619 Project doesn't do that. Rather, they're merely saying "here's another perspective to consider". You folks are actually acting like the communists in this regard because that's exactly what communists do.
 
This is nonsense.

Actually, it's just pure b.s.

You're not summarizing Critical Race Theory at all. You're summarizing the white-victimhood version of CRT (and just about EVERYTHING else that doesn't literally white-wash both history and current-events in the U.S.).

Dumb comment, Dixon.
You dont have a clue.

"When I See Racial Disparities, I See Racism" Kendi
 
No more so than yours is. It's the very height of hypocrisy when you folks pass legislation to require that everyone will be indoctrinated with your unprovable opinion. I would note that the 1619 Project doesn't do that. Rather, they're merely saying "here's another perspective to consider". You folks are actually acting like the communists in this regard because that's exactly what communists do.

I dont have an origin story. I prefer actual history instead.
 
I dont have an origin story. I prefer actual history instead.

Actually, I doubt you "prefer actual history". Rather, I think you prefer a whitewashed perspective of history. People who are seriously interested in history (like myself) realize that there can be a variety of valid perspectives on a particular set of historical phenomena because not all ideas about them are provable, particularly when it comes to opinions concerning which events are most important for purposes of non-factive generalization.
 
Critical race theory> pap for mushbrain woke white panderers.
 
All of Critical Theory is the neo marxists path to communism through the destruction of capitalism.
Yup, you don't even own your offspring.
 
Back then it was about treating people equal regardless of race. Equality. Now its all about "equity" which requires treating people differently because of their race.

You dont have a clue.

"When I See Racial Disparities, I See Racism" Kendi

I think CRT should be more honest and better known as CWRT or "Criticism (of) White Race Theory".
 
What communist propaganda? A Marxist approach studies history through a class struggle. That is something pretty much everyone does today, save your marginal libertarians. The study of race in America would be a based on a struggle between whites and blacks, which is has been. Thus it is a Marxist approach, but he has nothing to do with communism.

It's a great deal more complicated than that.

First, class struggle isn't what "pretty much everyone does these days", not for those of us familiar with the history of historians. Absolutely the "great man of history" perspective of a century and a half ago has receded. Since then history has been diced and sliced from innumerable perspectives, from that of the long term social history (the Annales school) to that of econometricians, intellectual history, history through geography and environment, women's history, frontier history, slave history, southern history, multicultural "studies" history of different racial and ethnic sub-groups, immigrant history, etc. .

Second, the more recent forms of American history (since the 1960s/70s) include two types of particular interest to me: the Republicanism history which rediscovered and emphasized the primacy of ideas as a social and cultural movement, a motivating forces in history (rather than material self-interest). Bernard Bailyn, Gordon Wood from Harvard formed the "Cambridge School"; at Washington University the "St. Louis School" was led by J.G.A. Pocock. And Atlantic History the social, immigration, and other history rooted in the Great Atlantic migration of millions of people not only too the new world but also throughout western Europe, and how the American experience was a part of that.

(A pretty good run-down as how it relates to American History can be found at: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Historiography_of_the_United_States#Bancroft)

Finally, I think your distinction between Marxist analysis and communist thought isn't that illuminating. The prior left-wing emphasis on class struggle and labor in history was shifted in the 60s/70s to race and gender (sex) by the left. The pseudo Marxists and their left fellow travelers reacted to the the working class conservatism and their dislike of the social unrest (68 to 75) by abandoning working class politics and creating an identity bandwagon of racial and gender group self-interest.

Authentic Marxism believes that forms of production dictate social, that is, class relations. The objective interests of all people, regardless of race or gender, binds them together in class struggle of unified interests. The racialism (and genderism) of identity politics doesn't care about the ownership or means of production or class interests, they begin with the assumption that the race and gender struggle are not born in the conditions of production, but "in the DNA" of those "bad" people who are not of that particular race or gender. It has nothing to do with the transformation of production from slavery, to feudalism, to capitalism, and finally to socialism... it has everything to do with race as the immutable "DNA" division, a tribe vs. tribe struggle for hegemony...one that demands one side bend the knee and the other reap the spoils.

Is it any wonder then that the left has degenerated into idiot identity obsessed politics; "intersectional studies", "whiteness studies", "critical race theory" and just about every other attempt to pit one group against the other?

Anyway, there are a few esoteric 'critical race theory' authors who so attempt to link slavery to capitalism, and then portray capitalism as the root of all evil. But by in large, most on the cultural left are not that sophisticated (which is why many big businesses think it best to endorse this nonsense).

In sum: the current left is a kind of pseudo Marxist and pseudo Communist conglomeration which, at its root, is just raw tribalism with a moralistic veneer.
 
It's a great deal more complicated than that.

First, class struggle isn't what "pretty much everyone does these days", not for those of us familiar with the history of historians. Absolutely the "great man of history" perspective of a century and a half ago has receded. Since then history has been diced and sliced from innumerable perspectives, from that of the long term social history (the Annales school) to that of econometricians, intellectual history, history through geography and environment, women's history, frontier history, slave history, southern history, multicultural "studies" history of different racial and ethnic sub-groups, immigrant history, etc. .

Second, the more recent forms of American history (since the 1960s/70s) include two types of particular interest to me: the Republicanism history which rediscovered and emphasized the primacy of ideas as a social and cultural movement, a motivating forces in history (rather than material self-interest). Bernard Bailyn, Gordon Wood from Harvard formed the "Cambridge School"; at Washington University the "St. Louis School" was led by J.G.A. Pocock. And Atlantic History the social, immigration, and other history rooted in the Great Atlantic migration of millions of people not only too the new world but also throughout western Europe, and how the American experience was a part of that.

(A pretty good run-down as how it relates to American History can be found at: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Historiography_of_the_United_States#Bancroft)

Finally, I think your distinction between Marxist analysis and communist thought isn't that illuminating. The prior left-wing emphasis on class struggle and labor in history was shifted in the 60s/70s to race and gender (sex) by the left. The pseudo Marxists and their left fellow travelers reacted to the the working class conservatism and their dislike of the social unrest (68 to 75) by abandoning working class politics and creating an identity bandwagon of racial and gender group self-interest.

Authentic Marxism believes that forms of production dictate social, that is, class relations. The objective interests of all people, regardless of race or gender, binds them together in class struggle of unified interests. The racialism (and genderism) of identity politics doesn't care about the ownership or means of production or class interests, they begin with the assumption that the race and gender struggle are not born in the conditions of production, but "in the DNA" of those "bad" people who are not of that particular race or gender. It has nothing to do with the transformation of production from slavery, to feudalism, to capitalism, and finally to socialism... it has everything to do with race as the immutable "DNA" division, a tribe vs. tribe struggle for hegemony...one that demands one side bend the knee and the other reap the spoils.

Is it any wonder then that the left has degenerated into idiot identity obsessed politics; "intersectional studies", "whiteness studies", "critical race theory" and just about every other attempt to pit one group against the other?

Anyway, there are a few esoteric 'critical race theory' authors who so attempt to link slavery to capitalism, and then portray capitalism as the root of all evil. But by in large, most on the cultural left are not that sophisticated (which is why many big businesses think it best to endorse this nonsense).

In sum: the current left is a kind of pseudo Marxist and pseudo Communist conglomeration which, at its root, is just raw tribalism with a moralistic veneer.
Historically capitalism + racism are interlinked, which is why I call them the conjoined twins + historians like me call them “racial capitalism” in the singular. But some self-described forms of “antiracism” are not anti-capitalist, which in my book means they’re not antiracism. Kendi

And its called neo marxism to distinguish from Marxism. Different paths to the same goal of the dismantling of Capitalism with Communism in its place
 
An origin story isnt a part of history, it is a tool of fiction.

We currently teach our children that our founders were saints except for some dirty business here and there. That is the biggest propaganda tool imaginable. And objectively a lie.

This country was founded on white supremacy. THere is nothing wrong with owning that and looking at how far we’ve come.
 

Oh, absolutely we do. We gloss over the worst parts of our history, of which there is a lot of. THe intended effect is to force propaganda on our children, giving them no room to review the full sweep of history.

THe problem conservatives have is that white folks no longer control all the narratives. Multiculturalism demands we look at everything our country did, because the “our” in that sentence includes non-whites.
 
Oh, absolutely we do. We gloss over the worst parts of our history, of which there is a lot of. THe intended effect is to force propaganda on our children, giving them no room to review the full sweep of history.

THe problem conservatives have is that white folks no longer control all the narratives. Multiculturalism demands we look at everything our country did, because the “our” in that sentence includes non-whites.

Those have become cliche's of unsupported platitudes, repeatedly recycled for at least the last 45 years. In all due respect, if you haven't collected and read the civics textbooks from at least the turn of the century until the 2000s then you really can't know what you are talking about. As a one-time avid textbook collector (I have about 50 to 60 American history textbooks) the stereotypes regurgitated by partisans are fevered claptrap.

And if you can't read the textbooks, you can read some excellent works chronicling their history, especially over the last 40 to 50 years.

You should begin with "America Revised", by Frances Fitzgerald. She is best known for her award winning (anti-war) book Fire in the Lake: The Vietnamese and the Americans in Vietnam (1972). (Ranked by critics as one of the top books of the year, it was on the New York Times bestseller list for more than 10 weeks, and it won the Pulitzer Prize for General Non-Fiction, the Bancroft Prize for history, and the National Book Award. It was published in paperback in 1973 by Vintage Books...wiki)

IN HER second BOOK America Revised, Frances FitzGerald wrote about the cutting and pasting of American history textbooks during the 1970s, and the social upheavals of the previous decade which prompted “the most dramatic rewriting of history ever to take place in American schoolbooks.” Gone were the upbeat and patriotic tone of older American history textbooks, along with some of the old white male heroes, and lots of racial minorities and women "heros" were inserted. Additionally, in place of the traditional coherent narrative about a nation that was constantly strengthening and expanding its democratic institutions, the textbooks of the 70s presented what she called a “bewildering” litany of problems, crises, and conflicts.

For the 90s to 2005 there is no better short work than "The Language Police" by Diane Ravitch which accurately reflects my own experience with these textbooks. The revisionist work of the former New Left (now in faculty positions) spilled over into textbooks. None celebrated the evolution and triumph of American democratic institutions. The radical ideologies took root in the academic disciplines, especially in the humanities and the multi-cultural claptrap that started in the 80s dominated the textbook narratives.

Which brings us to now (I stopped tracking textbooks 15 years ago). The current ignorant generation of internet opinion makers...those clueless as the to context or the landscape of prior debate and their already impacts on pedagogy.

Do you know that the emotionally charged debates over multiculturalism and even the whacky extremes of Afrocentrism was already resolved in favor of copious multiculturalism?

Do you know that in the 90s the curriculum "experts" asserted that traditional accounts of American history were not only racist and sexist but Eurocentric as well? And that more often than not they won that debate ?

Do you know that multiculturalism insisted that history should teach ethnic pride, not the capacity to think analytically and dispassionately about events, and they disparaged accounts of world history or American history that paid too much attention to the influence of Europe?

Do you know these textbooks attempted to boost the self-esteem of non-European children, and they ignored concerns about the dangers of turning history into a tool for group therapy or political action?

Do you know they shunned civic assimilation (melting pot) in favor of the maintenance of equal cultures living as a "mixed salad"?

Cont...
 
Cont...

Excerpts from Ravitch's book and her review of many primary and high school history books in 2005 illustrate:

"The textbooks published in the late 1990s do, however, contain a coherent narrative. It is a story of cultural equivalence: All of the world’s civilizations were great and glorious, all produced grand artistic, cultural, and material achievements, and now the world is growing more global and interconnected. Some bad things happened in the past, but that was a long time ago and now the cultures of the world face common problems. In keeping with the imperative of avoiding ethnocentrism, no culture is “primitive.” The idea of progress has disappeared, because no culture is more or less advanced than any other. Even those that had no literacy and only meager technology are described as advanced, sophisticated, complex, and highly developed. These are comparative terms, but cultures are never compared to one another. Today’s world histories, with rare exceptions, adhere closely to this line of cultural equivalence. The once traditional emphasis in textbooks on the growth of democratic institutions has nearly vanished. "

"In a significant variation on the cultural equivalence theme, Houghton Mifflin’s world history text for middle school students, To See a World, implies that every world culture is wonderful except for the United States. It lauds every world culture as advanced, complex, and rich with artistic achievement, except for the United States. Readers learn that people in the United States confront such problems as discrimination, poverty, and pollution. Those who came to this country looking for freedom, the book says, found hardship and prejudice; the immigrants did all the hard work, but the settled population hated and feared them. Despite these many injustices, people kept trying to immigrate to the United States, but many were excluded because of their race or ethnicity. Compared to the other cultures in the world, the United States sounds like a frightening place. Why people keep trying to immigrate to this unwelcoming, mean-spirited culture is a puzzle."

"The textbooks sugarcoat practices in non-Western cultures...Seemingly, only Europeans and Americans were imperialistic. When non-European civilizations conquer new territories, the textbooks abandon their critical voice. They express awe toward the ancient empires of China, India, Africa, and Persia but pay no attention to how they grew. Textbook after textbook tells the story of the “spread” of Islam. Christian Europe invades; Islam spreads. The texts should have a consistent critical lens, in which gross violations of human rights—like slavery, cannibalism, genocide, human sacrifice, and the oppression of women—are recognized as wrong. To avoid moralism and presentism, the textbooks should encourage discussion of differences in historical and contemporary standards across cultures, while recognizing that our present-day values are based on democratic principles that evolved over time. However, the current textbooks are selectively critical. They condemn slavery in the Western world but present slavery in Africa and the Middle East as benign, even as a means of social mobility...

The texts exaggerate women’s roles, perhaps thinking that this will improve the self-esteem of female students. In text after text, we learn that women in non-Western societies enjoyed extensive rights and privileges. ...
"

"With only a few exceptions, the textbooks are not good models of historical writing. They constantly moralize about the past, as though everyone in 1850 or 1900 or 1950 should have known what we know today and should have shared our enlightened values. They abound with anachronisms. Many imply that American women chafed under the burden of sexism at every point in history, not letting students know that feminists—in the contemporary sense—were an avant-garde until the 1970s. In addition, the books frequently quote historical figures or offer data without giving any sources for teachers and students who want to learn more, failing to demonstrate by deed the importance of presenting verifiable evidence."

Ravitch, Diane. The Language Police: How Pressure Groups Restrict What Students Learn (p. 149). Knopf Doubleday Publishing Group. Kindle Edition.

So when folks, such as you, carp about how history is taught and why "we" need to pile on more revisionist focus on yet another moralist based screed, I'm wondering WHERE HAVE YOU PEOPLE BEEN THE LAST 20 YEARS...LIVING IN ABANDONED MISSLE SILO?
 
You dont have a clue.
I have a "clue" that your remarks were an expression of white-grievance ignorance.

And I have a "clue" that you are someone who has no idea what the Critical Race Theory really is.

And I have a "clue" that CRT has nothing to do with Marxism, Communism or the destruction of Capitalism.

Those are just ignorant white-grievance/white-victimhood feelings/opinions/rantings that you and I BOTH know you can't back up substantively.

"When I See Racial Disparities, I See Racism" Kendi
:ROFLMAO:...what does Kendi have to do with the Critical Race Theory? He's expressing a view that is backed up with empirical evidence, not defining CRT.

First, you only took HALF of Kendi's quote: Here's the rest:

IBRAM X. KENDI, Ph.D: "As an anti-racist, when I see racial disparities, I see racism. But I know for many racist Americans, when they see racial disparities they see black inferiority"​

And Dr. Kendi is 100% correct about that last part, too, btw.

But, of course, his remarks are not even REMOTELY a summary of CRT. You just made that part up. In other words, you lied.

Now you're just deflecting, Dixon. Remember, your original claim (i.e. LIE) is that "according to critical race theory ANY racial disparity is by definition racism". Remember?

That was either a LIE....or a reflection of white-grievance and general ignorance about CRT.
 
I have a "clue" that your remarks were an expression of white-grievance ignorance.

And I have a "clue" that you are someone who has no idea what the Critical Race Theory really is.

And I have a "clue" that CRT has nothing to do with Marxism, Communism or the destruction of Capitalism.

Those are just ignorant white-grievance/white-victimhood feelings/opinions/rantings that you and I BOTH know you can't back up substantively.


:ROFLMAO:...what does Kendi have to do with the Critical Race Theory? He's expressing a view that is backed up with empirical evidence, not defining CRT.

First, you only took HALF of Kendi's quote: Here's the rest:

IBRAM X. KENDI, Ph.D: "As an anti-racist, when I see racial disparities, I see racism. But I know for many racist Americans, when they see racial disparities they see black inferiority"​

And Dr. Kendi is 100% correct about that last part, too, btw.

But, of course, his remarks are not even REMOTELY a summary of CRT. You just made that part up. In other words, you lied.

Now you're just deflecting, Dixon. Remember, your original claim (i.e. LIE) is that "according to critical race theory ANY racial disparity is by definition racism". Remember?

That was either a LIE....or a reflection of white-grievance and general ignorance about CRT.

I don't believe that unless one is very steeped in the intellectual history of left one can confidently reduce critical race theory to simple Marxism . There isn't any dispute that CRT derives from "Thinking Critically" and "Critical Studies" ideology, which in turn is a euphuism of the radical left obsession's with power structures as a super set of relationships, of which class is but one of them. But I'll leave it to others to explain the Frankfurt School, Structuralism, Post Structuralism, Post Modernism etc. and how Marxists 'evolved' into something similar but different to ordinary materialist Marxism.

Nor do I think it matters. After all, CRT, Identity Politics, Kendi's spin on CRT, and the new history of capitalism school are all birds of a feather - a gaggle of closely related comrades and concepts whose minuet differences are best left described by political theologians. However as CRT guru Kendi has said: "To love capitalism is to end up loving racism. To love racism is to end up loving capitalism. The conjoined twins are two sides of the same destructive body.” Sounds somewhat communistic, no?

And Kendi also has said that racism is defined by racial inequity, that if there is a policy that sustains an inequity then that policy must be racist. To be anti-racist is to create equity, to create by whatever means an equal outcome. To not do so is racist.

So yes, CRT does have something to do with Marxism, Communism, and/or anti-capitalism. Just what that something is requires far more reading and investigation that I think either of you wish to do - I know I don't.
 
So when folks, such as you, carp about how history is taught and why "we" need to pile on more revisionist focus on yet another moralist based screed, I'm wondering WHERE HAVE YOU PEOPLE BEEN THE LAST 20 YEARS...LIVING IN ABANDONED MISSLE SILO?

😂

Cry harder. Boo hoo we didn't teach the oppressed to sit back and take it but instead to take your country from you. What yall going to do about it? Cry? 😂 That is after all what we taught you and yours to do.
 
Oh, absolutely we do. We gloss over the worst parts of our history, of which there is a lot of. THe intended effect is to force propaganda on our children, giving them no room to review the full sweep of history.

THe problem conservatives have is that white folks no longer control all the narratives. Multiculturalism demands we look at everything our country did, because the “our” in that sentence includes non-whites.

We treat our founders second only to God, and maybe even put them ahead of God, as the authority on what our 21 century country should be like. It boggles the mind that even today, people want to base our government on the musings of several white men from over 250 years ago. There is a certain irony in this, as they, themselves, put faith in future generations to improve upon what they had done.
 
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